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Appalling bus transport article

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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,315 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Dravokivich
    Category Moderator


    Why didn't she get the dart? It goes straight into town, whereas a bus route usually meanders around. There's your time difference. It's also one of, if not the highest used services she did her piece on. So there'll be more loading times with higher throughput of passengers.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,677 ✭✭✭ strandroad


    Why didn't she get the dart? It goes straight into town, whereas a bus route usually meanders around. There's your time difference. It's also one of, if not the highest used services she did her piece on. So there'll be more loading times with higher throughput of passengers.

    46A doesn't meander, it goes up to N11 and into town to serve Deansgrange, Foxrock, Stillorgan and UCD. It's just very slow because bus lanes are only part of the way and loading/unloading is so slow with the inefficient system we have. And that's QBC speeds for you...


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 114 ✭✭ Joker2019
    Banned


    Riddiculous article. No one uses the 46a to go from DL ro the city centre. Most people use the DART and if they are using a bus it would be the quicker and more direct 7/a. It has to be remembered that buses don't go from A to B (ie. terminus to terminus) they go from A to Z via B, C, E, H, I, K. She clearly dosen't understand how buses work.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 114 ✭✭ Joker2019
    Banned


    strandroad wrote: »
    46A doesn't meander, it goes up to N11 and into town to serve Deansgrange, Foxrock, Stillorgan and UCD. It's just very slow because bus lanes are only part of the way and loading/unloading is so slow with the inefficient system we have. And that's QBC speeds for you...

    The N11 corridor is actually quite efficient if gou live along it. The main issue I have with it is the stretch from Leeson Street Bridge to the city centre which can be very slow due to private cars. I think it is an excellent service. Most people using it to go from DL are using as a local service to get ro places like Deansgrange, Stillorgan and UCD not the city centre.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,677 ✭✭✭ strandroad


    Joker2019 wrote: »
    Riddiculous article. No one uses the 46a to go from DL ro the city centre. Most people use the DART and if they are using a bus it would be the quicker and more direct 7/a. It has to be remembered that buses don't go from A to B (ie. terminus to terminus) they go from A to Z via B, C, E, H, I, K. She clearly dosen't understand how buses work.

    Many people from Deansgrange use it to go into town, it's quite a trek to go down to the Dart and you would need another walk from Tara or Connolly. And yes it's slow just as she described. Why to attack the author when she's presenting a legitimate point?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,086 ✭✭✭ Nijmegen
    Registered User


    I went in to town along the N11 axis the other night on public transport, and as folks say once you hit Donnybrook it's game over for any sort of progression. God help you crossing the canal and then merging down at the Sugar club to get some semblance of momentum back up if you're heading down Stephen's Green. On the bus you are not helped by the speed of loading and unloading thanks to our system with cash payments, but fundamentally the issue is congestion.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 114 ✭✭ Joker2019
    Banned


    strandroad wrote: »
    Many people from Deansgrange use it to go into town, it's quite a trek to go down to the Dart and you would need another walk from Tara or Connolly. And yes it's slow just as she described. Why to attack the author when she's presenting a legitimate point?

    I clearly stated DL in my post. The walk from Connolly, Pearse or Tara shouldn't be an issue to an able bodied person. I don't understand the point she is trying to make as there are quicker alternatives. The worst stretch on the 46a outside of the city centre is from Mountown Road to Deansgrange. Deansgrange is near enough the N11 and then again from certain areas it would be quicker to catch the 4.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,676 ✭✭✭ thomasj
    Registered User


    Maybe someone would be kind enough to remind our journalist friends that there are other bus routes operating in and out of the city :)


  • Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 34,538 Mod ✭✭✭✭ AlmightyCushion
    Moderator


    Is that the whole article or am I missing something? It looks like she didn't finish writing the rest of it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,676 ✭✭✭ thomasj
    Registered User


    Is that the whole article or am I missing something? It looks like she didn't finish writing the rest of it.

    There's a paywall there so you have to be a subscriber to see the rest of the article.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,677 ✭✭✭ strandroad


    Joker2019 wrote: »
    I clearly stated DL in my post. The walk from Connolly, Pearse or Tara shouldn't be an issue to an able bodied person. I don't understand the point she is trying to make as there are quicker alternatives. The worst stretch on the 46a outside of the city centre is from Mountown Road to Deansgrange. Deansgrange is near enough the N11 and then again from certain areas it would be quicker to catch the 4.

    Why not to cancel it then if it's so unnecessary? The point is that it's a popular QBC service and it's woefully slow.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,470 ✭✭✭✭ Dial Hard
    Registered User


    thomasj wrote: »
    Maybe someone would be kind enough to remind our journalist friends that there are other bus routes operating in and out of the city :)

    I think the point is that her experience of the 46A is broadly representative of plenty of other bus routes into the city. I take the 15 from Ballycullen to Rathmines every morning, a distance of 9.7km and it takes 50-53 minutes. Can be an hour on a rainy day.


  • Registered Users Posts: 656 ✭✭✭ drake70
    Registered User


    thomasj wrote: »
    There's a paywall there so you have to be a subscriber to see the rest of the article.

