New job,Exit interview

Heckler

So got myself a new job. Will be handing in my notice tomorrow. Will work out the 2 weeks if they wish. I will probably do an exit interview.

Workers, team leads and supervisors have all been great but above that, production managers etc have been terrible. No idea of how things work in the real world day to day. Concocting totally unworkable ideas that look good on paper but are completely unrealistic.

Have seen grown men Supervisors shouted at and berated in front of all levels of staff.

They say don't burn your bridges but I would never go back to this company. I'll draft the usual notice thanking the company etc.

I guess my question is when it comes to the exit interview should I just go through the motions or actually let them know what I really think ?

My new job is sorted, references etc. so nothing to lose.
There is one toxic individual in particular who needs behaving.
Opinions ? Advice ?

Thanks.

I wouldn't. There's nothing in it for you.

I would, as every little bit helps for everyone. Maybe you and others would have been spared their behaviour if someone had done likewise.

GT89

Does it matter you're leaving either way. Might aswell say nice things in order to not burn any bridges I left a job I didn't like recently and still said good things when I was leaving. As easy to be nice as it is to bad mouth the company. You're in new job so it won't make a difference what you say.

mugsymugsy

Ireland is a small place. Unless you are moving to a different industry or are sure you will have no future connection then I wouldn't bother

Vestiapx

Never burn bridges, while you might not ever return to that company your actions could cause someone who is questioned to look for work elsewhere, they might then get a job and eventually be in a position to influence your happiness. Ireland is a tiny country there is no reason to create enemies when you don't have to.

Deub

You may not work for this company again but you could see one of the production managers, etc in your next company (or maybe even the one you are moving to).

Heckler

Or maybe if someone had stood up to a toxic bitch from day one she might not be the c@nt she is today.

I'm not going to personalise anything but am going to let HR know where I think the company is failing.

brightspark

There is nothing to be gained by being completely honest. Don't burn your bridges.

If you feel you have to, just suggest something along the lines that communication could be improved and leave it vague. If there is a problem then it's their problem not yours.

But remember the real objective of an exit interview is to protect the company from "constructive dismissal" claims.


They have other methods of improving management staff relations if they wanted.

brightspark

Vestiapx wrote: »

... your actions could cause someone who is questioned to look for work elsewhere....

Very good point, Careful OP they could end being your boss again!!

Black Cloud

I suggest you tell HR not how the company is failing, as you put it, but rather cite examples/procedures that might help the company improve productivity. No one likes to hear how they're failing, especially by someone leaving.

Heckler

Vestiapx wrote: »

Never burn bridges, while you might not ever return to that company your actions could cause someone who is questioned to look for work elsewhere, they might then get a job and eventually be in a position to influence your happiness. Ireland is a tiny country there is no reason to create enemies when you don't have to.

So just put up with bullying, intimidation, shoddy work practices and incompetence and let whoever comes after deal with it ?

Say nothing about a nasty, toxic environment because my old boss might be my new boss somewhere down some hypothetical road ?

mugsymugsy

Heckler wrote: »

Or maybe if someone had stood up to a toxic bitch from day one she might not be the c@nt she is today.

I'm not going to personalise anything but am going to let HR know where I think the company is failing.

Op - I would be surprised if they don't know this already. Been there I did the exit interview as I was moving industry and they knew about it. I was the 4th person in that role within 18 months. The senior person was an absolute nightmare.

I left within 3 months as luckily lined up something else and could explain why I was moving on quickly.

Bicyclette

One option is to do the "grand" interview. Just answer "Grand" or "its grand" to every answer.

Another option would be to sandwich a criticism between two positives. E.g. Praise your team leads, explain that you found the production managers difficult and then then mention that you would be happy to work again with e.g. Your team leads and supervisors again.

Sometimes what you don't say can be as powerful as what you DO say.

wonski

Heckler wrote: »

So just put up with bullying, intimidation, shoddy work practices and incompetence and let whoever comes after deal with it ?

Say nothing about a nasty, toxic environment because my old boss might be my new boss somewhere down some hypothetical road ?

And you really think your opinion on exit interview will make them swoop the place and discipline all the people you listed when you left the company?

Bullying and intimidation are serious accusations, but to only bring it when you are leaving means nothing.

bucketybuck

Speaking your mind in an exit interview is akin to having a fight with somebody on the internet. You might think you won something, but in reality nobody else gave a ****.

If you really think it would make you feel better then sure, go for it, but dont delude yourself into thinking it will achieve very much.

Against that is the very real possibility that you cross paths again with somebody involved in the future. And that does happen, no matter how confident you are that it wont.

brightspark

Heckler wrote: »

So just put up with bullying, intimidation, shoddy work practices and incompetence and let whoever comes after deal with it ?

Say nothing about a nasty, toxic environment because my old boss might be my new boss somewhere down some hypothetical road ?

