External socket.

tom_tarbucket

Hi,

I have an external weatherproof socket and I plug my official Nissan 3 pin plug in to it. My issue is I cannot close the cover as the plug is too big in size.

I know I can buy a box and put charger in to it etc but I don’t like this.

Does anyone know for sure of an external weatherproof socket that is big enough to accommodate the bulky Nissan 3 pin plug so as to allow the cover to close over properly.

Gumbo

https://www.woodies.ie/masterplug-weatherproof-box-and-4-socket-8m-10a-extension-lead-1098787

Or a plastic bag

tom_tarbucket

kceire wrote: »

https://www.woodies.ie/masterplug-weatherproof-box-and-4-socket-8m-10a-extension-lead-1098787

Or a plastic bag

Thanks. But don’t want to use something like this. Just want a tidy setup on the wall without extension leads and boxes etc.

eddhorse

So you want something like this ?

tom_tarbucket

eddhorse wrote: »

So you want something like this ?

yes, but one that will close with a bulky plug.

the one I have already does not close properly

so wondering if anyone knows offhand of one that accommodates a larger plug

tom_tarbucket

I think I may have found the answer:

https://www.toughleads.co.uk/pages/bmw-charging-leads-overcoming-the-extra-large-13a-plug

tom_tarbucket

another q, I currently have a double socket installed.

Do I have to replace this with a double socket OR can I just do a single one?

Black_Knight

tom_tarbucket wrote: »

another q, I currently have a double socket installed.

Do I have to replace this with a double socket OR can I just do a single one?

It can just be a single if you want to replace it.

tom_tarbucket

Black_Knight wrote: »

It can just be a single if you want to replace it.

thanks, so there should be no issues with wires or excess wires etc going from a double to a single

NIMAN

Hope I'm not hijacking the thread, but I have a double outdoor socket which is currently mounted on a piece of wood which has a wooden stake attached to it.

This is simply stuck in the front garden.

As you can imagine, its not too well protected.

I was going to get the plug replaced with a new one but I'd like some sort of nice looking housing for it to keep it from the elements as well. Anyone any ideas?

I'd like it to be under cover but accessible.

Johnboy1951

tom_tarbucket wrote: »

Hi,

I have an external weatherproof socket and I plug my official Nissan 3 pin plug in to it. My issue is I cannot close the cover as the plug is too big in size.

I know I can buy a box and put charger in to it etc but I don’t like this.

Does anyone know for sure of an external weatherproof socket that is big enough to accommodate the bulky Nissan 3 pin plug so as to allow the cover to close over properly.

This is a standard 13A plug? EDIT: Apparently not ... it seems to have temp sensors built into the plug!

Why not replace the 3 pin plug on the lead with one that does fit?

Seems to be the cheapest and easiest to do.

tom_tarbucket

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

This is a 13A plug?

Why not replace the 3 pin plug on the lead with one that does fit?

Seems to be the cheapest and easiest to do.

Because it’s a moulded one for an electric car and I don’t want to tamper with it. I’m not looking for alternatives. Just the q in opening post.

KCross

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

This is a 13A plug?

Why not replace the 3 pin plug on the lead with one that does fit?

Seems to be the cheapest and easiest to do.

Don’t do that. It will likely render it useless.

Most granny chargers have extra wires in them for sensing temp etc so cutting off the plug and replacing it would remove those safety features... which you need when a 13A socket is running at full tilt for hours on end.

Johnboy1951

KCross wrote: »

Don’t do that. It will likely render it useless.

Most granny chargers have extra wires in them for sensing temp etc so cutting off the plug and replacing it would remove those safety features... which you need when a 13A socket is running at full tilt for hours on end.

I see.
To what are those wires attached in the plug? Some built in temp sensors?

KCross

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

I see.
To what are those wires attached in the plug? Some built in temp sensors?

Yes

adunis

I've yet to see a granny lead with anything other than a mains cable feeding the box of tricks just swap the plug

KCross

adunis wrote: »

I've yet to see a granny lead with anything other than a mains cable feeding the box of tricks just swap the plug

Not sure I get you. Its a moulded plug and fully sealed so you cant see the extra wires/sensor.

Are you saying you've bust open a few of them and found no temp sensors? What makes were they?
You could, of course, buy an after market cheap granny cable that doesnt have it but the OEM ones tend to have it.


Regardless, the Leaf granny charger, which tom has, does have a temp sensor in it so you're giving bad advice there.

adunis

The temperature sensing is done by the electronic gubbins within the box if tricks.

KCross

adunis wrote: »

The temperature sensing is done by the electronic gubbins within the box if tricks.

The sensor/resistor is in the plug, the gubbins reads that and turns off the charge if it’s too hot.

There would be no point in sensing temp inside the unit. It’s the plug gets hot. That’s where the sensing and extra wire is.

