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leap card app

  • 17-09-2020 9:34am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 4,971 ✭✭✭ bobbyss


    Don't know much about technology. Couldn't aee my history on mobile. The leap app it seems is only for top ups. Went to their website. Ive registered etc. Rang leap. They have no app to register etc only go to their website. I asked why no app to check history update prpfile etc. He said there's too much information on it.
    So on a mobile for a few weeks there's no history available.
    No app available to check your history.
    Why in rhe name of God don't they have one?
    Seems ludicrous.


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Comments

  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,315 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Dravokivich


    It's just a website, why do you need an app to function as a html wrapper, when you can just use a web browser?


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,127 ✭✭✭✭ Mrs OBumble


    They have one. Its called Chrome, and it lets you do a truckload of other things too.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,971 ✭✭✭ bobbyss


    It's just a website, why do you need an app to function as a html wrapper, when you can just use a web browser?


    Html wrapper?
    What in the name of God is that?


    Why do i need an app? I thought apps were handier to use? I could go on rte website and look for the weather there or i could download a weather app which would be handier to access s5nd give more information. Something along those lines.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 21,071 Mod ✭✭✭✭ bk


    bobbyss wrote: »
    Html wrapper?
    What in the name of God is that?

    HTML is the main language that websites are written in.

    HTML Wrappers are poor apps, which take the website and wrap it as an app, but really they are still just the website and offer nothing more then what the website offers.

    Such apps are pointless, it is easier to just go to leap.ie, then install an app like this.

    Native apps are only worth it if they can offer some extra functionality over what the website can offer. The Leap topup app is an example of this, as it does something (topup your card) that the website can't do.

    There are actually a number of Third Party Leap "HTML wrapper" apps available for iPhones if you want. But note, that means giving your username and password to a third party and giving them access to your travel data. I don't think there are any on Android.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,642 ✭✭✭✭ coylemj


    bobbyss wrote: »
    So on a mobile for a few weeks there's no history available.
    No app available to check your history.
    Why in rhe name of God don't they have one?
    Seems ludicrous.

    Hold your card to the phone and the app will show you your last 5 deductions, including the amount, date and time. If you want more history, visit the website when you're at home.

    What's the problem?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,433 ✭✭✭ bb1234567


    bk wrote: »
    HTML is the main language that websites are written in.

    HTML Wrappers are poor apps, which take the website and wrap it as an app, but really they are still just the website and offer nothing more then what the website offers.

    Such apps are pointless, it is easier to just go to leap.ie, then install an app like this.

    Native apps are only worth it if they can offer some extra functionality over what the website can offer. The Leap topup app is an example of this, as it does something (topup your card) that the website can't do.

    There are actually a number of Third Party Leap "HTML wrapper" apps available for iPhones if you want. But note, that means giving your username and password to a third party and giving them access to your travel data. I don't think there are any on Android.

    TIL an interesting fact :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,869 ✭✭✭ markpb


    Why is the OP getting such abuse? The vast majority of apps do nothing that a decent website couldn’t and yet apps are popular with users. For a lot of people, using your phone means using apps.

    Maybe it’s because app developers seem to make a better effort at designing apps to look and feel good on a mobile device instead of relying on responsive CSS which does an adequate job but never feels quite right.

    The Leapcard website definitely falls into the second category. The pages are long and rambling, the banners take up half the screen, there are two different menus for some reason, the table for displaying card information have been given no thought for mobile devices at all, the table for displaying trip history scrolls off to the right so it’s not responsive at all, the list is endless.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 21,071 Mod ✭✭✭✭ bk


    Yes, they are currently developing a new app for iPhone to enable topup's from iPhone. Perhaps they could add this functionality to this app then.

    However keep in mind, that the data on the website doesn't accurately represent the state and balance currently on the card. It can take up to 48 hours for transactions to appear on the website, so it can be somewhat misleading. The Topup App showing you your cards balance and 5 last transactions is actually far more accurate then the site as it shows the true current state of the card.

    So the data on the website is really of very little benefit to most people and probably not worth making a lot of effort integrating it into the app.

    Having said that, I do think it is a pity that you can't export the data as a spreadsheet or do other graphs and statistics to show your monthly/yearly spend, etc. Could be helpful to see if worth getting taxsaver cards, etc.

    With the project to move to next generation account based ticketing, I do expect they will put a lot more effort into the mobile apps.

    In the meantime, an iPhone topup app is the most useful app they can create IMO.


