Kona 11kW charger

mp3guy

Alright, plugged into a 43kW AC charger and lo and behold, 11kW pulled! Now to bring the evidence to the dealer to give me the proper cable.

JPA

I hope they sort you out but I they don't think they will. Your car is 11kw capable, that might be their arguement.

LeBash

My guess is the single phase cable works everywhere and you're on your own if you want a 3 phase but the car is capable of using it.

I'm raging. Have a Kona and a twin 22kw charger in work. Manual says empty the tank once per month and recharge to full but I'd say it would knock 3-4 hours which would probably be a working day and no in early followed by hanging around after.

Might have a look and see what they'll offer as a trade in.

mp3guy

mp3guy wrote: »

Alright, plugged into a 43kW AC charger and lo and behold, 11kW pulled! Now to bring the evidence to the dealer to give me the proper cable.

Not sure the dealer can do anything if Hyundai supply a single phase lead.

BMW also only supply a single phase lead with the i3.

JPA

LeBash wrote: »

My guess is the single phase cable works everywhere and you're on your own if you want a 3 phase but the car is capable of using it.

I'm raging. Have a Kona and a twin 22kw charger in work. Manual says empty the tank once per month and recharge to full but I'd say it would knock 3-4 hours which would probably be a working day and no in early followed by hanging around after.

Might have a look and see what they'll offer as a trade in.

Or get the 3 phase cable. What am I missing?

mp3guy

JPA wrote: »

I hope they sort you out but I they don't think they will. Your car is 11kw capable, that might be their arguement.

LeBash wrote: »

My guess is the single phase cable works everywhere and you're on your own if you want a 3 phase but the car is capable of using it.

I don't see this floating. Why not just give me a 3.6kW 16A cable then? Car is 7kW and 11kW capable, not their problem? It's a key feature on the new model. Definitely going to push them on it.

Deleted User wrote: »

Not sure the dealer can do anything if Hyundai supply a single phase lead.

At a minimum take it all the way back to HQ and give me their best excuse which I can tell them isn't good enough.

Even so, I would be surprised if they ponied up a proper cable, but that doesn't mean I can't let them understand just how wrong their current offering is before moving on.

mp3guy

KCross wrote: »

My guess is that the car isn’t 3ph enabled and hence a different cable won’t help you. It’s pulling that 11kW from one phase of the 43kW charger based on the pic you posted earlier.

If I were you I’d confirm that first before going back to the dealer. Get a loan of a 3ph 32A cable and plug it into an eCars 22kW charge point. My guess is that you’ll get 7.4kW, not 11kW.

This is definitely one other possibility. There are no 50A type 2 charge points though is there? So it would make the on board charger upgrade useless, besides at 43kW AC chargers.

Even still, an (albeit much weaker) argument to be made as to why I'm only provided a 32A cable for a 50A charger.

<edit> Looks like the post I quoted disappeared, or my browser messed up.

krissovo

LeBash wrote: »

I'm raging. Have a Kona and a twin 22kw charger in work. Manual says empty the tank once per month and recharge to full but I'd say it would knock 3-4 hours which would probably be a working day and no in early followed by hanging around after.

I thought general best practice for EV's is to charge at 7kw to normalise the battery and not at a faster speed.

krissovo

krissovo wrote: »

I thought general best practice for EV's is to charge at 7kw to normalise the battery and not at a faster speed.

Charging at 11 Kw is nothing to the battery, charging it at 70 kw is not bad for an almost 70 Kwh battery also.

Remember it can regen at 144 Kw ( as observed in the e-soul, this is the same battery,motor etc in the Kona) or possibly more going down a steep hill at speed.

The battery won't really need to balance if it's not taken to very low %. Li batteries stay pretty well balanced unless there are weak cells and/or it runs to a low charge %.

ELM327

mp3guy wrote: »

This is definitely one other possibility. There are no 50A type 2 charge points though is there? So it would make the on board charger upgrade useless, besides at 43kW AC chargers.

Even still, an (albeit much weaker) argument to be made as to why I'm only provided a 32A cable for a 50A charger.

