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Bus lane cameras to be introduced in 2020

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 9,233 ✭✭✭markpb


    trellheim wrote: »
    It certainly is, but as mentioned above, the DPC apparently has issued a directive or something.

    I've read the DPC website and can find no mention of it recently, but perhaps am looking in the wrong place. I want to see what exactly is the issue before jumping on one bandwagon or the other.


    GDPR compliance requires very clearly defined protections so I am interested here.

    https://www.businesspost.ie/ireland/gardai-are-told-to-switch-off-number-plate-id-cameras-5a0b7709


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,865 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    Seems to be no problem with ANPR on the M50 Toll Bridge. I suppose that is a special case, but enforcing traffic laws and catching criminals (as in the link above) is problematic.

    I am scratching my head here!


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,233 ✭✭✭markpb


    Seems to be no problem with ANPR on the M50 Toll Bridge. I suppose that is a special case, but enforcing traffic laws and catching criminals (as in the link above) is problematic.

    I am scratching my head here!

    At a guess, they have a specific legislative mandate under whatever act empowers the M50 toll operator to collect the tolls. AGS were probably operating their ANPR without supporting legislation or with improper processes.


  • Registered Users Posts: 991 ✭✭✭TuringBot47


    But these are fixed bus lane cameras ?

    I've seen European countries where the buses themselves had dashcams.
    That sounds much more effective.

    Then the bus(es) themselves become a mobile bus lane camera.
    Any car that is in their way will be caught.
    Even if only 10% of the fleet had them, it would be enough to make driver afraid of being behind them in a bus lane.

    I really wish the government would be thought into the implementation.
    Everyone will learn where the fixed cameras are.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,227 ✭✭✭Breezer


    Kaisr Sose wrote: »
    Using GDPR as a reason no to do something (in this case not rolling out static ANPR cameras) is the administrative equivalent of a No Comment Garda interview. They are all over Continental Europe as is GDPR, with no issues on privacy when driving a vehicle on a public road. Nor should there be.

    Yep, that was the point I was making. I’m in full agreement with you. ‘GDPR’ is up there with ‘Health and Safety’ as an excuse for everything.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,852 ✭✭✭trellheim


    markpb wrote: »

    thanks - Behind a paywall ? Also I presume it is just the newspaper article - theres lots of DPC opinions on the DPC website, but it is not listed there.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,249 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    It's great and all but can DCC actually issue fines using the anpr? Didn't they have to turn off the camera at blackhall place?

    The bus gate on bachelors walk, college green and city quay seem like obvious starting points. The double bus lane on pears st is also regularly chocoblock with cars.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    cgcsb wrote: »
    It's great and all but can DCC actually issue fines using the anpr? Didn't they have to turn off the camera at blackhall place?

    The bus gate on bachelors walk, college green and city quay seem like obvious starting points. The double bus lane on pears st is also regularly chocoblock with cars.

    I can only assume their plan is to embarrass AGS and the government into action?


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,852 ✭✭✭trellheim


    The Blackhall place camera was a pilot scheme. It was not extended and there were no GDPR issues I am aware of ( that said, GDPR was not in force at that time) Of the red light breakers 68% were motorists and 32% were cyclists


    Here is some information http://www.stickybottle.com/latest-news/cameras-benburb-blackhall-luas-red-lights/

    I cannot see what the GDPR issue is.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,233 ✭✭✭markpb


    cgcsb wrote: »
    It's great and all but can DCC actually issue fines using the anpr? Didn't they have to turn off the camera at blackhall place?

    Local authorities can hire traffic wardens with the authority to issue fines for some offences. I’m not sure if bus lane enforcement is covered by that or if ANPR could be used.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,249 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    If they're going to spend public money on it we need to know if it will actually amount to anything.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,818 ✭✭✭donvito99


    cgcsb wrote: »
    If they're going to spend public money on it we need to know if it will actually amount to anything.

    Bachelors Walk is an obvious location.

    Is it not obvious that such technology would reduce the number of vehicles using that stretch of bus lane illegally with the effect of improving journey times for bus passengers in particular? What more is required?


