Would you ever consider moving to continental Europe? And if so where?

Jim2007

Brian? wrote: »

I don’t know if you’ve noticed, but Irish people have a lot of peculiarities with how we speak English.

Very true. Actually here in the local school, kids with a native English speaking parent are allowed use the local rules - Supraregional Southern Irish English, as it is called.

suicide_circus

I've come to the conclusion that i cannot see myself retiring in Ireland.

Shocking weather
Bargain basement services and infrastructure
Extremely weak visionless leadership

I have dual citizenship (ireland/another continental european country) and my wife is from another continental european country so we have ties elsewhere which i hope to exploit.

Brian?

murpho999 wrote: »

Well in fairness if you know how boat is pronounced, which was just an example. then you know the sound and you need to use that and not how you'd say it with your Tallaght accent.
It's similar to the sound of moat or vote.

I think you're missing my point. I know how to say the words and do so with some difficulty, I was trying to explain why it isn't as easy for all English speakers as some people think it is. For someone from England I think these sounds are easier.

I'm surprised at what you say about your Dutch colleagues as that was not my experience when I was there. Dutch people speak Dutch together and like their language and even know if I go back , having moved away in 2005, people just speak Dutch to me even though I clearly have what they'd call a "engels" accent.

I don't know what to tell you, this is my experience.

Brian?

Jim2007 wrote: »

Very true. Actually here in the local school, kids with a native English speaking parent are allowed use the local rules - Supraregional Southern Irish English, as it is called.

A friend of mine has 2 Irish teenagers in normal Dutch school, they learnt Dutch in no time. But they actually got into arguments with Dutch English teachers about pronunciation. The Dutch teachers insisted they were wrong, despite them being native English speakers. The parents had to go to the school and tell the teachers to cop the feck on, it's called an Irish accent.

CelticRambler

Brian? wrote: »

A friend of mine has 2 Irish teenagers in normal Dutch school, they learnt Dutch in no time. But they actually got into arguments with Dutch English teachers about pronunciation. The Dutch teachers insisted they were wrong, despite them being native English speakers. The parents had to go to the school and tell the teachers to cop the feck on, it's called an Irish accent.

We had a more enlightened teacher in our local primary, who requested my arbitration on a dispute between an Irish immigrant and an English immigrant over the correct translation of a sporting term. The Irish child was correct.

So yes, on the one hand Brian? is correct in pointing out that it's not necessarily very helpful to explain foreign pronunciation using English equivalents when a regional accent can distort the way that word is pronounced (e.g. "castle" versus "castle" in different parts of England); but on the other, the English do not have an inherent advantage in speaking/using English compared to other countries just because their Queen uses it correctly!

And that applies equally to the "foreign" language: just because you learn from a native speaker doesn't mean that your pronunciation will be "perfect" - if your French friend comes from Provence, you'll eat "peng" for your lunch on "lengdi", and put "veng-seng" euros' worth of petrol in your "beng-yullll" ... Fat lot of good that'll do you trying to talk to the Alsatians! :pac:

yagan

suicide_circus wrote: »

I've come to the conclusion that i cannot see myself retiring in Ireland.

Shocking weather
Bargain basement services and infrastructure
Extremely weak visionless leadership

I have dual citizenship (ireland/another continental european country) and my wife is from another continental european country so we have ties elsewhere which i hope to exploit.

You may have another citizenship but before you came to this conclusion have you actually lived in another country on which to make comparison?

An awful lot of what we see about other countries is just advertising.

ancapailldorcha

suicide_circus wrote: »

I've come to the conclusion that i cannot see myself retiring in Ireland.

Shocking weather
Bargain basement services and infrastructure
Extremely weak visionless leadership

I have dual citizenship (ireland/another continental european country) and my wife is from another continental european country so we have ties elsewhere which i hope to exploit.

I could see myself going back but my problem is where. Dublin is no better than London in terms of affordability whereas the countryside is a no-no. I could probably get work in Limerick but I've never been there.

murmuring pines

I think about this a lot. On the one hand, I'm not really very happy here. On the other, I have a secure job and my own home, and I don't speak a second language (though I wish I could).