If you were bullied then make a formal complaint about it.

Shoddy work practices and incompetence are the companies problem, if it's illegal then whistleblow the HR dept are there to protect the company not the workers.

Leave a bad review on glass door if you must to stop others going there,

bucketybuck

Heckler wrote: »

So just put up with bullying, intimidation, shoddy work practices and incompetence and let whoever comes after deal with it ?

Say nothing about a nasty, toxic environment because my old boss might be my new boss somewhere down some hypothetical road ?

If this is so important to you then why not stay and fight for change from within?

Cluedo Monopoly

More often than not HR will ignored 100% of what's said in the exit interview. HR rarely rock the boat.
HR are just going through motions on the exit interview.

I wouldn't burn any bridges either, you never know when you will need a reference from your previous employer and you could well be working with these colleagues in the future.

Heckler

wonski wrote: »

And you really think your opinion on exit interview will make them swoop the place and discipline all the people you listed when you left the company?

Bullying and intimidation are serious accusations, but to only bring it when you are leaving means nothing.

This company loses staff by the new time and has no compunction in firing people when they walk in the door on a monday morning.

Of course I don't think any of my actions will make a difference in the long run but maybe if others following on make the same claims it might make them consider themselves and their policies.

spuddy4711

Assume that anything you say may be made known to everyone.

Heckler

bucketybuck wrote: »

If this is so important to you then why not stay and fight for change from within?

Not Erin Brockovich. Get real.

KaneToad

Thank them for giving you the opportunity to progress your career. Wish them well for the future. Smile and leave.

Telling them what you really think will have no benefit for you and is unlikely to benefit colleagues left behind.

brightspark

Heckler wrote: »

Not Erin Brockovich. Get real.

Precisely...So why risk it coming back to you in the future?

Heckler

KaneToad wrote: »

Thank them for giving you the opportunity to progress your career. Wish them well for the future. Smile and leave.

Telling them what you really think will have no benefit for you and is unlikely to benefit colleagues left behind.

It would have the benefit of me letting them know what a ****show of a company they run.

So noone should ever criticise a former employer ?

Deub

Heckler wrote: »

It would have the benefit of me letting them know what a ****show of a company they run.

So noone should ever criticise a former employer ?

Why do you ask for opinions/advice if you believe it must be done?

Go ahead and do it.

Treppen

Just wait a few months then put it up on Glassdoor.

HR are worth a **** in Ireland, they are brainwashed to ensure the company always comes before the welfare of the employee. That's what the exit interview is there for, it's not for you or your former colleagues.

km991148

There's a couple of reasons why you would want to.
1. You care about the place and want it to improve
2. You feel pissed off and want to let them know exactly what you think of them and are generally annoyed that you have to move and feel like you are on the back foot and want those feelings heard.


If 1. Then too late at exit interview. You could maybe gently suggest that they should look to improve processes etc and do whatever for team morale. But really there is more to loose then gain for you. If you carry that much and wanted to improve, you'd still be there doing that (helping).

If you feel a bit more like number 2. Then there is even more risk. You will get absolutely nothing in return and will feel more annoyed. Better to hand notice, draw a line and move on.

Life's too short and it's not your mess or company to sort out. You may feel bad for your soon to be former colleagues, but they are adults as well and can either help or get out as well.

The exit interview as others said is a formality. Box checking to protect against any future legal issues that may arise.


So give notice, be happy, talk about the 'better opportunities' 'better salary' or whatever the new place offers but I wouldn't go into anything at the point of exit interview.

km991148

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

More often than not HR will ignored 100% of what's said in the exit interview. HR rarely rock the boat.
HR are just going through motions on the exit interview.

It's really only there as a protection mechanism in case an employee wants to sue or something down the line.

Makes the case (for example) for constructive dismissal more difficult if the employee was afforded an opportunity to speak and never did.

brightspark

Treppen wrote: »

Just wait a few months then put it up on Glassdoor.

HR are worth a **** in Ireland, they are brainwashed to ensure the company always comes before the welfare of the employee. That's what the exit interview is there for, it's not for you or your former colleagues.

HR aren't brainwashed to ensure the company comes before the employee....it's their job. (never forget that he who pays the piper calls the tune)

They exist to get the maximum return from employees with the minimum expenditure. (including protecting against legal action etc.)

Heckler

km991148 wrote: »

There's a couple of reasons why you would want to.
1. You care about the place and want it to improve
2. You feel pissed off and want to let them know exactly what you think of them and are generally annoyed that you have to move and feel like you are on the back foot and want those feelings heard.


If 1. Then too late at exit interview. You could maybe gently suggest that they should look to improve processes etc and do whatever for team morale. But really there is more to loose then gain for you. If you carry that much and wanted to improve, you'd still be there doing that (helping).

