New Handicap

square ball

Just wondering when I submit 3 cards what my handicap should be. Playing in a par 72 course which I joined in May. Last few rounds I have been going around in 105-110 strokes with a handful of pars and bogeys but mainly double bogeys and only scratching the odd few holes. I had played maybe 10 rounds before I joined in May and have been playing 2-3 times a week all summer.

A friend of mine joined the same course in July and submitted the cards straight away and got a handicap of 22 going around in 110-115 strokes. He played with lads at a different course playing off 20 and 21 and reckoned they had nearly 20 strokes on him at the end.

I reckon his is far too low for his ability but what would I get based on my scores. I want my handicap to genuinely reflect my ability and I'm not going to be playing competitions this year anyway.

Tempora

22 is too low for 110-115 strokes but the handicap secretary was likely concerned that he would improve quickly once he started playing often, and didn't want him rinsing everyone in consecutive competitions as he got cut. I think it's probably the wrong decision on the secretary's part but that was probably the logic. There is a procedure for him to be adjusted up by more than the usual 1 stroke per year if he continues to play at that level. I am not intimately familiar with it nor with how often it is routinely applied by handicap secretaries in various clubs.

Someone going around in 110-115 should be on a 30-32ish handicap in my subjective opinion. 105-110 should see you with a 26-28 handicap. I am literally pulling these numbers out of the air based on the handicaps I've seen and the performance of the players holding them.

mike12

The number of strokes is irrelevant really.
Max score on a hole is 7 on a par 4 so u have to round everything down to that.

If you have a decent number of pars on the card it will also influence the handicap.

slave1

Think it's rounded down to double bogey actually

mike12

slave1 wrote: »

Think it's rounded down to double bogey actually

Might be, thought it was net double.

square ball

Tempora wrote: »

22 is too low for 110-115 strokes but the handicap secretary was likely concerned that he would improve quickly once he started playing often, and didn't want him rinsing everyone in consecutive competitions as he got cut. I think it's probably the wrong decision on the secretary's part but that was probably the logic. There is a procedure for him to be adjusted up by more than the usual 1 stroke per year if he continues to play at that level. I am not intimately familiar with it nor with how often it is routinely applied by handicap secretaries in various clubs.

Someone going around in 110-115 should be on a 30-32ish handicap in my subjective opinion. 105-110 should see you with a 26-28 handicap. I am literally pulling these numbers out of the air based on the handicaps I've seen and the performance of the players holding them.

I'd be happy enough with a handicap of 22-26 and it would probably take me a year or so to even play to that. But worried that if I do get a handicap it will be too low and take the fun out of playing when I am not competitive even playing with friends.

prawnsambo

mike12 wrote: »

Might be, thought it was net double.

Can't be net double if you don't have a handicap yet. The rule is now double par for all hole scores above double par.

To the OP, most golf clubs use software now that calculates handicap based on cards submitted. In my experience it's pretty accurate, but handicap committees obviously have the right to adjust these depending on the circumstances. Your friend may well have indicated that he had a level of experience that would mean (given time) that he'd be able to play to 22. He may also have had a combination of decent hole scores and a bunch of disastrous ones through bad shot choice or a wayward driver. There are lots of factors basically.

ahnoyouregrand

Quick (somewhat) related question. I played my first away open competition recently. Are all opens counting qualifying for handicap purposes? Will the away club ensure that this is added via golfnet or do I need to contact my own club?

dan_ep82

ahnoyouregrand wrote: »

Quick (somewhat) related question. I played my first away open competition recently. Are all opens counting qualifying for handicap purposes? Will the away club ensure that this is added via golfnet or do I need to contact my own club?

Not all no. In winter most are not excepting links courses.

The club should update golfnet and your club will see if. It will be under un processed away scores

ahnoyouregrand

dan_ep82 wrote: »

Not all no. In winter most are not excepting links courses.

The club should update golfnet and your club will see if. It will be under un processed away scores

Ok cool, thanks!

