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Next % to be banned?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,503 ✭✭✭ skyblue46


    KSU wrote: »
    WA have now released the guidelines for going forward

    Highlights:
    -Stack heigh limit- 40mm for shoes, 30mm for spikes
    -No prototype shoes (except for medical reasons)
    -Shoe must be available for 4 months to the public to be used
    -Only one rigid plate allowed in the shoe

    So TUEs will now extend to shoes :P

    So that's the Next% still in the game and the Alphafly in it's proposed guise gone!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,414 ✭✭✭ sideswipe




  • Registered Users Posts: 2,414 ✭✭✭ sideswipe


    skyblue46 wrote: »
    So that's the Next% still in the game and the Alphafly in it's proposed guise gone!

    From runners world:
    Nike Alphafly, a prototype worn by Eliud Kipchoge during his sub-two-hour marathon in Vienna last year, will not be allowed among athletes competing for prizes


  • Registered Users Posts: 943 ✭✭✭ KSU


    sideswipe wrote: »

    I think most people expected the Alphafly to get a pass?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,158 ✭✭✭ and still ricky villa


    sideswipe wrote: »
    From runners world:
    Nike Alphafly, a prototype worn by Eliud Kipchoge during his sub-two-hour marathon in Vienna last year, will not be allowed among athletes competing for prizes

    So, available to the general public for a paltry $500


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,145 ✭✭✭ Ceepo


    KSU wrote: »
    WA have now released the guidelines for going forward

    Highlights:
    -Stack heigh limit- 40mm for shoes, 30mm for spikes
    -No prototype shoes (except for medical reasons)
    -Shoe must be available for 4 months to the public to be used
    -Only one rigid plate allowed in the shoe

    So TUEs will now extend to shoes :P

    Who signs off on the TUE ?? :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,414 ✭✭✭ sideswipe


    KSU wrote: »
    I think most people expected the Alphafly to get a pass?

    Perhaps, personally I didn’t think they would. They had to be seen to do something to stop things getting out of hand even if some believe they already are. No doubt they’ll tweak and rename the alphas now?


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,450 ✭✭✭ Damo 2k9


    KSU wrote: »
    I think most people expected the Alphafly to get a pass?

    Yep including Nike who I presume were waiting to launch it in conjunction with the big race at London. Will be interesting to see what happens with them.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 6,301 Mod ✭✭✭✭ TFBubendorfer


    So, available to the general public for a paltry $500

    They would also have to remove the additional carbon plates


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,503 ✭✭✭ skyblue46


    They would also have to remove the additional carbon plates

    Or they could leave them with 3 plates and a stack height over 40mm. If the last couple of years have proven anything it is that there a very large group of people who are prepared to part with lots of cash to chop free seconds off their PBs...ones who will never have to worry about the 'win prizes' part of the new ruling. :D


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,156 ✭✭✭ Swashbuckler


    skyblue46 wrote:
    Or they could leave them with 3 plates and a stack height over 40mm. If the last couple of years have proven anything it is that there a very large group of people who are prepared to part with lots of cash to chop free seconds off their PBs...ones who will never have to worry about the 'win prizes' part of the new ruling.

    Coz why focus on the 96% when you can get 4% for "free"... (joking)


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,503 ✭✭✭ skyblue46


    Coz why focus on the 96% when you can get 4% for "free"... (joking)

    8% is the suggestion for the Alphafly as designed. I guarantee you they would sell even if not competition legal.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,156 ✭✭✭ Swashbuckler


    skyblue46 wrote:
    8% is the suggestion for the Alphafly as designed. I guarantee you they would sell even if not competition legal.

    I completely agree judging by how many I've seen wearing them.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,450 ✭✭✭ Damo 2k9


    skyblue46 wrote: »
    8% is the suggestion for the Alphafly as designed. I guarantee you they would sell even if not competition legal.