My thoughts on other EU countries, which might be totally off-base:
1) Netherlands: probably the safest bet, as English is basically a second language for the Dutch, and there seem to be many English speaking roles in my industry, employment safeguards seem broadly similar. Famously liberal culture. On the negative side, weather sounds much the same, and the people sound like the Germans in being a bit blunt and hard to get to know.
2) France: limited job opportunities, need paper qualifications for everything, celebrated but eye-wateringly expensive capital, and the industrial north is not supposed to be that nice.
3) Germany: famously well-run, a cosmopolitan capital with vibrant culture and great nightlife, has jobs if you speak the language and have qualifications, but they go through your CV with a fine-tooth comb, including school records. Lovely summers but savagely cold and dark winters.
4) Spain / Portugal: relatively low waged, not great job opportunities. The place to be in winter but possibly too hot in summer.
5) Other central / eastern europe: some beautiful cities, up and coming economies, plenty of English-speaking jobs in my industry, good summers but harsh winters, really low waged, and if things didn't work out that could make a move back to Ireland difficult (savings wouldn't go far), very difficult to learn languages. Employment safeguards might not be great. Some have more authoritarian politics.
6) Norway / Sweden / Finland: cold and expensive.
7) Italy: lovely country, not sure about jobs.

murmuring pines

suicide_circus wrote: »

I've come to the conclusion that i cannot see myself retiring in Ireland.

Shocking weather

There are continental countries where the hot/cold weather kills off pensioners in waves.

suicide_circus

suicide_circus wrote: »

I've come to the conclusion that i cannot see myself retiring in Ireland.

Shocking weather
Bargain basement services and infrastructure
Extremely weak visionless leadership

I have dual citizenship (ireland/another continental european country) and my wife is from another continental european country so we have ties elsewhere which i hope to exploit.

What with the EU that’s not a problem these days.

suicide_circus

yagan wrote: »

You may have another citizenship but before you came to this conclusion have you actually lived in another country on which to make comparison?

Only for short periods. I'm just totally disillusioned with Ireland in every respect but the lies we tell about ourselves are particularly galling. We're not welcoming at all beyond a paper thin veneer of the cead mile. We're not rebellious, quite the reverse, we're credulous, compliant and forelock-tugging.

In terms of healthcare, i really really don't want to be old in Ireland. Pretty much every interaction i've had with the health system has been shocking.

Cee-Jay-Cee

Spain for me purely for the weather and the more relaxed way of life, most likely the south or south east coast area. I would love to retire there or to Tenerife. I've spent 50 years in this country and the unpredictable weather is more depressing than ever. If fortunes allow i'll hopefully live permanently in spain one day.

suicide_circus

Deleted User wrote: »

What with the EU that’s not a problem these days.

I know but we both have family on the continent which would make moving somewhat easier

yagan

suicide_circus wrote: »

Only for short periods. I'm just totally disillusioned with Ireland in every respect but the lies we tell about ourselves are particularly galling. We're not welcoming at all beyond a paper thin veneer of the cead mile. We're not rebellious, quite the reverse, we're credulous, compliant and forelock-tugging.

In terms of healthcare, i really really don't want to be old in Ireland. Pretty much every interaction i've had with the health system has been shocking.

Well I can't argue with that as such feelings had me emigrate in the past. What I would say having legally resided and worked in a few other countries (USA, UK, OZ, NZ) is that overall we have it sweet.

But that's just my experience.

But when it comes to telling lies about ourselves, at least we know we are doing that. Some of the whoppers I heard elsewhere was astounding.

One of my favorites was Australians explaining how the superior Australian businesses culture saved it from the financial crash in 08 and had nothing to do with China's infrastructure spending spree. They're in total denial about how China has kept them out of recession for so long.

At least the Kiwi's are more pragmatic about it.

Strumms

suicide_circus wrote: »

Only for short periods. I'm just totally disillusioned with Ireland in every respect but the lies we tell about ourselves are particularly galling. We're not welcoming at all beyond a paper thin veneer of the cead mile. We're not rebellious, quite the reverse, we're credulous, compliant and forelock-tugging.

