No August is not the start of Autumn

Today, August 1st, is not the start of Autumn. Summer is June, July & August. We are in the Northern hemisphere which has the same seasons throughout. There is no mysterious weather phenomenon enveloping Ireland that gives us different seasons to the rest of the hemisphere.

The "Irish summer" of May, June, July is complete and utter bullshit. Please stop it. And before anyone says it, no farmers do not set the seasons.

IRE60

Jasus - keep the togs on! And punctuate that headline.

Yeah the summer togs.

Yellow_Fern

August makes more sense as autumn

pcadhain

Do you propose we stop calling September "Meán Fomhair" (middle of Autumn) and October "Deireadh Fómhair" (end of Autumn)?

Irish calendar - Wikipedia

PopePalpatine

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117689997#Comment_117689997

You'd have a point if July was renamed to "September". Fecking Caesar ruined it for everyone.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117689997#Comment_117689997

Yes exactly, the same way we stopped calling November 1st the start of the new year.

I mean you can still use the Irish words and recognise its original meaning, but just stop taking it literally. Similar how we say Dia Dhuit and don't literally mean "God be with you", we just mean "hello".

EmmetSpiceland

August is, most definitely, Autumn.

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

Everyone knows the Irish summer started 10 days ago and ended last Friday. Everything before that was winter and everything after that is winter.

NIMAN

Our heating went on last night for the 1st time this 'summer', so it must be autumn!

mohawk

Agreed OP. June, July and August are our warmest months. The kids are on their summer holidays not their Autumn holidays. Usually still have plenty of growth and colour in the garden etc. Also November is not Winter, February is colder and more likely that we would get snow in February then in November.

Beechwoodspark

Would agree. August is definitely autumn - early autumn but autumn no less.

humberklog

Nah, seasons are feelings of the senses. They're in romance not science. Autumn starts mostly sometime towards the 2nd part of September and continues towards end of November. Winter closes in early December and lasts forever into somewhere at the start of March. Spring, brief and lovely, comes mid March into the 1st big bright warm sunny day on May. Summer is from May to September.

It not just temperature. It's colours and light and smells and people's reaction to it. It's not the dead hand of some monk's want or an ancient king's edict or a 19th century meteorologist's method of clarification.

If you set dates on seasons your heart is dead and lacks the ability to embrace natural emotions and you are forever frozen in a pedantic academic winter.

Bobblehats

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117690355#Comment_117690355

—-

Isambard

longest day c21 June, ie Midsummer. Autumn begins about a month and half later, ie at the end of the second half of summer, roughly 7th August

If you want to simplify it just based on the normal weather. Spring: March April May, Summer: June July August, Autumn: Sept Oct Nov and Winter:Dec Jan Feb.

May June July as Summer actually closer

Point proven, Irish people do not understand the seasons. You don't get to just make it up yourself.

Allinall

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117690562#Comment_117690562

Which is exactly what you’re doing.

I got an email from Lifestyle this morning listing runners that I need for Fall.🙄

I definitely think today is the first day of Autumn, it even feels like it, I too was tempted to put the heating on the last few nights but made a hot water bottle instead. ☺️

source

The Celtic seasons which we observe are different to the meteorological seasons, they're based around the summer and winter solstace. Longest day is mid summer, shortest is mid winter.

It's not arbitrary and has nothing to do with farmers, it's based on a natural phenomenon which makes more sense than the seasons observed by the rest of the northern hemisphere.

JupiterKid

August is the final month of summer. About the only things Autumnal about this month is the harvest at the end and perhaps the longer nights.

So IMO we have another month of Summer. As so many boardsies loathe sunny and warm weather, I have a feeling these same individuals actually want Summer to be over already.

Well...it’s not. 😎☀️☀️☀️

Shakey_jake

Only killjoys think august is the start of autumn, i actually consider sept a summer / autumn hybrid

cdeb

Yup - I think the idea of summer being May/Jun/Jul is also around longer than Jun/Jul/Aug too.

Our weather is too changeable to base seasons off. The grand stretch in the evening though - which is what we do base it off - is very reliable.

I always find it funny that some people get their knickers in such a twist over something uniquely Irish, when we should be celebrating it as part of our unique culture.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117689997#Comment_117689997

Well in English September means the 7th month, October means the 8th month, November the 9th, December the 10th.

Housefree

We have cambers to tell us, when the light shines in for the Autumn Equinox at Loughcrew Cairns. And the little people drink whiskey and play some music. The Autumn has begun

Sure, didn't even have a proper spring this year and I have the (late planted due to frost) veg garden to prove it. To those saying summer is over... have you the cruelty of heart to stand among half-grown veggies and shout "You're getting two weeks summer this year and that IT! Now hurry up and feed me."

Didn't think so :D

August almost always has crappy weather, even when we got unusually hot summer weather in 2006, 2013, 2014 and 2018 August was a write off

Jim_Hodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117689997#Comment_117689997

So you want September to be the 7th month, October the 8th, November 9th and December the 10th? That makes sense.

TheValeyard

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117690352#Comment_117690352

Alright were done here. Good job everybody.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058201728/no-august-is-not-the-start-of-autumn

Wrong.

