Thinking of upgrading my 151 L24

jasonb

Hi there,

So I'm thinking about upgrading this, obviously for another Electric Car, I won't be going back to ICE. My L 24 has 130k on the clock and 11 bars (last SOH of Battery was about 86% earlier in the year).

I'm probably looking at a budget of around €20k ish, or at least around €12k ish + whatever I get for my L 24, though I do have a little leeway if the right car comes along.

I'm hopefully gonna arrange some test drives, the Ioniq 38 interests me the most with regards to how the car looks, but I do need to drive it. Obviously no matter what I get my range is going to increase!

Apart from looking for some general advice from everyone here, I also have some small questions that people might be able to help with. For example, sometimes it's the little things that make a difference, and I love that I can turn the heating on remotely using the App on my phone, that the seats/steering wheel are heated, etc. on my L24. Can anyone let me know if the Ioniq 38 has those features? Does it have a reversing camera? None of those little things are essential, but they're nice to haves that I've gotten used to!

Also, if I sell my L 24 privately, what's the best way of arranging payment, is it Bank Draft? I'm asking 'cos any car I've sold in the past has only been worth a couple of grand at most, so cash was fine, but I'm hoping the L24 will be worth a bit more that that and I don't know the safest way of dealing with the sale?

Thanks...

the_amazing_raisin

Ioniq38, Leaf40 and possibly even a Kona should be within range of your budget

Although it's a sellers market these days, so don't be expecting any deals

On the other hand, it puts you in a good position for selling your current Leaf

In terms of payment, you can do a bank transfer directly into your account instead of messing around with bank drafts. Money usually arrives within a day and if using revolut it can arrive instantly

jasonb

Thanks for your reply!

Regarding the Ioniq 38, I've heard of a facelift model. Are all 38s the newer, facelift one, and all 28s the older one, or is it more complicated than that? I have heard the facelift model has the 'dimpled' grill, so I suppose I'm asking are there any 28s with the dimpled grill, or any 38s with the smooth one? Just trying to figure out an easy way to tell them apart?

Lantus

Your budget would stretch to a 2017 ioniq or 2018 leaf 40. It's a tough time to buy and demand for EVs are very high pushing used prices up.

There are some good threads on selling cars you should look up.

Mickeroo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118135850#Comment_118135850

Only the 38kwh has the facelift and all pre-facelift cars are 28kwh. I don't think you can get a 38kwh for 20k either, you'd only be looking at the 28kwh for that money (unless I've picked you up wrong on your budget) Would still be a nice upgrade on the leaf, but there is no app support, to preheat the car you need to set it by a timer in the car. The 38kwh was supposed to have app support here, but I have a feeling that it never actually happened (hopefully current owners can clarify).

slave1

38kWh has no app support.

OP, we were in the exact same scenario earlier in the year, looked at a good few options inc the Ioniq38/Peugeot e208 etc and in the end stretched the budget for a Kona 64kWh. 100% no regrets and well worth the budget stretch for significant range increase

jasonb

Thanks for all the advice everyone, keep it coming!

I do have an option to stretch my budget a little, so I'll keep that in mind. Interesting that there's no App support in the Ioniq, that's a shame, but hardly a deal breaker.

My issue with the Kona is it looks like the boot and rear cabin are a lot smaller? The extra range of the Kona would probably be wasted on me, I drive about 30-40k most days, and it's only the rare day that I need a public charger. That said, that rare day has happened a bit more recently, so that's what got me thinking. But even the Ioniq 28 would be a jump in range for me.

slave1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118136181#Comment_118136181

Correct on Kona size, but our second car so not an issue and the range payoff was (for us) worth it.

Ioniq38 a huge spec car, we were very tempted

jasonb

I've been thinking about it, and the way I see it I have two options.

Firstly, I can do a small upgrade. Like to a 2018 Leaf 40 or Ioniq 28. It'll be a newer car, with better range, and it won't break the bank in terms of cost.

