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Bord Bia Audit

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  • 06-04-2021 3:50pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 332 ✭✭


    Is there any point in spending a few hours doing this. Like does it make a jot of difference to buyers in the ring?


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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 939 ✭✭✭trabpc


    No difference in Mart really. Doesn't matter. But if you kill cattle it obviously does. Depends on your system.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,051 ✭✭✭minerleague


    trabpc wrote: »
    No difference in Mart really. Doesn't matter. But if you kill cattle it obviously does. Depends on your system.

    Yeah have to do it at this stage for factory, did online audit last year for 12 month, got text recently to say valid now for 18 months


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,313 ✭✭✭Anto_Meath


    It's worth doing it as it focus your mind and makes sure you have everything in order, be it healthy & safety, medication & withdrawal dates or just that you keep your bookwork correct. From a value to an animal going into the ring it doesn't make that much difference as the person factoring the animal has to have it in their herd for 70 days now anyway. There was a time if you bought a qa animal you could get a qa payment on it if slaughter after 40 days but that's gone now. The other advantage of qa is that any factory will take your cattle & pay you the going base price. If you aren't qa then alot of factories wouldn't entertain you or give you something like 10 or 20 cent under the base even for old cows.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,968 ✭✭✭SuperTortoise


    I was contacted about 2 months ago by bord bia saying I'm due an audit haven't heard anything since, is it up to me to schedule an appointment?


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,588 ✭✭✭Cavanjack


    I was contacted about 2 months ago by bord bia saying I'm due an audit haven't heard anything since, is it up to me to schedule an appointment?

    No they will contact you but give them a call if you are nearly out of date.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 403 ✭✭E mac


    My experience is generally being told I'm doing everything right all is in order but I still have to be failed on something....


  • Registered Users Posts: 860 ✭✭✭Aravo


    E mac wrote: »
    My experience is generally being told I'm doing everything right all is in order but I still have to be failed on something....

    Animal remedies, always watch that. That's the one that any glitch here and its a straight fail.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,261 ✭✭✭Dunedin


    E mac wrote: »
    My experience is generally being told I'm doing everything right all is in order but I still have to be failed on something....

    You and everyone else.......


  • Registered Users Posts: 403 ✭✭E mac


    Aravo wrote: »
    Animal remedies, always watch that. That's the one that any glitch here and its a straight fail.

    Nope that’s the one thing I’ve never been caught on yet...it’s almost disappointing to them. One time as he said I have to fail you on something he looked down to pit of the parlour saw some standing water “oh I have to dock you for that”. Suggested I dig up the floor and insert a drain....


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,158 ✭✭✭DBK1


    I find the best approach is to make sure you have an obvious mistake that’ll be spotted quickly. Once they have something to put you down on then they don’t look too hard anywhere else!!

    To be fair to them they can’t be giving out 100% to everyone or they would be questioned to know is every yard they go to the text book example of how a farm should be.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,111 ✭✭✭✭wrangler


    Cavanjack wrote: »
    No they will contact you but give them a call if you are nearly out of date.

    We had an online audit yesterday, it was delayed too, but every time it came near the expiry date they extended the date so there's no need to be following it up, they'll contact you


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,478 ✭✭✭kk.man


    DBK1 wrote: »
    I find the best approach is to make sure you have an obvious mistake that’ll be spotted quickly. Once they have something to put you down on then they don’t look too hard anywhere else!!

    To be fair to them they can’t be giving out 100% to everyone or they would be questioned to know is every yard they go to the text book example of how a farm should be.

    I am fairly fed up with them now on a point of principal. I am unable to get 100% and I ve been in the scheme since the beginning.
    They said I have no 1st aid kit yet I had it the last time only he never asked. Guess what this time he said I am missing some items from it. I never opened the plastic in 7 years!

    Rat bait points were not óna plán despite submitting the same plan for last 7 years. My safety statement not up to date despite a new entry on it last October but on IST page under my signature is the date I first opened the audit book 7 odd years ago.

    I tell you I'll question them on everything next year as I have nothing to worry about as I am OCD in relation to animal remedies entries and feed.

    I am not looking for 100% but I hate excuses for not giving it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,588 ✭✭✭Cavanjack


    kk.man wrote: »
    I am fairly fed up with them now on a point of principal. I am unable to get 100% and I ve been in the scheme since the beginning.
    They said I have no 1st aid kit yet I had it the last time only he never asked. Guess what this time he said I am missing some items from it. I never opened the plastic in 7 years!