If you feel a bit more like number 2. Then there is even more risk. You will get absolutely nothing in return and will feel more annoyed. Better to hand notice, draw a line and move on.

Life's too short and it's not your mess or company to sort out. You may feel bad for your soon to be former colleagues, but they are adults as well and can either help or get out as well.

The exit interview as others said is a formality. Box checking to protect against any future legal issues that may arise.


So give notice, be happy, talk about the 'better opportunities' 'better salary' or whatever the new place offers but I wouldn't go into anything at the point of exit interview.

Yup. Sounds about right.

I'm happy to be moving on but just feel frustrated that people coming in behind me are just going to be putting up with same. They'll cop on, move on and the cycle just repeats.

Thanks for all the replies. I'll put in my notice tomorrow and keep schtum.

brightspark

Hontou

I think the OP is itching for the satisfaction they may feel from telling the d...head production manager where to go. Justifiably. You can do this professionally. In the exit interview, be very grateful for all you have learned in the company and say you have learned so much from your supervisors etc. If they ask, which they should, what could be improved or something along those lines, then politely say that you would change some administration processes to save time and encourage more motivation of the hard working staff. That might indirectly make it clear that there is a problem up the line. (They probably know). Then go to the production manager and thank them so much for all their help which enabled you to move and progress. They probably hate their job and are mad jealous of you moving.

delly

I recently came across a toxic person last year who I dealt with over 10 years ago in another job. As said earlier, if you were moving country or a totally different industry, maybe, but you never know who's path you might cross in the future.

km991148

Hontou wrote: »

I think the OP is itching for the satisfaction they may feel from telling the d...head production manager where to go. Justifiably. You can do this professionally. In the exit interview, be very grateful for all you have learned in the company and say you have learned so much from your supervisors etc. If they ask, which they should, what could be improved or something along those lines, then politely say that you would change some administration processes to save time and encourage more motivation of the hard working staff. That might indirectly make it clear that there is a problem up the line. (They probably know). Then go to the production manager and thank them so much for all their help which enabled you to move and progress. They probably hate their job and are mad jealous of you moving.

I know generally what you mean and if you do decide to communicate something then often a damning with faint approach can work better.

But really, no matter what your reasons are, no one actually cares.

Let it go op, it's the healthiest thing. In 4 weeks time it will be a distant memory.

Good luck in the new job.

Treppen

brightspark wrote: »

HR aren't brainwashed to ensure the company comes before the employee....it's their job. (never forget that he who pays the piper calls the tune)

They exist to get the maximum return from employees with the minimum expenditure. (including protecting against legal action etc.)

Really! You think they'd follow up on an employee's recommendations and concerns! I reckon the only reason they'd do this is to mitigate against any future potential legal action.

The company pays the HR Piper so they call the tune.

brightspark

Treppen wrote: »

Really! You think they'd follow up on an employee's recommendations and concerns! I reckon the only reason they'd do this is to mitigate against any future potential legal action.

The company pays the HR Piper so they call the tune.

Isn't that what I said??

Heckler

km991148 wrote: »

I know generally what you mean and if you do decide to communicate something then often a damning with faint approach can work better.

But really, no matter what your reasons are, no one actually cares.

Let it go op, it's the healthiest thing. In 4 weeks time it will be a distant memory.

Good luck in the new job.

Thanks. I'll let it go. Onwards and upwards. Or sideways at least !

Thanks for all the advice. I'll let ye know how it goes tomorrow.

screamer

I used to think the same op tell them the truth, what should be differ etc, but being honest they don’t care. Now, when I’m leaving somewhere like that I very politely decline an exit interview, when asked why I just tell them that there’s no point

bucketybuck

Heckler wrote: »

Not Erin Brockovich. Get real.

Exactly, you aren't a crusader, you just want to vent at them as you walk out the door. Which is a reason exit interviews aren't a big driver for change, because generally issues raised in them are being raised by people who may have a chip on their shoulder.

Nothing wrong with venting, but if you are weighing up the pros and cons then it's better to be realistic about why you are doing it, dont dress it up as fighting for future employees unless that is actually true.

On another note, I am constantly amazed how many people dont understand the function of HR departments. They are literally employed and paid to protect the company interests, calling them "brainwashed" is such a strange statement in that context.

Heckler

screamer wrote: »

I used to think the same op tell them the truth, what should be differ etc, but being honest they don’t care. Now, when I’m leaving somewhere like that I very politely decline an exit interview, when asked why I just tell them that there’s no point

Never thought of that ! Ta but no thanks. Gonna go with that approach I think !

GT89

Heckler wrote: »

So just put up with bullying, intimidation, shoddy work practices and incompetence and let whoever comes after deal with it ?

Say nothing about a nasty, toxic environment because my old boss might be my new boss somewhere down some hypothetical road ?

