Greta Thunberg (Continued...)

Thelonious Monk

Eric Cartman wrote: »

yeah stopping me driving my fleet of V8 powered cars around the city isn't going to help in real terms, nor were paper straws, a carbon tax etc..

the solution needs to be carrot based for Europe, stick based for Africa and Asia.

An African hardly pollutes at all compared to your average Irish person, so you can't lay the blame on them. Rich countries like Ireland fuel dirty industry in China etc too. Irish people pollute more than Chinese per capita .
It's a global problem.
Governments can't implement the measures actually needed because they'll lose votes - it might help if they stopped everyone from driving V8 cars yes, worldwide. But less cars in our cities, and certainly less SUVs and smaller engines, would mean cleaner air in Ireland too.

You needn't worry, as I said they can't get real on this or they wont get voted in, in any country. I just think it's mad that we're doing absolutely nothing about global warming and the destruction of the Earth through industry and farming etc. We need to slow down.

Tell me how

Eric Cartman wrote: »

yeah stopping me driving my fleet of V8 powered cars around the city isn't going to help in real terms, nor were paper straws, a carbon tax etc..

the solution needs to be carrot based for Europe, stick based for Africa and Asia.

This doesn't surprise me. At all. Not in the slightest.

Eric Cartman

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

An African hardly pollutes at all compared to your average Irish person, so you can't lay the blame on them. Rich countries like Ireland fuel dirty industry in China etc too. Irish people pollute more than Chinese per capita .
It's a global problem.
Governments can't implement the measures actually needed because they'll lose votes - it might help if they stopped everyone from driving V8 cars yes, worldwide. But less cars in our cities, and certainly less SUVs and smaller engines, would mean cleaner air in Ireland too.

You needn't worry, as I said they can't get real on this or they wont get voted in, in any country. I just think it's mad that we're doing absolutely nothing about global warming and the destruction of the Earth through industry and farming etc. We need to slow down.

if we impoverished millions of people in rural Ireland we'd have a lower output too, but in urban centres and water and air quality, African and asian countries are far worse and need to be sanctioned into improving.

Eric Cartman

Tell me how wrote: »

This doesn't surprise me. At all. Not in the slightest.

it doesn't surprise me that you went straight to the race angle in your head, nothing to do with that, stop your nonsense.

Tell me how

Eric Cartman wrote: »

it doesn't surprise me that you went straight to the race angle in your head, nothing to do with that, stop your nonsense.

I'm sorry for forming an opinion based on the posts you make across several threads across several years. My bad.

Thelonious Monk

Eric Cartman wrote: »

if we impoverished millions of people in rural Ireland we'd have a lower output too, but in urban centres and water and air quality, African and asian countries are far worse and need to be sanctioned into improving.

Water quality in Ireland has been deteriorating fast in the last 10 years or so, look it up, not many of our waterways are pristine any more.
Typical of you anyway to just try and blame poor people.

Eric Cartman

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Water quality in Ireland has been deteriorating fast in the last 10 years or so, look it up, not many of our waterways are pristine any more.
Typical of you anyway to just try and blame poor people.

Rich countries and rich people have cleaned up their act by miles, time for the others to do their bit instead of just oppressing westerners.

Thelonious Monk

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Rich countries and rich people have cleaned up their act by miles, time for the others to do their bit instead of just oppressing westerners.

lol no they haven't. Rich countries are the ones consuming everything and buying all the things. Private jets, cheap flights, developing every piece of land, importing everything from all over the world, industrial fishing, oil spills...
How has Ireland cleaned up its act if environmentally it's a much worse place than it was 50 years ago?

This was published today - https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/living/2021/0114/1189641-where-have-all-the-farmland-birds-gone/

If you actually believe what you're typing you've got problems.

gozunda

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Rich countries and rich people have cleaned up their act by miles, time for the others to do their bit instead of just oppressing westerners.

You are quite correct. This shows the decline
In green house gas emissions in the EU



It remains China is the single biggest emitter of ghgs globally and their emissions are continuing to rise

Greenhouse gas emissions by China are the largest of any country in the world both in production and consumption terms, and stem mainly from coal electricity generation and mining. When measuring production-based emissions, China emitted over 12 gigatonnes (Gt) CO2eq of greenhouse gases in 2014; almost 30% of the world total. This corresponds to over 7 tonnes CO2eq emitted per person each year, slightly over the world average and the EU average 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenhouse_gas_emissions_by_China

Many of our trans-migratory birds no longer reach our shores due to African land cover changes that are key to the population declines of many such species over recent decades.