  • Registered Users Posts: 978 ✭✭✭ Stephen Strange


    bk wrote: »
    Yes, they are currently developing a new app for iPhone to enable topup's from iPhone. Perhaps they could add this functionality to this app then.

    However keep in mind, that the data on the website doesn't accurately represent the state and balance currently on the card. It can take up to 48 hours for transactions to appear on the website, so it can be somewhat misleading. The Topup App showing you your cards balance and 5 last transactions is actually far more accurate then the site as it shows the true current state of the card.

    So the data on the website is really of very little benefit to most people and probably not worth making a lot of effort integrating it into the app.

    Having said that, I do think it is a pity that you can't export the data as a spreadsheet or do other graphs and statistics to show your monthly/yearly spend, etc. Could be helpful to see if worth getting taxsaver cards, etc.

    With the project to move to next generation account based ticketing, I do expect they will put a lot more effort into the mobile apps.

    In the meantime, an iPhone topup app is the most useful app they can create IMO.

    The website should become more up to date with the introduction of the iPhone app though, shouldn't it? I was under the impression that the iPhone app was to coincide with moving the transactions to account based rather than on the card if that makes sense, I'm not explaining it well.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,315 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Dravokivich


    Account based is a long way off. And its unclear if you think that means web account. Account based means a relationship to an account in the leap back end for the NFC device in use, be it a bank card / phone/ watch or whatever gets implemented as the authenticator.

    It has nothing to do with the website or a payment method for the leap card.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 978 ✭✭✭ Stephen Strange


    Account based is a long way off. And its unclear if you think that means web account. Account based means a relationship to an account in the leap back end for the NFC device in use, be it a bank card / phone/ watch or whatever gets implemented as the authenticator.

    It has nothing to do with the website or a payment method for the leap card.

    Ah, I thought they were linked given iPhone's locked down NFC


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 22,676 ✭✭✭✭ beauf


    Never liked any part of this system. Haven;t use it in a while. Maybe they've improved it.

    I misspelt a username there is no way to fix it.
    Decided I'd change my email to a dummy one and just start again.
    It doesn't let you reuse an email thats been registered even if no longer in use, with another account.
    Makes me wonder about the database design, these might be primary keys.
    It might be security but I doubt it as doesn't anticipate typos.

    Shows you the zone fare taken, and the amount refunded when you tap off. But not the balance. When its really only the balance that you want to see. The exact amount that the Journey cost you.

    The buses aren't live but 24hrs out of date. You have to go to a train or luas stop to get a current update on your card.

    Maybe this is me but the annual personalized leap card seems to lose signal (go faulty) far more often than a normal leap card. I had to replace a number of them, but none of non-personalized cards. The process for replacement is cumbersome and takes some time. When it starts to go bad I find it only tags on/off at certain pads and not others. So I have to tap them all till I find one that it works at. Usually the one getting on my train caused the most problems.

    Decades ago I used systems in Europe and you tapped at the start of your journey, you could then wander all over the transport system, swap from bus to train and tram, only taping off at the end, and it worked out that multi mode journey. Leap still can't do that.

    I'm grateful that its there. But it felt ancient even when new. The whole website/application difference also feels old.
    Personally, I'd like to the cards dropped and the ability to do it from your phone or watch, possibly automatically.

    Not used it since covid and didn't renew my annual tickets in Dec. I hope I'll be using it less in the future if we get to WFH more.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 22,676 ✭✭✭✭ beauf


    Also the existing App was very hit and miss with any NFC phone I tried. Often took many attempts to get it read if you have a few cards (family). Seems to struggle to refresh when you presented it with a different card.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 21,071 Mod ✭✭✭✭ bk


    The website should become more up to date with the introduction of the iPhone app though, shouldn't it? I was under the impression that the iPhone app was to coincide with moving the transactions to account based rather than on the card if that makes sense, I'm not explaining it well.

    Well, first of all, let me point out that I don't work for the NTA or anything like that, my info is based on publicly available info, but might not be 100% correct.

    There seems to be 2 or 3 different apps/projects happening at the same time:

    1) iPhone Leap "Topup" App

    The NTA seem to have already issued or about to issue a contract to a company called Vix Technologies for the development of this app.

    This is basically a copy of the existing Android "Topup" App, but for iPhone.

    You can hold your existing Leap card to your iPhone and the app allows you to check the balance on the card, view the last 5 transactions, add cash and tickets to the card. Just like the Android app that has been there for the past 4 years.

