F1 2020: ROUND 14 Turkish GP

Faugheen

quokula wrote: »

It's surely doing reputational damage to their brand though (which is literally the only reason they're in the sport - this isn't a pure racing team like Williams or McLaren or the like)

For example, McLaren's most iconic car which is still well remembered is not the one that Hakkinen or Hamilton won titles with, it's the one that Prost and Senna battled each other in. If you google "McLaren F1 car" it appears just under the current one and well ahead of any other. If you google "Most iconic F1 cars" it's right there at the top.

No matter who Mercedes puts in the two cars, they're guaranteed both titles before a wheel is turned thanks to the hardware they have and the rules that are stacked in their favour. So why not put two good drivers in the car, surely that would get them in the headlines more and get more exposure for the brand and it's sponsors?

People still fondly remember that McLaren, even though it was just as dominant as the Mercedes, albeit over one season rather than 7. If you load up a computer game where players can customise their cars, the most popular livery for every McLaren road car by far is a Marlboro one. The brand and the sponsors of that era are still getting free advertising 30 years later.

Almost nobody will fondly remember the hybrid era, or praise Mercedes for seeking out the worst driver they could find after Hamilton was shown up and beaten by Rosberg. Anyone who follows the sport closely will know there are huge question marks over whether Hamilton could succeed with a decent team mate, and everyone who doesn't closely follow the sport will have long since switched off out of boredom.

Have people forgotten that before Rosberg beat Hamilton, Hamilton beat him twice before?

Hamilton beat Alonso, Button and Rosberg as team-mates. All world champions.

Anjobe

Faugheen wrote: »

Have people forgotten that before Rosberg beat Hamilton, Hamilton beat him twice before?

Hamilton beat Alonso, Button and Rosberg as team-mates. All world champions.

Hamilton beat Rosberg 3 seasons out of 4.

Joeface

please don't bring this in to the thread , it just runs wildly off coarse when top trumps is started

BikeRacer

Faugheen wrote: »

Have people forgotten that before Rosberg beat Hamilton, Hamilton beat him twice before?

Hamilton beat Alonso, Button and Rosberg as team-mates. All world champions.

Honestly, don't bother trying to argue with him. He posts the same "Hamilton is average, merc is evil, hybrid era blah blah blah" copy-paste rubbish all the time.

Inquitus

Pretty much a full replay on Ch 4 starting at 4pm for anyone, like me, who decided to have a lie on this morning! Can flick between that and Dublin v Laois!

This is it

Inquitus wrote: »

Pretty much a full replay on Ch 4 starting at 4pm for anyone, like me, who decided to have a lie on this morning! Can flick between that and Dublin v Laois!

Dublin, the Mercedes of football

El_Duderino 09

quokula wrote: »

It's surely doing reputational damage to their brand though (which is literally the only reason they're in the sport - this isn't a pure racing team like Williams or McLaren or the like)
...

Reputational damage? Winning the drivers’ and constructors’ championships is causing them them reputational damage? If that’s damaging their reputation, who is gaining reputation out of f1?

In reality it probably enhances their reputation by less than the iconic senna-Prost season or the Hamilton-Rosberg merc. But it only enhance their reputation to a greater or lesser degree. The notion that it damages the reputation is miles off.

Inquitus

This is it wrote: »

Dublin, the Mercedes of football

Dublin v Laois is on the RTE News Channel of all places, the GAA is spread out across a serious amount of channels and platforms, Sky Sports, TG4, RTE, RTE News, hard to keep up with lol!

Adamocovic

Delighted for Vettel.

Needed this with the horrid season he had. Hamilton just too good and was smart with overruling the teams pit decision.

Bottas is so far away from him.

Inquitus

Adamocovic wrote: »

Bottas is so far away from him.

This was probably Bottas's worst performance as a Mercedes driver! It was brutal, so many spins, so far off the pace, his team mate wins and he fails to score points in an identical car, it really doesn't get much worse for the Finn!

AMKC

That was an ok race certainly no classic do. Hamilton won again ye, not how boring. Delighted for Sergio Perez and Vettel do just a pity it was not a fresh face that won.
Bottas was woefull.
That was Lance Strolls race to win and he decked it up. Max not at his best either with a very bad start and not a good recovery.

