Good news for businesses as RTE announce women are now working for free until the end of the year

pleh

Just talking to a friend about the fact we two out of a bunch of women (30s to 50) are the only two full-time workers, rest are part time, 3 days or 4 days, or full time mothers or on disability.

Now this friend is going on long term leave due to a operation. So that just leaves me full time, the others must think im an awful dope!

cloudatlas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118136112#Comment_118136112

There are two female fire fighters in one of my friendship group. Christ you sound worse than the people you are complaining about.

Where can i get these free women?

c.p.w.g.w

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118135655#Comment_118135655

Sure all the women in my social circle out earn the majority of the men...

So that 5 & 5

The lowest earner in the women's group is 38,500 p/a and highest is on 50,000(estimated)

In the group of us men, all bar 1 earns less than 36,000 while one of the lads is 45,000(but Christ does he earn it🤯🤯)

Mid West Region so it goes much further than say Dublin

Shao Kahn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118153670#Comment_118153670

Cool story bro!

So they like a bit of the old hose do they?

What's a friendship group btw? Is that like a support group for abandoned & wayward friends?

cloudatlas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118153765#Comment_118153765

I can't stand extremists on either side, both irrational and unhinged.

generic_throwaway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118136112#Comment_118136112

Just for balance, it's exceedingly unlikely that you will be in a situation where you are expected to sacrifice for a woman (unless you have reason to believe otherwise) whereas the pay gap affects every working woman.

There is undoubtedly a more complex picture at work here than straight up discrimination (and I think even the folks raising the issue will acknowledge this), but to dismiss the whole issue on such a fatuous argument is pretty stupid.

generic_throwaway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118153765#Comment_118153765

Watch out, we have an edgelord here.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118153876#Comment_118153876

Just for balance, it's exceedingly unlikely that you will be in a situation where you are expected to sacrifice for a woman (unless you have reason to believe otherwise) whereas the pay gap affects every working woman.

Actually, there's plenty of occasions that a man might be expected to sacrifice for a woman. Taking on extra work (without any promotion or salary increase), or losing a position because a woman has returned from maternity leave. Hell, there are initiatives in place for quotas in the workplace, and for panels, often which are used even when there is a balance in the numbers of women compared to men. I've known of guys who have lost out on training/upskilling programs because they felt they needed a woman to represent them. There are heaps of places in employment where a man could lose out to a woman, simply due to her gender.

Any time you provide benefits or treatment that is based entirely on gender, that will open up areas where a man could be made to sacrifice (for the good of the company), in favor of a female staff member.

And again, no, the gender pay gap doesn't affect every woman, because there have been studies showing women outpacing men in both promotions and salaries in a variety of professions, in addition to the research showing that women under 30 often get paid more than men. So... there are quite a few women who far outperform both, other women, and the men they work alongside.

There is undoubtedly a more complex picture at work here than straight up discrimination (and I think even the folks raising the issue will acknowledge this), but to dismiss the whole issue on such a fatuous argument is pretty stupid.

The area of discrimination against women has been covered for almost three decades now, during which a wide range of safeguards have been implemented at both company level, and that of our State laws. Does it continue to exist? Of course. It's never going to be completely removed, just as discrimination against men, based entirely on gender will continue to exist too.

The gender wage gap is worth being dismissed because every detailed probe into the arguments and statistics has returned data that show the claims of it's existence is false. People make choices, both in terms of choosing a career, and the development of that career. Invariably, that is what brings about the discrepancies in salaries and benefits received. People who work longer hours, take less holidays, and commit to their careers get paid more (talent and education being part of it). The opportunity is there for women, just as it is for men, to avail of that way of life... as shown by the women who are raking in the money, but working to the hilt to do so.

The problem for many women is that they've chosen low income careers. That was a choice. Just as many men have chosen to do the same with other careers that have a low income. If women want a higher salary, enter the industries that have a reputation for that kind of income, but the truth is that many woman don't want to enter that kind of competitive environment, and so they lose out. It's not discrimination... it's the consequence of making a choice.

Freddie Mcinerney

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118139497#Comment_118139497

Majority section of the 66% could be children.

Finty Lemon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118139483#Comment_118139483

A lot of ladies would hate the though of this ever becoming a thing in Ireland. No more coffee and Insta for 2 hours after dropping little Jack and Emily to school.

