Dairy farm worker

Mrtm17

ruwithme wrote: »

poorer than it was pre covid I'd say. have noticed alot of lads advertising themselves available for work on donedeal with a focus on dairying in recent months.
€10 ahour nett if your familiar with dairy farming and thats with someone who knows the value of another's labour.

That is very low,not many could settle for that

Bass Reeves

kerryjack wrote: »

Ya starting out its low paid, but there is opportunities now to herd share or maybe rent your own place. Would I advise my own kids to do it, No way you would be mad.

Herd shares are few and far between in Ireland. Tax free leasing is too attractive. This catches you again leasing as people leasing longterm pay the PRSI and USC if applicable whether rentis received or not. Therefore they tend to lease to established farm businesses. I never see working for a minimum wage in any industry as a chance to advance significantly in that industry

My miwadi

Stan27 wrote: »

Seen a few job advertisements, farmers looking for lads for 39 hours a week for 22k a year. No wonder farmers cant get good labour.

Its absolutely mad. Theres one place in wexford that supplys labour to dairy farmers and he is fleasing the workers paying noting and charging the farmer top rates and sending in someone who is just starting out. Its no wonder it never works out for both partys.. I really cant understand how he is still in business to be honest. Has other ventires too. He had resorted to bringing in workers from the phillipines before covid the poor phillipine lads are coming in expecting to be treated well and are just been taken advantage of.

ruwithme

Some seem surprised at €10 a hour nett pay to a employee on a dairy farm. Nett pay that is,so obviously more than that with various taxes paid on your part by the employer.

I don't doubt lots of farmers pay staff more than that. Unfortunately though i see any amount of so called unskilled jobs on indeed.com advertised at €10 a hour gross pay and a short list of demands for a employee

Bass Reeves

ruwithme wrote: »

Some seem surprised at €10 a hour nett pay to a employee on a dairy farm. Nett pay that is,so obviously more than that with various taxes paid on your part by the employer.

I don't doubt lots of farmers pay staff more than that. Unfortunately though i see any amount of so called unskilled jobs on indeed.com advertised at €10 a hour gross pay and a short list of demands for a employee

The difference between net and gross pay at that rate is minimal. A gross pay of 22k is 10.75/hour, a net pay of 9.8/hour. Ya milking cows is unskilled work. But there is a lot more virtual minimum paid jobs which are a lot easier to do.

Jjameson

Speaking anecdotally in my own part of the country the guys looking for full time help are always looking for full time help as nobody stays with them. Wages, hours and the expectation to be as motivated as the farmer (who always has his eye on his neighbours acre! Or a new machine or whatever gives him his endorphin rush!)

Bass Reeves

Jjameson wrote: »

Speaking anecdotally in my own part of the country the guys looking for full time help are always looking for full time help as nobody stays with them. Wages, hours and the expectation to be as motivated as the farmer (who always has his eye on his neighbours acre! Or a new machine or whatever gives him his endorphin rush!)

I think this is the nub if it. A farmer that does not drink or smoke, works 70-100 hours a week expect Joe Soap who is a minimum paid worker to not take a smoking break not to arrive hung over in the morning, not to take it easy going to bring in the cows or mending that fence. He expecting to get a lads who's a good unskilled worker, but that lad is working for Jimmy the builder or plant hire man for 13-15 euro/your.

My son who is in college was getting 10.5/ hour part time in a pub restaurant and if he had been fulltime he be on 12/hour or more. He be getting 30-40/week in tips if fulltime as well. With tip that is 11.5/hour net. That person is in out of the cd and wet. He is not in a freezing cold milking parlour in February and March. Every evening he comes home he is not rushing into the shower. He is not getting into cold damp clothes every morning for 3-4 months of the year.

kerryjack

Tips the only tips you can expect on a dairy farm is a tip of a dirty tail across the face.

davidk1394

Jjameson wrote: »

Speaking anecdotally in my own part of the country the guys looking for full time help are always looking for full time help as nobody stays with them. Wages, hours and the expectation to be as motivated as the farmer (who always has his eye on his neighbours acre! Or a new machine or whatever gives him his endorphin rush!)

Same story around here. The lads who have the big numbers of cows find it difficult to find and keep good workers. No employee is going to work as hard as the farmer.

Bass Reeves

davidk1394 wrote: »

Same story around here. The lads who have the big numbers of cows find it difficult to find and keep good workers. No employee is going to work as hard as the farmer.

