Apprenticeship rates are just depressing

johnnyfruitcake

eggy81 wrote: »

Those days of lugging stuff all over the place and being filthy are in an awful lot of cases gone especially in electrical or plumbing. Electrical in particular is not physically demanding.

Ha, Electrical is physically demanding, try threading and bending 25mm conduit all day, or pulling in 90sq SWA cables. etc.
It can be dirty as well, changing out pumps and motors.

Your dreaming

eggy81

johnnyfruitcake wrote: »

Ha, Electrical is physically demanding, try threading and bending 25mm conduit all day, or pulling in 90sq SWA cables. etc.
It can be dirty as well, changing out pumps and motors.

Your dreaming

I'm doing it 15 years mate. Once you get your skillset up to speed it's not physically demanding.

This is it

I started my apprenticeship when I was 18 at around €200 a week. The way I saw it I was getting paid for on the job training. Yes the employer does well from it, cheap labour, but the 40+ weeks you spend in college (20/10/10) are also paid at the full weekly rate. Standard third level you pay to go and get a small grant if you're lucky, an apprenticeship you get paid to learn and work. It is low, it is difficult especially in the first year and especially for anyone with bills, but it is manageable with nixers and other bits.

I did a few nixers a month and worked in a bar for a night or two a week for the first two years. Tough but as I said, manageable. I'm not in trade anymore but it definitely helped throughout my career to have had it.

This is it

Worked as an electrician for about 6/7 years and it was a rare day that wasn't physically demanding. Be it up and down ladders all day, crawling through ceilings, chasing walls, bending conduit, pulling in SWA, etc. Grand if you're a project manager or foreman but the sparks on the ground isn't an easy job. Domestic is probably the least demanding but then you've to deal with customers and home owners direct, and that's nearly worse again.

eggy81

This is it wrote: »

Worked as an electrician for about 6/7 years and it was a rare day that wasn't physically demanding. Be it up and down ladders all day, crawling through ceilings, chasing walls, bending conduit, pulling in SWA, etc. Grand if you're a project manager or foreman but the sparks on the ground isn't an easy job. Domestic is probably the least demanding but then you've to deal with customers and home owners direct, and that's nearly worse again.

I did 3 years of domestic before moving into industrial. Id view industrial in a physical sense as easier on the body than domestic. The reality now is that big sites a generally all union workers. Ladders are completely banned on a lot of sites so you drive around in a mewp all day . The safety has gone to a stage where its ridiculous almost. Hard to see how money is made. I'm off the tools currently but in my experience the job has got a lot easier over the years. No comparison between sites now and the ****holes I first walked onto in 2004.

FFVII

I know a 21 year old lad 13 months into electrician apprenticeship.

Extremely fit, built like Schwarzenegger and runs 5KM in 16 minutes.

Packed it in during covid. Physicality of it was going to have to much of an accumulative affect he said. He wasn't wrecking his body.

sasta le

FFVII wrote: »

I know a 21 year old lad 13 months into electrician apprenticeship.

Extremely fit, built like Schwarzenegger and runs 5KM in 16 minutes.

Packed it in during covid. Physicality of it was going to have to much of an accumulative affect he said. He wasn't wrecking his body.

What the hell kinda work was he doing?It use to rare to have such a fit apprentice the stereotype was party heads

sasta le

Would doing a trade at 40 be mad?

FFVII

FFVII wrote: »

I know a 21 year old lad 13 months into electrician apprenticeship.

Extremely fit, built like Schwarzenegger and runs 5KM in 16 minutes.

Packed it in during covid. Physicality of it was going to have to much of an accumulative affect he said. He wasn't wrecking his body.

Probably couldn't fit in working & training TBH.
That kind if 5km time with a 100kg BW is hard to believe though.

sasta le

sasta le wrote: »

Would doing a trade at 40 be mad?

Not if you can afford the rates of pay for the apprenticeship.

Plenty folk try and move away from tradework in their 40s though..... It's a hard days work (more often than not) in the building game, pipefitting etc etc.

This is it

FFVII wrote: »

I know a 21 year old lad 13 months into electrician apprenticeship.

Extremely fit, built like Schwarzenegger and runs 5KM in 16 minutes.

Packed it in during covid. Physicality of it was going to have to much of an accumulative affect he said. He wasn't wrecking his body.

What exactly was he doing to "wreck his body"?

salmocab

FFVII wrote: »

I know a 21 year old lad 13 months into electrician apprenticeship.

Extremely fit, built like Schwarzenegger and runs 5KM in 16 minutes.

Packed it in during covid. Physicality of it was going to have to much of an accumulative affect he said. He wasn't wrecking his body.