Still stihl waters 3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118153956#Comment_118153956

If true, which I doubt, then wouldn't that be a much bigger story than 33% of women addicted to crack, I mean a majority share of 66% all crackheads in Ireland being children would be a fcukin catastrophe, yea...... I'm not buying it

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118153994#Comment_118153994

A female friend of mine told me that many mothers, in the UK, will drink cocktails while watching their kids at the playgrounds, with the other moms. So, when it came to picking up their older kids at schools, many of them would be drunk at the wheel. Seems there's quite a social aspect to taking their kids to the playground. 😄

Freddie Mcinerney

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118154001#Comment_118154001

Depends on the cut off age.

Shao Kahn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118153876#Comment_118153876

That depends on the definition of the word "sacrifice" though, doesn't it?

The amount of dirty and dangerous and downright horrible jobs that exist in the world is huge. And the amount of these jobs that women either can't do or simply decide they don't want to do, is also huge.

Men are the ones that have to take up the slack in these jobs, and make the sacrifices for the greater good of society. (that means both men & women btw) Usually without looking for any fanfare or pats on the back. And very often for crap wages too.

So, making it merely about going down in the titanic or saving someone in a fire, is overly simplistic. It is of course, far more complex than that.

But then I was being slightly facetious with those remarks anyway. (in case you hadn't noticed)

Besides, even though you could make a very strong argument for why men actually deserve slightly better average pay than women - based on working all of those 1,000's of dirty/dangerous/unpopular/exhausting jobs that most women don't want to touch with a 10ft barge pole. I wouldn't even bother with that angle, there is really no need.

The gender pay gap has been completely debunked, it's well and truly a myth at this stage.

The only people who are really still pushing this flawed idea, are angry feminists and those limp-wristed white knight type males, who love to show off how thoroughly egalitarian and respectable they are.

It's a game. Just like all the other woke and social justice BS. 

And I'm not saying that to upset women. I love women. But men and women make different choices in life, and I don't really think there is anything wrong with that. I actually think women are better at achieving work life balance in many cases than men. Which is far more important than many people realize.

Still stihl waters 3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118154174#Comment_118154174

You're wrong, please tell me you don't seriously believe the statistics say that the majority of 66% of crack users I Ireland are children regardless of cut off age

@Finty Lemon

@Finty Lemon I kind of agree that there would be opposition as everyone fights their own corner but if you want equality ? It is a smarter approach in my opinion

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118154325#Comment_118154325

On your (little) bike, rev up and you know the rest 🙂

Freddie Mcinerney

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118154508#Comment_118154508

Crack babies :(

Still stihl waters 3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118156854#Comment_118156854

Just stop talking out your arse Freddie

Freddie Mcinerney

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118157523#Comment_118157523

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/crack%20baby#:~:text=%3A%20an%20infant%20subjected%20to%20prolonged,cocaine%20in%20the%20mother's%20womb

Still stihl waters 3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118157596#Comment_118157596

You say that the majority section of the 66% could be children although only 33% of crackheads are female, can you see where I'm going with this

Freddie Mcinerney

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118157657#Comment_118157657

More than one child per mother.

Still stihl waters 3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118157693#Comment_118157693

Yes that makes sense, they all had 2 kids each and the 2 kids are addicted to crack, you've me convinced, no need for further discussion

MilkyToast

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118157693#Comment_118157693

And they all just happen to be boys or??

Freddie Mcinerney

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118157843#Comment_118157843

No. Children are classified both girls and boys.

Freddie Mcinerney

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118157789#Comment_118157789

Not at all. Think of the children.

MilkyToast

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118158378#Comment_118158378

Then how would "crack babies" change the sex breakdown of crack users?

generic_throwaway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118154369#Comment_118154369

Oh, you're anti-woke? There's a huge surprise. If this was 60 years ago you would have been protesting black people being allowed sit on the bus or whatever the anti-woke people were doing at that time.

Freddie Mcinerney

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118158480#Comment_118158480

Men, women and children (both male and female).

Shao Kahn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118158505#Comment_118158505

Living up to your name, eh?

A lazy generic throwaway insult.

Yawn!

