2021 Irish EV sales

Widescreen · 17-01-2022 3:19pm

I have a 15 Auris. 60km nice little mover 1.2 T - I normally change every 5-6 years. With all the confusion in the car market why would I bother changing now?

Am, In my 60's so long term targets are less appealing! Firstly I fancied a Corolla Hybrid then I heard the government don't back them with any funding so I thought that means that car will be worth zilch in 5 years time as well.

Then I thought maybe I should buy a Plugin hybrid which for the distance I travel would mean very little use of the petrol engine. But low and behold they pulled the plug on a grant for that, so why would I bother with one of them either now. Will be worth not a whole pile in 5 years time.

As far as a PROP[ER electric vehicle goes, they are mostly out of Joe Soap's price range at the moment, so basically I am just going to drive my car into the ground until someone offers me scrappage and maybe a grant of some sort to make you want to upgrade to electric and all the grief that goes with that!

Anyone have any advice for my situation which I am sure is very common throughout the country as to what you would suggest as regards changing my car.. thanks

KCross · 17-01-2022 3:41pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118489533#Comment_118489533

Driving your own car until it stops is probably the cheapest option and a '15 Auris is still a very good reliable car. Likely to last a long time yet.

If you are making a change anyway, dont focus on the grants, just look at the bottom line.

An entry level Toyota Corolla is €28k.

You can buy a Nissan Leaf for the same money with 0% finance so effectively cheaper!

A Renault Zoe is also €28k. The cheapest VW ID.3 is €34k so a few grand more for that alright.

Are you going to change the car anyway? What would you be spending on it if you are? Would the Corolla be the kind of car you would look at (5-door hatch type car or do you care?)

What mileage do you do each year?

sk8board · 17-01-2022 3:59pm

I wouldn’t jump into a full EV until we go through one or two more iterations on the battery tech, range and price.

the 2nd generation of all the current 3-400km family EVs will do far more range and on better tech e.g solid state batteries. That’s a given.

unkel · 17-01-2022 4:02pm

There is no iterations in battery tech. Prices are already pretty much on a par with ICE engines, with total cost of ownership already cheaper for BEV. What range do you need? Many new EVs now have at least 400km real life range. How often do you go over that without wanting / needing to stop for 15 minutes anyway?

Get with the program dude! 😂

Widescreen · 17-01-2022 4:03pm

Working from home at moment so mileage has gone down from 12k a year to 2k, so little incentive there to change as it would just mean a different car to look at in the driveway for most of the time!

When you say entry level corolla 28k, what do you mean by that?

I'd like a similar car to Auris but electric ideally. I'd like a range of at least 500 though! I assume if you crawled along at 90( on motorway) in an electric vehicle instead of 130 the range should be a lot further? I assume using radio, heater, full beam lights etc would all be battery drainers?

That is interesting about the Leaf, do you know what range the current leafs do?

sk8board · 17-01-2022 4:19pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118489856#Comment_118489856

by your reasoning, a 2025 2nd hand buyer should treat a 3yo LFP MIC M3 the same as a fremont SR+.

it simply wont happen. For a start, the MIC owner will jump up and down about all his advantages.

The cars cost the same to buy new, a few weeks apart, but will be viewed differently in future.

its just market forces.

fits · 17-01-2022 5:02pm

Just fyi as an owner of the big battery ID.3 we haven’t gone anywhere near the limit of the range yet. If you’re buying a car with bigger range you’re carrying extra weight and cost for no reason unless regularly doing long spins.

( we bought it as I thought the 250 km return journey to office would be close to limit on days like today of sub zero temperatures. )

unkel · 17-01-2022 5:15pm

The overwhelming majority of EV owners know nothing about the chemistry of the battery or how a battery degrades. And rightly so. They don't and shouldn't need to know. The problem is with the people that know a little and perpetuate stuff that doesn't matter. Like avoid charging to 100% and other nonsense.

Red Silurian · 17-01-2022 5:29pm

I see 2 more companies in recent web searches this morning are doing what muxan in the netherlands do. On both the rangetherapy.org and cleevelyev.co.uk website they talk about upgrading or extending a Nissan Leaf battery

I think this is the future and more companies will start going down this offering so rather than buying a new car I will probably buy a new battery or range extender when my car is 7-8 years old.

creedp · 17-01-2022 6:12pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118490330#Comment_118490330

Nearly €10k is expensive to gain an additional 140km range and an 18cm shallower boot. Prices would need to come down and ideally be a battery replacement, either new of reconditioned, rather than a battery extender in the boot to be attractive IMO. As it stands the battery extender would be worth more than many early Leafs which are really the only cars suitable for this upgrade.

