Wokeism of the day *Revised Mod Note in OP and threadbanned users*

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120211036#Comment_120211036

Even the supposedly censorious Ireland of the 20s to the 60s didn't censor Ulysses, unlike actions taken in the UK and US.

Ireland was actually so censorious at the time, that they didn’t even chance importing the book for fear of the losses and costs of having to contest a ban -

Contrary to popular belief, James Joyce's Ulysses was technically never banned in Ireland, but this was because it was never imported and offered for sale, for fear of such a ban and its attendant costs.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_censorship_in_the_Republic_of_Ireland

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120211097#Comment_120211097

Maybe people should stop being offended so **** easily

Indeed 🤔

Trigger warnings are a silly concept, but that’s all they are - warnings. There’s nobody telling anyone what they can and cannot read, and for what it’s worth you’re probably better off for not having read Ulysses, not because it contains the odd bit of titillation, but simply because the rest of it is so incredibly boring it should carry a warning that it could put readers to sleep 😴

Economics101

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120211439#Comment_120211439

How can someone judge in advance just what might offend someone? You might as well put warnings on literally everything as there is bound to be someone who is offended by just about anything.

cdeb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120211595#Comment_120211595

Are you comparing deadly peanut allergies with your own inability to deal with previous emotional experiences?

Not really a reasonable comparison, don't you think?

I'm currently finishing Paul Theroux's The Great Railway Bazaar. A fantastic book and an acknowledged classic of travel literature. I wonder what warnings you might like on it to cover, as you say, "I’m glad for you that you’ve never had an experience in your life that is so traumatic the mere thought of it, never mind reading about the subject, would send you into a state. But other people have lived such lives. Myself included."? Here's a few thoughts -

This book contains trains! (For people who were involved in a serious train crash in their past)

This book contains discussion of the Vietnam War! (For people who fought in it)

This book contains Thais! (For people who were mugged and seriously beaten in a tourist attack in Thailand)

This book contains scenes in brothels! (For people who were trapped working in the sex trade)

And so on. Do you not see how ridiculous that gets?

And I find it interesting that, when I asked you to engage with the points I had Economics101 had made in our defence, you ignored that. It's typical of the mindset here that your self-importance is so great that you deem counter-arguments not worth engaging in.

Not good enough, I'm afraid.

cdeb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120211547#Comment_120211547

Hogwash? Any reason, or just because you say it is?

What's a controversial or triggering component? Who decides? Are they right? (I asked all this in an earlier post, but of course that was ignored)

The article Economics101 linked suggests a masturbation scene was controversial. Really? That's offensive? Is this Puritan England or what?

Paterson Jerins

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120211439#Comment_120211439

Yawn

CGI_Livia_Soprano

Most right minded people would consider content warnings on books about topics such rape, war, frottage, or ultra violence to be perfectly reasonable. It’s just the typical sheltered types who start crying about even that, before going on to imagine scenarios where people are warned about mentions of “Thais,” or “trains.”

Like I said, there’s not a reason in the world why a professor in a university wouldn’t say something along the lines of “just you all know: there are scenes of sexual violence in this book” before the class gets stuck into studying it.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120211865#Comment_120211865

Inability to deal with a trauma?

I’m bowing out. I wouldn’t waste another second speaking to someone who is that ignorant.

Peace.

CGI_Livia_Soprano

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120211887#Comment_120211887

Hogwash? Any reason, or just because you say it is?

The role of advising university students about content on the curriculum would fall to the staff, not their “friends.” That’s why it’s hogwash.

Jequ0n

trigger labels for books, classic ones in particular. Yes, the worker is getting dumber by the day.

thegame983

https://www.pcgamer.com/hogwarts-legacy-review/

'I'm impressed by my first 32 hours, but also haunted by JK Rowling.' - Actual words written by an adult human.

cdeb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120211899#Comment_120211899

And that's the modern mindset.

Ignore all points made by other posters, claim offence, and leave without actually having contributed to the discussion.

cdeb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120211895#Comment_120211895

That first sentence comes with a BIG "citation needed" warning.

I'll call bullshit on it anyway. But hard to engage with you when you just state your opinion and think it counts as a solid debatable point.