JoeCole26

Hi OP, I handed in three cards back in May of 94,92 and 86 and got a handicap of 10 when I was playing nowhere near to that. I expected the handicap committee to cut maybe 1 or 2 once they had worked it out, as mentioned here, they don’t want newbies winning competitions straight off the bat. All the new members I have played with since have said they felt they were given a lot lower handicap than they expected.

My last 7 rounds I have scored 27-30-30-31-29-24-28, which has really taken the enjoyment out of playing for me recently.

Everyone says it’s harder to come down to where your handicap is probably at that to go up, so keep that in mind when handing in cards. Realistically I’m about a 15 handicapper. Based on the current system it will take me another 4 years to get there.

Miley Byrne

JoeCole26 wrote: »

Everyone says it’s harder to come down to where your handicap is probably at that to go up, so keep that in mind when handing in cards.

What do you mean by the bit above OP?

jamesbondings

had a question on handicaps. when toting up the strokes for the round, what is a scratch worth? 10?

have two cards done, just need to do my final card but i have maybe 5 scratches on the two cards. i have maybe 6 or 7 pars and a birdie or two.

Ottoman_1000

jamesbondings wrote: »

had a question on handicaps. when toting up the strokes for the round, what is a scratch worth? 10?

have two cards done, just need to do my final card but i have maybe 5 scratches on the two cards. i have maybe 6 or 7 pars and a birdie or two.

Technically you are actually meant to play out each hole when compiling your 3 cards. But quadruple bogie would be a score that would put you out of the scoring equation regardless anyway as the max handicap you can be given is 54!

jamesbondings

so how do the non scoring holes affect the handicap given? they just chalk it down to quadruple bogey so an 8 on a par 4 and a 9 on a par 5?

copacetic

JoeCole26 wrote: »

Hi OP, I handed in three cards back in May of 94,92 and 86 and got a handicap of 10 when I was playing nowhere near to that. I expected the handicap committee to cut maybe 1 or 2 once they had worked it out, as mentioned here, they don’t want newbies winning competitions straight off the bat. All the new members I have played with since have said they felt they were given a lot lower handicap than they expected.

My last 7 rounds I have scored 27-30-30-31-29-24-28, which has really taken the enjoyment out of playing for me recently.

Everyone says it’s harder to come down to where your handicap is probably at that to go up, so keep that in mind when handing in cards. Realistically I’m about a 15 handicapper. Based on the current system it will take me another 4 years to get there.

On the current system you can only get back 2 shots a year, but new system due Nov 2 will resolve it for you. Before that you would have to ask specifically for a review, although you will probably find you are coming in the bottom half of the pack each comp but not right at the bottom with those scores...

hurleronditch

Ottoman_1000 wrote: »

Technically you are actually meant to play out each hole when compiling your 3 cards. But quadruple bogie would be a score that would put you out of the scoring equation regardless anyway as the max handicap you can be given is 54!

Speaking to a former handicap secretary about this as I just handed in my own three cards, he suggested a good way to think about it is mentally mark your card as a stableford round off a nominal handicap around where you think you’d be. So if you mark it off 18, and including the scratches you have 32 points that broadly suggests a 22 handicap round. It’s not perfect but gives you a ballpark at least.

I handed mine in, a 12 and a 13 over and a clusterf&ck round littered with doubles and scratches. Will be interested to see what I get.

gypsy79

hurleronditch wrote: »

Speaking to a former handicap secretary about this as I just handed in my own three cards, he suggested a good way to think about it is mentally mark your card as a stableford round off a nominal handicap around where you think you’d be. So if you mark it off 18, and including the scratches you have 32 points that broadly suggests a 22 handicap round. It’s not perfect but gives you a ballpark at least.

I handed mine in, a 12 and a 13 over and a clusterf&ck round littered with doubles and scratches. Will be interested to see what I get.

10 or 11 guaranteed nearly

Golfgraffix

hurleronditch wrote: »

Speaking to a former handicap secretary about this as I just handed in my own three cards, he suggested a good way to think about it is mentally mark your card as a stableford round off a nominal handicap around where you think you’d be. So if you mark it off 18, and including the scratches you have 32 points that broadly suggests a 22 handicap round. It’s not perfect but gives you a ballpark at least.

