Wokeism of the day *Revised Mod Note in OP and threadbanned users*

Wibbs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119607007#Comment_119607007

I don't see what freedom he's talking about tbh. Sounds like he is indeed looking to plug into the right on stuff to get more attention. Would Updike and Roth not sell any books if they were writing today. "other voices" or no? Has their audience magically dissappeared? Would publishers baulk at publishing their stuff for some reason?

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119607364#Comment_119607364

Its not clear but I have to assume he means the freedom to write about sex, men and women, in an un-PC way since that it what Roth and Updike are partly known for.

Could a Roth novel like Portnoy's Complaint be brought out today? Mainstream publishers would baulk at it I would say. Too sexist and sexually explicit.

These were authors that were heavily promoted in the media from the word go, so how big of an organic audience they really have no one knows. I was never impressed with novels like Rabbit Run and American Pastoral or anything by McEwan.

I would call Roth's The Human Stain a great novel and bits of it stuck with me permanently. Its about race and political correctness so recommended for readers of this thread.

If you are a mainstream careerist novelist dependent on a connections in the NYC literary world then ultimately you have to do as you're told to some extent, I'd imagine.

AllForIt

I'm sayin nothin

https://twitter.com/RadioGenova/status/1569654873305522176

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119614623#Comment_119614623

I'd be very interested to see the daily diet of one of those paying their respects ...

🤡

They've still failed the purity test though, by not being called TheirFamily.ie

RobbieTheRobber

You have to love the absurdity of the sort of the people who go on about freedom of speech. Yet they then get really annoyed by people who use words in a context they don't like.

🤡

RobbieTheRobber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119615351#Comment_119615351

Back to the usual mocking people for phyiscal characteristics.

You stay classy leg end.

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119615614#Comment_119615614

You too.

Wibbs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119615351#Comment_119615351

Just how many Veegs did she eat?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119615609#Comment_119615609

I don't go on about free speech though. A lot of the time my view on those who do, is likely a view you share - they just want to be able to say whatever unpleasant stuff they like, and they don't care about the free speech of those whom they disagree with. I even mock that crowd as the "freeze peach" lot. Also, I don't think "free speech" is really a thing - nobody can publish absolutely anything they want, and they never could. FreeDOM of speech is different because it implies limits, but a private company doesn't have to answer to it (although it shouldn't be censoring views it doesn't agree with - I don't mean cruel, abusive views, just views it doesn't agree with).

But I find the throwing under the bus of women by the left (of which I once was a card carrying member, and still agree with on a lot of things) in recent years to be quite something.

The term "birthing people" offends me as a woman. I find it dehumanising and demeaning - and describing it as inclusive language is laughable. A phrase which removes the words woman/mother is the opposite of inclusive. And it's easy for a man to sneer at this point of view.

RobbieTheRobber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119617178#Comment_119617178

This is a tweet from an individual it doesn't represent some announcement of the Group think for "the left" to me anyway!

You don't like this persons tweets, don't follow them. Don't search them out. I have never seen this tweet or tweeter until this thread. So it looks like your on the hunt to be outraged.

Could you give me a little definition of who you mean by the left in this context. Like are the american democrat party "the left", or how would you define this term?

Am I part of "the left" to you?

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119614623#Comment_119614623

Wait so it's fine to kill flowers to use in a protest. Great logic with these lot.

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119615520#Comment_119615520

Birthing people, a person with a cervix, vulva-owners ...

It's degrading and crass to reduce women to a biological function or anatomical part, but apparently that's woke.

I wonder do inseminating people, a person with a prostate or scrotum-owners prefer to be just called men?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119617528#Comment_119617528

HerFamily.ie is a publication, not an individual - surely you can clearly see this? And language in healthcare which undermines women is not just from them.

And where is the evidence I sought them out? Why would I do that? How would I know what to look for? This Facebook post (not tweet) appeared on my news feed because of one of my friends commenting to it.

Dismissive stuff.

I don't think any adult in the 21st century with an interest in politics genuinely doesn't know what the left means, but I'll bite: when it comes to social issues, left - liberal, right - conservative. These are broad terms obviously but there are plenty who feel duty-bound to one "side". Supporters of this absurd redefining of woman are exclusively on the left. Yeah the Democratic party are on the left socially, although not economically.