It can be a heavy enough job at times but something doesn’t add up here. There can be tough days but nothing an average lad couldn’t do easily.

This is it

Augeo wrote: »

Not if you can afford the rates of pay for the apprenticeship.

Plenty folk try and move away from tradework in their 40s though..... It's a hard days work (more often than not) in the building game, pipefitting etc etc.

Yep, it's why I moved away from it when I got a chance to retrain during the last recession. I worked with an auld lad who was in his 60s, still out on freezing cold sites, bending conduit, pulling in cable, struggling up and down ladders. I loved the job but fûck that. You'd want to be moving towards PM by the time you're hitting your 40s in my opinion

Brandon75

Dont understand why someone would do 4 years of an apprenticeship and then leave the trade. Most people I know with a degree are only on 35k max where a qualified electrician would be on 50k after there apprenticeship.

My partners brother is only 25 and his knees and back are gone he works as a industrial plumber cant say the same of any electrician and by the time your in your late 30s would be in a higher role with others running cable for you and doing the so called dirty work I never see electricians come out of work wrecked.

salmocab

Brandon75 wrote: »

Dont understand why someone would do 4 years of an apprenticeship and then leave the trade. Most people I know with a degree are only on 35k max where a qualified electrician would be on 50k after there apprenticeship.

My partners brother is only 25 and his knees and back are gone he works as a industrial plumber cant say the same of any electrician and by the time your in your late 30s would be in a higher role with others running cable for you and doing the so called dirty work I never see electricians come out of work wrecked.

Most electricians move to other jobs where their skills are relevant and are paid the same sorts or maybe a bit more. I stopped working as a spark on site when I was 39 to work in facilities. It’s clean regular I spend quite a bit of time at my desk but still work on equipment a bit and I’m paid more than I was on site for less hours. The thoughts of being 50 and on site was in no way appealing so I made a conscious decision to move on.

This is it

I was forced out, it wasn't a choice, but I'm glad now with the way things have worked out for me. Having the apprenticeship has certainly helped but I'm ok just having it on my CV and not working in the industry anymore.

Jim2007

Brandon75 wrote: »

I know someone who was in the same college phases as electrician apprenticeship they were the only one working in a company that just does lifts.

No matter what trade or profession you choose to learn you will not learn all aspects of the job during the training period. You’ll learn most of the basic theory and many aspects of the job. But your learning will not stop once you have served your time, in fact it will take several more years of work experience before you will really have mastered your trade. And employers know this, when they take on newly qualified staff they are still recruiting potential not competent professionals. They expect you to know the theory and have the ability to learn as you go.

Brandon75

This is it wrote: »

I was forced out, it wasn't a choice, but I'm glad now with the way things have worked out for me. Having the apprenticeship has certainly helped but I'm ok just having it on my CV and not working in the industry anymore.

What line of work are you In now. Did you not have to start at the bottom again.

Brandon75

Brandon75 wrote: »

Dont understand why someone would do 4 years of an apprenticeship and then leave the trade. Most people I know with a degree are only on 35k max where a qualified electrician would be on 50k after there apprenticeship.

My partners brother is only 25 and his knees and back are gone he works as a industrial plumber cant say the same of any electrician and by the time your in your late 30s would be in a higher role with others running cable for you and doing the so called dirty work I never see electricians come out of work wrecked.

Well surely you can understand why your partners brother would leave the trade.

Most folk I know with degrees are on 50k to 150k.... They likely all started on 35k ish or less, no doubt.

Brandon75

salmocab wrote: »

Most electricians move to other jobs where their skills are relevant and are paid the same sorts or maybe a bit more. I stopped working as a spark on site when I was 39 to work in facilities. It’s clean regular I spend quite a bit of time at my desk but still work on equipment a bit and I’m paid more than I was on site for less hours. The thoughts of being 50 and on site was in no way appealing so I made a conscious decision to move on.

I can understand that makes sense. Smart move I will probably do the same when I'm in my late 30s.

salmocab

Brandon75 wrote: »

I can understand that makes sense. Smart move I will probably do the same when I'm in my late 30s.

I worked on sites for just over 20 years, enjoyed it for the most part but it’s not something that I could have done for another 25 years or so. Time catches up, there are plenty of jobs that having a tradesmans skill set in particular electrical that are gettable also plenty of things that can be studied that are related.

Danny552

Augeo wrote: »

Well surely you can understand why your partners brother would leave the trade.

Should look after there body more, sounds like they were young starting and didnt bother wearing the proper ppe and I would say out most weekends drinking and having a bad diet most do when they go in a trade straight from school.