Duckworth_Luas

In twenty years time nobody will give a **** what month it is!

TheValeyard

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117692810#Comment_117692810

Is there a way to set a reminder for 20yesrs here?

OneEightSeven

I've always adhered to the metrological calendar. It's scientific and makes sense. The others just seem arbitrary.

dotsman

Officially, in Ireland, June, July & August are the summer months.

Some people think differently because they still abide by what they were taught when they 5 years old in a Catholic school (May-July is the catholic church calendar, and based on saint's days and other such nonsense). At the same time they were being fed this nonsense, they were also taught about baby jesus, the tooth fairy, easter bunny and santa claus.

It has never once occurred to these people that they were getting their "summer" holidays in July & August in primary school; June, July & August in secondary school and even June July, August & some/all of September in college. They never questioned why the 5 months of daylights savings are November to March (final month of Autumn, 3 months of Winter and the first month of Spring). And, of course never questioned why August is warmer than May (on average). They will also likely be unaware that the official department of education position on it is that, while May-July is incorrect, it is ok to teach the wrong seasons in a Catholic primary school (but teach the correct seasons in educate together, non-denom schools etc), as students will be taught the correct seasons later when they enter second-level - except, for a reason that only the Department of Education can answer - the seasons of the year don't feature in any subject at second-level, so a considerable number of Irish people go through life with a stupid misconception. Only in Ireland.

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058201728/no-august-is-not-the-start-of-autumn

That's just one definition you are running with.

Enjoy your Autumn bank holiday.

Quantum Erasure

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117692810#Comment_117692810

because with global warming there'll be no seasons

q2ice

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117697744#Comment_117697744

Officially, in Ireland, May, June & July are the summer months.

Midsummer is the 21st of June. As midsummer is in the middle of June it means that May and July are the other Summer Months.

Midwinter is the 21st of December. Conversely the other Winter Months are November and January.

This also means that February, March and April are Spring and August, September and October are Autumn.

Edit: this predates Catholicism in Ireland. Also, daylight savings cannot really be used as they daylight savings were only introduced in Ireland in 1916 in a bid to save energy (specifically oil lamps). They include the darkest evenings which are in Winter and the start of Spring.

The only stupid misconception is your own

ps200306

There's no standardised definition of seasons. Different countries use meteorological, astronomical, climatological or cultural definitions. I'm interested in all four subjects but I use the traditional Irish seasons, with spring starting on February 1st and autumn on August 1st. If that's a bit too "catholic" for some people, well the catholic feasts exist in the first place because they replaced older pagan ones. Blame the druids. Either way, it's nothing to apologise for, nor worth getting the panties in a twist about.

The fact of the matter is, the Irish climate is too variable to base anything around. The conventional meteorological definitions are better suited to continental climates with larger seasonal temperature variations, where winter snows arrive and depart to a reasonably standard schedule. This year I was watching birds collect nesting material in early January. I've often seen trees start to push out new buds without even the decency to wait for the end of December. First cut of the grass could be required anywhere between early February and the end of March.

I've an additional objection to summer starting in June by either meteorological or astronomical definitions. On the Atlantic fringe of Europe it is the month in which we get the "return of the westerlies", sometimes called the European monsoon. The westerly Atlantic airflow often weakens in April and May, only to return in June. A resurgent jet stream dips south and conveys a stream of Atlantic depressions in our direction.

I reckon you're better off just relishing our long daylight hours -- we have sunsets after 9pm from the start of May until mid-August. In my book you should start looking for good weather when the clocks go forward in March, because it's so often a case of "blink and you've missed it". Constant changes of light and shade are one of the most enchanting things about the Irish climate.

If I were to muck with our seasons at all, I'd reduce them to two -- defined by the clock changes and daylight saving hours. Even at that it would be hard, with our climate, to know what to call them -- Wet and Not-So-Wet? Mild and Milder? Salad and Beer?

maccored

OP needs to understand that seasons and weather change around the world. August might be summer elsewhere - its autumn here though

https://www.timeanddate.com/calendar/aboutseasons.html

"In Ireland, St Brigid's Day on February 1 is often thought to mark the beginning of spring in the ancient Celtic calendar system."

Hotblack Desiato

It's all entirely arbitrary, so there is no good reason for all the seasons to be the same length either.

How about this:

Winter: Nov, Dec, Jan, Feb

Spring: Mar, Apr

Summer: May, Jun, Jul, Aug

Autumn: Sep, Oct

Really, spring and autumn are more of a transition between winter and summer rather than seasons in their own right - and our weather is so variable anyway. It can still be very wintry in March, it can still be quite summery in September. We had a late spring and late frosts this year as a poster pointed out above.

August in autumn is crazy talk. Sea temperatures are still rising and the days are still long.

Sleeper12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117697744#Comment_117697744

Can you please post an "official" link from government of met office site?

What.Now

Sould it not go on how much daytime each month gets.

