Briars and Ivy taking over Ireland

PoorFarmer

GreeBo wrote: »

Just because the honey might be nicer doesnt automatically mean we should allow ivy to take over.
There are huge areas of wildflower these days, specifically to support bio-diversity and pollinators.

Ivy is good for bees mainly because it flowers so late in the year it can often be the difference between a hive surviving or not.
I have loads of it but it hasn't taken over. Like most things it needs to be controlled so a snip every now and again keeps it in check without killing it off completely.

On a side note was fencing a field today that had the hedges failed Sept 2018. Briars I reckon have grown max 6 feet in that time

80sDiesel

Every field wants to be forest. And how It tries to achieve that is by taking it over with thorny scrub so that pioneer tree species can gain a foothold. Unless you plant some trees in the hedgerows to eventually shade out the scrub they will continue their battle.

Frankx

I cut away the ivy from 2 trees yesterday

Just happened to see this thread, they were swamped with it , inch thick vines going up the trees

coolshannagh28

amadangomor wrote: »

Where I'm from briars are blackberry bushes and bucky briars are the dog roses.

They are two different animals . one ,the briar, is a nuisance and fairly benign , the other the bucky briar has the most evil thorns imaginable.

Glenomra

the country is indeed becoming overgrown. The fact is that is what the government wants to happen. They see that as protecting the environment. I live close to the Shannon and went for walk along its bank recently. A pathway that was easily accessible is now inaccessible. two reasons, one is forcing farmers to put their farm fences well back from the river and secondly, the fact that the older fishermen who used the path regularly and kept the path clear are dying off and not being replaced. Younger people on their media, not fishing.!!!! The situation was highlighted for me this morning when I walked across our own yard, to find a fe****g briar had encroached in about six feet from the neighbour's hedge. If left unattended, the briars would take over a property within months.

GreeBo

Birdnuts wrote: »

You must be joking!! - outside of places like the Shannon Callows nearly all our original wildflower meadows have vanished over the past 60 years. Figures for the the UK show a 99% loss since WW2.

You are talking about original areas, I'm referring to the new ones that are being purposefully created.

White Clover

Birdnuts wrote: »

You must be joking!! - outside of places like the Shannon Callows nearly all our original wildflower meadows have vanished over the past 60 years. Figures for the the UK show a 99% loss since WW2.

You're being a tad sensationalist with that statement. Look at all the posters that were on the hay making thread in the last month, from all corners of the country I'd bet. What kind of meadows do you think they were?

Buford T. Justice XIX

Glenomra wrote: »

the country is indeed becoming overgrown. The fact is that is what the government wants to happen. They see that as protecting the environment. I live close to the Shannon and went for walk along its bank recently. A pathway that was easily accessible is now inaccessible. two reasons, one is forcing farmers to put their farm fences well back from the river and secondly, the fact that the older fishermen who used the path regularly and kept the path clear are dying off and not being replaced. Younger people on their media, not fishing.!!!! The situation was highlighted for me this morning when I walked across our own yard, to find a fe****g briar had encroached in about six feet from the neighbour's hedge. If left unattended, the briars would take over a property within months.

There's a reason for that though, and a good one for once.

The fence is supposed to be 1.5m out from the river bank and left with a thick cover of vegetation. This is to reduce dramatically the overflow from land after heavy rains, which are much more common now that previously, because that runoff from heavier land tends to be higher in levels of N.

The bank of vegetation reduces the absolute N levels due to higher infiltration rates due to the water and dissolved nutrients being held longer and reduces the concentration of those N levels due to slowing the runoff waters passage into the stream now being diluted from higher flow levels of water.

Birdnuts

White Clover wrote: »

You're being a tad sensationalist with that statement. Look at all the posters that were on the hay making thread in the last month, from all corners of the country I'd bet. What kind of meadows do you think they were?

You don't create a wildflower meadow overnight - traditional wildflower meadows had species like Cowslips, Orchids etc. in it. Just cos hay is made in a field does not mean it becomes a great place for pollinators overnight - especially if the previous management involved chemical fert and herbicides. The ongoing decline of many bumblebee species etc. shows that. Which brings me back to my original point about hedgerows with ivy etc. being the only source of pollen/honey on many farms these days.

Birdnuts

GreeBo wrote: »

You are talking about original areas, I'm referring to the new ones that are being purposefully created.

That is to be welcomed but its still a drop in the ocean compared to the situation only 50 fifty years ago

amadangomor

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Sure did. I was always told it was good for cattle.

Cavan as well? My grandfather had loads of the cures for animals and had them in a book that was lost.

amadangomor

coolshannagh28 wrote: »

They are two different animals . one ,the briar, is a nuisance and fairly benign , the other the bucky briar has the most evil thorns imaginable.

Yep, remember it when following my father shooting pheasants going through rough ditches or going fishing myself and it if it caught you would rip you apart.

ruwithme

No need for razor wire round the top of the prison wall, if you had a line of the bucky briar growing up there.

worded

Roundup is poisonous to humans and may be responsible for a host of health issues

Please don’t use it for everyone’s sake

patsy_mccabe

worded wrote: »

Roundup is poisonous to humans and may be responsible for a host of health issues

Please don’t use it for everyone’s sake

You should tell that to most gardening enthusiasts. Go into any B&Q, Woodies etc and it's the first thing you will see stacked up high. Farmers only use a fraction of what house owners use.

whisky_galore

farmertipp wrote: »

I have a neighbour whose whole place is yellow with ragwort . this yr it's worse than ever. why don't they enforce the law?