    This isn't part of the next generation ticketing account.

    2) Commuter Ticket App

    Last year, the NTA contracted with Cubic Systems to develop an app to allow people to buy tickets on their phone and then show them as QR codes on the phone to the driver/ticket checker.

    This is aimed at long distance services like Irish Rail and BE. I think this app is already developed and it is currently in beta testing.

    3) Next Generation Account Based Ticket

    This is a much bigger overall project then the above two, a complete revamping of the whole ticketing system. Moving to account based ticketing, Apple/Google Pay, contactless cards, etc. Suppose to take the next 7 years or so.

    I'd assume this will come with new website, apps, etc.

    I'd guess some of the two companies and apps above might end up being involved with this too and those apps getting merged in, but just a guess.


  • Registered Users Posts: 608 ✭✭✭ p_haugh


    bk wrote: »
    2) Commuter Ticket App

    Last year, the NTA contracted with Cubic Systems to develop an app to allow people to buy tickets on their phone and then show them as QR codes on the phone to the driver/ticket checker.

    This is aimed at long distance services like Irish Rail and BE. I think this app is already developed and it is currently in beta testing.

    This app is called TFI Go and is currently being trialled on Bus Eireann Route 133, but you can only buy 10 journey tickets for Adult & student so far. Meant to be rolled out to more routes/operators at some stage down the line.

    https://www.transportforireland.ie/tfi-go-app/


  • Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 26,348 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Peregrine


    bk wrote: »
    1) iPhone Leap "Topup" App

    The NTA seem to have already issued or about to issue a contract to a company called Vix Technologies for the development of this app.

    This is basically a copy of the existing Android "Topup" App, but for iPhone.

    You can hold your existing Leap card to your iPhone and the app allows you to check the balance on the card, view the last 5 transactions, add cash and tickets to the card. Just like the Android app that has been there for the past 4 years.

    This isn't part of the next generation ticketing account.
    Yeah, this was awarded in April so development should be under way. Vix in partnership with Snapper. Same as the Android app.
    bk wrote: »
    3) Next Generation Account Based Ticket

    This is a much bigger overall project then the above two, a complete revamping of the whole ticketing system. Moving to account based ticketing, Apple/Google Pay, contactless cards, etc. Suppose to take the next 7 years or so.
    It's a big project, of course, but I think most of the benefits to passengers will be very front-loaded. Contract yet to be awarded but I'd expect contactless, G Pay/Apple Pay and 90 min fare by 2022. They said it'll start in 2021 but the tender was supposed to go out in early 2020 and that only happened two weeks ago.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,971 ✭✭✭ bobbyss


    markpb wrote:
    Why is the OP getting such abuse? The vast majority of apps do nothing that a decent website couldn’t and yet apps are popular with users. For a lot of people, using your phone means using apps.


    What's interesting and disappointing is the first poster who replied, a moderator I believe, either didn't read or ignored the first five words of my post.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 21,071 Mod ✭✭✭✭ bk


    Peregrine wrote: »
    It's a big project, of course, but I think most of the benefits to passengers will be very front-loaded. Contract yet to be awarded but I'd expect contactless, G Pay/Apple Pay and 90 min fare by 2022. They said it'll start in 2021 but the tender was supposed to go out in early 2020 and that only happened two weeks ago.

    Yes, even that will be great, I can't wait for T90 + contactless payment, I think it will make a big difference.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,315 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Dravokivich


    bobbyss wrote: »
    What's interesting and disappointing is the first poster who replied, a moderator I believe, either didn't read or ignored the first five words of my post.

    I didn't ignore any of your post. What was your problem with my response?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,971 ✭✭✭ bobbyss


    I didn't ignore any of your post. What was your problem with my response?

    What's with all this defensive language: 'What was your problem... .? '

    Just read the first post and then read your post.


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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,315 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Dravokivich


    bobbyss wrote: »
    What's with all this defensive language: 'What was your problem... .? '

    Just read the first post and then read your post.

    You are the one loading my response. All I said was making an app to do what you wanted, would just be recreating a web browser. What's your problem with that?


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 11,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭ devnull


    bobbyss wrote: »
    What's interesting and disappointing is the first poster who replied, a moderator I believe, either didn't read or ignored the first five words of my post.

    Firstly, the poster you mention is not a moderator of this forum, but another forum on boards, therefore they are treated and should be treated as a regular poster just like you and others contributing to this thread.

