Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on [email protected] for help. Thanks :)
Private profiles - please note that profiles marked as private will soon be public. This will facilitate moderation so mods can view users' warning histories. All of your posts across the site will appear on your profile page (including PI, RI). Groups posts will remain private except to users who have access to the same Groups as you. Thread here
Some important site news, please read here. Thanks!

Awkward Chief

  • 28-10-2020 5:39pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 149 ✭✭ RS98
    Registered User


    I'm wondering if anyone has come across this:

    I applied for a restricted cert about 4 months ago. I have a few guns at the moment, none are restricted. I meet the security requirements and have my good and sufficient reason etc.

    After many (many) calls to urge on the application, and well past the 3 months, my local FO rang me saying the chief is asking if I can give up one of my guns to get this one.

    I use them all often, so obviously I don't want to do that. District Station FO adviced I send him an additional letter stating uses for all my current guns. I've done just that and am waiting to hear back. I've also said I can give range attendance, competition results etc etc if needed.

    Anyone been in this situation? Any advice?

    Cheers


Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 6,759 ✭✭✭ clivej
    Registered User


    I had much the same when applying for another rifle, a 22lr rifle. I was called for an interview, yet again #4 this time. I have a monitored alarm system. He tried to get me to do a couple of things.
    1. To give up a firearm.
    I said it was not a requirement for me to do that as I had good reason for applying for the rifle.
    2. To put an alarm zone on the safe.
    I said I wasn't going to do that as my Eircom system only has 2 zones, home and away. I would not take either one away for the safe.

    The Super was trying it on, don't put up with it, tell him how it us.
    There a third condition, just as trivial, that I also said I wasn't going to do, can't think what it was now.

    I remember phoning the FO. up after to say I wasn't getting the rifle now as a higher person than the Super said I can't have it (her indoors)


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,342 ✭✭✭✭ Grizzly 45
    Registered User


    RS98 wrote: »
    I'm wondering if anyone has come across this:

    I applied for a restricted cert about 4 months ago. I have a few guns at the moment, none are restricted. I meet the security requirements and have my good and sufficient reason etc.

    After many (many) calls to urge on the application, and well past the 3 months, my local FO rang me saying the chief is asking if I can give up one of my guns to get this one.

    I use them all often, so obviously I don't want to do that. District Station FO adviced I send him an additional letter stating uses for all my current guns. I've done just that and am waiting to hear back. I've also said I can give range attendance, competition results etc etc if needed.

    Anyone been in this situation? Any advice?

    Cheers

    Short answer ..No! I'm not swopping anything... Unless it was a like for like,Fk off!!:D
    Don't get into this mullarkey of swopping one for the other, it becomes a deal
    a situation where you will probably come out the worse off.
    You have given your reasons, you have been no problem with the other firearms, let him make the judgement call on your record and the reasons provided by you. If he refuses, then consider your options, but horse-trading like this isnt a good idea.

    Confucius say."He who says one man cannot change World. Never has eaten bat soup in Wuhan!"



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭ Feisar
    Registered User


    I can across the give one up line. I politely explained they were all different and the FO was happy enough.

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Registered Users Posts: 441 ✭✭ jb88
    Registered User


    So this happens a lot its designed as a deterrent to limit access to firearms, by you "volunteering", to give up or change something.
    Common enough tactic, it feels like they have a bullet point list of things to suggest when they have a prospective applicant in front of them.

    Just re enforce your purpose and reasons for requiring said item along with your reasons for use.
    I brought in a copy of my results for 3 years once and I think thats enough to last them a lifetime.

    Just keep feeding them paperwork and emails and eventually it will come through, fingers crossed for me, again ;-)
    They would want an airtight case to not allow you to have one if you satisfy all the criteria.

    Main thing is, this ok "Show me where it states this in the legislation and I will comply", that generally lets everyone know you are on the right page.

    There is a lot of make it up as you go along, and its rince and repeat, ive had it from at least 4 Chiefs over the years at this stage.