Daylight hours.GIF

If it was then the Summer months would be May, June & July

What.Now

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117699420#Comment_117699420

https://www.worlddata.info/europe/ireland/sunset.php

dotsman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117699354#Comment_117699354

https://www.met.ie/cms/assets/uploads/2021/06/spring21sum.pdf

https://www.met.ie/climate/climate-of-ireland

Hell, here is their fun facts for primary school children (but not to be shown to the Catholics!) https://www.met.ie/cms/assets/uploads/2021/02/YP-Fun-Facts-Meteorological-Seasons.pdf

dotsman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117697798#Comment_117697798

You are, of course going to provide a link to this "official" definition from a state body?

Your post is just a whole stream of misinformation, I barely know where to start. Don't worry, I don't blame you, I blame are poor education system that prioritises religion over science.

First, June 21st in not midsummer. Midsummer is actually June 24th.

June 24th is not the "middle" of June.

Midsummer is only relevant to the astronomical seasons, with midsummer marking the beginning of summer! As you appear to be a firm believer of the Irish Catholic Church calendar, I would suggest you stay away from astrology - it's nothing but the devil's work.

There really is no specific date associate with the term "midwinter". That term usually refers to the middle period of winter when the weather is at it's harshest (which, in Ireland would be January/February).

Daylight savings applies for the 5 most wintry months. It is silly to think that the most wintry months are winter and 2/3rds of spring. The whole concept of spring/autumn is transition from summer to winter an vice versa. Thus, the 5 months apply to the final month of Autumn, the 3 winter months and the first month of Spring.

Of course everything related to season/calendars predates Catholicism. That's not the point. The point is that the catholic church in Ireland have their own calendar based on saint's days and that is the one taught to children who attend these schools (which still remains the majority of children to this day). Because you were taught this in primary school, you now believe that the church calendar is the "official" calendar.

As per my previous posts for related links, but I will leave you with this one from a teacher who has trouble understanding the stupidity of the Irish curriculum (and also the confusion with people thinking the church calendar is somehow related to the astronomical one).

http://www.infanteducation.ie/infanted-blog/teaching-season

For a discussion on the validity of the Easter Bunny, we can discuss that on another thread...

q2ice

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117700393#Comment_117700393

In my opinion, your previous posts are riddled with misinformation and highlight your lack of education. 😆

You keep mentioning how the seasons are a product of the Irish Catholic Church however you fail to recognise that there are actually 6 seasons in Catholicism not four - Advent, Christmas, Ordinary Time, Lent, Holy Week and Easter. I have never once said the Catholic Church is the official calendar - it most definitely is not.

You also keep interchanging the terms Astrological and Astronomical - they are two different concepts. Astronomy is a science which studies celestial objects, space and the universe. Astrology is a pseudoscience - a collection of beliefs and superstitions based on superstitions.

The summer solstice this year in Ireland was on June 21st - this marked the day with the longest period of Sunlight - hence Midsummer. The summer solstice in Ireland is usually either the 20th or 21st of June.

The winter solstice this year in Ireland will be on December 21st - this will mark the day with the shortest period of Sunlight - hence Midwinter. (again usually 20th or 21st). Midwinter has nothing to do with how "harsh" the weather. It is half way through winter and the date after which we start to get more daylight.

Daylight savings has nothing to do with the weather and it is 'silly' to think it does. 😅 It is based on how much daylight is available on a given particular day (saving daylight). It is the practice of advancing the clocks forward by one hour in the spring so that darkness falls at a later time - thus having more sunglight during summer days. We then revert to Standard Time in Autumn.

Edit: You can discuss the Easter bunny away on another thread if you like, to your hearts content. I hate to break it to you though, its not real 😎

dotsman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117700694#Comment_117700694

Go to www.google.ie

Type in "Midsummer".

Come back here and let us know the date given...

q2ice

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117700752#Comment_117700752

The date given was 21st June. Whats your point?

dotsman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117700760#Comment_117700760

I highly doubt that...

q2ice

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117700776#Comment_117700776

Friday the 24th is the Christian Church's designated date for Midsummer as it is the feast day of St. John the Baptist. You previously denigrated the teaching of the seasons in school to be the doing of the Catholic Church, then turn around and give the church's date for Midsummer. Priceless 😅

Well fook me, I'm confused now. Can we at least agree on what century it is and Ireland's general location before I lose me bearings altogether?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058201728/no-august-is-not-the-start-of-autumn

While August isn't Autumn to me, I feel that the hysteria about it from some quarters in Ireland is part of the Irish cultural cringe.

Fact is most countries had the Irish system in the past - why? Because the hours of sunlight are easier to measure than minor changes in temperature. Saying that February is winter because on average it is one or two degrees colder than November wouldn't be obvious the past, How could they in the absence of proper modern instrumentation, tell the difference between 1 or two degrees on average.

And of course the temperature is wildly erratic from year to year, a given November could easily be colder than a February.

Anyway midsummer festivals in Europe are in June, not July -- and googling midwinter returns Dec 21. I am fine with the idea of either, both the hottest 3 months or the longest 3 months in terms of light can work.

( What doesn't work for me is Winter starting on Dec 21, some US weather forecasters used to say that, because they use astronomical seasons. Always bugged me when I lived there.)