Secondly, I can bite the bullet and aim higher, like a Ioniq 38 or something, and break my budget.

Not sure which I'll do yet, think I'll have a look at some cars and arrange some test drives.

By the way, what's the story with the 'mechanical' speedometer on the Leaf 40s? I like the digital look of the L24 dash, and it looks like a step back on the L40?

jasonb

Something else I just thought of, I have a tethered Zappi Type 1 charger at home. I presume this will need to be changed to Type 2? Can this be done with an adapter, or can the cable be changed, or is it a whole new Zappi charger?

slave1

The cable can be changed, I had a faulty cable on my Z2 and changed it in about 20 minutes. You can use a Type1 to Type2 adapter (we used one for a few months) but don't go there, not worth the hassle and same cost as new cable anyhow

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118136835#Comment_118136835

I believe a few Zappi owners have been able to purchase a Type 2 cable which can be swapped out from the Type 1 on a tethered Zappi (by a qualifed electrician of course)

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118136181#Comment_118136181

Another option is getting a Leaf62 at 0% finance from Nissan. It's an older design, but you can put down your current car as deposit, get a longer range car without paying interest and in 3 years trade up to something newer

jasonb

That's great about the Zappi Cable, thanks!

That's interesting about the finance, I'll look into that too. Though I really don't think I need that kind of range, we have a second car that we use for cross country driving.

jasonb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118136933#Comment_118136933

I'm new to the Finance thing, would that be HP or PCP - their website lists both. Whats the difference between them?

And they both suggest a 10% Deposit, my car would be worth a good bit more that than, right? So would they therefore take it as (say) a 20% or 30% deposit, and reduce the figures accordingly?

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118136979#Comment_118136979

Disclaimer: Go talk to Nissan for accurate figures

HP - Big deposit, usually 40% minimum, monthly repayments until the car is paid off and you own it

PCP - Smaller despoit (min 10%), montly repayments for a set time (typically 3 years) and a big payment at the end (called GMFV)

Short story with PCPs, they're a gambit by garages to get customers back every few years to buy a new car. The idea is that your current PCP gets sold or traded in, the final payment on the loan is paid off and the remaining equity goes towards a new car. You also have the option of paying this amout and the car is yours

Do all your research on the pros and cons before getting into any sort of finance agreement, but it's hard to argue with a 0% interest loan. You'll need to factor in things like GAP insurance, what happens if you decide to hand back the car and your annual mileage

It also opens up the wonderful world of predicting depreciation. The Leaf is a bit of a mystery in this regard. It's probably going to suffer somewhat since the charging network isn't going to get any better (Chademo installs are on the way out) and the Leaf62 suffers from rapidgating problems, so chances are the future value mightn't be great

On the other hand, demand for EVs isn't going down anytime soon and the Leaf is still a decent car in every other regard. And if you can save while making the monthly repayments, you're basically renting the car for 3 years and can get a bigger deposit towards your next car

jasonb

Thanks for those details, I appreciate.

So, I think I understand most of it, apart from the trade-in part of the PCP. At the end of the PCP, I can walk away with no car and not pay anything else (I've essentially rented the car for the period of the PCP) or I can pay the GMFV and the car is mine. Is that correct? What I don't understand is the trade-in part? The GMFV is still owed, and I still have to pay it, but any difference between the GMFV and the actual dealer value of the car can then be used as a deposit, right?

What I'm also struggling with is where I find the money for GMFV at the end of the PCP!

But like you say, 0% Interest is, well, interesting! :)

Actually, another quick thing, I presume I'd probably get more for my own car in a private sale than the value the Dealer would put on it as a deposit on the 0% offer? In other words, if I could, selling my own car and then using cash as a deposit would probably get me more than just using the car itself? I will of course check Nissan for their actual figures...

jasonb

Ok, here's a "how long is a piece of string" question, but approx. what is my current car worth, do ye reckon? It's a 151 L24 SV, 130,000 Km, 11 bars, SOH was 86% earlier in the year, 6.6 kWh Charger, Cold Pack, good condition, and with a Granny Cable? I'm finding it hard to compare with cars online, as I don't know if they have 6.6 charging and the Cold Pack or not. Just trying to get a sense of it. Thanks!