Ash.J.Williams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118135655#Comment_118135655

small Businesses won’t pay any more than they have to and why would they, you join a company on a negotiated salary. If your talent is required you will get pay increases to remain in the company

generic_throwaway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118159560#Comment_118159560

Listen, if you don't understand that you are a type, that is unfortunate. A little self-knowledge goes a long way. You are a reactionary - you resent change that does not benefit you personally, and there is a straight line bewteen you and the people who opposed women voting, civil rights in the US, and every other conservative reactionary movement in history.

'Woke' is just a faddish term for 'progressive' (as you will realise if you give it 5 seconds of thought). Your grandchildren will marvel at the stuff you got upset about.

riclad

Many jobs are primarily done by women , childcare , fashion, dress making, etc how many women do you see working on building sites . Not many. This is fake news. I'm not saying there's no jobs where men get promoted more often than women . Most women simply do not want to work as bricklayers, street cleaners, plasterers etc they prefer to work in retail or offices the situation is more complex than the headline

Finty Lemon

The gender discretionary SPENDING gap needs to be addressed. It is real, people.

Walk in the city centre any weekday and you will see the evidence. Talk to any courier either. Its real.

Dundrum TC, Kildare Village, BT, Mahon take your pick. Throw in Asos, Boohoo and PLT for good measure. Are these temples of spending the bastion of male privilege? Are they fuch! Every one-horse town in the country has a salon of some description also. Plenty of plastered ladies coming out of them, not too many plasterers going in.

The pay gap is down to career choices and time spent at work. The spending gap might just have the similar causes.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118160111#Comment_118160111

He is a type because you have judged him to be a certain type. It's pure rubbish. Even in psychology, where types are all the rage, there is plenty of recognition about how inaccurate categorisation or type assignment is. Why should any of us consider you to be some kind of authority or expert, capable of assigning types to other people? Based on your posts so far, and the general lack of defense would suggest that you're not. Just sounds like you're projecting, tbh.

As for woke and progressive, neither are labels to be proud of.

Shao Kahn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118160111#Comment_118160111

Listen, you're not as progressive as you seem to think you are.

You label people as a "type" just because they disagree with your opinion / world view. Lumping people into a box and slapping a label on them is not progressive. You're preaching about equality, but attitudes like that simply create division and discord in society.

Many modern so-called progressives, have these amazing powers of deductive reasoning. You can put 2+2 together in your head, and somehow always manage to come out with the number 666. It's an incredible level of mental gymnastics. But also unfortunately, intellectually lazy.

generic_throwaway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118160588#Comment_118160588

Of course you are correct to rail against reductive arguments. They are generally pretty weak.

Now tell us more about why 'woke' is all rubbish?

generic_throwaway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118160457#Comment_118160457

Yes my friend. Again, we know exactly where you would have been standing when they were trying to give civil rights to black people. Not on the side of the progressives you despise.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118160930#Comment_118160930

haha.. seriously? That's the extent of your ability to debate? To throw out ignorant remarks about other posters, as if progressives were the only ones capable of understanding and fighting for civil rights?

In fact, I wonder if you really understand what being "progressive" is all about, and how it's changed over the last century or so.

In some ways, the progressive movement is hard to pin down because it was no movement at all, but rather an ever-shifting coalition of organized groups and individuals who agreed on certain issues and disagreed on others. They worked together and in opposition with equal fluidity and enjoyed strongholds within each of the two major political parties. Bound together by a common self-definition and guided by malleable principles, they entertained a diversity of thought and action. It was precisely this wide range of thought and action that made progressivism so powerful.

Take a look. You might learn something: https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2019/06/01/progressives-history-227037/

The fact is that the establishment/protection of civil rights is not owned by the left, the progressives, by <insert group>, because it was brought about by people who had an interest in it. Which included people from all walks of life, and all manner of political or ideological beliefs.

Shao Kahn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118160930#Comment_118160930

Those guys back then, could legitimately have called themselves progressives with a straight face. They were fighting against very real prejudices and doing some very fine and brave work to break down barriers.

Modern progressives, from what I can see, are largely to blame for much of the division and hatred we see in society today. Trying to divide everyone up into as many groups or "types" as possible, generating fake outrage, and pitting everyone against each other.