Red Silurian · 17-01-2022 6:16pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118490554#Comment_118490554

You are correct at the moment they don't make much sense and are just for enthusiasts. Just like EVs were back 5-6 years ago

What I can see happening is more companies getting involved, reconditioned/used batteries coming down in price and in 5 years time it might be more economical to get a range extender or a new battery

As it stands you can get a 2012 28kWh leaf for about 5k, se my earlier post, add a 33kWh extender for €12,000 and assume the original battery is at 80% and you've got a 10 year old EV with a 50-52kWh usable battery for €17,000, no doubt it has to come down in price - but not massively

KCross · 17-01-2022 6:36pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118489839#Comment_118489839

Cars will depreciate alot faster than the battery iterations will happen.

Solid state is "around the corner" now for years. If you sit and wait for the perfect battery/car you will have bought and scrapped many ICE cars before it will happen. There are also external forces, like EU regulation, government grants being reduced/removed and ICE bans, which will keep EV residuals/prices artifically held up for a while yet.

If a car is available today and it suits you, buy it.

KCross · 17-01-2022 6:43pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118489870#Comment_118489870

Working from home at moment so mileage has gone down from 12k a year to 2k

In that case I'd be hanging onto the Auris. Spending €30k for 2k km's would be madness.

I gave the €28k Corolla example since it is the nearest thing that Toyota now have to match your Auris if you were going to buy new.

And then gave you the EV's that were a similar price to show that there isnt actually a price differential to go to an EV.... depends on the car you pick of course, some are more expensive.

I assume if you crawled along at 90( on motorway) in an electric vehicle instead of 130 the range should be a lot further? I assume using radio, heater, full beam lights etc would all be battery drainers?

Yes, same as an ICE car. If you drive it slow you will get better mpg.

Radio, lights, wipers wont affect range. Heater will affect it but can be mitigated by heating the car at home before you leave when its connected to your house electricity.

That is interesting about the Leaf, do you know what range the current leafs do?

I'll have to defer to current Leaf owners for that. I know it wont do your requested 500km's though. Note, there are two Leaf versions.... 40kWh and 60kWh, so there are different ranges and hence prices for those.

creedp · 17-01-2022 7:27pm

I'd say you'd be lucky to have 70% / 80km capacity remaining on a 2012 Leaf. In addition, the 36cm height of the extender battery in the Gen 1 Leaf effectively means you will have extremely limited boot space and with no frunk, very limited storage overall. Also with only 110bhp, the extra weight of the extender battery would dull the performance of the car even further. Finally it would still suffer from one of the Leaf's biggest weakness compared to most other EV's at this stage, very inefficient at higher speeds. However, still a reasonable proposition if price feel to day €5k for a replacement battery. I have a 2016 L30 with 79% SOH/ 120 km range and would consider replacing the battery with a 40kw/h option if available in a couple of years so I could keep the car as a run around. We'll see what the future brings.

Grumpypants · 17-01-2022 7:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118489839#Comment_118489839

What is more likely is the price of today's tech will come down and the solid state tech will be on the higher spec more expensive models.

The grants will also be gone, so that 5k will wipe out any saving that is made.

I'm not sure anyone needs more than 400km range for a day to day car.

innrain · 17-01-2022 8:07pm

I think I do around 2k km on my treadmill in a year. You definitely don't need to sunk money in a new car which would loose value sitting. Even now is expensive. Just motor tax and insurance cost you around 30c/km. Add depreciation, fuel and maintenance and you're looking at 80-100c/km?

A new car loosing 5000 in a year it is 2.5euro/km.

timsey tiger · 17-01-2022 8:59pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118490955#Comment_118490955

I guess you've seen the fully charged episode where Robert swopped the battery of his leaf.

innrain · 17-01-2022 10:04pm

From what I see here and on FB there are a big number of new EVs registered this month. Anybody willing to name what the number would be? Would it be over 2k? My first two 221 reg seen in the wild were EVs a Leaf and an Ioniq5. I also think I saw a 221 Tesla but not 100% sure.

AndyBoBandy · 17-01-2022 10:20pm

I saw a 221 BMW i3(S?) today and it looks a bit chunkier around the when arches…. Looks like they have wider tyres on them now too…

creedp · 17-01-2022 11:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118491390#Comment_118491390

Is that the episode when the Leaf battery was replaced by Muxan in Holland? From memory that option seemed a lot better value than being offered by Rangetherapy.org for the battery extender option.

unkel · 18-01-2022 12:43am

From memory it's about 20% more expensive to have it done in the UK (compared to NL) and about 30-40% more expensive to have it done in Ireland

Anyway, we had a dedicated thread about this upgrade of the Nissan Leaf battery. Conclusion: it is terrible value for money. You are much better off financially just selling your Leaf as is and buying another EV with the range you require.

timsey tiger · 19-01-2022 3:35pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118492244#Comment_118492244

Yes, I think it went out there a good while back and he recently did an episode driving it home. It got disrupted by the pandemic. Seems like a far superior solution.