When you are fishing at the bottom of the barrel you take what you get. This was another FJ/Teagasc miscalculation. They never factored in farm labour like the calves senario. One of theories was that where there was accomodation available (especially on second and third milking platforms) that these farms would employ couples from Eastern Europe and pay the minimum wage. This was to get around working hours legislation. However any couple that were any good exited when there English was good enough if not before when they got the lie of the land.

Another trick was to call them farm managers and pay them a slightly higher salary but expect them to work 50 hours+ a week

Any lad any good is gone elsewhere after a while especially when the economy lifted

Mooooo

Depends on experience really. A lad coming in, possibly his/ her first job may require a bit of training in a share of tasks as well as needing to build up experience as time goes on in the farmers presence may start on minimum wage fine, but if you're looking to hold on to them for any period of time more will have to be paid eventually. When I was a young fella I started at 15/ 16 yrs old on 3 pounds an hour in petrol stations and supermarkets, with short shifts which was a bollox as couldn't get hours up to make anything by the time I was in college euros were in a year or two and I had worked on sites and in grain yards where you could put in the hours to make a few bob and the last two summers were in a plant where I was a 10er an hour but could work away up to 80 hours a week with time and a half on weekends.

Students might be ok on minimum wage once they can work the hours up and won't be taxed but full time work would have to be more than that. Have a lad working between here and the neighbours here but not a hope would either of us afford a fulltime person. At 124 cows here, even if I get to the 150 which would be a medium term target anyway i wouldn't afford a fulltime person along with the other costs of running the farm

popa smurf

I don't see milking as hard work or feeding calves, is it skilled I don't think so, I think you could pick it up in a few weeks, maybe they should be a campaign to get lads off the dole and take up these jobs. I worked on a lot of farms when I was a young man on my travels and can honestly say I never met a bad one, always got paid up and well fed. Now the building game is a different story, met some thick foremen in my time the ticker the better at that game.

Jjameson

popa smurf wrote: »

I don't see milking as hard work or feeding calves, is it skilled I don't think so, I think you could pick it up in a few weeks, maybe they should be a campaign to get lads off the dole and take up these jobs. I worked on a lot of farms when I was a young man on my travels and can honestly say I never met a bad one, always got paid up and well fed. Now the building game is a different story, met some thick foremen in my time the ticker the better at that game.

So a thicko can rise to foreman in the building trade but work for a dairy farmer is “unskilled”..

1373

popa smurf wrote: »

I don't see milking as hard work or feeding calves, is it skilled I don't think so, I think you could pick it up in a few weeks, maybe they should be a campaign to get lads off the dole and take up these jobs. I worked on a lot of farms when I was a young man on my travels and can honestly say I never met a bad one, always got paid up and well fed. Now the building game is a different story, met some thick foremen in my time the ticker the better at that game.

It’s a very skilled job if you’re into doing it well

popa smurf

1373 wrote: »

It’s a very skilled job if you’re into doing it well

Are we talking about milking cows or farm management

Timmaay

Mooooo wrote: »

Depends on experience really. A lad coming in, possibly his/ her first job may require a bit of training in a share of tasks as well as needing to build up experience as time goes on in the farmers presence may start on minimum wage fine, but if you're looking to hold on to them for any period of time more will have to be paid eventually. When I was a young fella I started at 15/ 16 yrs old on 3 pounds an hour in petrol stations and supermarkets, with short shifts which was a bollox as couldn't get hours up to make anything by the time I was in college euros were in a year or two and I had worked on sites and in grain yards where you could put in the hours to make a few bob and the last two summers were in a plant where I was a 10er an hour but could work away up to 80 hours a week with time and a half on weekends.

Students might be ok on minimum wage once they can work the hours up and won't be taxed but full time work would have to be more than that. Have a lad working between here and the neighbours here but not a hope would either of us afford a fulltime person. At 124 cows here, even if I get to the 150 which would be a medium term target anyway i wouldn't afford a fulltime person along with the other costs of running the farm

Do many spring calving systems need a fulltime 2nd labour unit anyways? For around here, from after 1st cut until mid Oct and you start winter feeding its mostly just milking and the few jobs like fert/mowing etc. Obviously if your still in expansion mode your going to have alot more work aside from the day to day stuff, but if the farm is largely setup. Personally I'd take 2 extra labour units from feb to April anyday over a fulltime person whole year around.