How exactly does highlighting the lack of hard evidence to support the theory of a gender pay gap, make someone a racist anyway? Very strange logic there. Like I said, mental gymnastics!

generic_throwaway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118161508#Comment_118161508

I'm glad peopleare finally standing up for that long-oppressed and downtrodden group, white males.

Honestly, reactionaries are beyond satire sometimes.

generic_throwaway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118161264#Comment_118161264

Yes, I'm sure it was conservatives who pushed for all the key social changes we've seen over the last few centuries. Conservatives are well know for...progressive attitudes.

Honestly?

funkyzeit100

One of the worst, if not worst, developments in our countries has been the purposeful division and encouraged hatred between men and women.

As is usual, it is a handful of lunatics that drive this narrative of victimhood and blame, and a further handful that outright want to undermine society for their own sickly ends.

Men and women need to stick together as the team they are, voice their objection to these crazy things as one, and tell these looney's that they don't represent anyone but looney's.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118161848#Comment_118161848

Okay. I see the pattern here. Make a statement, meet resistance, deflect, insult indirectly, deflect, deflect etc.

Grand.

Chris_Heilong

The god damn pay gap argument has still not died it seems, There is no Pay gap, it is made up by feminists to pit men and women against each other. Men and women are paid the same per hour in jobs as it is against the law to discriminate, All other considerations are internal politics or personal circumstance due to life decisions and nothing the public need to get involved in.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118162160#Comment_118162160

All other considerations are internal politics or personal circumstance due to life decisions and nothing the public need to get involved in.

Except when it goes entirely the other way, in which case we need to step in, to remind people that equality is the goal here, because feminists are not going to complain that women are being paid or receiving more benefits than men.

Ash.J.Williams

If you want more money you ask for it , if you’re denied, you leave

generic_throwaway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118162115#Comment_118162115

Of course. Nobody seems to like realising that they are reactionaries, and they are the type of person who has stood in the face of every step of social progress in history. They imagine there was some exact moment, just a few years ago, when everything was ok, but now it has gone too far and they must roll things back. They (i.e. you) are like the doomsday cults where the end of the world, oddly enough, is always a few years ahead during their own lifetimes.

Tell yourself you would have been at the forefront of social progress if you like. You might even believe it.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118164476#Comment_118164476

Tell yourself you would have been at the forefront of social progress if you like. You might even believe it.

Except, I know I wouldn't have been. Which is the case for the vast majority of people. However, the problem with your perspective is that you're stuck in two-sides mode, lacking any appreciation for the nuances involved in social progress. You're a product of the modern social science/social justice movement, or as you prefer, the "woke" movement (which alas has been taken over by misguided progressives constantly seeking the next glorious crusade).

Standing on the sidelines, isn't the same as opposing social change. That's the other problem with your perspective. It's the continuation of the American-led agenda which says you're either with us or against us. No middle ground.

The funny thing is that I suspect you're pushing beliefs that you'll never ever commit yourself to. You'd be happy sitting at a cafe arguing political science, and dredging up vague references to theories created by people far smarter than you.. but in the end, all you would do is talk. Action is for other people. So, you would criticise, complain, judge others, etc, but not actually commit to bringing about the changes that you talk about. After all, while other peoples' sacrifices are worthy of acclaim, you wouldn't want to sacrifice anything yourself. Well, except for some small superficial gestures like taking on free-trade coffee, or products that you "know" (but not really know) that come from enlightened co-ops.

As for being a reactionary, and people not liking being that way... that's nonsense, since reactionaries tend to be very proud that they're standing against change.. and in many cases, they are right to do so. A lot of social change is misguided, with limited research performed to determine how it will effect change. In most cases, the movement to bring about change is chaotic/destructive, lacking any real direction, and simply lucky that something positive comes about from it. But I'm pretty sure you're incapable of understanding this because you've embraced the religion of sacrificing others for some greater ideal, or vague objective.

So.. yeah... your repeated posts to this thread show just how limited your understanding is, your constant need to project beliefs on to others, without any basis of evidence for doing so. Nobody said anything about standing against social change, and yet, you felt the need to call me a reactionary. I suspect you're looking for a pat on the head for showing how enlightened you are. Alas... you haven't shown any kind of real understanding, or even appreciation for the drivers behind social change, and so.. no pat on the head.