CGI_Livia_Soprano

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120212034#Comment_120212034

You’re the one who started crying about “trains,” “Thais,” and “deadly peanut allergies,” mate.

I’m debating like an adult here, using examples of other mainstream media using content warnings, when you come in bawling about how impossible it is to warn people about every single topic on earth and whinging that people are posting their opinions. Far from the mature “tell it like it is” merchant you imagine yourself as, you’re coming across as a bit of a baby to be totally honest.

Jequ0n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120212087#Comment_120212087

The “warnings” on other mainstream media are over the top and ever increasing. If you pick up a book that was written in a very different time period or culture you have to expect to come across ideas and attitudes that differ from your own. And isn’t that also the purpose of choosing these books/films etc?

If someone gets triggered then they need to work on their resilience or else they won’t be able to cope with their pathetic lives.

CGI_Livia_Soprano

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120212166#Comment_120212166

The “warnings” are over the top? You think an 18s sticker on a film poster or a “parental advisory” label on a CD is over the top? I think you’re being a little bit sensitive, my friend.

Jequ0n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120212244#Comment_120212244

You know exactly what warnings I am referring to. There is no need for 2 rows of trigger warnings at the beginning of an episode or film, particularly if they have specific age rating.

Arghus

It's an interesting debate I suppose.

I studied Ulysses in college during the late noughties and there wasn't any talk of warnings or triggering elements to the novel when I was studying it - I'd be curious to know whether that has changed in the intervening period.

I think it would be hard done by if that's the case. I wouldn't regard it as a particularly "triggering" work. It's undoubtedly graphic and frank, in places. But, speaking for myself, I found it more exhilarating than troubling. And I can't imagine that many that come to the novel in those settings - where, in all likelihood, the majority of people who do attempt to read it actually do, come to it totally blind to the fact that it does contain some stuff that could make a reader uncomfortable.

At some level I do find it a bit weird that a novel, more than any other I can think of, which deals with all of the daily business of being alive - the eating, the talking, the thinking, the pissing, the crapping, the shagging - could have a warning or something akin to it attached it. That feels so dry and joyless.

There was also far wilder stuff on different parts of the curriculum, like American Psycho, which was also part of the "canon" - without much remark being passed on its potential to cause offence.

I can understand the use of warnings, at some level, but, part of it doesn't sit right with me either.

CGI_Livia_Soprano

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120212255#Comment_120212255

Why not exactly? Who does it hurt to have a “contains scenes of rape; viewer discretion is advised” card at the start of a film or TV show?

I’d also like to know what the actual problem is with a similar label on a book’s cover.

We’ve all read classics (or, at least I have read the classics) where the publisher will prefix a new edition of the book with a foreword by a modern day scholar. This is usually to explain that certain certain standards and behaviour were different when the book was written, “Kafka (look him up, by the way) was very much a product of his time” and so on.

I remember a similar foreword to my copy of Robinson Crusoe dating from the 1970s, it’s not like I was shaking my fists at the ceiling and cursing the gods for destroying the illusion of fiction. I just got on with reading the book.

nullzero

I suppose the real question is, have books without labeled warnings been causing problems for people up to now?

In a way I can see some reason in outlining if a book contains x, y or z but I see other posters comparing this to film certification standards which is probably a better model for books to follow as opposed to "warning you may be triggered".

If we expand on the film certification idea, films do currently offer restriction by age but outside of streaming services you won't see "this contains blah blah blah".

If I walk into a cinema and buy a ticket the person serving me isn't going to issue a trigger warning with my purchase.

So while correct classification is sensible, doing so in service of "trigger warnings" seems to be putting feelings in front of rationality like so many issues in the modern world.

Jequ0n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120212746#Comment_120212746

The foreword is supposed to put the work in context, not to warn the reader that they might get upset by something or “that certain certain standards and behaviour were different when the book was written”. But surely you knew that since you have read some books.

If you are reading or watching something it’s by your own choice and therefore your responsibility. If you are reading something as part of a set curriculum the teacher will work with the the students to discuss the material. There is no need for a page of labels to try to cross off every potential unresolved trauma or phobia someone might have.

Potential-Monke

Does the bible (and it's many variations) have trigger warnings?

Timothy 2:12

New Revised Standard Version: "Permit no woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she is to keep silent."

