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Has anyone invested in an EII project/scheme?

  • 24-06-2020 3:31am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 3,564 ✭✭✭ One More Toy


    If so how did it go?

    Had the opportunity to invest in a windfarm under the scheme a few years ago but pulled out at the last minute, kinda raining I didn't give it a chance


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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,564 ✭✭✭ One More Toy


    Bumping for visibility


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,564 ✭✭✭ One More Toy


    No takers?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,564 ✭✭✭ One More Toy


    Surely someone has taken a punt at EII?


  • Registered Users Posts: 8 fangs


    I've taken out a few over the years with 3 active EIIS. All recommended by my financial advisor who does the due diligence. The scheme is more attractive this year in that companies can self certify and all of the tax credit can be redeemed in year one. One company EIIS was due to mature this year, but they requested an extension on foot of a buy out. Shoot if you have any questions....


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,564 ✭✭✭ One More Toy


    fangs wrote: »
    I've taken out a few over the years with 3 active EIIS. All recommended by my financial advisor who does the due diligence. The scheme is more attractive this year in that companies can self certify and all of the tax credit can be redeemed in year one. One company EIIS was due to mature this year, but they requested an extension on foot of a buy out. Shoot if you have any questions....

    Did you invest in any specific projects? I was going to invest on a wind farm then pulled out of it last year

    Have you seen a profit at the end?

    Tia


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,574 ✭✭✭ adam88


    I did a few pound in a crematorium few years back. Cashing out next year I think


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,020 ✭✭✭✭ Water John


    If you're a high income/tax earner and can afford it then annually investing in an EII is an easy way to lower your tax bill over time. Some agencies put together a portfolio of projects, if you wanted to lower your risk.
    If you can pay in for 3/5 years, you're then paying in taxable income one side and drawing tax free income on the other. Thus keep investing and cashing down.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,226 ✭✭✭ Valhallapt


    Anyone ever made a few quid on this, I’ve never heard anything positive


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,020 ✭✭✭✭ Water John


    The tax break is the money, anything else would be a bonus.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,564 ✭✭✭ One More Toy


    adam88 wrote: »
    I did a few pound in a crematorium few years back. Cashing out next year I think

    Shannon crematorium is it? Was humming and hawwing about that too


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  • Registered Users Posts: 8 fangs


    Did you invest in any specific projects? I was going to invest on a wind farm then pulled out of it last year

    Have you seen a profit at the end?

    Tia
    Apologies for the delay, I was away for a bit. i invested in an online book publishing business, a dairy product company and a solar panel installation company. The publishing business hit a stumbling block which has resulted in a delay to the maturity. I'm told they are likely to be bought out next year, at which point I will get my return. All the others are active and progressing according to plan per the updates I receive. I have received the tax refunds for each already (save the final 10% for the publishing company). Each company was vetted by my financial advisor, tbh I don't think I would invest without somewhat of a professional due diligence being done. There are a lot of high risk companies out there, and I'm sure COVID has added to the risk. I think there are EIIS funds available which invest in a portfolio of companies, this may take out some of the risk involved with investing in single companies (google eiis funds ireland). Hope that helps


  • Registered Users Posts: 421 ✭✭ the goon


    Hi just wondering if anyone can give me some advice. Invested in Davy 2018 scheme and received paperwork for one of the companies recently. Trying to figure out when I can claim the initial relief as it has two dates;

    Date on SQEI3: 06/02/2020
    Date on which 30% of the amount raised has been expended on a qualifying purpose; 31/12/2019

    My understanding from this is that I won't be able to claim the initial relief until doing my 2020 return next year?

    Any help much appreciated.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,564 ✭✭✭ One More Toy


    Any new schemes up yet?


  • Registered Users Posts: 915 ✭✭✭ sternn


    I've recently invested in a project in Spark Crowdfunding that is EII approved. It's my first dabble in this arena.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,220 ✭✭✭✭ retalivity


    Any new schemes up yet?

    I got an email from BVP about their fund for this year but havent looked at it. If i remember from last year, it all looked a bit wishy-washy


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,788 ✭✭✭ Cute Hoor


    Any new schemes up yet?

    greencrowd.ie
    solarstream.ie (I think you can invest directly with solarstream which would probably mean less fees than if you invested via greencrowd)
    patientmpower.com
    pureirishice.ie (have already raised €530k of the €600k they plan to raise as per yesterday's SBP)

    I'm not batting for any or all of the above.

    There will most likely be more in the SBP EIIS special being published in the SBP on 22nd November, might be worth waiting for that


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,953 ✭✭✭ caviardreams


    Some interesting opportunities in the business post today.