Mooooo

Timmaay wrote: »

Do many spring calving systems need a fulltime 2nd labour unit anyways? For around here, from after 1st cut until mid Oct and you start winter feeding its mostly just milking and the few jobs like fert/mowing etc. Obviously if your still in expansion mode your going to have alot more work aside from the day to day stuff, but if the farm is largely setup. Personally I'd take 2 extra labour units from feb to April anyday over a fulltime person whole year around.

Fair point, but depending on location part time workers are hard to consistently find, and to hold on to someone full time secure work is needed more often than not. Ideally I'd like to get to the stage where I could employ someone full time, so for the second half of the year or quieter times it would be worked so we both have more time off and or an adapted working week, 4 days on maybe or alternating weekends or options along that vein. Farm needs a fair bit of development tho so not sure I'll get there. We'll see

Mrtm17

How can u pay a lad 10 an hour,u can get 17 or 18 on a building site without any experience

Bass Reeves

Mrtm17 wrote: »

How can u pay a lad 10 an hour,u can get 17 or 18 on a building site without any experience

First off in rural most building sites will not be paying 15/hour. I in a fairly busy rural area. General rate to labourers a n a building site is 15/hour and most would be fairly capable lads. However the real catch is that the hear lads get handed the best of protective clothing and footwear. Proper breaks and canteen facilities. On a lot of jobs there a bit of leaning on the shove time

cute geoge

I would consider a building labourer heavier work then farm labourer .In fairness plenty of good women well capable of farm labourer but have not seen any women levelling conco or on a jack hammer!!!
Although I have heard a few farm relief workers say the work on the bigger dairy farms with 300 cows plus the work is relentless with no time or place for the leaning on the shovel

kerryjack

Mrtm17 wrote: »

How can u pay a lad 10 an hour,u can get 17 or 18 on a building site without any experience

Nothing new on this people have being leaving agriculture and moving on to construction since the time of the Roman's. 10 euro an hour workers don't stay around long and move on.

Grueller

How much an hour does a farmer pay to FRS for a worker?
How much does the worker get fromFRS?
Somewhere in the middle might be a reasonable guide?

kevthegaff

Grueller wrote: »

How much an hour does a farmer pay to FRS for a worker?
How much does the worker get fromFRS?
Somewhere in the middle might be a reasonable guide?

could be about 18euro an hour

Grueller

kevthegaff wrote: »

could be about 18euro an hour

I assume to FRS, so worker probably on €12ish.
€14 or so would seem fair then.

Mf310

20 year old here been working and relief milking on dairy farms since I was 16 and the wage is still more or less the same since 10/hour for part time work 40€/milking and 50€/milking for a sunday .. happy enough with that but wouldnt do dairy work full time for 10/hour anymore and no farmer wants to give any over it really. Working for a tillage farmer for the last 2 summers @ 12/hour. Any of these lads with second units or completely relying on labour are going to have to allow the worker bring in their own stock and have some sort of a share farming agreement in it to keep the worker motivated to stay because if not the worker is really only one phone call from leaving at any time.

Bass Reeves

Grueller wrote: »

I assume to FRS, so worker probably on €12ish.
€14 or so would seem fair then.

If FRS is getting 18/hour worker would be 12tops if not minimum wage. FRS have to pay employer PRSI, bank holiday and holiday pay out of that. It equivalent to over 30% on top of basic hourly rate . As well any safety training such as safepass has to be paid by FRS

Grueller

Bass Reeves wrote: »

If FRS is getting 18/hour worker would be 12tops if not minimum wage. FRS have to pay employer PRSI, bank holiday and holiday pay out of that. It equivalent to over 30% on top of basic hourly rate . As well any safety training such as safepass has to be paid by FRS

Agreed but I am talking a worker directly employed by the farmer

kevthegaff

Bass Reeves wrote: »

If FRS is getting 18/hour worker would be 12tops if not minimum wage. FRS have to pay employer PRSI, bank holiday and holiday pay out of that. It equivalent to over 30% on top of basic hourly rate . As well any safety training such as safepass has to be paid by FRS

Had a lad drawing bales for 10 hrs and I think it was 180 iirc.

ruwithme

I reckon if i was dairy farming and looked for a worker in the morning,paying €10 a hour i,de have me pick of lads and maybe lassies.

It's the way things are for now anyway. Our countries full of youth,keen to work and maybe learn something too.

Maybe our region is lucky in that. Look at the marts. They have plenty of help,mainly young help,and thats only odd days a week

I doubt the marts are paying much more than €10 ahour

kerry cow

pay gross , not net .

a person tax is their own affair .