Compulsory retirement and the rise in the State pension age.

noodler

Riskymove wrote: »

whether or not you consider the pay restoration a pay increase is actually immaterial to the basic claim you made about PS pensions

PS pensions were cut and then there was a process of restoration of these cuts, still underway

Likewise PS pay was cut and there was a process of restoration, also still underway


But PS pensions did not benefit from the restoration to PS pay in addition to their own restoration process

This is what you claimed earlier but it is incorrect

Under the PSSA 2018-2020 they certainly did.

You make a point about a specific cohort of pensioners who left using early Incentivewd retirement during the downturn and applying it to all PS pensioners.

You have absolutely not proven that the link between PS pay increases over the 2015-2020 period does not exist.

noodler

2lazytogetup wrote: »

im confused. reading through this thread with all these pension benefits. Pensioners who probably dont have alot of expenses as kids have left the nest, and mortgage paid for. Defined benefit, defined contribution. State pension. Yet are they the most vulnerable in society? Can someone explain.

They are the least vulnerable in society as measured by the at risk of poverty metric published by the CSO SILC.

AndrewJRenko

noodler wrote: »

Under the PSSA 2018-2020 they certainly did.

You make a point about a specific cohort of pensioners who left using early Incentivewd retirement during the downturn and applying it to all PS pensioners.

You have absolutely not proven that the link between PS pay increases over the 2015-2020 period does not exist.

Have you proven that the link between PS pay restorations over 2015-2020 does exist?

The Rape of Lucretia

political analyst wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/0109/1105274-rte-appeal/




How would letting her stay past the age of 65 be unfair to younger colleagues? She would have retired eventually and so the vacancy would still have arisen anyway. What difference would waiting a few more years have made?

The RTE case sounds very weak. What makes 65 special then. Why not argue she should be made retire at 60 ?

marieholmfan

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

The RTE case sounds very weak. What makes 65 special then. Why not argue she should be made retire at 60 ?

She sounds like an unimaginable mediocrity who shnooked herself a cushy job and did no work. 112,000 a year for making programmes that nobody watches.

elperello

marieholmfan wrote: »

She sounds like an unimaginable mediocrity who shnooked herself a cushy job and did no work. 112,000 a year for making programmes that nobody watches.

Where are you getting that?
Aside from the current case her career stands on it's own merit.
No Country for Women was outstanding.

FGR

Ah if only we had some forethought throughout the madness of the tiger and established a framework of annual savings in anticipation of the increase in pension expenditure. A national fund perhaps. One that would have been reserved for pensions perhaps ! -sigh-

https://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/pension-reserve-funds-to-be-spent-on-banks-137796.html

The NPRF was one of the smartest moves made but ended up being plundered to cover the crash. A shame too as that €15bn would come in handy for this looming crisis. It just comes to show that anything the gov will do as regards saving for the future will be spent in the next recession.

That's why the strategy appears to be fund everything from current day to day expenditure. Not wise imo.

On topic - If the retirement age is increasing to 68 now then what will it be in 30 years time when many of us are 68?

iamwhoiam

My advice to everyone is to look after themselves and be sure you have an income when retired.About 10 years ago I rang Social Welfare regarding Voluntary Contributions to gain more credits .I was told by a member if staff that as I had more then 520 credits at the time I would not need any more to get a full pension .Well I told the young man that I had lived long enough to see Governments move the goal posts when it suited them .I was right , the 520 credits is now not enough to gain a full pension as the criteria has completely changed .Luckily I did not trust the information I was given at the time

Trigger Happy

iamwhoiam wrote: »

My advice to everyone is to look after themselves and be sure you have an income when retired.

I think this is as good advice as you will get. Putting yourself at the mercy of future governments and attitudes is a risky business and I would not trust them as far as I could throw them.
Most of us have a respectful attitude to the current generation of pensioners. No one begrudges them their state pension. They made the sacrificies that got us to where we are today.
But as the worker to pensioner ratios change over the next 2 decades I wonder will that attitude change. I am not taking the chance.

Mad_maxx

elperello wrote: »

It can be confusing but if you look around at older members (say 70+) of your own family it may help to explain the dynamics of aging.

You might notice that they are slowing down a bit. Even the ones who are healthy are probably not in a position to do a days work.

Whatever they have managed to save plus the pension to which they are entitled is it, endgame, for them.
There will be no more earnings, bonuses, promotions, better job offers etc.

You are correct that they don't have the expenses of younger people like raising children or mortgages.
However there are expenses attached to old age like extra heating, health care, getting jobs done around the house and garden. In addition they still have to pay Local Property Tax.

Most of them get on with it and don't regard themselves as "the most vulnerable in society" but they have their problems like all of us.

They are politically the most powerful voting bloc in the land and have several salary drawing lobby groups who earn a living portraying them as poverty stricken.

Health care is free for all but very well off pensioners

mrslancaster

Mad_maxx wrote: »

...

Health care is free for all but very well off pensioners

Do people get medical cards automatically when they reach pension age?

AulWan

mrslancaster wrote: »

Do people get medical cards automatically when they reach pension age?

No, its means tested. Between ages 65 and 69 a pensioner living alone the limit is approx €201.50 per week, but if you live to age 70, that jumps to 500 per week for a single person and 900 for a couple which is very generous.