    The scheme is new to me and I've read up on it, but as a PAYE taxpayer is it really as straightforward as just doing your tax return at the end of next year, and claiming back the 40% relief on say a 20k investment. And then hoping in 4 years you get your 100% back (ideally a little more, or hopefully at least 60% so you break even).

    I presume you have to claim back the tax relief in one year e.g. if you only pay €5k in tax each year at the higher rate, could you spread the relief over 2 tax years, so that you could claim back the full 8k tax relief (spread over 2021 and 2022) in the example above?

    Also, how much financial info do you normally get from the companies? I got a brochure with general sales figures but no balance sheet or P&L etc. Is it reasonable to ask for this kind of detailed info or is it not teh norm, and you just go by the brochure?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,054 ✭✭✭ Static M.e.


    Following. I would love to know how it works too.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,564 ✭✭✭ One More Toy


    I'm going to give it a miss this year because I was off sick and don't have much income in the higher bracket as a result so wouldn't make much sense really


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,788 ✭✭✭ Cute Hoor


    Some interesting opportunities in the business post today.

    The scheme is new to me and I've read up on it, but as a PAYE taxpayer is it really as straightforward as just doing your tax return at the end of next year, and claiming back the 40% relief on say a 20k investment. And then hoping in 4 years you get your 100% back (ideally a little more, or hopefully at least 60% so you break even).

    I presume you have to claim back the tax relief in one year e.g. if you only pay €5k in tax each year at the higher rate, could you spread the relief over 2 tax years, so that you could claim back the full 8k tax relief (spread over 2021 and 2022) in the example above?

    Also, how much financial info do you normally get from the companies? I got a brochure with general sales figures but no balance sheet or P&L etc. Is it reasonable to ask for this kind of detailed info or is it not teh norm, and you just go by the brochure?

    I will try to give a simple example of how it works.

    You invest €10,000 in an EIIS scheme in November/December 2020 - it is important that this €10,000 is 2020 income that has been taxed at 40%.
    You do your tax returns for 2020 in January 2021 or whenever you can, and you will be allowed the first 30% tax relief - so you will get €3,000 back from Revenue.
    When you are doing your 2024 tax returns you will be allowed the additional 10% tax relief - so you will get a further €1,000 back from Revenue.

    You will hopefully get your original €10,000 investment back plus a little bonus after 5 years approx, the timing will depend to some extent on a companies ability to pay out at that particular point in time.

    Generally speaking the Business (or their agent) should provide you with sufficient information in their prospectus to make a reasoned decision, but I'd be pretty sure that they would provide you with any additional information if requested.

    You can spread the investment over multiple tax years (to the best of my knowledge)


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  • Registered Users Posts: 19,020 ✭✭✭✭ Water John


    So doing that you invest each year in an EII. By year 5 you have a full return income stream. In year 5 you get the 10K investment of year 1 , along with the final tax refund on year 2 and the main tax return on year 4.
    This then can happen on a rolling basis. Know of one guy with a good income business and I believe he maxes the EII each year.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,788 ✭✭✭ Cute Hoor


    Water John wrote: »
    So doing that you invest each year in an EII. By year 5 you have a full return income stream. In year 5 you get the 10K investment of year 1 , along with the final tax refund on year 2 and the main tax return on year 4.
    This then can happen on a rolling basis. Know of one guy with a good income business and I believe he maxes the EII each year.

    That's the theory, but in order for that to run smoothly you are hoping to avoid hiccups, such as a business having to delay payment, not being able to make full repayment, or in the worst case scenario going bust.


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,020 ✭✭✭✭ Water John


    Cute Hoor wrote: »
    That's the theory, but in order for that to run smoothly you are hoping to avoid hiccups, such as a business having to delay payment, not being able to make full repayment, or in the worst case scenario going bust.

    Indeed, but I think the record is quite good. Don't some of the accounting cos put together bundles of projects as an investment portfolio?


  • Registered Users Posts: 217 ✭✭ DM1983


    Has anyone on here gone through a 5 year cycle yet??? How did it perform?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,788 ✭✭✭ Cute Hoor


    DM1983 wrote: »
    Has anyone on here gone through a 5 year cycle yet??? How did it perform?

    Yea, I've gone through a few cycles, all did OK so far, touch wood, can be minor delays getting your money out at the end but that can be understandable. My investments have all been in individual companies. I've done a few with McKeogh Gallagher Ryan (I'm not batting for them here), and I've found them good to deal with. I've done others as well.


  • Registered Users Posts: 217 ✭✭ DM1983


    Cute Hoor wrote: »
    Yea, I've gone through a few cycles, all did OK so far, touch wood, can be minor delays getting your money out at the end but that can be understandable. My investments have all been in individual companies. I've done a few with McKeogh Gallagher Ryan (I'm not batting for them here), and I've found them good to deal with. I've done others as well.