This is it

AMKC wrote: »

That was an ok race certainly no classic do. Hamilton won again ye, not how boring. Delighted for Sergio Perez and Vettel do just a pity it was not a fresh face that won.
Bottas was woefull.
That was Lance Strolls race to win and he decked it up. Max not at his best either with a very bad start and not a good recovery.

Hamilton might've won but it was definitely one of the more exciting races I've seen in a long time. 2nd, 3rd and 4th literally decided on the last corner!

Lots of spins and slides, bit of overtaking. Nearly every onboard I was on the edge of my seat waiting for a slide or spin. Watching the drivers fighting the car on every corner to keep the back end in check. Brilliant race for me and great to see Vettel on the podium again

GarIT

I really enjoyed the race, it was one of the better ones but I think it will be hard to beat Austria this year as the greatest race of all time.

El_Duderino 09

GarIT wrote: »

I really enjoyed the race, it was one of the better ones but I think it will be hard to beat Austria this year as the greatest race of all time.

It was a bonkers race without really having many major incidents. All except 4cars finished and at least 2 of those were mechanical issues. That’s crazy for a wet race.

Form went out the window. Stroll on poll, Vettel on the podium, both Alfas in q3 and Mercedes worst quali since before the hybrid era.

chicorytip

Inquitus wrote: »

This was probably Bottas's worst performance as a Mercedes driver! It was brutal, so many spins, so far off the pace, his team mate wins and he fails to score points in an identical car, it really doesn't get much worse for the Finn!

In mitigation, it seems his car suffered some front end damage which affected the handling. That may explain the exceptionally poor result he had although you would wonder why they didn't just retire the car if that were the case.

ElisaAtWar

Not many Lewis fans around these days, but when you consider the weather levelled the playing field and he still won, that says something about his ability as a driver. Personally I rather F1 in wet conditions as it really opens up the race.

Man with broke phone

If I was mercedes or red bull Id be looking at Perez for second driver over what they have there. He brings 30 mill with him supposedly too.

the_pen_turner

Man with broke phone wrote: »

If I was mercedes or red bull Id be looking at Perez for second driver over what they have there. He brings 30 mill with him supposedly too.

red bull hopefully are.
merc s wont do anyhting unless lewis leaves. they have a great driver and a very obedient back up

El_Duderino 09

ElisaAtWar wrote: »

Not many Lewis fans around these days, but when you consider the weather levelled the playing field and he still won, that says something about his ability as a driver. Personally I rather F1 in wet conditions as it really opens up the race.

I know that’s something people say but I don’t think it’s easy to make the case that the weather levelled the field. Looking at quali, Lance stroll was fastest. Does anyone think he’s fastest on a level playing field?

It becomes much more clear when you look at where teammates qualified and then you see that The cars were almost certainly the limiting factors. E.g. some cars just happened to be good in those conditions because nobody intentionally build their car to be good at wet, very low grip and very low track temps. Both racing point and red bulls on the first two rows, both Renault and Alfas in q3. Both Ferraris qualifying in 12 and 14.

Teammates tended to be grouped together so it seems likely the cars were the main factor today, though in a different order to normal.

flazio

AMKC wrote: »

That was Lance Strolls race to win and he decked it up.

I'm not sure I'd blame Stroll here. The strategy got away from him as the track started drying out. I have to say he's a serious dark horse in very wet conditions.
.

Man with broke phone

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

I know that’s something people say but I don’t think it’s easy to make the case that the weather levelled the field. Looking at quali, Lance stroll was fastest. Does anyone think he’s fastest on a level playing field?

It becomes much more clear when you look at where teammates qualified and then you see that The cars were almost certainly the limiting factors. E.g. some cars just happened to be good in those conditions because nobody intentionally build their car to be good at wet, very low grip and very low track temps. Both racing point and red bulls on the first two rows, both Renault and Alfas in q3. Both Ferraris qualifying in 12 and 14.