Unfortunately the extras above don't necessarily add much if any price at the second hand market. But at the same time they most likely will make the car to sell quicker if the owner is clued. Based on DD ads I'd say 8000 asking and see what happens.

I would actually recommend a L40 without hesitation if you can get an early car (181 or 182) that is above average in mileage. Based on what we sold ours this summer I'd say 17/18k would buy you one from non-franchised dealer like electricautos and they have pretty much twice the range of the L24 in real life and also charge at a bit quicker rate at low state of charge than a L24 before the battery rapidgates after the second charging session of the day. Also might be worth trying to broker a trade in deal with a second hand dealer. Likewise see if a Nissan dealer would do a deal on a new L40.

jasonb

Thanks for your reply!

Have been chatting to a Nissan Dealer about the 0% finance. They're offering €7,000 for mine as trade in. The price of a new L40 IU was looking at also doesn't include €1,800 delivery charges, which seems rather steep to me! Will do some maths and see what I think.

Could another Nissan Dealer potentially give me a better offer for mine, or are they all singing off the same hymn sheet?

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118140626#Comment_118140626

In general the list price of the car probably won't change, but you might get a better trade in for your current car

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118140626#Comment_118140626

Sure, worth ringing some more dealers. I have personally dealth with Windsor Airport and Naas and would recommend both of those. Naas dealer actually rang and texted me about trading in our L40 recently but we had already moved on. But they seem very keen to sell cars.

JimmyVik

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118140626#Comment_118140626

How much is the L40 you were looking at?

jasonb

The talk of 0% Finance and the hope of a decent price for my car got me interested in a new L40 SVE. €33,350 according to Nissan.ie, €35,748 according to Nissan Naas, including Metallic Paint and then the delivery charges etc. That extra €2,400 has me pausing for thought a litte, that's a chunk of money I wasn't expecting.

I'm gonna try a couple of other Nissan Dealers to see if I can get a better price for my car, and if not will have to decide if I want to go down the private sale route, and whether it'll be worth it.

TitianGerm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118140924#Comment_118140924

At those prices would you not ring around a few VW dealers and see do they have any demo ID3 available? Or the same with Peugeot for the e208?

Yes, indeed. We are talking about better part of 30k cost of change vs. 10-15k in best case to change for a SV+/SVE 181 reg L40. It's a big jump. An eNiro 64 kWh and perhaps even ID3 58 kWh are getting close enough both of which offer CCS for future proofing and more range.

jasonb

Thanks for your advice. Lack of 0% finance, and lack of a decent boot in the e208, would cause me some problems I think. The only reason I'm looking at a new car is that 0% finance, that would make it doable I reckon.

Otherwise, I'm back to looking at a 2nd hand Leaf/Ioniq.

While I am conscious of the CCS/Chademo future proofing issue, I'm not as worried about getting 58 kWh + ranges, an L40 would easily give me all the range I need for the foreseeable. I've had the L24 for three years, and I only use public chargers with it maybe once or twice a month at the moment, and some months not at all.

jasonb

Ok, am visiting Windsor Nissan Liffey Valley & Belgard on Friday. Will get a test drive of the demo SVE in Liffey Valley. Both garages want to see my car before giving a value for it, which is fair enough. Liffey Valley have said it could be April before they get an SVE in, and that's not guaranteed. Belgard say they've an SVE on the way (Naas had said they'd get an SVE for Jan if ordered in the middle of this month).

Will see what they all say on the day, thanks for all your advice so far.