I handed mine in, a 12 and a 13 over and a clusterf&ck round littered with doubles and scratches. Will be interested to see what I get.

Only the 12 over round will count, the other two are not used at all.

JoeCole26

hurleronditch wrote: »

Speaking to a former handicap secretary about this as I just handed in my own three cards, he suggested a good way to think about it is mentally mark your card as a stableford round off a nominal handicap around where you think you’d be. So if you mark it off 18, and including the scratches you have 32 points that broadly suggests a 22 handicap round. It’s not perfect but gives you a ballpark at least.

I handed mine in, a 12 and a 13 over and a clusterf&ck round littered with doubles and scratches. Will be interested to see what I get.

I’d say a 9 handicap. Let us know how you get on.

Seve OB

copacetic wrote: »

On the current system you can only get back 2 shots a year, but new system due Nov 2 will resolve it for you. Before that you would have to ask specifically for a review, although you will probably find you are coming in the bottom half of the pack each comp but not right at the bottom with those scores...

2 shots?
Where do you play?

prawnsambo

hurleronditch wrote: »

Speaking to a former handicap secretary about this as I just handed in my own three cards, he suggested a good way to think about it is mentally mark your card as a stableford round off a nominal handicap around where you think you’d be. So if you mark it off 18, and including the scratches you have 32 points that broadly suggests a 22 handicap round. It’s not perfect but gives you a ballpark at least.

I handed mine in, a 12 and a 13 over and a clusterf&ck round littered with doubles and scratches. Will be interested to see what I get.

Assuming that the 12 over round is not adjusted downwards by any hole score being greater than double par, the calculation is (and this assumes your course SSS is the same as par) (12 + (12 * 0.13))/1.237 = 10.96 rounded to a handicap of 11.

However, other things may be taken into account by the handicap secretary; such as your previous golfing experience, a past handicap that you provided them with etc.

copacetic

Seve OB wrote: »

2 shots?
Where do you play?

Sorry, mistype..

ThunderCat

Lads is there any special allowance this year due to courses being closed for a few months with regards losing your handicap by not playing enough? My understanding is that you have to play in at least 3 counting comps over a calendar year to keep your handicap. Was just looking over my own activity this year and I've only played in one counting singles comp so far. I seem to have played mostly in doubles/team comps and with a baby at home I'm not getting out very much anyway. Just wondering if I need to get the finger out and play in two more counting comps before the year is out or if it's relaxed because of the year that's in it. Also roughly speaking when do the counting comps stop? October?
Thanks.

DuckSlice

ThunderCat wrote: »

Lads is there any special allowance this year due to courses being closed for a few months with regards losing your handicap by not playing enough? My understanding is that you have to play in at least 3 counting comps over a calendar year to keep your handicap. Was just looking over my own activity this year and I've only played in one counting singles comp so far. I seem to have played mostly in doubles/team comps and with a baby at home I'm not getting out very much anyway. Just wondering if I need to get the finger out and play in two more counting comps before the year is out or if it's relaxed because of the year that's in it. Also roughly speaking when do the counting comps stop? October?
Thanks.

I don't think there has been any allowance made for it. I'd say play in two more comps just to be on the safe side. And was the requirement not changed to 4 cards? or is that just for interclub, or have I made that up?

prawnsambo

ThunderCat wrote: »

Lads is there any special allowance this year due to courses being closed for a few months with regards losing your handicap by not playing enough? My understanding is that you have to play in at least 3 counting comps over a calendar year to keep your handicap. Was just looking over my own activity this year and I've only played in one counting singles comp so far. I seem to have played mostly in doubles/team comps and with a baby at home I'm not getting out very much anyway. Just wondering if I need to get the finger out and play in two more counting comps before the year is out or if it's relaxed because of the year that's in it. Also roughly speaking when do the counting comps stop? October?
Thanks.