Teammates tended to be grouped together so it seems likely the cars were the main factor today, though in a different order to normal.

You flip flop constantly.

Perez (who you called a solidly mediocre driver) beat his teammate by about 12 places. He qualified a little slower than him because he wobbled at the end of q3 when everybody put in a slightly better lap. Probably the only time he made a mistake in the last two days. He got overtaken on the last lap with no tyres and retook position against a driver (leclerc) that you say is great who was then overtook by his teammate Vettel who you say is a terrible driver who forgot how to drive.

Then you roll in telling us how to decipher the finishing positions to prove you know everything.

El_Duderino 09

Man with broke phone wrote: »

You flip flop constantly.

Perez (who you called a solidly mediocre driver) beat his teammate by about 12 places. He qualified a little slower than him because he wobbled at the end of q3 when everybody put in a slightly better lap. Probably the only time he made a mistake in the last two days. He got overtaken on the last lap with no tyres and retook position against a driver (leclerc) that you say is great who was then overtook by his teammate Vettel who you say is a terrible driver who forgot how to drive.

Then you roll in telling us how to decipher the finishing positions to prove you know everything.

Lol. I think you've got the wrong poster. I've never said that Vettel has forgotten how to drive - but there is another poster who uses that phrase.

The fact i observed is that teammates tended to be clustered together on the grid which is contrary to the idea that the rain was a big leveller (as i explained earlier, if the rain was a leveller, is anyone willing to suggest that Stroll and Perez are among the fastest 3 drivers?) How the cars happened to be suited to the unique conditions was clearly the biggest factor.

I think Perez is pretty average based on years of his performances, where exactly did I flip flop on anything?

Man with broke phone

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Lol. I think you've got the wrong poster. I've never said that Vettel has forgotten how to drive - but there is another poster who uses that phrase.

The fact i observed is that teammates tended to be clustered together on the grid which is contrary to the idea that the rain was a big leveller (as i explained earlier, if the rain was a leveller, is anyone willing to suggest that Stroll and Perez are among the fastest 3 drivers?) How the cars happened to be suited to the unique conditions was clearly the biggest factor.

I think Perez is pretty average based on years of his performances, where exactly did I flip flop on anything?

But his teammate wasnt grouped anywhere near him.

El_Duderino 09

Man with broke phone wrote: »

But his teammate wasnt grouped anywhere near him.

Ah, I see your misunderstanding. I referred to quali, in which both RPs were only one grid position form each other.

Where did i flip-flop on anything?

Top Dog

Man with broke phone wrote: »

Perez (who you called a solidly mediocre driver) beat his teammate by about 12 places.

2nd vs 9th = 12

Spudman_20000

Congrats to Lewis on his 7th championship. More of the same next year I'd imagine.

Bottas was embarrassing. He really is as useful as a chocolate teapot.

Charlie-Bravo

Spudman_20000 wrote: »

Congrats to Lewis on his 7th championship. More of the same next year I'd imagine.

Bottas was embarrassing. He really is as useful as a chocolate teapot.

Bottas' teapot had suffered damage. So tea was leaking out before the chocolate could melt.

Sabre0001

ElisaAtWar wrote: »

Not many Lewis fans around these days, but when you consider the weather levelled the playing field and he still won, that says something about his ability as a driver. Personally I rather F1 in wet conditions as it really opens up the race.

After the race, I was wondering if I would like Hamilton more if there was less team radio coverage. There's usually a message about how tires are gone followed by him setting fastest lap after fastest lap. I imagine I would have liked Schumacher less had I been subject to the same coverage

Definitely prefer the wet or unpredictable conditions too. Hamilton adjusted to challenging conditions better than most and really took the advantage when it started to dry out (though still had to drive well as we saw drivers have late spins).

Entertaining race all-in-all. Strange, in a good way, to see Ferrari do well after recent performances and unspectacular qualifying.

jammiedodgers

Looks like Lance was driving with damage

https://twitter.com/RacingPointF1/status/1328314584177008640

SureYWouldntYa

It was strange how he totally dropped off

Max and Albon looked good at stages but they fell due to mistakes they made while Stroll just lost pace after pitting