Most folk I know with degrees are on 50k to 150k.... They likely all started on 35k ish or less, no doubt.

Let me guess IT jobs ? Average salary in Ireland is around 35k I think will take a good 20 years to get up close to 100k let alone 150k then you lose half of it on tax. I would say anyone one on 100k to 150k have a high stress job . Then in trades you really dont no know how much they make on the side cash in king.

Danny552

Danny552 wrote: »

Let me guess IT jobs ? Average salary in Ireland is around 35k I think will take a good 20 years to get up close to 100k let alone 150k then you lose half of it on tax. I would say anyone one on 100k to 150k have a high stress job . Then in trades you really dont no know how much they make on the side cash in king.

Lol

Plenty money out there that's not in IT.

I said "Most folk I know with degrees are on 50k to 150k.... They likely all started on 35k ish or less, no doubt."

Cash on the side is overtime..... Cash is not at all king, spare time is.

If you think having to do mixers to maintain a standard of living isn't stress you're dreaming. After 40 hours work who wants to do nixers? It's not sustainable.... Race to the bottom esque.

Most sparks I know have no interest in doing work when they clock out, they're happy with their wage which is as you say approx 50k/annum.

This is it

Brandon75 wrote: »

What line of work are you In now. Did you not have to start at the bottom again.

Network Engineer. As I said, I was forced out with the last recession so it was either sit back and wait for things to kick off again or retrain. Yes I started at the bottom again but I likely earn more now than I would as a sparks so I like to think it worked out well.

Jim2007

Brandon75 wrote: »

Dont understand why someone would do 4 years of an apprenticeship and then leave the trade. Most people I know with a degree are only on 35k max where a qualified electrician would be on 50k after there apprenticeship.

Your qualification is only a starting point, not an end point. Many people will continue in the area they started out in, but just as many will leave and do something else and it is not just about money, it's about what interests you, what motivates you and the opportunities that come along.

Many people end up doing stuff because they had an interest in something or knack for doing something and it coincided with a need in the firm they worked, then did other courses etc... and so it happened.

You know there really only was one generation where the cycle: initial training to retirement actually worked. Before that and since then, it is not unusual for people to work at two or more careers along the way.

Jim2007

Danny552 wrote: »

Let me guess IT jobs ? Average salary in Ireland is around 35k I think will take a good 20 years to get up close to 100k let alone 150k then you lose half of it on tax. I would say anyone one on 100k to 150k have a high stress job . Then in trades you really dont no know how much they make on the side cash in king.

"IT" covers a multitude of sins and average salary is dragged down by this. Most of the core IT jobs for graduates with say 5 years experience are well over the 50k mark.

Carter D

Has anyone ever done a trade just as like a back up in case they dont get into there first choice job.
Say I did a trade but in a year or so I have a chance to go into my first choice. Then again if you dont get in you can still carry on doing a trade and make good money .

I wouldn't see it as a waste as you will have a trade behind you .

Instead of getting a job in an office base role like a call centre you would be on 25k can make more in your 3rd year as an apprentice and more again once qualified

This is it

Carter D wrote: »

Has anyone ever done a trade just as like a back up in case they dont get into there first choice job.
Say I did a trade but in a year or so I have a chance to go into my first choice. Then again if you dont get in you can still carry on doing a trade and make good money .

I wouldn't see it as a waste as you will have a trade behind you .

Instead of getting a job in an office base role like a call centre you would be on 25k can make more in your 3rd year as an apprentice and more again once qualified

So finish your trade or only do a year of the trade?

salmocab

Carter D wrote: »

Has anyone ever done a trade just as like a back up in case they dont get into there first choice job.
Say I did a trade but in a year or so I have a chance to go into my first choice. Then again if you dont get in you can still carry on doing a trade and make good money .

I wouldn't see it as a waste as you will have a trade behind you .

Instead of getting a job in an office base role like a call centre you would be on 25k can make more in your 3rd year as an apprentice and more again once qualified

Doing 4 years just in case seems an odd thing to do.

Danny552

salmocab wrote: »

Doing 4 years just in case seems an odd thing to do.

Not really I know a few that have wanted to be a garda or firefighter and couldn't get in so they did a trade as a back up some got in before finishing there trade others have been qualified for a year or two and then got in .

Going for public service jobs you have to go through stages and takes awhile then you might just fall short and not get in and keep trying until you do . Why not have a trade behind you incase it takes a couple of years to get in.

Those roles come around maybe once a year and if dont get in at least you are getting a good trade behind you . You might even stay if you reach at point where you are making more money and not worth moving unless you have your heart set on joining the public sector.