Irish Property Market chat II - *read mod note post #1 before posting*

The Student

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118966362#Comment_118966362

I am no so sure. If anything I would see more and more people priced out of Dublin.

I know alot have already being priced out but I expect the majority of new properties will be build to rent targeted at the wellpaid immigrants who most likely will be housed as part of their renumeration.

I do agree there will be increased pressure on the other big cities eg Cork, Galway and probably some within commuting distance of Dublin.

The Student

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118966392#Comment_118966392

Our ability to decide our future financial decisions may be taken out of our hands again. Either by the IMF or the EU.

Amadan Dubh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118966392#Comment_118966392

The thing is, SF are almost certainly going to be in power in less than 3 years so like it or not, you'll have to deal with them. It is a genuine prospect that they will be a majority partner in government at least. People worrying about it will need to start to realise what is likely to change when this happens instead of thinking that somehow FF and FG will pull a victory out of the flames or else they will be caught with their pants down when SF raise taxes on higher earners or corporates to pay for the additional, free spending socialist policies.

Amadan Dubh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118966606#Comment_118966606

Its why our central bank is a bit useless, serving as a data collector more than anything. They can't do much to ensure price stability.

The Student

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118966624#Comment_118966624

I don't agree. Our central bank introduced some restraints on mortgage levels.

Our main issue is political decisions and their impact on our/State finances.

The financial implications of our political decisions is the control that will be taken away from us.

Timing belt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118966624#Comment_118966624

Central bank lending rules have ensured prices don’t totally run away

jill_valentine

Quick amateur hour question folks - there's an apartment in my development which has apparently never been occupied. It would suit a relative of mine down to the ground, (and very few other people for various reasons).

I'm told it's "owned by the bank" by some of the neighbours, but nobody has further details and it's not under management.

How might I go about confirming who actually owns it, or approaching somebody with a view to buying it?

Timing belt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118967273#Comment_118967273

Would be extremely hard to find out because if it’s owned by a bank it has probably already been sold on to some fund when they sold on their bad book

Pussyhands

This government are a disgrace. Outbidding first time buyers to buy houses for refugees. When are people going to take to the streets?

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118965666#Comment_118965666

Of the median gross income is 80k it gives a mortgage if 280 k plus 10% deposit 33k( which should be achievable with this median couple) plus the HTB tax back of 30k gives 340k.

So the median couple can afford the average house. The other test is repayment capacity. 280k mortgage will cost about 1250/ month in repayments or 15k/ year. That is 27% of a 55k take home income of this median couple.

J_1980

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118966609#Comment_118966609

Yes all the American companies will happily pay these extra taxes and see their employees fleeced at 60%.

you severely underestimate the 2nd order effects in taxation. Remember Hollande in France? Wealth tax and 70% top tax rate? France is still suffering from the outflow of capital/wealthy people to this day.

Amadan Dubh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118967673#Comment_118967673

That's what SF and friends will do to Ireland and we'll only have ourselves to blame for letting housing affordability and supply issues get to crisis levels for so long, pushing voters to populism. The IDA has cited the political risk of SF getting into government to its activities, don't for one second think it will be like a Labour/FF type government with SF; it will be grim.

Browney7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118966592#Comment_118966592

The cynic in me thinks it will be more the state via HAP and enhanced leasing schemes paying the bulk of the rent on the new build BTRs and topped up by the tenant. Just look at the homeless HAP thresholds. Are the techbros/sisters really going to live in the new build BTRs in Cabra, clongriffin, ballyer etc paying 2 Gs a month? I have my doubts

J_1980

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118968215#Comment_118968215

I wouldn’t worry about house prices if Sf/lefties come in. Financial markets are starting to show zero leniency (like in Chile currently) given the historic 100% fail rate of left wing politics. Ie they won’t have time/resources to enact their program.

Murph85

If the **** comes crashing down with sf. Ffg are directly responsible for sf vote surge, based on the housing disgrace. Ffg might show some interest in doing something about it in future...

Murph85

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118964245#Comment_118964245

ItS behind a paywall.. can you screenshot it ?

I have never voted SF in my life but they're about to get a new voter now all because of the policies the current charlatans have introduced regarding housing and the corruption surrounding it. I will honestly say that FG will never ever get a vote from me again.

The cynic in me is thinking they are milking it for what it's worth now before they get kicked out at the next election fully in the expectation that the country is going into the gutter and can blame SF when it does and then try stroll back in after that.

iColdFusion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118967273#Comment_118967273

If you go onto the land registry website you should be able to buy the folio for €5, that should give the name and address of the owner and the details of the bank that have a lean on the title, I've never used it for an apt though.

Option 2 might be to go to your management company to see if they have contact details, someone might be paying the management charges

https://www.landdirect.ie/index

There might be some difficulty in getting a mortgage on it though if all the official paperwork when it was built wasn't completed and whether it can be occupied immediately which is likely if it was never occupied or rented.

Villa05

The whole scenario looks like a unique opportunity to bring back supply of unused stock.