AndrewJRenko

marieholmfan wrote: »

She sounds like an unimaginable mediocrity who shnooked herself a cushy job and did no work. 112,000 a year for making programmes that nobody watches.

What do you actually know about her career and what she does or doesn't do Marie?

Have you any basis for your rush to judgement?

marieholmfan

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

What do you actually know about her career and what she does or doesn't do Marie?

Have you any basis for your rush to judgement?

Fair enough.

elperello

Mad_maxx wrote: »

They are politically the most powerful voting bloc in the land and have several salary drawing lobby groups who earn a living portraying them as poverty stricken.

Health care is free for all but very well off pensioners

Good for them if they are organised enough to have a voice in civil society.
There are plenty of other pressure groups working to improve the lot of other sections of the community ie. business, farmers etc.

There are some pensioners who live sad lonely lives without enough money to sustain themselves. I like living in a country where there are organisations who reach out to help these people.

You are most likely referring to the full medical card which they get with a means test only after 70.You might have heard about the shortcomings of the public health service.

Mad_maxx

mrslancaster wrote: »

Do people get medical cards automatically when they reach pension age?

Not until seventy but the threshold is very high, especially for couples

Mad_maxx

elperello wrote: »

Good for them if they are organised enough to have a voice in civil society.
There are plenty of other pressure groups working to improve the lot of other sections of the community ie. business, farmers etc.

There are some pensioners who live sad lonely lives without enough money to sustain themselves. I like living in a country where there are organisations who reach out to help these people.

You are most likely referring to the full medical card which they get with a means test only after 70.You might have heard about the shortcomings of the public health service.

Vast majority of over seventies qualify for a medical card once they reach seventy, over 90%

iamwhoiam

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Vast majority of over seventies qualify for a medical card once they reach seventy, over 90%

They qualify for GP cards not medical cards . Have you a link to say 90% qualify for a full medical card ?

mickdw

Do state employees such a teachers and nurses get their proper pension once retired or are they forced onto the dole too?

solerina

If you have worked your whole life you deserve a decent pension in retirement, I for one would be quite happy for people on long term unemployment benefit to be cut so that people who have worked their whole lives can continue to qualify for their pensions at 66.
Before I get lynched...I mean the long term unemployed who choose to be unemployed because they just don’t want to work !!

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

mickdw wrote: »

Do state employees such a teachers and nurses get their proper pension once retired or are they forced onto the dole too?

They go straight to pension, as it's not the State Old Age Pension.

iamwhoiam

Edison Lazy Pavilion wrote: »

They go straight to pension, as it's not the State Old Age Pension.

Nurses pay a credit since 1995 . They can access their pension from the HSE from 55 but must wait until age 66 to access the State Pension

iamwhoiam

mrslancaster wrote: »

Do people get medical cards automatically when they reach pension age?

No , you are entitled to an over 70 GP card which is not means tested . A full medical card is means tested for pensioners

The Rape of Lucretia

iamwhoiam wrote: »

No , you are entitled to an over 70 GP card which is not means tested . A full medical card is means tested for pensioners

Again, its important to take care that you have no private pension to ensure you can get the full card.

4068ac1elhodqr

Is it right that Ireland will soon have retirement age of 68 (uk is 66) the French have protested and stopped any planned increase of 2yrs up to 64.

Instead after complaining, Macron caves in and they can enjoy finishing up their (low hour work work) at just 62.
('the withdrawal of the pivot age' from the controversial bill).

fundi

Sloane Jolly Toothpick wrote: »

Is it right that Ireland will soon have retirement age of 68 (uk is 66) the French have protested and stopped any planned increase of 2yrs up to 64.

No, it is not right. But what can we do? Strike?

Touchee

fundi wrote: »

No, it is not right. But what can we do? Strike?

Yes, strike is definitely the answer. Otherwise, no one ever seems to listen. Making such changes to retirement age shouldn’t go unnoticed, media barely reports on it.

A strike would definitely draw attention to the issue and get more people involved.

PCeeeee

Touchee wrote: »

Yes, strike is definitely the answer. Otherwise, no one ever seems to listen. Making such changes to retirement age shouldn’t go unnoticed, media barely reports on it.

A strike would definitely draw attention to the issue and get more people involved.

The media is cheerleading the raising of the pension age under the guise of 'allowing people to work on'

Touchee

PCeeeee wrote: »

The media is cheerleading the raising of the pension age under the guise of 'allowing people to work on'

😀
It’s more like forcing rather than allowing. I’m ready to retire now (at 33), never mind at 65.

Airyfairy12

My mother will have to retire at 65, my dad has no pension, he's a bit of a waster, lived his life drinking and gambling and my mothers always been the bread winner although not that she earned much. She is terrified about whats going to happen, she has a mortgage, copd, a bone disease and medication already costs hundreds every month. We're all terrified. I feel like the government stole my twenties, im in my thirties and only now achieving the things I should have achieved 10 years ago, like learning how to drive, working full time, being able to save money. Now all that will have to go out the window as I will be supporting my parents financially form when my mother is forced to finished work.
This government is so completely out of touch with normal society, they really seem to live in a privileged little bubble unaware of the suffering theyre putting onto other people.
How are we allowing this to happen?