Hydrogenated Vegetable Oil - Home heating

ryanfitzgerald797

Can anyone help me here? I have a 2001 house with D3 rating and no plumbing for central heating. Just a fireplace. I am not on the gas line.

Is HVO a good option or oil fired kerosene which can be converted to HVO if it ends up cheaper some day? Is there any grants or tax relief on this if I am getting HVO boiler and radiators plumbed and installed? Or is there a better heating option that I'm not thinking of?

redlough

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120259382#Comment_120259382

HVO doesn't seem to be consumer ready yet*

You can buy a new kerosene boiler now which will support HVO in the future, Firebird or Grant boilers support.

How is a house from 2001 built without plumbing/heating?

ryanfitzgerald797

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120259482#Comment_120259482

It was built with electric storage heaters downstairs and electric panel heaters upstairs, everyone on the road was in the same boat originally

redlough

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120259493#Comment_120259493

You could try Infrared heaters

Check the group "infrared heating Ireland users and experience" on facebook

Now it is the company selling them that runs it but a number of customer reviews etc

If no plumbing then it could be an option. Just beware that its a 1:1 COP

ryanfitzgerald797

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120259549#Comment_120259549

Thanks for that yeah any 1:1 COP is of course going to be more expensive that's why we're ready to invest in central heating

ongarite

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120259582#Comment_120259582

But central heating COP will be less than 1:1 due to losses in burner efficiency & piping water around home. The only advantage used to be it's cheap price & probably for you is the ability to have heat on demand.

ryanfitzgerald797

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120259612#Comment_120259612

But surely heating 8 radiators 5 hours a day in the winter will be far cheaper by oil-fired central heating than anything based solely on electricity, even if kerosene goes back to its worst price at beginning of Ukraine conflict?

redlough

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120263471#Comment_120263471

Potentially but as the person said above the COP on kerosene, if I could find it, is 0.7 or 0.8.

If you have no heating system currently then running pipes etc to install a boiler plus radiators is going to be significant. The infrared seem to be an easier installation based on the videos etc and you can control per room so only heat the rooms you need

You need to sit down and do the maths, no easy answer without a lot of work on pricing etc

ryanfitzgerald797

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120264018#Comment_120264018

After some digging and calculations oil is definitely going to be a lot cheaper than infrared radiators for heating 8 radiators, even if it goes back up to last year's ridiculous prices again. The only way I'd see infrared being better is if you only need 2 or 3 radiators. So I guess my curiosity remains as to whether there's another option for central heating that could be cheaper? I have heard bad things about wood pellets in cost of running and maintenance.

monseiur

Steer well clear of wood pellets. We live in an ever changing world, but as things stand at the moment kerosene is the way to go. A good plumber should be able to install it with little disruption. Depending on house layout a channel may have to be opened at front and back door to sink pipes but otherwise all pipes can be run along skirting board. Outdoor boilers come in units that are fully weatherproof, they are no bigger than an under counter fridge, costs approx €2,000.00. But needless to say insulation is very important - both attic & walls, and double or ideally triple glazed windows & doors. Grants may be available - check the SEAI website for details.

redlough

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120264222#Comment_120264222

Uptake on wood pellets didn't happen so it kind of died out. I have a wood pellet room heater and it is perfect, a lot better than a standard wood/multi fuel stove. Putting them in for a heating system requires a large hopper so not ideal to be honest.

If you have a decently insulated house that will be half the battle.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120264555#Comment_120264555

Little disruption? I wouldn't say that. Running the pipes around an entire house is a big job if doing retrofit. Even if you plan on taking off all the skirting boards and running behind them its no small task and can end up been very messy.

I would be interested to see a finished job of an entire house, the times I seen it done was for 1-2 rooms to existing system and was not ideal

MegamanBoo

This doesn't look like a long term runner. Doesn't seem to be enough of a c02 reduction, if this stuff is really just palm oil from the Philippines which has replaced forestry.

There might be some place for biofuels in future for heavy machinery/aviation but I can't see them being an alternative for general heating and transport.

ryanfitzgerald797

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120278587#Comment_120278587

You think a CO2 reduction of 90% compared to kerosene is not enough of an incentive? It's the only option for most of the 600,000 homes heated by kerosene unless everyone gets given €60,000 - € 80,000 for sufficient renovation for heat pump. 10 times less CO2 is quite a lot.

MegamanBoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120279211#Comment_120279211

The problem is that it's not 90% reduction if you factor in transport and displacing forests to grow it. That's before you get into food shortages/price increases if there's a major switch to biofuels.

I'd love if there were an easy substitute for kerosene. Boiler systems have been relatively cheap, effective and easy to run.

I just don't think this is it.

Even if someone was looking at this from a purely economic perspective I'd imagine the next few years will see crackdowns on efforts like this that are seen as green washing or just clever carbon accounting.

Calahonda52

HVO for domestic kero burners is a one way bet as opposed to in the diesel car where it can mix with diesel so no drama if no HVO.

where as a red diesel burner would be fine

Data centres re ramping up their storage of HVO for the gen sets as it has a 10 year life, so its along way from being priced as kero