New International Version: "I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man; she must be quiet."

King James Version: "But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence."

Exodus 21:20-21

New Revised Standard Version: "When a slaveowner strikes a male or female slave with a rod and the slave dies immediately, the owner shall be punished. But if the slave survives a day or two, there is no punishment; for the slave is the owner’s property."

New International Version: "Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property."

King James Version: “And if a man smite his servant, or his maid, with a rod, and he die under his hand; he shall be surely punished. Notwithstanding, if he continue a day or two, he shall not be punished: for he is his money."

Leviticus 20:13

New Revised Standard Version: "If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall be put to death; their blood is upon them."

New International Version: "If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They are to be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads."

King James Version: "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

I've no issue with warnings, but something akin to 18s, 16s, etc. But breaking down the warnings, it's kinda like spoiling the film/book imo. I watch/read for entertainment, knowing something is going to happen that requires a warning kinda takes away from the experience a bit. But that's just my 2 cents. Initially I was using the labels as a ticklist of "may make this good", the more the merrier, but now I try to not read them.

Rothko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120211899#Comment_120211899

You're bowing out because you're entirely incapable of addressing the points that they raised. That's the real reason and it's plain for everyone on this thread to see. It's pathetic.

Strumms

Every fućker is triggered these days, you’ll probably have annoying announcements….“This film may contain films of motor vehicles using excess leaded fuels”. If anyone has been impacted by this, a number will be shown at the end of the film where standing by will be trained councillors, environmental health specialists, community flower arrangers and a three legged dog……named Fergus.”

Yeah_Right

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120211895#Comment_120211895

"topics such rape, war, frottage, or ultra violence"

One of these topics is not like the others 🤔😂 FFS.

awec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120211931#Comment_120211931

The reactions to this game are disappointing and a bit nonsensical IMO, as if buying the game means you must agree with JK Rowling and whatever she thinks about anything.

I will buy it and I won't feel guilty, because the overwhelming majority of people who will benefit from it are not called JK Rowling and nor are they multi-millionaires. I'll benefit from it, cause it'll be fun to play, and the people who actually made the game will benefit from my money in their pocket. If some of my money ends up in her pockets I don't particularly care, I'll still sleep at night. I disagree with her view on trans people, but whether I buy this game or don't buy this game makes no difference whatsoever to the lives of trans people, and it's delusional to think that JK Rowling gives a damn, she's set for life and will never need to earn another cent in her life.

I am sure my money eventually ends up in the pockets of many people I find undesirable, if you're willing to trace it back far enough. I'm sure, in the process of putting diesel in my car, I've given numerous sheckles to that saudi lad who likes to cut people's heads off. It seems like a relatively absurd hill to die on IMO to suggest we all must feel guilty about playing a video game.

AllForIt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120212805#Comment_120212805

I think the warnings are for people who get offended on other peoples behalf.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120213749#Comment_120213749

I don't think they are - I think it's just massively exaggetrated by a few idiots who have nothing else in their lives to do but angry about things.

YFlyer

Surely it is not the mods. Oh never.

BruteStock

Bill Maher eviscerates the woke ideology.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yysKhJ1U-vM&ab_channel=RealTimewithBillMaher

Recently Gwen Stefani received backlash for saying she feels Japanese. That's a big no-no because of "cultural appropriation" The woke left hates nationalism but loves a thriving country like Japan to remain homogeneous and nationalistic. They insist and demand their culture can't be shared or celebrated by anybody in the West. Gwen wasn't the first to get attacked for embracing Japanese culture , Katie Perry and Madonna got hit first. Strangely Bjork was left alone , probably cos she's Icelandic.

https://www.aljazeera.com/economy/2023/1/15/japan-shrugs-as-us-fumes-over-gwen-stefani-appropriation-furore

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120213324#Comment_120213324

Been done P-M:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10555441/amp/University-named-cardinal-John-Henry-Newman-slaps-content-warning-BIBLE.html

Way I look at trigger warnings is they’re simply getting my hopes up 😂 They’re basically to make otherwise uninteresting content seem remotely interesting; the appearance of giving a shìt about anyone’s mental state is only an added bonus.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120213761#Comment_120213761

Just casually slipped it in there, without any warning 😂