Some species such as swallow are netted in a number of North African counties whilst flying to European breeding grounds. With they result that our populations of these birds are declining each year

https://www.cms.int/en/page/bird-trapping-egypt-and-libya

For sure Europe has significant environmental problems with intensive production, vast areas of urban spread and pressures from food production and industrialisation which has seen many habitats in decline.

Population density is also another issue which places huge presures on developed and developing countries. With Europe, China, Asia etc being some of the most densely populated areas globally



It would appear to be part of the currently fashionable colonial guilt popularised by some environmental politics which are failing to recognise the global nature of these issues.

Tell me how

And therein is the problem.
Some people here are the sort to pull the ladder up after they have gotten in the life boat.
They use it as an excuse to absolve themselves from action so that the life they have grown accustomed to doesn't have to change.

tabby aspreme

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

This was published today - https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/living/2021/0114/1189641-where-have-all-the-farmland-birds-gone/

I would agree farm bird population has dropped, what I have noticed here is a scarcity of crows, pheasants, and the snipe that were here as long as I can remember, are gone recently, despite an increase in cover for them, the arrival of two families of buzzards may have something to do with that. That RTE report is there usual poorly researched lazy crap, Barn Owls do NOT nest in hedgerows

Eric Cartman

Tell me how wrote: »

And therein is the problem.
Some people here are the sort to pull the ladder up after they have gotten in the life boat.
They use it as an excuse to absolve themselves from action so that the life they have grown accustomed to doesn't have to change.

well if the planet is going to suffer if everyone continues progressing then pulling the ladder is fairer than forcing those accustomed to higher standards to drop their quality of life.

The climate crisis can be solved by improving the way we have our standards of living e.g nuclear power, the option of electric cars etc.. plant based foods side by side with real meat. But the option shouldn't have to be forced or our standard of living dropped.

and yet again, Europe has made so many changes already, its diminishing returns for us to continue progress without dragging the rest of the world to an acceptable level of progress.

Tell me how

tabby aspreme wrote: »

I would agree farm bird population has dropped, what I have noticed here is a scarcity of crows, pheasants, and the snipe that were here as long as I can remember, are gone recently, despite an increase in cover for them, the arrival of two families of buzzards may have something to do with that. That RTE report is there usual poorly researched lazy crap, Barn Owls do NOT nest in hedgerows

Would the thoughts of Bird Watch Ireland be to your required standard?

Link

Barn Owl is a Red-listed Bird of Conservation Concern in Ireland and its populations have declined dramatically, largely due to land use changes and the intensification of agriculture, which has caused the reduction in the extent and quality of habitats available to it.

Retr0gamer

Greenhouse gases might be on the decline in Europe but it's only because we now depend on China and the likes for cheap labour and manufacturing. Greenhouse gas production has just transferred from europe to these countries and the net result is more greenhouse gases are being produced to feed the developed world's lust for cheap consumer goods.

Potatoeman

Germany is shutting its nuclear and fossil power plants to reduce its emissions but they are piping in gas from Russia. Not exactly a sustainable plan. They want us to reduce our cattle herd most of which is exported, so were not exactly eating all this beef. Is it just me or is this simply Germany passing the ball to someone else rather than a sustainable solution?

Tell me how

Eric Cartman wrote: »

well if the planet is going to suffer if everyone continues progressing then pulling the ladder is fairer than forcing those accustomed to higher standards to drop their quality of life.

The climate crisis can be solved by improving the way we have our standards of living e.g nuclear power, the option of electric cars etc.. plant based foods side by side with real meat. But the option shouldn't have to be forced or our standard of living dropped.

and yet again, Europe has made so many changes already, its diminishing returns for us to continue progress without dragging the rest of the world to an acceptable level of progress.

It is if you are willing to admit you are motivated primarily by selfish desires.

Eric Cartman

Potatoeman wrote: »

Germany is shutting its nuclear and fossil power plants to reduce its emissions but they are piping in gas from Russia. Not exactly a sustainable plan. They want us to reduce our cattle herd most of which is exported, so were not exactly eating all this beef. Is it just me or is this simply Germany passing the ball to someone else rather than a sustainable solution?

every solution has really been passing the buck on. We realistically need a massive strategy of interconnected EU power grids and nuclear power and pumped storage to offset demand spikes when renewables can't supply.