If I can't get a new one to work out, I'll go back to looking at 2018/2019 ones instead I reckon.

This is all your fault the_amazing_raisin, with your talk of 0% finance! :)

JimmyVik

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118140924#Comment_118140924

That €2400 is the cost of your 0% finance :)

Look at it another way. You are paying €33k minus the price you get for your car for your last 6 years of driving.

Gile_na_gile

You could also factor SH L40s and L62s into the mix from Nissan dealers, which are available instantly. Personally, I think the value point is a SH L62 for 30k ish or an L40 201/202 SVE for around 25k. For your situation, it sounds like the 40kWh battery is sufficient. I got a new L40 SV in 2019 for just over 28.5k with parking sensors. Seems a lot to pay 5k more now for the SVE trim, but there are shortages.

jasonb

I think one of the things that annoyed me about the unexpected "extra" €2,400 is that even the PCP/HP figures/examples on the website use the base figures (not including delivery charges etc.) so you use those examples to start figuring out your finance and then you ring a garage and find out it's more.

When it comes down to it, I'll have to calculate exactly how much a 0% new car costs me over the term of the loan, compare that with the cost of a x% SH car over the term of the loan, and see if the difference is worth it. Assuming new cars are actually available, 3 different garages have given me three different initial answers to that question!

Gile_na_gile

They all have access to the same pool of stock, and the delivery costs are just another makey-uppy cost which offsets the loss incurred through 0% APR on PCP. Always good to take your time and be prepared to let it slide since you are not in a rush. I wouldn't spend over 30k on an L40 now with the Megane-E just around the corner, plus the ID.3 available, but secondhand, the LEAF is a great medium-sized non-SUV car just like the Ioniq 28kWh. It is a first-time EV car, for the most part, but a solid one.

jasonb

Yep, one of the garages also has a 181 L40 SVE, so I can compare the costs for the two options (new and SH) and see how I feel.about it.

Have also asked Electric Autos to value my car as well, to see what they'd pay for it.

Redfox25

Alas they all tack on delivery charges in most if not all dealers.

Might be worth asking if there are paint or fabric protection products in that delivery charge that you could opt out of and save a few quid but not sure if Nissan do that or not.

jasonb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118142681#Comment_118142681

Yep, I reread the email I got, the charges include Metallic paint, car mats, supagard and delivery. So there are possible opt-outs there.

jasonb

Just a quick update...

Electric Autos had a look at my car today, and are getting back to me with a price. They did a LeafSpy report, which is handy, so I now know I have a SOH of 83.35%, which is good to know.

Am visiting a couple of Dealers tomorrow to get their value on mine, and their best offers for a new car, or for a SH one if I spot one I like. I'm hoping by tomorrow evening to have a better take on whether I'm going to go new, or go SH, and whether I'll do a trade in with mine, or sell it privately. At this stage I'm fairly certain I want an L40 SVE/Tekna (I just don't know the year!), but I'll know that better tomorrow when I drive one.

The L40 will be a grand upgrade coming from a bit degraded L24, and I agree the full spec is the way to go if the price is right. They are very nippy compared to the mk 1.5 and also handle a bit better in my opinion. Also the ProPilot and automatic wipers/high beam work remarkably well in the car.

Also do keep an eye on the launch edition L40: There is a way to upgrade the halogen headlamps cheaply (less than 100 quid with aftermarket bulbs) btw if a SV+/Acenta+/LaunchEdT with ProPilot with winter pack would tempt you also as the lack of leather and those lights are the only difference really.

I did that on ours as the poor lights were the only bugbear (and the lack of heaters on the Irish Launch Edition also). And you've gotten used to the poor halogen high beams already so these upgraded lights would be much better than your old car. It's was a night/day type of upgrade.

jasonb

Thanks for the advice!