    Rat bait points were not óna plán despite submitting the same plan for last 7 years. My safety statement not up to date despite a new entry on it last October but on IST page under my signature is the date I first opened the audit book 7 odd years ago.

    I tell you I'll question them on everything next year as I have nothing to worry about as I am OCD in relation to animal remedies entries and feed.

    I am not looking for 100% but I hate excuses for not giving it.

    I was getting 100% the last time but he said it’s best not to get 100% as it could lead to me being audited again because he could be audited by someone above him. He knocked a few percent off for out of date eye wash in the first aid kit. I had no issue with this.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,158 ✭✭✭DBK1


    kk.man wrote: »
    I am fairly fed up with them now on a point of principal. I am unable to get 100% and I ve been in the scheme since the beginning.
    They said I have no 1st aid kit yet I had it the last time only he never asked. Guess what this time he said I am missing some items from it. I never opened the plastic in 7 years!

    Rat bait points were not óna plán despite submitting the same plan for last 7 years. My safety statement not up to date despite a new entry on it last October but on IST page under my signature is the date I first opened the audit book 7 odd years ago.

    I tell you I'll question them on everything next year as I have nothing to worry about as I am OCD in relation to animal remedies entries and feed.

    I am not looking for 100% but I hate excuses for not giving it.
    I’d be agreeing with CavanJack, you’re far better off not to be looking for 100%.

    To look at it from a different perspective, if the auditor gives you 100% and he has a manager above him looking at that result the question i’d be asking if I was the manager is, “Are you saying this farm is the model farm and is 100% perfect on everything they do? If so then is this the farm that we will now arrange all Bord Bia farm walks for as it is perfection?”

    Now maybe you’d be happy with that scenario but I’d certainly rather have the 98% and remain under the radar!


  • Registered Users Posts: 5 oneone


    kk.man wrote: »
    I am fairly fed up with them now on a point of principal. I am unable to get 100% and I ve been in the scheme since the beginning.
    They said I have no 1st aid kit yet I had it the last time only he never asked. Guess what this time he said I am missing some items from it. I never opened the plastic in 7 years!

    Rat bait points were not óna plán despite submitting the same plan for last 7 years. My safety statement not up to date despite a new entry on it last October but on IST page under my signature is the date I first opened the audit book 7 odd years ago.

    I tell you I'll question them on everything next year as I have nothing to worry about as I am OCD in relation to animal remedies entries and feed.

    I am not looking for 100% but I hate excuses for not giving it.

    Honestly do not lose sleep over it. I used to work for Bord Bia, my job was not an inspection role.

    Let me tell you about my inspection;
    20 min call for a dairy audit, a big no no.
    They told me one thing was wrong with paperwork, which clearly wasn't, but I "left him off", bearing in mind 2 other people are to review this person's work before certification is issued, you'd hope they would catch it but no.

    So for the audit, only one thing was wrong, which wasn't actually wrong.

    Then I get the cert letter, 5 extra AFIs for questions that were never asked.

    The scheme is a joke. An absolute joke, I will stand up and argue if needs be. I have zero confidence in the scheme.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5 oneone


    DBK1 wrote: »
    I’d be agreeing with CavanJack, you’re far better off not to be looking for 100%.

    To look at it from a different perspective, if the auditor gives you 100% and he has a manager above him looking at that result the question i’d be asking if I was the manager is, “Are you saying this farm is the model farm and is 100% perfect on everything they do? If so then is this the farm that we will now arrange all Bord Bia farm walks for as it is perfection?”

    Now maybe you’d be happy with that scenario but I’d certainly rather have the 98% and remain under the radar!

    Not necessarily correct but not wrong either. I have had auditors say this to me in the past, which they should absolutely not be saying to farmers.

    All auditors are supposed to be auditing to the same standard but this is clearly not the case.

    It is the auditor who would be under more scrutiny, how can they say a farm has excellent compliance, but the next auditor find a slurry pit not fenced, its unlikely a fence has disappeared.

    bord bia get audited by an auditing crowd, and its the auditing crowd who are looking at the 100% farms.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,158 ✭✭✭DBK1


    oneone wrote: »
    Not necessarily correct but not wrong either. I have had auditors say this to me in the past, which they should absolutely not be saying to farmers.

    All auditors are supposed to be auditing to the same standard but this is clearly not the case.

    It is the auditor who would be under more scrutiny, how can they say a farm has excellent compliance, but the next auditor find a slurry pit not fenced, its unlikely a fence has disappeared.

    bord bia get audited by an auditing crowd, and its the auditing crowd who are looking at the 100% farms.
    That’s all the more reason I will now definitely be making sure there is an obvious fault somewhere, far better with 98% and nothing to worry about than 100% and an audit!