In terms of healthcare, i really really don't want to be old in Ireland. Pretty much every interaction i've had with the health system has been shocking.

We are welcoming of money into tills, that’s about it.

100% on healthcare... the most toxic experience I’ve every encountered in my lifetime...

ONE example...A physical rehabilitation specialist earning a six figure salary and who spends hours bigging himself up on social media....asking ME what he should do to help me.... hydrotherapy I exclaimed as I’d had success procuring it privately... “ ohh that’s a great idea hmmmm, god, I don’t know where, erm, ok, let me look it up, I’ll be in touch “

It was available, in the hospital where he worked as a physical rehabilitation consultant....

It was on me checking with the department directly available to outpatients as long as a consultant referred me...and they agreed it would have been extremely beneficial in fixing the problem.

Never heard back from the prick...that’s a year prior to covid.

CelticRambler

Interesting to see the number of people using "weather" as a reason for considering a move from where they are (mostly in Ireland) to somewhere else. Cee-Jay-Cee's remark about "the unpredictable weather" falls neatly into this category - believe it or not, the weather here on the continent is also "unpredictable" and increasingly so over the last decade. 'Twould be very foolish to move to [insert country with glorious weather here] only to find that the average year-round climate had changed to something very different to your fond memories of balmy summer (or winter) holidays.

strandroad

For weather driven retirement plans we should probably consider climate change! 30 years from now, is Spain going to be burnt to a crisp and Portugal ravaged by wildfires? How much will be left of the Netherlands and Adriatic coast? Will Ireland get any cosier... surely not if the Gulf Stream breaks down?
Languages won't matter, our phones (brain implants?) will take care of it in real time.

yagan

I really missed seasons when I lived in hotter climes. I could never do hot again, which is why I really could only consider north Iberia or France. I'd be happy with Cork considering how it's generally warmer that the rest of the island.

If anyone is considering a move to warmer clime I'd highly suggest a temporary move for their best and worst extremes before committing all in.

I think an awful lot more could be made of enjoying our climate if we designed more for it. The total ignoring of sun orientation when designing houses and apartments was a total wasted opportunity.

CelticRambler

strandroad wrote: »

For weather driven retirement plans we should probably consider climate change!

Never mind retirement - it was a genuine consideration for us, moving here 15 years ago, and one that has so far proven to be a very sensible criterion to have included in our research parameters. The places that we left and the places that we struck off our list have all suffered "worst ever" seriously disruptive weather events in the intervening years.

While our weather has also evolved, it's cope-able with - given the right investment. Historically, this area has had a higher annual rainfall than Ireland. Anyone who's seen my posts on the gardening forum will know that I'm currently in the process of creating storage capacity for 50,000 litres of water to get us through what's now a new normal in the summer: four months of drought (and today - 11th March - is the first day we've had any kind of precipitation in the last four weeks).

irelandrover

Brian? wrote: »

I think you're missing my point. I know how to say the words and do so with some difficulty, I was trying to explain why it isn't as easy for all English speakers as some people think it is. For someone from England I think these sounds are easier.




I don't know what to tell you, this is my experience.

I'm going to go out on a limb and assume Brian lives in Eindhoven. When i first arrived people were a lot more open to speaking Dutch with you.

Now there are so many foreigners that there is almost always someone in the group who does not speak Dutch that English is becoming the first language in companies. Why would the Dutch person put in the effort helping your Dutch when likely they have to speak English with you 95% of the time anyway.

ancapailldorcha

Are there many English language TV stations or networks in the Netherlands? Do cinemas used dubbed versions of films or Dutch subtitles.

Barna77

Spain, obviously

I really like Budapest, so maybe there.

I am tekashi 6ix9ine

Amsterdam for the cannabis.

Italy for the wine and women.

ancapailldorcha

Brian? wrote: »

What field are you in? I live in Eindhoven and speak very little Dutch.