<edit> Looks like the post I quoted disappeared, or my browser messed up.

It's not a possibility
No car sold in the EU charges at more than 32a on single phase.
If you're getting 11kW it's 16a three phase.


It is not possible to charge at higher than 32a single phase in the EU spec cars without doing some wizardry.

mp3guy

Update: Dealer got back to me after I emailed all the info off to him yesterday and admitted I was completely correct and they've a new cable for me to collect later this afternoon. Happy days! Depending on what cable they give me.

It's really bizarre they would stick a 50 amp sticker on the charger.

Shame they won't supply a 3 phase cable that's just mean, 3 phase leads are not cheap having said that I would not part with my 3 phase lead in a hurry, charging at 11 Kw makes a big difference the only issue we have now is that the AC points are much busier and there are lots more PHEV on the road with tiny batteries addicted to charge points.

The ESB plan to upgrade AC points but I'm not so sure about installing more, I saw last week Blanch AC has been upgraded, that was always dodgy but why couldn't they install 2 AC points ? or even 6 or 7 ? they would be all used, that's a very busy spot.

mp3guy

mp3guy wrote: »

Update: Dealer got back to me after I emailed all the info off to him yesterday and admitted I was completely correct and they've a new cable for me to collect later this afternoon. Happy days! Depending on what cable they give me.

Well there's a result, well done mate, I'm delighted, BMW basically told me to get stuffed !

KCross

mp3guy wrote: »

Update: Dealer got back to me after I emailed all the info off to him yesterday and admitted I was completely correct and they've a new cable for me to collect later this afternoon. Happy days! Depending on what cable they give me.

Cool, interesting that they have the cable ready to go for you. I would have thought the cable was put in at manufacturing time rather than something done by the dealer.

So I guess your earlier picture means it can handle 70-285V per phase rather than its total across the 3 phases. So, its a 3ph charger with a max of 50A.

Ideally you want them to give you a 32A 3ph cable. They might give you a 16A cable which will give you 11kW on 3ph but will only give you 3.6kW on 1ph at home. The cable should be clearly marked.

ELM327

Deleted User wrote: »

It's really bizarre they would stick a 50 amp sticker on the charger.

Shame they won't supply a 3 phase cable that's just mean, 3 phase leads are not cheap having said that I would not part with my 3 phase lead in a hurry, charging at 11 Kw makes a big difference the only issue we have now is that the AC points are much busier and there are lots more PHEV on the road with tiny batteries addicted to charge points.

The ESB plan to upgrade AC points but I'm not so sure about installing more, I saw last week Blanch AC has been upgraded, that was always dodgy but why couldn't they install 2 AC points ? or even 6 or 7 ? they would be all used, that's a very busy spot.

I've said it for ages, they should put 22kW DC chargers at blanch, a bank of 6-7 as you say

mp3guy

Deleted User wrote: »

Well there's a result, well done mate, I'm delighted, BMW basically told me to get stuffed !

What a piss take. Wouldn't stand for that myself, rotten customer service.

KCross wrote: »

Cool, interesting that they have the cable ready to go for you. I would have thought the cable was put in at manufacturing time rather than something done by the dealer.

So I guess your earlier picture means it can handle 70-285V per phase rather than its total across the 3 phases. So, its a 3ph charger with a max of 50A.

Ideally you want them to give you a 32A 3ph cable. They might give you a 16A cable which will give you 11kW on 3ph but will only give you 3.6kW on 1ph at home. The cable should be clearly marked.

Yeah I'll be on the look out for this when I collect it. He said he had a chat with their EV technician on site in the workshop and he agreed I was correct so I'm assuming he understands this.

ELM327

ELM327 wrote: »

I've said it for ages, they should put 22kW DC chargers at blanch, a bank of 6-7 as you say

Even better but would likely cost a lot more.

ELM327

Deleted User wrote: »

Even better but would likely cost a lot more.

Not really, 22kW DC is surprisingly cheap once you have the power in.
Also, they could charge for it.

alanowx

Forgive my ignorance here but if car charge socket has actual pins - as opposed to blank openings - in the lower 2 of the 7, L2 & L3 in the photo, can one then assume that the car is 3 phase compatible. (Not referring here to the very bottom 2 pins for DC CCS charging).