Yeah, the Leather Seats don't really interest me half as much as the cold pack and better lights, though obviously that might change tomorrow when I drive one with leather seats! 😊 I'll definitely keep my eyes open with the different options out there...

the_amazing_raisin

I used to be a big fan of leather seats but I've gone off them. Most of the fabrics used for seats these days are pretty comfortable and clean easily enough

And since they're breathable, no back sweat to deal with on warm days

jasonb

Well, had a test drive in a 211 L40 SVE today and it's a lovely car, so that's my choice of car confirmed.

Now I have to decide if I want a new one, or a second hand one. I've done the figures with a couple of places, and when it comes down to it it's basically €100 extra a month (for 5 years) for a new car. Or €6,000 in total. So I just have to decide if I think a new car is worth that extra money.

A little advice, is the Supagard (for paint and interiors), GAP Insurance (if the car is written off) and Smart 36 Insurance (for chips and paintwork damage etc.) worth it?

Thanks!

jasonb

After thinking about it over the weekend, I've bitten the bullet and ordered a new L40 SVE. I decided the extra €100 a month was worth it for a new car, I can afford the repayments. I got 4 different values on my car, and the highest was from Nissan Naas, so I went with that as a trade in. I might get a little more with a private sale, but I might not, and obviously trade in is a lot less hassle.

I've been told I'll definitely have one in January, so we'll see how that goes!

Thanks for all the advice everyone, it's much appreciated.

the_amazing_raisin

You'll definitely want the GAP insurance in case the car is written off. The other two are kind of dependent on how likely you are to scratch the car

VW have equivalent products for their new car (I think all the brands do) and I decided to get the bodywork insurance

My reasoning was that the paint protection could still get scratched, but money can fix everything, so the insurance would work out better.

I'm going to bring in the car before trade in time and get as much of the scratches (I've already put a few on 😬) fixed before I get the car valued

That's the plan anyway, ask me how well it worked in 3 years

jasonb

Yeah, I got some advice about GAP and Smart 36, and the consensus I got was that it's more aimed at PCP purchases (which I think yours is?) as it's so important to have the car in good condition at the end of the 3 years.

I'm going with HP, I just didn't like the "pressure" of keeping the car spotless and keeping an eye on mileage etc., it would feel more like a rental than my car, if you know what I mean?

peposhi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118151689#Comment_118151689

The year doesn’t really matter. Once you get a well kept and tidy car and the deal is good - go for it.

peposhi

Ugh… didn’t read the full thread before I answered above…

Excellent choice on the new car. 0% interest rate? If yes - happy days…

Go for the Supaguard, it would certainly help you keep the car cleaner and less prone to get dirty anyway…

jasonb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118184235#Comment_118184235

Yep, 0%, or I wouldn't be buying it! :) Got the Supagard too, as I have an 8 year old so I reckoned it would come in handy!

Well wear and hope you'll get your new car soon. The SVE spec is nice. Which colour did you go for?

jasonb

Thanks! Hopefully it will arrive in Jan, and the earlier the better, but we'll see. Technically if it's delayed it doesn't really affect me, I still have my L24 and it'll do me just fine until the new one comes in. First new car in 20 years, so that's exciting!

I went with Black, that's always my first option!

jasonb

Quick update and quick question...

Garage have confirmed that I have loan approval for the 0% Finance (as expected, but you never know!) and in even better news, they have received delivery of my car, and will register it once they open in the new year. So this should move fairly quickly. I'm gonna drop in next week to have a look at the car.

As for the quick question, what do I have to do to remove my email address from my current Car, so that the Nissan App no longer works with it, and I don't get email etc. when charging finishes?

Thanks...

slave1

I just went into my Nissan account and removed the car from my garage, that was all

jasonb

Can you let me know where you went into that @slave1 , how you get to it? Is it an online website? I only use the Nissan EV App.

Dropped into the garage today to actually see my new car, and got to take it out for a little spin. Very happy with it, comfy and lots of new gadgets to learn. The Camera Rear View mirror is kinda cool.