Are you still suggesting cutting off the plug is a good idea?

adunis

Screenshot_2019-12-23-08-11-36-442_com.android.chrome.jpgYes I am ,you are correct K cross and I stand corrected ,I looked there's a 22kohm resistor across a pair of extra wires nothing more complex than that

Dardania

adunis wrote: »

Screenshot_2019-12-23-08-11-36-442_com.android.chrome.jpgYes I am ,you are correct K cross and I stand corrected ,I looked there's a 22kohm resistor across a pair of extra wires nothing more complex than that

Simple, elegant solution.

KCross

adunis wrote: »

Screenshot_2019-12-23-08-11-36-442_com.android.chrome.jpgYes I am ,you are correct K cross and I stand corrected ,I looked there's a 22kohm resistor across a pair of extra wires nothing more complex than that

I’ve seen that particular picture before. That’s not an OEM one, that’s a guys effort at doing it himself in a standard plug.

I think Tom has found his solution anyway which is a bigger socket. That’s a lot easier than mangling his cable and soldering/insulating a new resistor in to a plug not designed to take it.

tom_tarbucket

Is it a big job to swap out an external socket? Let’s say like for like. Swap a double with a double.

Would it need a qualified electrician or just a handyman?

KCross

tom_tarbucket wrote: »

Is it a big job to swap out an external socket? Let’s say like for like. Swap a double with a double.

Would it need a qualified electrician or just a handyman?

Not much more complicated than wiring a plug. Being outside, the main thing is to ensure its the right type of external socket and is installed properly and remains watertight.... you dont need an electrician for that, just someone with a bit of cop-on.

tom_tarbucket

KCross wrote: »

Not much more complicated than wiring a plug. Being outside, the main thing is to ensure its the right type of external socket and is installed properly and remains watertight.... you dont need an electrician for that, just someone with a bit of cop-on.

Right. Might give it a go myself. Just don’t like playing with electricity

NIMAN

tom_tarbucket wrote: »

Right. Might give it a go myself. Just don’t like playing with electricity

Switch it off at the main fuse box. You'll be grand.

tom_tarbucket

NIMAN wrote: »

Switch it off at the main fuse box. You'll be grand.

Hmmmm, will see.

NIMAN

tom_tarbucket wrote: »

Hmmmm, will see.

I would have been afraid of this type of job in the past, until one time I had a spark in changing out a few internal sockets for me.

He asked would I not have done them myself, I told him I'd probably have killed myself trying.

Then he changed one out and told me to watch it being done.

It did appears easy enough and I have since changed about 4 or so to ones with USB sockets enclosed.

So I assume replacing the external double socket will be something similar, so if I get a dry day over Xmas I'll have a look at mine.
Just ensure the socket isn't live when doing it.

Dardania

NIMAN wrote: »

I would have been afraid of this type of job in the past, until one time I had a spark in changing out a few internal sockets for me.

He asked would I not have done them myself, I told him I'd probably have killed myself trying.

Then he changed one out and told me to watch it being done.

It did appears easy enough and I have since changed about 4 or so to ones with USB sockets enclosed.

So I assume replacing the external double socket will be something similar, so if I get a dry day over Xmas I'll have a look at mine.
Just ensure the socket isn't live when doing it.

only thing to be careful with an outdoor compared to internal socket normal risks is the risk of water ingress.

tom_tarbucket

NIMAN wrote: »

I would have been afraid of this type of job in the past, until one time I had a spark in changing out a few internal sockets for me.

He asked would I not have done them myself, I told him I'd probably have killed myself trying.

Then he changed one out and told me to watch it being done.

It did appears easy enough and I have since changed about 4 or so to ones with USB sockets enclosed.

So I assume replacing the external double socket will be something similar, so if I get a dry day over Xmas I'll have a look at mine.
Just ensure the socket isn't live when doing it.

Thanks, yeah. I may give it a go so. Hopefully should be ok. The external socket is on its own circuit with its own dedicated switch in the circuit board, presume switching this off will kill the power to external socket or should I switch off all the power.

Johnboy1951

tom_tarbucket wrote: »

Thanks, yeah. I may give it a go so. Hopefully should be ok. The external socket is on its own circuit with its own dedicated switch in the circuit board, presume switching this off will kill the power to external socket or should I switch off all the power.

If it is wired correctly it should be OK ...... but there is no harm at all in being even safer by tripping the whole lot

tom_tarbucket

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

If it is wired correctly it should be OK ...... but there is no harm at all in being even safer by tripping the whole lot

True. The current socket will have the cabling wired as a guide for me. So l can take a photo and copy for new scenario. Is it kinda the same as wiring a plug?

I know from last experience of wiring a plug that it can be very frustrating pairing back the outer cable to make sure you have enough wires cable to make the connections. Is it the same general scenario with the external socket?

Johnboy1951

tom_tarbucket wrote: »

True. The current socket will have the cabling wired as a guide for me. So l can take a photo and copy for new scenario. Is it kinda the same as wiring a plug?

I know from last experience of wiring a plug that it can be very frustrating pairing back the outer cable to make sure you have enough wires cable to make the connections. Is it the same general scenario with the external socket?

