Pistol

Paddy Mc Ginn

Is there any way you can get a 9mm pistol for lamping foxes/deer hunting. The use would be for putting down a wounded deer/fox.

Cass

Short answer - No.

Long answer - Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo.





The licensing of centrefire restricted short arms was banned/prohibited back in 2009. So other than a discussion on ballistics, the need to be a member of a range, the loophole on using one for hunting, etc. its all made moot by the fact you won't get a new license for one, hence won't get one.

Feisar

I had to dispatch a deer one at close range that had been hit by a car. With a fully decked out TRG it was awkward to say the least.

otmmyboy2

Yeah, in some ways the UK is rather better in firearms laws since hunters can own pistols over there, usually restricted to 1-5 shots, for the purpose of humane dispatch.

Over here apparently there is zero thought to such things, bar for vets and similar.

Cass

There was "talks" of such a scheme here back before the ban, but it died a quick death once plans for the ban/2009 act were announced.

By talks i mean it was unofficial and involved the NPWS rangers having lads that were licensed for such firearms to be "on call" so if there was an accident or animal in need of humane dispatch they would be called. It was only chat between rangers and some lads so never was an official position of the NPWS and never got any further than "high stool" chat.

Grizzly 45

otmmyboy2 wrote: »

Yeah, in some ways the UK is rather better in firearms laws since hunters can own pistols over there, usually restricted to 1-5 shots, for the purpose of humane dispatch.

Over here apparently there is zero thought to such things, bar for vets and similar.

Its two shot only, and you have to prove you are an employed qualified professional deerstalker, huntmaster,head groom, vet, slaughterer or the like.God help you if you pitch up anywhere else with that pistol other than a place of work.Like one dafto did,went down to his range with it to try it out.Sayonara to all his firearms licenses after that...

otmmyboy2

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Its two shot only, and you have to prove you are an employed qualified professional deerstalker, huntmaster,head groom, vet, slaughterer or the like.God help you if you pitch up anywhere else with that pistol other than a place of work.Like one dafto did,went down to his range with it to try it out.Sayonara to all his firearms licenses after that...

Interesting, I had seen some chaps with Glocks, M&Ps, various revolvers etc restricted in mag size but could only find vague numbers on the actual number.

I wonder, since you can get such things licenced in a very restricted fashion for collection and for shooting on a range provided they stay at a range, could you have something licenced under multiple sections, allowing you to shoot it at the range with X provisos, and then carry it as a humane killer when stalking under the other section.

Similar to some countries where you can shoot with an unlimited mag at the range but restricted to a few rounds in the mag while hunting.

Grizzly 45

Cass wrote: »

There was "talks" of such a scheme here back before the ban, but it died a quick death once plans for the ban/2009 act were announced.

By talks i mean it was unofficial and involved the NPWS rangers having lads that were licensed for such firearms to be "on call" so if there was an accident or animal in need of humane dispatch they would be called. It was only chat between rangers and some lads so never was an official position of the NPWS and never got any further than "high stool" chat.

IDS are running a qualified humane dispatcher course once in a while, Where you end up on call to dispatch any injured deer in your area at road traffic accidents. Apparently, they started this around early 2020 and it has been well received by AGS .From brief chats on FB they think having a pistol in certain cases would have merit and be justified.

Trouble is of course our legislation prohibiting any new CF licenses being issued. Which would leave only really 3 options in current circumstances.

1] Give anyone who is a hunter who has a already liscensed CF pistol an exemption for carry and use who does this course.

2] Allow .22 pistols for such work.It can be done,but shot placement in the skull is critical and is borderline at best.

3]Allow some sort of single shot UK contraption in 9mm smoothbore or 410 on a restricted liscense with 410 slugs.Techcnically it is a restricted shotgun because of its length in this case .Somthing like the Falco shot pistol thingy.

A 3in 410 is coming with a 44 magnum muzzle velocity and being a 9mm slug in a smoothbore for the distances of a humane dispatch sub moa groups isnt required.

Be the only way I could see it happen under current legislation on CF pistols.

Grizzly 45

otmmyboy2 wrote: »

Interesting, I had seen some chaps with Glocks, M&Ps, various revolvers etc restricted in mag size but could only find vague numbers on the actual number.