AllForIt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119618292#Comment_119618292

Well it's a terrible waste of vegan food at least.

Quantum Erasure

https://www.unilad.com/film-and-tv/the-whale-brendan-fraser-fat-people-20220914?source=facebook

Taking to Twitter, she wrote: "I can’t recommend in good conscience that fat people watch The Whale.

"I can’t recommend that skinny people watch it either, since it reinforces the notion that fat people are objects of pity who have brought their suffering upon themselves through lack of coping skills."

She added that the movie featured 'massive red flags' for eating disorders and fat phobia, and she found it 'incredibly triggering'.

"You can tell that no actually fat peoples were involved in the production," she wrote, adding: "I’m really feeling like s**t after that viewing experience. There’s a scene where the main character drops a key and can’t pick it up, and PEOPLE WERE LAUGHING."

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119619773#Comment_119619773

But I didn't say they are and are not on the left. You omitted two words. I said they are socially to the left, but economically they aren't.

Socially left-wing and economically left-wing don't always automatically co-exist. E.g. there are trade union activists (this is an economically left-wing position) with conservative/right-wing social values, e.g. Eddie Dempsey and Paul Embery in Britain.

The Democratic Party in the US, while socially liberal, is definitely not a party that's affiliated with the labour movement.

Potential-Monke

Any chance of keeping the serious political "debates" out of this? Supposed to be a light-hearted thread. Left, right, who cares, they're all a bunch of useless feckers.

RobbieTheRobber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119620023#Comment_119620023

So they are "the left" to you though right?

CGI_Livia_Soprano

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119620123#Comment_119620123

The problem is that nobody uses it as it’s intended. It's just a link dump for people to moan about minority groups over-reaching. For example one poster came in to have a go at someone who tweeted “birthing people" instead of "women," obviously expecting everyone else to pile on slagging off inclusivity for transpeople. Hardly light-hearted. And the whole thread is like that.

AllForIt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119619889#Comment_119619889

I recommend they do go, because I think they would really enjoy a nice bucket of toffee coated popcorn, a bag of jelly babies and an XL Coke.

RobbieTheRobber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119621202#Comment_119621202

Totes LOL amigo.

Fat people eating food that's so woke, eh!

cdeb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119620991#Comment_119620991

But "birthing people" isn't inclusive of transpeople. It's just gobshitery.

Inclusivity doesn't mean leaving the brain switched off when considering if things are silly or not.

CGI_Livia_Soprano

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119621856#Comment_119621856

Right well why don’t you switch your brain back on then and consider that throwing a bitchfit over saying “birthing person” over “woman” in a tweet about people who give birth isn’t as much of a noble stand against “gobshitery” as you think. Not all women are capable of giving birth, for many different reasons. And not all people who give birth are women.

All this is is throwing a tantrum over a drift in language. The anti-wokists really are such sensitive little snowflakes.

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119621902#Comment_119621902

Could you not have used something gender neutral rather than "bitchfit"?

It's rather surprising given your predilection towards wokism and inclusively.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119621902#Comment_119621902

Shur it's grand and easy for a man to be ok with language undermining women, and preposterousness like "not all people who give birth are women" - or at least for him to pretend to be ok with it.

cdeb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119621902#Comment_119621902

There's no bitchfit (whatever that is)

I agree with Fugue and Leg End Reject, who have outlined their objections very well. Including the suggestion that the language excludes more people than it includes, and that hardly seems reasonable.

The growing scandal in Tavistock is a very strong indication that we really should start to challenge the idea that people can pick and choose their gender and no-one else has any real say.

CGI_Livia_Soprano

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119622210#Comment_119622210

Who does it exclude exactly?

BruteStock

You're a racist if you have a problem with the new little mermaid film. Say the people who banned Halloween costumes and cancelled Apu because he was voiced by a white man😕

cdeb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119622253#Comment_119622253

Well there's female posters here effectively saying they feel a random decision that the term "women" isn't appropriate any more is exclusionary.

You don't have to be inclusive of every daft thing people believe about themselves. Otherwise we'd be promoting anti-vax equality and avoiding terms like "round the world" because it's offensive to flat-earthers.

You've conveniently ignored the Tavistock issue btw.