Somehow missed this. Life sciences.

jobeenfitz

CelticRambler wrote: »

Interesting to see the number of people using "weather" as a reason for considering a move from where they are (mostly in Ireland) to somewhere else. Cee-Jay-Cee's remark about "the unpredictable weather" falls neatly into this category - believe it or not, the weather here on the continent is also "unpredictable" and increasingly so over the last decade. 'Twould be very foolish to move to [insert country with glorious weather here] only to find that the average year-round climate had changed to something very different to your fond memories of balmy summer (or winter) holidays.

Im in southern Spain, winters here are far better than summers in Ireland. This is my sixth winter here. Usually from September/October to May/June.

Not one of those Christmas days (25th) have been under 18 degrees.

Its the main reason I'm here.

When I'm home I walk on thr beach in Galway but its not easy to find the enthusiasm during winter.

Even on a wet day here you may get a dry and warm few hours to get out walking.

Strumms

CelticRambler wrote: »

Interesting to see the number of people using "weather" as a reason for considering a move from where they are (mostly in Ireland) to somewhere else. Cee-Jay-Cee's remark about "the unpredictable weather" falls neatly into this category - believe it or not, the weather here on the continent is also "unpredictable" and increasingly so over the last decade. 'Twould be very foolish to move to [insert country with glorious weather here] only to find that the average year-round climate had changed to something very different to your fond memories of balmy summer (or winter) holidays.

Having again lived abroad on the continent... take Paris. The summer was fantastic, average high during the summer months is 3.5 degrees warmer than here..

Ireland averages about 30 inches of rainfall per year...

Paris 24 inches... that was a big plus.

seenitall

CelticRambler wrote: »

And that applies equally to the "foreign" language: just because you learn from a native speaker doesn't mean that your pronunciation will be "perfect" - if your French friend comes from Provence, you'll eat "peng" for your lunch on "lengdi", and put "veng-seng" euros' worth of petrol in your "beng-yullll" ... Fat lot of good that'll do you trying to talk to the Alsatians! :pac:

Pain, lundi, vingt cinq, bagnole. Am I right, do I win anything?? :P

And no, I’m not French, whether Alsatian or otherwise... why wouldn’t they understand a different accent, it’s still the same language..? Even the slang word for ‘car’ seems to be universal in the country.

You get all kinds of regional accents in my country as well, all very different from one another, with different loan words from various neighbouring nations, depending on the area... yet with just a tiny bit of goodwill, everyone understands each other. Same language.

McGiver

seenitall wrote: »

I’m from a place originally where half a day’s drive/Train will bring you to Venice, Vienna, or Budapest, to name just a few. I’ve lived in Ireland 20 years now, and as fantastic as life here is, of late I really get the call of the continent more and more. The climate here is killing me, it’s way too humid (it wasn’t always the case, but in the last few years I’ve had some slight breathing problems and cottoned on to the fact that they clear up once I’ve been away for my hols!?) and I’m missing my beloved Central Europe something awful now. The lockdown is probably exacerbating it.

So anyway; a chalet in the Alps (Salzburg region will do fine) for snow activities, a townhouse in Lugano or similar for a bit of urban living, a house in the olive grove on an island in the Adriatic for the summers (love hot summers!), and a palazzo in Venice for the in-between seasons. That’s the fantasy wish list and I’m sure I wrote about it before!!

The reality will be staying in Ireland til the child is reared and then leveraging some assets and hopefully a bit of inheritance to make a base of some kind on the continent a reality. May end up doing the full circle and going back home to live.

Let us guess the location! North Slovenia? West Slovakia?

McGiver

murmuring pines wrote: »

6) Norway / Sweden / Finland: cold and expensive.

Southern Norway (Oslo region), southern Sweden (Skåne) and eastern Denmark (Copenhagen) are drier and hotter in summer than Dublin and twice as much as South and West of Ireland - you can dream about that dry and warm summer in 80% of Ireland where it pisses all the time and you get 20 C.
I got serious sunburns there. Forest fires in Norway are common in summer now. 28 C easily. Nice, almost, proper summer.

Yes, winter is much colder, but you've four seasons. And you can go skiing and play ice-hockey