I wonder, since you can get such things licenced in a very restricted fashion for collection and for shooting on a range provided they stay at a range, could you have something licenced under multiple sections, allowing you to shoot it at the range with X provisos, and then carry it as a humane killer when stalking under the other section.

Similar to some countries where you can shoot with an unlimited mag at the range but restricted to a few rounds in the mag while hunting.

I'm not that up on the UK legislation,but I figure if there was such a possibility to do such someone in the UK would have done it already. Short answer ,doubtful.

Cass

Option 1 would be the only viable one with a C/F restricted short firearm. AGS cannot supercede legislation.

Option two is doable with current legislation and in the case of option 3 barrel length, so as not to make it a restricted short firearm, would be key.

If AGS are interested in using this scheme it'd be a good move, but as you said limited to currently licensed guys.

Grizzly 45

True they cant supercede the legislation, but a CS can attach conditions to a license,which doesn't always have to be detrimental.

The barrel length is kind of a thing,as you do need to be able to maneuver it in awkward situations in the brush where most animals will head for if injured and mobile or be able to conceal it if you have some of the public rubbernecking at the incident.

Can't see a CS being too hard on licensing such a gun,as it is going to be used for one specific job,isn't the fastest firing gun either and could have conditions attached to be used only for these circumstances. Plus they are butt ugly, would you want to be seen with a yoke like this down at the range?:eek:
[IMG][/img]http://www.deactivated-guns.co.uk/live-firearms-and-shotguns/brand-new-falco-9mm-shot-pistol/prod_858.html

Cass

I only meant for C/F restricted pistols. The Act prohibits them so no licenses.

The rest is completely doable in some form.

otmmyboy2

I thought 22 pistols were only licencable for target shooting, no other purposes, so presumably that would put paid to any plan to use them for humane dispatch?

Cass

Not quite.

The law says you must be a member of a target range in order to apply. You could, in theory, tick hunting and if granted with no conditions (not for hunting, etc) then technically the license would be for the reasons you applied for.

The other challenge is a 22lr does not meet the criteria for hunting deer so it's illegal to hunt them with one, so special permission/license from the NPWS would also be required. IOW you couldn't get a 22lr for hunting, under the radar, and just go hunting with it. There are other safeguards in place.

Grizzly 45

Would it be classified as hunting tho?
You are a qualified hunter doing a humane dispatch something totally different,and the fact that the act and law doesn't specify how,or with methods an injured deer can be put down with.
IOW you could be a totally unqualified member of the public and go and bash in its brains with a ball pein hammer as the act is currently written.:eek:

Cass

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Would it be classified as hunting tho?

“hunt” means stalk, pursue, chase, drive, flush, capture, course, attract, follow, search for, lie in wait for, take, trap or shoot by any means whether with or without dogs according to the 1976 Wildlife act. Could be argued this is included.

You are a qualified hunter doing a humane dispatch something totally different,

Section 23(7) deals with it.

and the fact that the act and law doesn't specify how,or with methods an injured deer can be put down with.

It does. Any means once the animal is inured and for the purpose of humane dispatch.

IOW you could be a totally unqualified member of the public and go and bash in its brains with a ball pein hammer as the act is currently written.:eek:

Thats a broad interpretation, but possibly correct. However i think they'd prefer some sort of humane dispatch which a 22lr would provide more than a hammer or judo chop to the neck.

cookimonster

Okay it's not Ireland but it illustrates a point made here.

Paul Harrell
Paul's Top 5 Rifle/Pistol Combos
https://youtu.be/dpqJf25yIw0


If you don't want to watch the whole lot ( including flying soda bottles) fast forward to time stamp 06.07 and have a watch.

Grizzly 45

Methinks he needs a German Drilling a couple of rifled caliber adaptors and a handgun from his ample battery.:)
12 GA bird /buckshot/slug in the shotgun barrels,a 9.6 X in the rifle barrel in case he comes across an elephant.A 12 GA/.22 chamber adapter for long-range bunnies a 12 GA/ 9mm adaptor for longer shots on smaller critters and a 9mm handgun for 2 legged pests.:p