It's kind of been a perfect storm this year. Because we're changing over to the WHS, the advice has been to get as many rounds in so that your new WHS handicap index is as accurate as possible. You can use supplementary scores for this, but obviously they won't count towards your competition status. You need three qualifying scores in the current year to have competition status. For inter-club competitions run by the GUI, the requirement is usually four qualifying competitions in the previous calendar year.

ThunderCat

Thanks for the replies lads. I'll be favoring singles comps instead of fourballs etc. over the next while so.

charlieIRL

ThunderCat wrote: »

Lads is there any special allowance this year due to courses being closed for a few months with regards losing your handicap by not playing enough? My understanding is that you have to play in at least 3 counting comps over a calendar year to keep your handicap. Was just looking over my own activity this year and I've only played in one counting singles comp so far. I seem to have played mostly in doubles/team comps and with a baby at home I'm not getting out very much anyway. Just wondering if I need to get the finger out and play in two more counting comps before the year is out or if it's relaxed because of the year that's in it. Also roughly speaking when do the counting comps stop? October?
Thanks.

I'm in a very similar situation, with lockdown and then localised lockdowns, I've only 1 counting round played. Could be a busy few weeks for me.

ThunderCat

charlieIRL wrote: »

I'm in a very similar situation, with lockdown and then localised lockdowns, I've only 1 counting round played. Could be a busy few weeks for me.

Looking back over my own playing activity and I can see I played in an away counting comp in Corballis in Jan 2019 so I'm guessing they probably have counting comps all year round there. Don't know where you are based but you could perhaps get in a couple of comps there as late as Christmas if you were still stuck in order to secure your handicap. You might see me out there with you. Pair of us in Santa hats hacking away.

gypsy79

corballis is qualifying year round

My home course Elmgreen try do qualifying as much as possible for their opens. But last year had none nov till lockdown

But year before weather was much better and we had some more

charlieIRL

ThunderCat wrote: »

Looking back over my own playing activity and I can see I played in an away counting comp in Corballis in Jan 2019 so I'm guessing they probably have counting comps all year round there. Don't know where you are based but you could perhaps get in a couple of comps there as late as Christmas if you were still stuck in order to secure your handicap. You might see me out there with you. Pair of us in Santa hats hacking away.

do they have to be at your home course though??

would definitely be up for a few rounds in Corballis though.

ThunderCat

charlieIRL wrote: »

do they have to be at your home course though??

would definitely be up for a few rounds in Corballis though.

That I don't know. Hopefully someone else on here will tell us for sure. But all I can say is that I got my 0.1 back that day so I'm guessing it counts.

prawnsambo

charlieIRL wrote: »

do they have to be at your home course though??

would definitely be up for a few rounds in Corballis though.

No. But afaik, you should have three at your home club in order to get competition status and after that they can be anywhere.

hurleronditch

JoeCole26 wrote: »

I’d say a 9 handicap. Let us know how you get on.

9 is what I got.

I was abroad for a number of years and my handicap away finished as 9 so that was taken into account I imagine. Off 9 having to hole out all putts as we do in Ireland vs the casual gimme golf that still counts for handicap that I’ve been used to when away may take a while to get my head around but looking forward to the challenge!!

Mantis Toboggan

ThunderCat wrote: »

Looking back over my own playing activity and I can see I played in an away counting comp in Corballis in Jan 2019 so I'm guessing they probably have counting comps all year round there. Don't know where you are based but you could perhaps get in a couple of comps there as late as Christmas if you were still stuck in order to secure your handicap. You might see me out there with you. Pair of us in Santa hats hacking away.

With the new handicap system coming in November counting comps are year round everywhere so you should have plenty of time.

IAmTitleist

I do quite enjoy going out in the winter months playing the odd round here or there knowing the pressure of playing for 0.1 isn't on the line.

Weeks/months could pass between me playing.

This new system could potentially make me play less given that i will have to play relatively well all winter too to maintain my handicap, something which is much more difficult if you're playing sporadically rather than regularly during summer.

Not looking forward to the new system to be honest.

charlieIRL

prawnsambo wrote: »

No. But afaik, you should have three at your home club in order to get competition status and after that they can be anywhere.

what would happen if you didn't?

