US Religious Minister

Oscar Madison

A Televangelist Begs for a Private Jet | The Daily Show - YouTube

Peregrinus

"The 'Eye of the Needle' was a narrow gate in the Jerusalem city wall" is one explanation of this particular text but, as riffmongous points out, there is no evidence that there was ever a gate so named, and the claim that this text refers to an actual gate can't be traced to earlier than the ninth century. So it looks bogus.

There's another possible explanation, which is that the Aramaic word for a camel is extremely similar to the Aramaic word for a rope, and there may have been a translation error when the oral tradition (in Aramaic) was written down (in Greek) by the author of Mark. That, at least, would make the metaphor work - "It's easier to thread a needle with rope than it is to do X".

The third and most likely explanation - because it's the only one for which we have any evidence - is that at the time "eye of the needle" was an established figure of speech for any narrow gap or opening, either real or figurative. The phrase turns up in other writings of the era, including in the Jewish Talmud (where it's elephants, not camels, that are unlikely to go through the eye of a needle) and, slightly later, in the Qu'ran, where a camel passing through a needle's eye is a metaphor for impossibility. So Jesus wasn't referring to a particular gate in Jerusalem; just to narrow gaps in general, and his point was not about laden versus unladen camels. He was saying that it's impossible for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven.

According to the scripture, that's certainly what the disciples understood him to be saying because, when he says the bit about the eye of the needle . . .

... they were exceedingly astonished and said among themselves, "Then who can be saved?" Jesus looked at them and said, "For human beings it is impossible, but not for God. All things are possible for God.

For the prosperity gospel merchants, this means that so long as you have faith in God, the impossible becomes possible, and therefore your riches are no longer a problem. You can wallow in your heap of gold coins like Scrooge McDuck, and still get into heaven, because you are justified by your faith.

That's not the orthodox interpretation, though. Jesus isn't saying that giving your wealth away is a kind of entry price you would have to pay to get into heaven only, fortunately, God doesn't charge entry to those who have faith. Rather, in the kingdom of God (which, NB, is not the same thing as heaven or the afterlife) people give their wealth away, because generosity, sharing and a raising up of the poor and downtrodden are what characterise the kingdom of God; a world in which people hoard their wealth is, by definition, not the kingdom. And, therefore, if you are clinging to your wealth, you won't enter the kingdom because you don't want to.

The disciples are bothered by this for two reasons. First, a desire for wealth is understandable; wealth give you security, the knowledge that you can feed and house yourself and your dependants and, if you have enough of it, reassurance that you'll be able to do that next year and the year after. Who wouldn't want that? Secondly, what Jesus is saying goes against established religious tradition which was that, if you lived a fortunate life — propserity, contentment, a happy home, lots of kids — that was a sign of God's favour. Jesus is basically saying that you should trust in God to provide the things that matter, not in a store of gold. And, if you do have gold, that's not good because it provides you with food, housing, etc, but because it allows you to provide food, housing, etc to others, which is what characterises the kingdom.

Oscar Madison

Televangelists: Last Week Tonight with John Oliver (HBO) - YouTube

Another example from the U.S.

I can only imagine that these are the extreme ones?

Ash.J.Williams

:)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hy4z_9OnNo8

SouthWesterly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118254964#Comment_118254964

The city was destroyed. It was a common security feature from my reading.

Of course you're ignoring that in the context of the discussion Jesus had told the rich ruler to sell his possessions and then follow Him.

Its not my job to defend the millionaires. I just know the pastors I know aren't and many of them are living hand to mouth having lost their jobs and associated income in the last 2 years.

Capt'n Midnight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118254964#Comment_118254964

Charles Watson-Wentworth, 2nd Marquess of Rockingham built one so he could drive a coach through it

Shao Kahn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118249372#Comment_118249372

I always thought one of the main issues the protestant denominations had with Catholicism and the pope etc, was all the grandeur and showiness connected to it? That's what I was once told anyway, that they prefer their faith to be a more toned down affair - simple plain chapel, humble, no frills etc.

Peregrinus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118266025#Comment_118266025

Well, clearly they don't all prefer that.

Hotblack Desiato

Fools and their money.