    Have my pre order in already....:pac:


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,503 ✭✭✭ skyblue46


    Damo 2k9 wrote: »
    Have my pre order in already....:pac:

    Yep, the sport now truly is at the mercy of one gigantic sporting brand and its puppet at the head of World Athletics....

    Some people seem to think this is the end of the issue. It's only the start.


  • Registered Users Posts: 777 ✭✭✭ daydorunrun


    Every generation looks over their shoulders and say things like the ‘sport is gone’.

    From coloured football boots to ones that promise a more powerful shot or ability to whip the ball, boots with blade studs that promise ability to turn quicker on the ball.

    Old runners look at the variety of gels and drinks and think ‘in my day we weren’t going on a picnic, we just ran’. Technological advances in all sports happen all the time- golf, tennis, cycling etc Having gloves to play GAA was rare in my day, now they available to all and are like spiderman hands. Never heard of gum shields, you took a whack and either lost a tooth or didn’t things move on.

    The virtue signaling and hyperbole online in relation to the shoes is quite something.

    Anybody can buy any shoe that WA have now deemed acceptable, they have drawn a line in the sand to prevent any further escalation or arms race, do people really think they should/could be banned and all races over the last couple of year be wiped.

    The funny thing is athletics has real problems. These shoes have been a distraction from them. Having said that it’s certainly got more non-negative attention over the last while.

    My only regret about the whole situation is that I didn’t buy shares in Nike.

    “You tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is, never try.” Homer.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,503 ✭✭✭ skyblue46


    Every generation looks over their shoulders and say things like the ‘sport is gone’.

    From coloured football boots to ones that promise a more powerful shot or ability to whip the ball, boots with blade studs that promise ability to turn quicker on the ball.

    Old runners look at the variety of gels and drinks and think ‘in my day we weren’t going on a picnic, we just ran’. Technological advances in all sports happen all the time- golf, tennis, cycling etc Having gloves to play GAA was rare in my day, now they available to all and are like spiderman hands. Never heard of gum shields, you took a whack and either lost a tooth or didn’t things move on.

    The virtue signaling and hyperbole online in relation to the shoes is quite something.

    Anybody can buy any shoe that WA have now deemed acceptable, they have drawn a line in the sand to prevent any further escalation or arms race, do people really think they should/could be banned and all races over the last couple of year be wiped.

    The funny thing is athletics has real problems. These shoes have been a distraction from them. Having said that it’s certainly got more non-negative attention over the last while.

    My only regret about the whole situation is that I didn’t buy shares in Nike.

    Ah yeah blame it on the older generation....you are absolutely so far off the mark I spat out my tea laughing.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,414 ✭✭✭ sideswipe



    Anybody can buy any shoe that WA have now deemed acceptable, they have drawn a line in the sand to prevent any further escalation or arms race, do people really think they should/could be banned and all races over the last couple of year be wiped.

    I agree a full ban would have been impossible, especially in an olympic year. I just wonder if these are indeed 'cheaterflys' as I've seen them referred to how come they were ever allowed in the first place? I mean Nike weren't releasing them stealthily, they were shouting their benefits from the rooftops! Where were WA then?


  • Registered Users Posts: 777 ✭✭✭ daydorunrun


    skyblue46 wrote: »
    Ah yeah blame it on the older generation....you are absolutely so far off the mark I spat out my tea laughing.

    Hope your dentures stayed in, enjoy the Late Late Show:pac:

    “You tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is, never try.” Homer.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,503 ✭✭✭ skyblue46


    sideswipe wrote: »
    I agree a full ban would have been impossible, especially in an olympic year. I just wonder if these are indeed 'cheaterflys' as I've seen them referred to how come they were ever allowed in the first place? I mean Nike weren't releasing them stealthily, they were shouting their benefits from the rooftops! Where were WA then?