Sorry for going off topic!!

hurleronditch

IAmTitleist wrote: »

I do quite enjoy going out in the winter months playing the odd round here or there knowing the pressure of playing for 0.1 isn't on the line.

Weeks/months could pass between me playing.

This new system could potentially make me play less given that i will have to play relatively well all winter too to maintain my handicap, something which is much more difficult if you're playing sporadically rather than regularly during summer.

Not looking forward to the new system to be honest.

Interesting to see how they deal with this to be honest. Whilst I love winter golf, and under the old system would have no fear of a .1 back at Corballis, .1 actually ended up being limited enough with Qualifying reduction only thrown in plenty of the time of the weather was inclement.

Under the new system, a competent low teens handicap golfer could easily go out for some casual winter golf and shoot 4 rounds out of 5 in the mid 90s, and come back in spring having turned their 13 into a 16.

As a generalisation, Americans are much more fairweather about their golf, whilst people do play year round particularly in southern states where the weather is good all year, golfers in the big population centres in the northeast and Midwest don’t golf from October to April as most courses shut or as good as shut. so the US handicap system which we are effectively adopting here, doesn’t need to ever cater for bad weather golf at all

blue note

I think you'd be a fool to let a new handicap system ever put you off playing. If your handicap goes up (or down) so what? Maybe it'll be the case that it'll go up a couple of shots over the winter and back down those shots in summer.

A low handicap is a nice thing to chase, I won't pretend it's not. But not if it puts you off playing.

dan_ep82

You can still play casuals with no impact on your handicap. Its not like America where all rounds must be recorded.

Seve OB

Mantis Toboggan wrote: »

With the new handicap system coming in November counting comps are year round everywhere so you should have plenty of time.

But are they?
We don’t know this yet for certain

prawnsambo

Seve OB wrote: »

But are they?
We don’t know this yet for certain

Can't see how this could be if there's placing in the rough, mats and other winter rule changes that aren't eligible for qualifying comps.

Seve OB

prawnsambo wrote: »

Can't see how this could be if there's placing in the rough, mats and other winter rule changes that aren't eligible for qualifying comps.

Indeed and there has been nothing from the GUI to indicate that they will be qualifying.

Mantis Toboggan

Seve OB wrote: »

But are they?
We don’t know this yet for certain

Yeah true nothing definite from the GUI, I'd imagine they'd follow the UK but who knows.

They'd want to get the finger out it's just over a month away. Nobody in my club has a clue about it.

cowboyjoe

Would appreciate any response to similar issue to OP. Handed 3 cards in June - one best ever round had 2 birdies, so first time handicap I get was 13. Have now played approx 10 open/comps since July with 9 straight 0.1 increases to get me to 14 now. I have not got over 23 points in those 10 comps. My ND in these comps have been between 12-18. None lower at all. Handicap secretary won't increase me, as he says every new member will be looking for same and WHS goes live 2 Nov. So wait til then.
My question is, how much can I expect the WHS to change my handicap, if at all. Totally demoralizing knowing you are gonna score poorly every proper comp/round.

prawnsambo

cowboyjoe wrote: »

Would appreciate any response to similar issue to OP. Handed 3 cards in June - one best ever round had 2 birdies, so first time handicap I get was 13. Have now played approx 10 open/comps since July with 9 straight 0.1 increases to get me to 14 now. I have not got over 23 points in those 10 comps. My ND in these comps have been between 12-18. None lower at all. Handicap secretary won't increase me, as he says every new member will be looking for same and WHS goes live 2 Nov. So wait til then.
My question is, how much can I expect the WHS to change my handicap, if at all. Totally demoralizing knowing you are gonna score poorly every proper comp/round.

I've often said this here when people talk about bandits. It's far far harder to get a handicap up to your playing level than the other way around. It took me 18 months and an annual review adjustment of two strokes before I was able to play close to my handicap.