Nobody wants to discuss this, only more taxes and less cars.
The beef industry is being rode roughshod by the left who have all become obsessed with killing meat consumption, its a red herring in emissions.

Thelonious Monk

Potatoeman wrote: »

Germany is shutting its nuclear and fossil power plants to reduce its emissions but they are piping in gas from Russia. Not exactly a sustainable plan. They want us to reduce our cattle herd most of which is exported, so were not exactly eating all this beef. Is it just me or is this simply Germany passing the ball to someone else rather than a sustainable solution?

Does it matter who's eating it? It's still being produced here.

Tell me how

Tell me how wrote: »

Would the thoughts of Bird Watch Ireland be to your required standard?

Link

That's old. I saw last week on the 6 news barn owls are recovering in tremendous numbers in Ireland

Tell me how

Deleted User wrote: »

That's old. I saw last week on the 6 news barn owls are recovering in tremendous numbers in Ireland

Well according to Tabby Asperme, RTE is usual poorly researched lazy crap.

Don't think a report from less than 18 months ago could be considered 'old' in the context of bird population figures which are usually measured over decades rather than months or years.

gozunda

Tell me how wrote: »

And therein is the problem.
Some people here are the sort to pull the ladder up after they have gotten in the life boat.
They use it as an excuse to absolve themselves from action so that the life they have grown accustomed to doesn't have to change.

The only one going around in boats seems to be greta et al.

But I suppose Its easier to select those politically expedient to blame and ignore everything else.

However looking at the issue in its totality - doesn't excuse anyone and that's the thing....

tabby aspreme

Tell me how wrote: »

Would the thoughts of Bird Watch Ireland be to your required standard?

Link

Yes I agree, bird population is in decline, I'm a subscriber to Birdwatch, I even have a Barn Owl box in a shed for the past 15 years, the widespread use of rat poison is probably the greatest reason for the decline of Barn Owls. My point still stands, Barn owls do not nest in hedgerows, it's lazy journalism by RTE

gozunda

Retr0gamer wrote: »

Greenhouse gases might be on the decline in Europe but it's only because we now depend on China and the likes for cheap labour and manufacturing. Greenhouse gas production has just transferred from europe to these countries and the net result is more greenhouse gases are being produced to feed the developed world's lust for cheap consumer goods.

Two sides to that. If China didn't push out cheap tat and aggressively market it - then people couldn't buy it. If I had a cent for every 'Wish' or Alibaba online webpage promotion I'd be rich.

The things is - it's not just Chinas export trade which is dependent on fossil fuels
A significant amount of Chinas greenhouse gas emissions come from both domestic production and consumption of goods and services produced using coal dependent electricity generation

nolivesmatter

I see her last tweet says 'School strike week 126'. Fridays off school for 2.5 years, yeah I'd have been trying to 'save the world' too if I was still in school.

gmisk

nolivesmatter wrote: »

I see her last tweet says 'School strike week 126'. Fridays off school for 2.5 years, yeah I'd have been trying to 'save the world' too if I was still in school.

Is she not 18? Should she not be done with school already?

Tell me how

tabby aspreme wrote: »

Yes I agree, bird population is in decline, I'm a subscriber to Birdwatch, I even have a Barn Owl box in a shed for the past 15 years, the widespread use of rat poison is probably the greatest reason for the decline of Barn Owls. My point still stands, Barn owls do not nest in hedgerows, it's lazy journalism by RTE

Deflect, deflect, deflect.

tabby aspreme

Potatoeman wrote: »

Germany is shutting its nuclear and fossil power plants to reduce its emissions but they are piping in gas from Russia. Not exactly a sustainable plan. They want us to reduce our cattle herd most of which is exported, so were not exactly eating all this beef. Is it just me or is this simply Germany passing the ball to someone else rather than a sustainable solution?

And in return for closing it's Nuclear plants, Germany has ramped up it's open cast mining and burning of highly polluting Lignite, with a new Lignite Power Plant commissioned last year, and will be allowed burn lignite till 2038

Tell me how

gmisk wrote: »

Is she not 18? Should she not be done with school already?

There might just have been something in the news about her taking a year out. Think I heard it mentioned somewhere once or twice.

tabby aspreme

Tell me how wrote: »

Deflect, deflect, deflect.

In what way?

Tell me how

tabby aspreme wrote: »

In what way?

Getting worked up about the specifics of a report rather than its central message of the declining numbers of wildlife species because of human influence.