Likewise would this logic also apply to the cable.


Image and data below taken from this webpage
https://evcables.co.uk/index.php/3-phase-euro-series-charging-cable-type-2-to-type-2.html



Thanks

mp3guy

alanowx wrote: »

Forgive my ignorance here but if car charge socket has actual pins - as opposed to blank openings - in the lower 2 of the 7, L2 & L3 in the photo, can one then assume that the car is 3 phase compatible. (Not referring here to the very bottom 2 pins for DC CCS charging).

Likewise would this logic also apply to the cable.

Image and data below taken from this webpage
https://evcables.co.uk/index.php/3-phase-euro-series-charging-cable-type-2-to-type-2.html


Thanks

This was another hunch I had it was 3 phase, but honestly the entire thing is so opaque I had to go through all this hassle to check. Nothing Hyundai official online, in the manual or under the hood actually says it's 3 phase definitively. Would it be that difficult for them to even print it on the OBC?

ELM327

ELM327 wrote: »

Not really, 22kW DC is surprisingly cheap once you have the power in.
Also, they could charge for it.

Seems mad they wouldn't do it then.

I think the lower powered DC chargers that I have seen are 20 Kw and CCS only so that might be 1 reason but they might have ChaDeMo and CCS 20 KW chargers these days I don't know.

1 AC and 1 DC point in Blanch is a disgrace really. There should be 4 or 5 DC chargers there at this stage. On Saturday when I went to use it it was down.

liamog

The perfect shopping centre charger

https://electricmobility.efacec.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/CS168I1311F1_QC20.pdf

I'd configure it as CCS, CHAdeMO and AC22 socket. Same input requirement (2x22kVA) as the current 2xAC22 sockets ESB are currently using for AC supply.

alanowx

mp3guy wrote: »

This was another hunch I had it was 3 phase, but honestly the entire thing is so opaque I had to go through all this hassle to check. Nothing Hyundai official online, in the manual or under the hood actually says it's 3 phase definitively. Would it be that difficult for them to even print it on the OBC?

I don't own an EV but always willing to expand my knowledge. Seen alot Of you tube EV reviews some with close-ups of charge socket and noticed empty pins for those L2 & L3 spots in most cases.

ELM327

liamog wrote: »

The perfect shopping centre charger

https://electricmobility.efacec.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/CS168I1311F1_QC20.pdf

I'd configure it as CCS, CHAdeMO and AC22 socket. Same input requirement (2x22kVA) as the current 2xAC22 sockets ESB are currently using for AC supply.

Do you know how to get prices for these?
I want to ask facilities in work about upgrading our 3*22kW chargers to these.

mp3guy

Alright to close out I swapped cables at the dealer (see attached), went to a 22kW ecars station and it pulled 11kW! No problems, case closed. Hopefully this thread is useful to any one else who has a similar problem.

Nice one, I hope the dealer reports this to Hyundai Ireland and supply a 3 phase lead with all 11 Kw Konas.

KCross

Good that they also gave you a 32A 3ph cable.... you have the best of all worlds with that.

Kramer

KCross wrote: »

Good that they also gave you a 32A 3ph cable.... you have the best of all worlds with that.

The only issue is many 3ph cables are very unwieldy with the extra conductors.
No issue if using a tethered home charge point but I'd rather be using a single phase 32a cable at home.
When we got the Ioniq, Hyundai Ireland hadn't sent out any Type 2 cables (they hadn't apparently received them). We were loaned a 3ph 32a cable & it was as thick as my wrist & stiff as a poker (the cable ).

This also indicates Hyundai don't ship the cables with the cars but they are issued separately, probably depending on location.

Glad it's resolved for the op & well wear .

highdef

For the record, I've a 2020 Kona premium for a few days, courtesy of Hyundai. Currently plugged into the 22kw AC on Street charger outside crumlin Garda station using the supplied cable and I'm currently pulling 11kw so hopefully the OP's issue was just a one off!