I've heard of voluntary donations of housing being refused for miscellaneous stuff like lack of some key attribute like lack of or broken heating boiler. Maybe such issues could be corrected for the cost of a hotel room for 3 weeks. Then you have a house for 3 years.

6k homes in the fair deal scheme, could surely be used for short to medium term again with a small bit of spending

Could we ask Zelinsky for a small team of builders to be excused and allowed to come here for 6 months to help in bringing some of our empties back to liveable condition for their women and children. They seem far more adept at getting things done over there. Maybe their women and children could do alot of it while we are thinking about it.

With regard to empties assess the condition and cost of bringing them back into use. Where the cost is viable to bring them back into stock, offer the owner to do it in return for the utilisation of the home for 3 years. Where the owner refuses tax the owner a percentage of the utility value of the home.

Tax waste more and work less.

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118968929#Comment_118968929

It's too long for a screenshot. I didn't realise it was paywalled, apologies. I found it through Google which sometimes overrides paywalls - perhaps if you search for it and go in through a search link it will show the full piece.

iColdFusion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118969085#Comment_118969085

This would be the most logical solution to the issue, the government funding the emergency refurbishment of houses which would be difficult projects for normal house buyers and people would be happy to see derelict houses coming back into use but I think we all know it'll never happen, councils will use their extra cash to outbid private buyers to meet whatever arbitrary housing targets the government sets for them, usual lazy public sector shite.

combat14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118967454#Comment_118967454

wwonderful to hear the logic that the median earning couple here are having absolutely no trouble buying the averaged price house

looks like the median single earner here are absolutely #$%ed

combat14

is it even safe to buy houses built in this country over the last 10-15 years.... looks like the state is facing as usual writing another blank check to resolve builders/engineers shoddy work...

Expert warns defective blocks likely more widespread and scheme could cost €5bn

Aidan O'Connell, who is a structural expert, told RTÉ's This Week he believes that up to 12 counties in total may be impacted by the issue and that the total eventual cost of the State's Defective Concrete Blocks Grant Scheme could reach €5bn.

"I am worried about this increasing over the coming years, because it takes a long time for the pyrite problem to manifest itself in blocks ... it can be anything from ten to 15 years," he said.

He also said he can see the cost of the State's grant scheme "certainly going well above the €2.2 billion allocated.

Villa05

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118969394#Comment_118969394

Is there anyway of taking it out of the councils remit and hand it to the red Cross, Housing associations, other charities

With the private sector threatening to pull the plug on existing projects, extra labour could potentially be available for such projects.

Would open the door for small developers and self employed into guaranteed regular work as opposed to sub contracting for the larger developers and the risks that entail.

iColdFusion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118969466#Comment_118969466

I would guess the government and council's would have to run it so they can give themselves the emergency powers for funding, planning exemptions etc, can't let anyone else break the rules plus leaving it up to a few different voluntary could end up with them competing with each other for builders if they all need to refurb say 2 houses each in the same town.

Now I agree with you it would be better because alot of councils are failing miserably to bring back into use their own vacant social housing stock for years

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/news/special-report-4000-properties-owned-by-councils-empty-in-a-housing-crisis-41244351.html

Villa05

A good article on commercial vacancy and potential to convert to residential

According to the Geo Directory Commercial Vacancy Rates Report for Q4 2021, there were 29,317 vacant commercial units dispersed across the State. This was the highest level recorded by GeoDirectory in nine years of reporting.

Mr McDonald also pointed out the issue with office buildings that were built in the 1970s and 1980s which no longer meet contemporary office requirements.

"It seems to me to make a lot of sense to convert those buildings into residential rather than demolishing them," he said

 McDonald was critical of Government housing policy which he said has "essentially been determined by the property lobby".

"What that involves is the creation of blocks of build to rent apartments which is the most profitable development model around and that’s of interest to big institutional investors

“A lot of [local authorities] seem to think older buildings are liabilities rather than assets.

“It is a systemic failure to recognise the value of town buildings as liabilities rather than assets and potential future homes where people would have immediate access to shops and other services

Room to improve: Turning vacant commercial property into residential accommodation | BreakingNews.ie

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/room-to-improve-turning-vacant-commercial-property-into-residential-accommodation-1294121.html

By the end of 2021, there were 29,317 vacant commercial units dispersed across the State

Villa05

And what we see on the media is the government frantically searching for housing to meet the refugee crisis.

Simultaneously so much under utilised property under there noses, much of it in their own control

jill_valentine

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118969001#Comment_118969001

Much appreciated.

So per the folio, the last entry on it is a judgement mortgage against the (now deceased) builder by one of his industry creditors in 2013. Am I correctly interpreting it then that technically the apartment - or at least a mortgage on it - belongs to the creditor?

The Student

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118970638#Comment_118970638

The first creditor listed on the folio has first call on the property. Whoever is listed first is the owner of the property.

The creditor obtained a judgement mortgage for non payment of a debt.

Ozark707

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118969620#Comment_118969620

The reality is that even with the best will in the world much of this under utilised property cannot be brought on stream in time in terms of the numbers coming in. The authorities have no option but to buy/rent as much as they can if they want to be able to house them