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 3,119 Mod ✭✭✭✭K.G.


    As audits go the bord bia is relatively easy and farmer friendly enough.wouldn't get het up about getting 100 %.if bord bia wasnt in place we might have more audits by buyers and customers for our product which would be alot more onerous and the would probaly be of an unannounced variety and the consequences of issues woyld be alot more serious .i think its great to get my paperwork up to date and have a bit more sorted for other inspections


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,859 ✭✭✭893bet


    Only recently joined. When you fail on somehing but pass overall, do you have to have it fixed for the next audit?


  • Registered Users Posts: 5 oneone


    893bet wrote: »
    Only recently joined. When you fail on somehing but pass overall, do you have to have it fixed for the next audit?

    Its an area for improvement probably, the theory is yes that it should be fixed for the next audit, and if the area has not improved by the next audit, a non compliance should be issued. But this rarely happens.

    What was the AFI? It should be on the back of your cert letter.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 5 oneone


    K.G. wrote: »
    As audits go the bord bia is relatively easy and farmer friendly enough.wouldn't get het up about getting 100 %.if bord bia wasnt in place we might have more audits by buyers and customers for our product which would be alot more onerous and the would probaly be of an unannounced variety and the consequences of issues woyld be alot more serious .i think its great to get my paperwork up to date and have a bit more sorted for other inspections

    The scheme is essentially a box ticking exercise. They seem to get away with no scrutiny and simply shift blame onto the factories.

    For example, there is a price difference in beef between here and UK, bord bia will say they are not involved in price setting, yet they have this big fancy price tracker and won't explain why there is a difference either.

    Your paperwork should be up to date regardless of Bord Bia (I know the reality is that if Bord Bia wasn't in place farmers wouldn't have half the records in place).

    The only difference between a Bord Bia inspection and a department inspection is the Sustainability Survey.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,189 ✭✭✭orm0nd


    893bet wrote: »
    Only recently joined. When you fail on somehing but pass overall, do you have to have it fixed for the next audit?

    My experience is that it's never mentioned again unless it's something very essential.

    They just move on and dock you points on something else.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,446 ✭✭✭J.O. Farmer


    kk.man wrote: »
    I am fairly fed up with them now on a point of principal. I am unable to get 100% and I ve been in the scheme since the beginning.
    They said I have no 1st aid kit yet I had it the last time only he never asked. Guess what this time he said I am missing some items from it. I never opened the plastic in 7 years!

    I remember them asking for a first aid kit on the farm even though the house is within 100 yards of the sheds and a first aid kit in the house.

    If we ever needed first aid the first place we'd go is the house. Suppose I cut myself and it needs bandaging I'm going to want to clean it and bandage it somewhere cleaner than the slatted shed.

    That said it's an easy box to tick leaving a small cheap kit in the medicine cabinet.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,111 ✭✭✭✭wrangler


    I remember them asking for a first aid kit on the farm even though the house is within 100 yards of the sheds and a first aid kit in the house.

    If we ever needed first aid the first place we'd go is the house. Suppose I cut myself and it needs bandaging I'm going to want to clean it and bandage it somewhere cleaner than the slatted shed.

    That said it's an easy box to tick leaving a small cheap kit in the medicine cabinet.

    Not every kit has the eye wash which is important and some stuff goes out of date.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5 oneone


    wrangler wrote: »
    Not every kit has the eye wash which is important and some stuff goes out of date.

    First aid kit needs to be on farm. Not 100 yards away, (those are the rules).
    Kit needs to have eye wash.
    Eye wash is only thing that goes out of date, that they check for.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,478 ✭✭✭kk.man


    OK I see the points you all make. I'll just bite my lip in future.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,145 ✭✭✭Dinzee Conlee


    kk.man wrote: »
    OK I see the points you all make. I'll just bite my lip in future.

    If you bit right hard you might get to open the plastic on the first aid kit :):)


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,478 ✭✭✭kk.man


    If you bit right hard you might get to open the plastic on the first aid kit :):)

    Can't be using parts of the first aid kit as might be docked in the inspection ðŸ˜!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,272 ✭✭✭jfh


    anyone know if it's a fail if you cant find knackery certs, can't find 2, knackery cant help either was hoping that they would have copies



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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,189 ✭✭✭orm0nd



    Doubt if it's a straight fail just a minor.

    Last fellow here didn't look at the dockets.



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