Yes, generally it is the same.

IMO best to have two people there if unsure.

tom_tarbucket

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

Yes, generally it is the same.

IMO best to have two people there if unsure.

You offering to help ?

tom_tarbucket

tom_tarbucket wrote: »

True. The current socket will have the cabling wired as a guide for me. So l can take a photo and copy for new scenario. Is it kinda the same as wiring a plug?

I know from last experience of wiring a plug that it can be very frustrating pairing back the outer cable to make sure you have enough wires cable to make the connections. Is it the same general scenario with the external socket?

Will there be 6 cables to connect - 2 live, 2 neutral and 2 earth?

tom_tarbucket

Also it seems I have to punch or make new holes in the new plastic box. (For screwing it to wall and for electric cable feed) All holes are sealed/solid now. How is this normally done? (ESP the bigger hole)

graememk

tom_tarbucket wrote: »

Also it seems I have to punch or make new holes in the new plastic box. (For screwing it to wall and for electric cable feed) All holes are sealed/solid now. How is this normally done? (ESP the bigger hole)

Usually drilled out/knocked out

You can then get glands that you can fit in to fill the holes that tighten onto the cable I'll get a link to an example.

https://www.screwfix.ie/p/tower-male-comp-gland-black-20mm-pack-of-2/80851

tom_tarbucket

tom_tarbucket wrote: »

Will there be 6 cables to connect - 2 live, 2 neutral and 2 earth?

I see on my new socket that it only has 1x Live port and 1x Neutral port. I presume you just group the 2 cables and put the 2 live cables to the one port etc.

adunis

If you have 6 wires 9 wires etc there's other **** daisy chained on that circuit (ahem.....stared in electrical parlance makes it sound propper even if it isn't great practice),if right was right you should have 3 wires,there's only ever going to be 3 connections in a socket ,stick all the lives together in the appropriate connection same for the neutrals and earth's.

tom_tarbucket

This is the way it looks in attached.

punisher5112

Bit of silicone around it at the back and no water will get in.....

tom_tarbucket

punisher5112 wrote: »

Bit of silicone around it at the back and no water will get in.....

Where do you put silicone. Directly on to back of box is it

punisher5112

tom_tarbucket wrote: »

Where do you put silicone. Directly on to back of box is it

Yeah you could.

tom_tarbucket

punisher5112 wrote: »

Yeah you could.

Thing is. With the cable pulled through in proper final position I cannot get the sealant gun to go where I want. The gap is too narrow. Or should I apply sealant on box first and then pull the cable through.

punisher5112

tom_tarbucket wrote: »

Thing is. With the cable pulled through in proper final position I cannot get the sealant gun to go where I want. The gap is too narrow. Or should I apply sealant on box first and then pull the cable through.

You could just throw the sealant around the outside between box and wall. Then no danger of water getting in.

tom_tarbucket

punisher5112 wrote: »

You could just throw the sealant around the outside between box and wall. Then no danger of water getting in.

Noted. Is it ok for the sealant to get on the white outplaying wire. Presume it is. I see the white outer cable has a slight crack in it that would sealant in to the 3 smaller inner wires (live, neutral, earth). But at the place where no copper exposed.

punisher5112

tom_tarbucket wrote: »

Noted. Is it ok for the sealant to get on the white outplaying wire. Presume it is. I see the white outer cable has a slight crack in it that would sealant in to the 3 smaller inner wires (live, neutral, earth). But at the place where no copper exposed.

Best not if you can do without as some will break down or react with certain materials.

Bit around the box when fitted should be fine....

DublinDilbert

tom_tarbucket wrote: »

Noted. Is it ok for the sealant to get on the white outplaying wire. Presume it is. I see the white outer cable has a slight crack in it that would sealant in to the 3 smaller inner wires (live, neutral, earth). But at the place where no copper exposed.

Just loosen the screws and put some silicone around where the cable exits the wall and enters the back of the box. Also a little bit at each screw hole. No need to fully seal the box to the wall.

tom_tarbucket

DublinDilbert wrote: »

Just loosen the screws and put some silicone around where the cable exits the wall and enters the back of the box. Also a little bit at each screw hole. No need to fully seal the box to the wall.

Could I put the silicone *inside* the box - as In the circled part of attached picture.

Johnboy1951

I would put a bead of silicone along the top and down both sides of the box after it is fitted.
I would not put any along the bottom --- this allows any moisture/condensation to escape.
Work the silicon well into the joint of box and wall, and smooth off with damp finger to finish.

tom_tarbucket

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

I would put a bead of silicone along the top and down both sides of the box after it is fitted.
I would not put any along the bottom --- this allows any moisture/condensation to escape.
Work the silicon well into the joint of box and wall, and smooth off with damp finger to finish.

Thanks.

Is there a need to put any silicone inside the box?
Or at the ‘back’ of the box?

Your suggestion above - would I install the box first. i.e. screw it to the wall etc .......and then after this apply the silicone.