You should have stated your grievances whilst you were still working there and spoke to a union rep saying them when your leaving is a bit late surely.

Jim2007

Heckler wrote: »

They say don't burn your bridges but I would never go back to this company. I'll draft the usual notice thanking the company etc.

You may not want to go back there, but that does not mean the people there will not go somewhere else and you will meet them again.

Many moons ago I knew an asset management team that was lead by a Danish guy, as his leaving party the team decided to be very blunt about what they though of him, after all he was going back to Denmark and they'd never see him again..... big mistake, his new company took over that asset management company six months later and guess who their new boss was.....

Nothing stays the same, most people move on eventually, no matter what you say it will have no positive impact.

OMM 0000

They don't want you to say anything negative. They want the exit interview to be simple and everyone looks good.

Sure I know "officially" they want to use the exit interview as a way to improve the company, but in reality they don't as it makes work for them and can cause problems.

Treat it like a job interview - never say anything negative.

Dublin Lad2021

Hi OP,

Haven't read the entire thread but I think you've made your mind up. Anyways I've conducted exit interviews in a previous company as the HR manager, I like exit interviews, often people have ideas of how to make the company better, I've implemented stuff that was suggested in exit interviews. Exit interviews are generally strictly confidential however I wouldn't trust it to be that way depending on the company and people involved. If you think you can add something productive that you think the company will act on and make things better for your friends and colleagues that remain then yeah absolutely do the exit interview. If the only thing you wish to discuss is bullying etc. I would leave it. Truth be told the company probably knows and doesn't care (my experience) and bullying is difficult to deal with especially if no one is interested in doing formal complaints and interviews over the matter, my company had a huge bullying problem in the UK I reported to directors and they ignored me including people being bullied for their skin colour. They didn't want to touch managers that would be hard to replace. If you really want to tell HR of the bullying problem I guess set up a fake email address and send HR an anonymous email I guess or advise colleagues to complain and agree to be a witness if required but I would probably just drop the bullying thing entirely, the company will find out in time if it's worth holding onto them

Just leave, there is no upside to critizing them as you leave. Ireland is tiny, you'll eventually cross paths with some of these people again.

wonski

Having an experience of "exit interview" in some companies it consists of a chat with the manager and filling up a form (reason for leaving/comments) and that's it. Heckler worked in manufacturing company so it could be that there is no HR involved and the chat will be with one of the bullies ticking the boxes.

It would depend on the position held at the time of leaving, too.

This will go into the employee file (without even being read by HR if it even exists) and will be shredded after statutory time passed. That's my experience.

Hontou

GT89 wrote: »

You should have stated your grievances whilst you were still working there and spoke to a union rep saying them when your leaving is a bit late surely.

Very difficult to do when you are in a job that you are dependent on and scared of your bully boss / poor conditions. The brave whistle-blowers get managed out. The only possible way to air grievances is the exit interview for many. But as others have said here, protect yourself, say nothing.

Pity that this is our culture and unfortunately saying nothing is the right thing to do. If employees had stood up to/highlighted bad practices in the public service/ banking in this country and been listened to then maybe we wouldn't have so much wasted resources in The Children's Hospital (€1.43bn) or a corrupt stockbrokers or maverick banks.

OP, I admire your gut feeling of wanting to do something. But protect yourself. Speak with your feet. Onwards and upwards for you. Maybe you will be in a position to offer those good co-workers a job in future and get them out of that toxic workplace.

km991148

Well? Did you tell them to go fuk themselves? Out in a blaze of glory?

Or was it all tea and crumpets and chit chat about the unseasonably cold weather?

Heckler

GT89 wrote: »

You should have stated your grievances whilst you were still working there and spoke to a union rep saying them when your leaving is a bit late surely.

Don't have a union. I stated my grievances every day to my team lead and supervisor as I was told to do if I had a problem. They both knew exactly where I was coming from but higher than supervisor level the managers don't want to know about it and didn't care about changing anything.

Anyways notice given. I finish tomorrow week, am training in a replacement. Have a week off and will be starting the new job after the May bank holiday.

No mention of an exit interview so unlikely to happen.

I appreciate all the replies. Its just so frustrating to see such poor management and a demoralised workforce.

Thanks again for all the advice.

Treppen

Heckler wrote: »

Don't have a union. I stated my grievances every day to my team lead and supervisor as I was told to do if I had a problem. They both knew exactly where I was coming from but higher than supervisor level the managers don't want to know about it and didn't care about changing anything.

Anyways notice given. I finish tomorrow week, am training in a replacement. Have a week off and will be starting the new job after the May bank holiday.

No mention of an exit interview so unlikely to happen.

I appreciate all the replies. Its just so frustrating to see such poor management and a demoralised workforce.

Thanks again for all the advice.

Besta luck