Your WHS handicap will be based on the best 8 of your last twenty rounds. So you should expect an adjustment to something more in line with your ability. But get as many rounds in as possible before the change to make sure you have enough data points to get this as accurate as possible. To work it out yourself, you'd need your course and slope ratings and all your individual hole scores to get an adjusted gross score from which you can calculate your handicap index.

Mantis Taboggan wrote:

Yeah true nothing definite from the GUI, I'd imagine they'd follow the UK but who knows.

They'd want to get the finger out it's just over a month away. Nobody in my club has a clue about it.

A new Rules of Handicapping booklet was sent out to golf clubs in the last couple of weeks. Rule 2 deals with scores acceptable for handicap purposes. As I said above, it pretty much mirrors what are currently the rules for qualifying and non-qualifying scores. One of which being rounds played during the 'active season'.

cowboyjoe

prawnsambo wrote: »

I've often said this here when people talk about bandits. It's far far harder to get a handicap up to your playing level than the other way around. It took me 18 months and an annual review adjustment of two strokes before I was able to play close to my handicap.

Your WHS handicap will be based on the best 8 of your last twenty rounds. So you should expect an adjustment to something more in line with your ability. But get as many rounds in as possible before the change to make sure you have enough data points to get this as accurate as possible. To work it out yourself, you'd need your course and slope ratings and all your individual hole scores to get an adjusted gross score from which you can calculate your handicap index.

Thanks for the reply. Do you know is there any upper limit to what the WHS can change your handicap up or down. Read something about your HC can only change 3 shots in any calendar year.

copacetic

cowboyjoe wrote: »

prawnsambo wrote: »

I've often said this here when people talk about bandits. It's far far harder to get a handicap up to your playing level than the other way around. It took me 18 months and an annual review adjustment of two strokes before I was able to play close to my handicap.

Your WHS handicap will be based on the best 8 of your last twenty rounds. So you should expect an adjustment to something more in line with your ability. But get as many rounds in as possible before the change to make sure you have enough data points to get this as accurate as possible. To work it out yourself, you'd need your course and slope ratings and all your individual hole scores to get an adjusted gross score from which you can calculate your handicap index.

Thanks for the reply. Do you know is there any upper limit to what the WHS can change your handicap up or down. Read something about your HC can only change 3 shots in any calendar year.

JoeCole26

cowboyjoe wrote: »

Would appreciate any response to similar issue to OP. Handed 3 cards in June - one best ever round had 2 birdies, so first time handicap I get was 13. Have now played approx 10 open/comps since July with 9 straight 0.1 increases to get me to 14 now. I have not got over 23 points in those 10 comps. My ND in these comps have been between 12-18. None lower at all. Handicap secretary won't increase me, as he says every new member will be looking for same and WHS goes live 2 Nov. So wait til then.
My question is, how much can I expect the WHS to change my handicap, if at all. Totally demoralizing knowing you are gonna score poorly every proper comp/round.

I am in the exact same boat. I’ve completed 9 rounds now all 30 and less. I’m going to send an email to the handicap committee during the week. Last time I spoke to them they were fairly unhelpful, even when I talked through where I thought they adjusted for my original card incorrectly as per the CONGU guideline. Shocking that they said they wouldn’t review and to wait until the new system comes in. Very demoralising. I thought the GUI would want to attract players to take up golf.

gypsy79

Some clubs seem intent on making sure they give new people 4-5 shots lower in some cases to ensure they dont win too early

If anything my club gives the exact handicaps as per the calculation without any reference

JoeCole26

Hi all,

Has anyone ever received a handicap review upwards? As mentioned here, i was given a handicap when i joined a new club and have been getting nowhere near my handicap. 28points last weekend, which is my 8th consecutive round 30 or below.

I think i will reach out to the handicap committee at my club for a review but wondering am i wasting my time?

I know the CONGU guide states below, but it only states them to "consider"

"Equally, there is a continuous handicap review. If a player returns 7 consecutive cards over buffer
zone, the handicap committee will be prompted to review the player’s performance and consider if
an immediate increase in handicap is warranted"

Just interested in peoples thoughts. Thanks