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,249 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    donvito99 wrote: »
    Bachelors Walk is an obvious location.

    Is it not obvious that such technology would reduce the number of vehicles using that stretch of bus lane illegally with the effect of improving journey times for bus passengers in particular? What more is required?

    I think it is, in rush hour it's common for buses to take upto half an hour to get from Ormond quay to Nassau st. This is largely due to cars and taxis using bus lanes illegally


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    cgcsb wrote: »
    If they're going to spend public money on it we need to know if it will actually amount to anything.

    If anything it will result in better more predictable bus journeys


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,249 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    If anything it will result in better more predictable bus journeys

    Assuming that fines are issued and enforced. Rather than simply collecting data on how many violations there are in what location broken down y Audi or non Audi etc.


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,253 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    trellheim wrote: »
    The Blackhall place camera was a pilot scheme. It was not extended and there were no GDPR issues I am aware of ( that said, GDPR was not in force at that time) Of the red light breakers 68% were motorists and 32% were cyclists


    Here is some information http://www.stickybottle.com/latest-news/cameras-benburb-blackhall-luas-red-lights/

    I cannot see what the GDPR issue is.
    It wasn't just that 'it wasn't extended'. They had to stop passing over reports to the Gardai for action as there were too many reports for the Gardai to actually deal with, unsurprisingly.



    This raises a bit issue for the planned expansion - how will it be resourced to ensure that they can actually continue to issue a significant number of fines that will stand up in Court.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,852 ✭✭✭trellheim


    It wasn't just that 'it wasn't extended'. They had to stop passing over reports to the Gardai for action as there were too many reports for the Gardai to actually deal with, unsurprisingly.



    This raises a bit issue for the planned expansion - how will it be resourced to ensure that they can actually continue to issue a significant number of fines that will stand up in Court.

    Thats interesting - as you say what point any new initiative here unless it is resourced ? There seems to be some resistance out there to "flash-for-cash" BS if you look at that kind of thing on twitter but I cant see any reason why it can't be self-financing.. and the day it makes no money because no-one ran a red light - I'm ok with that.

    Still not a GDPR issue tho


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,799 ✭✭✭✭DrumSteve


    Eagerly awaiting one for the bus lane on the naas road across from the red cow heading towards town.

    All the queue jumpers can suck it as far as Im concerned.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,256 ✭✭✭Macy0161


    Hard to see that any Data Protection issues/ concerns couldn't be overcome.

    However, there's no political will to introduce ANPR, which could be used for tax, insurance, nct, bus lanes, red lights, yellow boxes, cycle lanes, illegal turns etc., as they're too politically unpopular with all the supposedly law abiding motorists ("Shooting fish in a barrel, Joe...").

    I get there's no political will, I really don't understand the RSA not being stronger on their use, and instead want more gardai instead of the technology that's used in other countries.


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,253 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Macy0161 wrote: »
    Hard to see that any Data Protection issues/ concerns couldn't be overcome.

    However, there's no political will to introduce ANPR, which could be used for tax, insurance, nct, bus lanes, red lights, yellow boxes, cycle lanes, illegal turns etc., as they're too politically unpopular with all the supposedly law abiding motorists ("Shooting fish in a barrel, Joe...").

    I get there's no political will, I really don't understand the RSA not being stronger on their use, and instead want more gardai instead of the technology that's used in other countries.
    In fairness, they are rolling out the Garda Mobility App to put ANPR functionality in the hands of every Garda .


    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/new-app-being-rolled-out-to-gardai-to-detect-dodgy-drivers-38366052.html


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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,256 ✭✭✭Macy0161


    In fairness, they are rolling out the Garda Mobility App to put ANPR functionality in the hands of every Garda .


    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/new-app-being-rolled-out-to-gardai-to-detect-dodgy-drivers-38366052.html
    That's great an all, but ANPR camera's can be civilian operated or even static fixed camera's (or a number of locations set up, with randomly rotating camera's). I could give 7 bus lanes regularly abused between Foxrock Church and Donnybrook on the N11 that would justify at least one camera. Actually many stretches would justify two or three potential locations, given how far back people enter them!


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