    Great to hear. So can we say 100% success in "getting out"? That has always been my concern. I know its a revenue approved scheme but some of the blurb associated with it from BVP just screams scam! Could you also say roughly what your average recovery of capital invested has been, tax relief aside? Less than 100%?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,788 ✭✭✭ Cute Hoor


    DM1983 wrote: »
    Great to hear. So can we say 100% success in "getting out"? That has always been my concern. I know its a revenue approved scheme but some of the blurb associated with it from BVP just screams scam! Could you also say roughly what your average recovery of capital invested has been, tax relief aside? Less than 100%?

    So far I've had 100% success in getting out, always with the 100% capital + what was promised extra. I did pick the businesses to invest in myself (windfarms were a favourite) so I don't know anything about BVP. Investing in a group of businesses (as opposed to 1) should give one comfort to safeguard much of your capital investment, the downside is if just one of the group of businesses go belly-up you are automatically partially down on your capital investment.

    This is not without risk obviously, so I wouldn't be encouraging anybody to waste their hard earned. Depends on your risk appetite.


  • Registered Users Posts: 994 ✭✭✭ Curious Geroge


    Cute Hoor wrote: »
    greencrowd.ie
    solarstream.ie (I think you can invest directly with solarstream which would probably mean less fees than if you invested via greencrowd)
    patientmpower.com
    pureirishice.ie (have already raised €530k of the €600k they plan to raise as per yesterday's SBP)

    I'm not batting for any or all of the above.

    There will most likely be more in the SBP EIIS special being published in the SBP on 22nd November, might be worth waiting for that

    Is there somewhere that lists the available schemes ?
    Cute Hoor wrote: »
    You invest €10,000 in an EIIS scheme in November/December 2020 - it is important that this €10,000 is 2020 income that has been taxed at 40%.
    You do your tax returns for 2020 in January 2021 or whenever you can, and you will be allowed the first 30% tax relief - so you will get €3,000 back from Revenue.
    When you are doing your 2024 tax returns you will be allowed the additional 10% tax relief - so you will get a further €1,000 back from Revenue.

    You will hopefully get your original €10,000 investment back plus a little bonus after 5 years approx

    Not to get personal but if a bonus comes back with the original investment, what typical % could you see ?

    Is it correct to assume that the max investment would be whatever you have paid at the top rate of tax in the year (assuming paye worker) ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,788 ✭✭✭ Cute Hoor


    Is there somewhere that lists the available schemes ?



    Not to get personal but if a bonus comes back with the original investment, what typical % could you see ?

    Is it correct to assume that the max investment would be whatever you have paid at the top rate of tax in the year (assuming paye worker) ?

    I don't think there is anywhere you can get a list of them, so this is the list of ones that I can find, all taken from SBP over the last couple of weeks
    greencrowd.ie
    patientmpower.com
    pureirishice.ie (have already raised €530k of the €600k they plan to raise as per SBP of a few weeks ago)
    Davy EIIS Fund
    Spark Crowdfunding
    Neighbouroo
    Moby
    Dairy Concepts
    Kinsale Spirit Co
    Brampton Care Home
    Zero Recycling
    Velo Coffee Roasters
    Sensibin
    Emex/Blackbee

    The payment on exit will be set at investment time, generally speaking it is capped at 110% / 115%. When you think about it this is very cheap money for the business, they are getting your money for 4/5 years and are only paying 10/15% interest, and no money is paid by them until the end of the investment.

    Yea ideally you only want to be investing the element of your income that you paid 40% tax on, I think you can spread your investment across a couple of tax years but not sure how that works, I have never done that.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,564 ✭✭✭ One More Toy


    Cute Hoor wrote: »
    I don't think there is anywhere you can get a list of them, so this is the list of ones that I can find, all taken from SBP over the last couple of weeks
    greencrowd.ie
    patientmpower.com
    pureirishice.ie (have already raised €530k of the €600k they plan to raise as per SBP of a few weeks ago)
    Davy EIIS Fund
    Spark Crowdfunding
    Neighbouroo
    Moby
    Dairy Concepts
    Kinsale Spirit Co
    Brampton Care Home
    Zero Recycling
    Velo Coffee Roasters
    Sensibin
    Emex/Blackbee

    The payment on exit will be set at investment time, generally speaking it is capped at 110% / 115%. When you think about it this is very cheap money for the business, they are getting your money for 4/5 years and are only paying 10/15% interest, and no money is paid by them until the end of the investment.

    Yea ideally you only want to be investing the element of your income that you paid 40% tax on, I think you can spread your investment across a couple of tax years but not sure how that works, I have never done that.

    Yeah I'm gonna give it a miss this year as I have little income in the higher bracket due to illness and pension contributions


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