Years ago it would have been taken seriously, even if the law wasn't enforced, it was a noxious weed, that was all the incentive you'd want to get rid of it. You'd go and pull them by hand yourself, you won't get them all but over time you'll make a dent in the population. Now they're too lazy to get off a tractor to do that.

Castlekeeper

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

You should tell that to most gardening enthusiasts. Go into any B&Q, Woodies etc and it's the first thing you will see stacked up high. Farmers only use a fraction of what house owners use.

On a sheer acreage basis I'd never have thought so, where did you see that?
I suppose another difference is that as farmers , we're applying it directly or indirectly into the human food chain.

worded

Just a quick google for roundup

Roundup causes cancer. Buyer pays out billions in US

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/24/business/roundup-settlement-lawsuits.html

worded

worded wrote: »

Just a quick google for roundup

Roundup causes cancer. Buyer pays out billions in US

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/24/business/roundup-settlement-lawsuits.html

The case is rubbish, only reason there is any payout is that it’s America claim culture.

Roundup is essential for farming.

worded

Castlekeeper wrote: »

On a sheer acreage basis I'd never have thought so, where did you see that?
I suppose another difference is that as farmers , we're applying it directly or indirectly into the human food chain.

It’s banned in lots of counties

We are paddy last it seems

https://www.baumhedlundlaw.com/toxic-tort-law/monsanto-roundup-lawsuit/where-is-glyphosate-banned/

GreeBo

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

You should tell that to most gardening enthusiasts. Go into any B&Q, Woodies etc and it's the first thing you will see stacked up high. Farmers only use a fraction of what house owners use.

B&q stuff is all glyphosate free these days

Dinzee Conlee

whisky_galore wrote: »

Years ago it would have been taken seriously, even if the law wasn't enforced, it was a noxious weed, that was all the incentive you'd want to get rid of it. You'd go and pull them by hand yourself, you won't get them all but over time you'll make a dent in the population. Now they're too lazy to get off a tractor to do that.

Was driving on the Cork - Fermoy motorway and there was motorway maintenance lads picking ragwort on the side of the motorway...

As for too lazy to get off a tractor - you sound like every old lad giving out about the younger generation... And the generation before you said the same about your lot...

Arlo High Cowhand

Arlo High Cowhand wrote: »

The case is rubbish, only reason there is any payout is that it’s America claim culture.

Roundup is essential for farming.

They paid out early due to it being lethal/cancerous.....if they had been found liable in a court of law,they would been bankrupt by end of the week




Roundup is important for farming,but dont think for 1 second it isnt cancer causing or poisionus....anyone i ever known,who done contract spraying for years,died of cancer/kidney failure.

its to farming,what aspestos was to building

blackbox

GreeBo wrote: »

B&q stuff is all glyphosate free these days

This is just virtue signalling.

I'm not going to claim that Roundup is completely harmless, but it is much less toxic than many other herbicides.

Biscuitus

farmertipp wrote: »

I have a neighbour whose whole place is yellow with ragwort . this yr it's worse than ever. why don't they enforce the law?

whisky_galore wrote: »

Years ago it would have been taken seriously, even if the law wasn't enforced, it was a noxious weed, that was all the incentive you'd want to get rid of it. You'd go and pull them by hand yourself, you won't get them all but over time you'll make a dent in the population. Now they're too lazy to get off a tractor to do that.

Its a biennial airborne weed. Enforcing a law would be like fining farmers for littering when a tayto packet blows in. You can't stop ragweed. It will always be there and as much as you can sort out your own farm it will mean nothing if neighbours don't either. The council in my county have abandoned maintaining roadways completely. Ragweed everywhere let flower and spread without a care. Now all the surrounding fields are covered.

I had my farm spotless. It cost a lot in spray and many days pulling but last 2 years there was barely anything and that got pulled. Then builders dug up about 20 acres near my farm and this year I'm covered worse than I've ever been.

2 years of near spotless fields but because of the council and my neighbours I'm covered again so I should get a fine?

farmertipp

if there was a rounded approach to the problem. the guy who caused it gets hit. I know a farmer who had furze in a corner and dept rang to know what he was growing. he was an old man and had to get a digger to remove it. so they c as n see it and track it if they wanted to.
I'm talking about severe infestation. you cant see the grass in this place. a sea of yellow.
****er should be committed.

Biscuitus

Straw yields way down this year and grass growth rapidly dropping yet briars growing 6-10 feet this year. madness!

Local contractor doing hedges says it's great for him. Hedges he cut way down at the start of the year have 3 years worth of growth now and he'll be busy for weeks on end.

Siamsa Sessions

Biscuitus wrote: »

Straw yields way down this year and grass growth rapidly dropping yet briars growing 6-10 feet this year. madness!

Local contractor doing hedges says it's great for him. Hedges he cut way down at the start of the year have 3 years worth of growth now and he'll be busy for weeks on end.

Seems to be a year for weeds and other undesirables. Would it be the extra heat we had maybe?

gozunda

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

Seems to be a year for weeds and other undesirables. Would it be the extra heat we had maybe?

Our normal climate of wet / humid conditions favours rampant plant growth and weeds thrive in it. Even more so during our warm / wet / humid season.

Lower stocking rstes and restricted hedge management often means weeds have the upper hand.

If we could sell weeds - we'd all be millionaires ...

Siamsa Sessions

gozunda wrote: »

If we could sell weeds - we'd all be millionaires ...

Or rushes