    You meet the criteria, then you wont have a problem, they smell weakness and its a legal duel. Speak firmly put your case across and if it comes back negative keep asking and sending them documentation until they do.

    Gardai like paperwork, so pile it in there and have a good supporting letter and pictures, they like pictures.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,342 ✭✭✭✭ Grizzly 45
    Registered User


    My take on this;
    Have a care too with paperwork.
    Because once it is on paper, its evidence and official [using their own logic and reasoning against them].
    I would never provide pics of a firearm they want unless it is the actual firearm in question you are going to license for the first time. I'm sure Google works well in AGS stations?
    [Say a Ruger mini 14 for pig iron].
    Provide the blandest stock photo possible Wooden stock, no high cap mags, weird black stocks etc. Some edjits have provided pics of these type of guns kitted out with all the bells and whistles, and guess how successful their applications were?:roll eyes: Ditto, don't use any website pics of these guns in a police/military/home defence setting off a webpage...Remember a picture paints a thousand words? It might have to to a DC judge. And it certainly is for Bushmaster/Remington in a lawsuit for the mass shooting in Connecticut!

    IOW think like the Cheif...What can he do to refuse you in your application?

    Reapplication with new Cheifs in the districts... Reason for owning this statement IF EVER ASKED "My reasons for owning/licensing this firearm are exactly the same as per my original application, and my circumstances and needs have not changed." And leave it at that.
    I wouldn't go into lengthy explanations, for a renewal reapplication as they are new reasons and it "can be used against you as evidence in a court of law"

    Different if it is a new application for a new firearm.THen you have to have your I dotted and T crossed, and that's a different story.

    Target scores..Meh if you want...It's just so much sugar to them. All they want to see is have you been to the range "regularly",3 or 4 times a year d depending on the range? Which of course is bollixed this year with national lockdowns and COVID:eek: And will be no doubt in 21 to probably 24 as well.So that has to be taken into consideration too in the future with this paperwork.

    Confucius say."He who says one man cannot change World. Never has eaten bat soup in Wuhan!"



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 149 ✭✭ RS98
    Registered User


    Quick update on this, got the licence two weeks ago. Thanks for everyone's advice.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,759 ✭✭✭ clivej
    Registered User


    RS98 wrote: »
    Quick update on this, got the licence two weeks ago. Thanks for everyone's advice.

    Way to go.................... Great result


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,555 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Cass
    Moderator


    Congrats, well done.

    Forum Charter - Useful Information - RFDs - Ranges by County - Hunting Laws/Important threads


    If you see a problem post use the report post function, "FLAG" & let a Moderator deal with it.


    Your Shooting Forum Moderators - Cass, Cookimonster, Vegeta, Sparks, It wasn't me!



  • Registered Users Posts: 473 ✭✭ The pigeon man
    Registered User


    Interesting tactic being used by the supers. You'd swear it was a hostage negotiation where the negotiator has to ask for a concession from the hostage taker. (Give over hostage for a phone call).

    Don't surrender or else every occasion you license a firearm it becomes a negotiation.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,280 ✭✭✭ tudderone
    Registered User


    Interesting tactic being used by the supers. You'd swear it was a hostage negotiation where the negotiator has to ask for a concession from the hostage taker. (Give over hostage for a phone call).

    Don't surrender or else every occasion you license a firearm it becomes a negotiation.

    Its strikes me as being unprofessional tbh. An application shall be judged on its merits, not on some sort of horse trading like you'd see at Ballinasloe.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 4,772 ✭✭✭ meathstevie
    Registered User


    [quote/] .,,,,,,

    Gardai like paperwork, so pile it in there and have a good supporting letter and pictures, they like pictures.[/quote]

    No they don’t, most hate it with a passion. The problem is that it has a habit of expanding by itself with every little new procedure or piece of legislation and nobody in authority bothers getting rid of the stuff that’s been around since Robert Peel was a boy.

    Provide the minimum necessary and keep your argument short and sweet if you have to provide additional info.


Advertisement