    That's the thing. WA didn't do their job. To be honest they still aren't. Today was a total fudge. Why would a total ban have been impossible in Olympic year? Could athletes not just run in different shoes?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 783 ✭✭✭ Lambay island


    skyblue46 wrote: »
    That's the thing. WA didn't do their job. To be honest they still aren't. Today was a total fudge. Why would a total ban have been impossible in Olympic year? Could athletes not just run in different shoes?

    Personally dont think it was impossible but would have opened a bigger can of worms. For example the marathon, you have guys who have qualified for Olympics already using the shoe and you have guys about to run a qualifying race to do the same.
    Do you say to anyone from now who hasn't run their qualifying race - tough luck you cant use same shoes what the others used or do you scrap all results and start from scratch 6 months out?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,503 ✭✭✭ skyblue46


    Personally dont think it was impossible but would have opened a bigger can of worms. For example the marathon, you have guys who have qualified for Olympics already using the shoe and you have guys about to run a qualifying race to do the same.
    Do you say to anyone from now who hasn't run their qualifying race - tough luck you cant use same shoes what the others used or do you scrap all results and start from scratch 6 months out?

    It's messy but the alternative is worse. Has nobody thought down the line on this one?


  • Registered Users Posts: 777 ✭✭✭ daydorunrun


    skyblue46 wrote: »
    It's messy but the alternative is worse. Has nobody thought down the line on this one?


    What are you predicting down the line?


    A retrospective ban would have been some mess recalculating results etc

    I don’t have a problem with the verdict TBH but then again I’m willing to try anything to get where I want to be....legal that is.

    “You tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is, never try.” Homer.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,503 ✭✭✭ skyblue46


    I meant a retrospective ban. Would have been some mess recalculating results etc

    I don’t have a problem with the verdict TBH but then again I’m willing to try anything to get where I want to be....legal that is.

    4% weren't legal for a long time...lots ran in them


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,414 ✭✭✭ sideswipe


    skyblue46 wrote: »
    That's the thing. WA didn't do their job. To be honest they still aren't. Today was a total fudge. Why would a total ban have been impossible in Olympic year? Could athletes not just run in different shoes?

    There would have been people stripped of Olympic qualifying time running in shoes that were legal at the time, it’d be chaos, think legal cases etc.


  • Registered Users Posts: 777 ✭✭✭ daydorunrun


    skyblue46 wrote: »
    4% weren't legal for a long time...lots ran in them

    But sure the tech is available to all companies to use, when all the (free) publicity dies down and other companies catch up things will settle down again.

    “You tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is, never try.” Homer.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,503 ✭✭✭ skyblue46


    But sure the tech is available to all companies to use, when all the (free) publicity dies down and other companies catch up things will settle down again.

    Eh no...Nike have erected a patent ringfence which makes it very difficult for others to catch up...


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,503 ✭✭✭ skyblue46


    sideswipe wrote: »
    There would have been people stripped of Olympic qualifying time running in shoes that were legal at the time, it’d be chaos, think legal cases etc.

    Most were not legal at the time...prototypes were not legal. Nor do shoes released in tranches before being off the market for weeks fall under the category of "reasonably available".


  • Registered Users Posts: 777 ✭✭✭ daydorunrun


    skyblue46 wrote: »
    Eh no...Nike have erected a patent ringfence which makes it very difficult for others to catch up...

    I wasn’t aware of that, I’ve seen Adidas and Brooks with carbon plates? Didn’t Adidas have special ’Boost’ foam before. I’m just finding it hard to understand why it riles you up, I guarantee the others will come up with similar, you may be sure they’ve been furiously working on them for months. I think it has an effect at the top of the field which will balance out in time but I’m not sure why middle aged men and women in bright pink shoes is a big deal.

    “You tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is, never try.” Homer.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,208 ✭✭✭ shotgunmcos


    I've no doubt big shoe companies will speed their prototypes to market in the next 3 months otherwise they miss the Olympics as any new shoes need to have a 4 month shelf life.

    Be good to see other options than bright pink


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