    Secondly if you have a problem with a post or think it breaks the rules, you should report it to us and we will take a look and whether action needs taking.

    Thirdly, lets stick to the topic at hand and not argue backwards and forwards among each other about if someone should have posted something or not.

    - Moderator


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,971 ✭✭✭ bobbyss


    devnull wrote:
    Secondly if you have a problem with a post or think it breaks the rules, you should report it to us and we will take a look and whether action needs taking.


    Thank you.


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,991 ✭✭✭✭ AndrewJRenko


    The interface is poor. The 'add credit' option isn't too obvious on the front screen, and then they change terminology with 'top up' on the second screen. The dial to choose the amount is a bit fiddly, especially if you're wearing gloves or have a shaky hand. Buttons would be much better.


  • Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 26,348 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Peregrine


    Peregrine wrote: »
    It's a big project, of course, but I think most of the benefits to passengers will be very front-loaded. Contract yet to be awarded but I'd expect contactless, G Pay/Apple Pay and 90 min fare by 2022. They said it'll start in 2021 but the tender was supposed to go out in early 2020 and that only happened two weeks ago.

    The contract for account based ticketing won't be awarded until Q3 2022 so it'll be 2023 before we see payments via bank cards, GPay etc.

    BusConnects network implementation will start in March 2021 with the H spine and more significant changes are planned for Q3 2021 with the implementation of the C spine. Still quiet on the 90 min fare front. Maybe we'll hear something once the NTA takes control of the farebox. Impossible to do the network changes without it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 349 ✭✭ legend99


    I always thought a major aim of a Smart Card for transport was to help speed up the loading of passengers. I find it incredible that Leap has actually slowed it down.

    You still have to tell the driver your destination so he knows what fare to charge. She/He then, it appears to me, has to set the machine to charge that much, and the card takes upwards of 5-8 seconds to give it the okay? Is there a lookup back to the actual database or how can it take so long for the card to report its balance? And why do we not just have a system where you deduct your fare while waiting, like for Luas, and then just walk straight onto the bus. The monetary cost of buses wasting so much time loading must be enormous??


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,991 ✭✭✭✭ AndrewJRenko


    legend99 wrote: »
    I always thought a major aim of a Smart Card for transport was to help speed up the loading of passengers. I find it incredible that Leap has actually slowed it down.

    You still have to tell the driver your destination so he knows what fare to charge. She/He then, it appears to me, has to set the machine to charge that much, and the card takes upwards of 5-8 seconds to give it the okay? Is there a lookup back to the actual database or how can it take so long for the card to report its balance? And why do we not just have a system where you deduct your fare while waiting, like for Luas, and then just walk straight onto the bus. The monetary cost of buses wasting so much time loading must be enormous??

    You need to tag on AND tag off on the Luas.


  • Registered Users Posts: 349 ✭✭ legend99


    You need to tag on AND tag off on the Luas.

    Yes. But both are done on the street. The Luas is not stopped while you queue to do it. Right now, certainly in Cork, the loading time of buses has not improved at all with Leap. If anything it is worse.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 21,071 Mod ✭✭✭✭ bk


    Ah you are in Cork. Yes the implementation of Leap in Cork is particularly bad. It is better in Dublin!

    In Dublin there is a second leap card validator on the right hand side next to the door. This validator can be used without interacting with the driver and is used by folks with monthly/yearly passes and those paying the full fare or child fares. This is much faster then interacting with the driver and does speed things up greatly.

    For those looking to pay shorter fares, they have to interact with the driver, which is slower then the right hand validator, but about the same or slightly faster then cash.

    * Cork is particularly mad because there is no right hand validator, despite most routes in Cork being flat fare unlike Dublin! And for some reason interacting with the driver for leap is much slower in Cork then Dublin. It seems to require more button presses by the driver from what I can see. That sounds like a software issue.

    There are supposed to be some improvements coming over the next year or so. I believe right hand validators are coming to Cork and in Dublin they should be getting the 90 minute ticket which should mean most people use the right hand validator.

    Long term there will be new faster ticket machines and readers and support for contactless debit/credit card and mobile payments (Apple pay, etc.).

    * I haven’t been on a bus in Cork in about a year, so some of these may have already been improved on, but this was what it was like up to last year.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,064 ✭✭✭✭ Thelonious Monk


    are there any plans to just scan your phone or bank card like it is in London and everywhere else these days? Leap technology must be 20 years old at this stage.


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