    No need to pay, just subscribe with your email address and create a password


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,140 ✭✭✭✭ is_that_so
    Registered User


    Dial Hard wrote: »
    I think the point is that her experience of the 46A is broadly representative of plenty of other bus routes into the city. I take the 15 from Ballycullen to Rathmines every morning, a distance of 9.7km and it takes 50-53 minutes. Can be an hour on a rainy day.
    While that may be accounted for by issues with car traffic, from O'Connell St to get through D'Olier St in the mornings can take up to 20m; sheer volumes of buses and the Luas at Trinity. I've also heard of people being "trapped" on buses for almost as long at College Green inbound for the same reason. I've had bus journeys from Whitehall Church to O'Connell St, a distance of not even 5km, take 30m and it's bus lanes all thr way.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,079 ✭✭✭ dancingqueen
    Registered User


    Joker2019 wrote: »
    Riddiculous article. No one uses the 46a to go from DL ro the city centre. Most people use the DART and if they are using a bus it would be the quicker and more direct 7/a. It has to be remembered that buses don't go from A to B (ie. terminus to terminus) they go from A to Z via B, C, E, H, I, K. She clearly dosen't understand how buses work.

    Wrong. Plenty of us use the 46a to go to town. It's closer to a lot of areas in town than the DART and you have a higher chance of getting a seat (some people can't stand for prolonged periods of time). Living up towards the N11, your commute is longer getting to and from the DART and/or to and from work from the DART. The 7a is not in fact quicker, it is less frequent (every 20 minutes as opposed to every 8) and the bottleneck of Blackrock means you can sit on the bus from one side to the other for up to 20 minutes to get down past the Frascati. So, if you add all that together, the stress is far less to go for a 46a, maybe miss it and still get one in 8 minutes. There is a bus lane most of the way bar a small part of Deansgrange. In my time commuting from DL to town, the 46a is the best option. And it's always packed. Usually full from Park Pointe.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,079 ✭✭✭ dancingqueen
    Registered User


    Joker2019 wrote: »
    I clearly stated DL in my post. The walk from Connolly, Pearse or Tara shouldn't be an issue to an able bodied person. I don't understand the point she is trying to make as there are quicker alternatives. The worst stretch on the 46a outside of the city centre is from Mountown Road to Deansgrange. Deansgrange is near enough the N11 and then again from certain areas it would be quicker to catch the 4.

    I get on the 46a on Mountown Road and it's no slower there than it is dropping off at all the schools in Stillorgan. I'd rather that than sit in Blackrock for an age from Stradbrook all the way past the Frascati. That is far worse.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,999 ✭✭✭✭ AlekSmart
    Registered User


    Joker2019 wrote: »
    The N11 corridor is actually quite efficient if gou live along it. The main issue I have with it is the stretch from Leeson Street Bridge to the city centre which can be very slow due to private cars. I think it is an excellent service. Most people using it to go from DL are using as a local service to get ro places like Deansgrange, Stillorgan and UCD not the city centre.

    Oh dear...the elephant in the room.

    The decision of DCC to install the "Armadillo" cycle-lane deliniators on a singularly inappropriate stretch from the inbound bus-stop 786 to the Earlsfort Tce/Stephens Green Junction.

    Almost incredibly,the same City Council (I presume) have just had the other road markings re-applied in the exact same configuration as existed BEFORE the Armadillos were installed.

    This shows a full lane as being available for Left Turning traffic into Earlsfort Tce,when in facta,there is none...this has pushed ALL traffic over to the right,which now blocks ALL Bus routes attempting to position for a Right Hand turn onto Stephens Green in addition to imposing a heretofore absent level of conflict between the three available routes through the Junction...always remembering that there is also an OUTBOUND Contra-Flow Bus Lane in full operation from that junction to reduce the now seriously reduced available roadspace.

    This now leads to everyday total shambolic gridlock all the way back over Leeson Street bridge and,at times back to Appian Way,which impacts upon all those much referred to Canal Cordon public transport surveys...why fcuxkin bother sez you ?

    Only in the rarefied world of Dublin City Council's Senior Traffic Planning elite can this sort of imbicilic nonsense be passed off as "professional"...whilst even cyclists are forced to see it for the pile of ameturish,dangerous codology it actually is.

    By all means install cycle freindly facilities,but for Crying out loud,don't just allow your craziest wild-eyed professional Loon free rein to actually install shytt until some human actually walks from Civic Offices up to the stretch of Leeson St in question and spends a couple of hours physically LOOKING at how the thing flows before deciding to take a few more swigs and suddenly try to turn base-metal into gold.

    If the NTA have any real intent to impliment Busconnects-The Project,then they need to cut off all power to Dublin City Council's Traffic Planners offices and pump laughing-gas into their air-con system !!!

    I hope the Herald will despatch a team of investigative journalists to Civic Offices toute-suite !! :D


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 114 ✭✭ Joker2019
    Banned


    strandroad wrote: »
    Why not to cancel it then if it's so unnecessary? The point is that it's a popular QBC service and it's woefully slow.

    Because it serves more of a purpose for local journies that are not going into the city centre from DL to Deansgrange. I know some use it to go to the city centre but many are only using it to go from DL to Deansgrange, Stillorgan or UCD. Not everyone using N11 buses are going into the city centre.

    It's not woefully slow either it takes me around 45 mins to an hour to get from Foxrock Church to the city centre at 7.45 in the morning which seems ok.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 114 ✭✭ Joker2019
    Banned


    Wrong. Plenty of us use the 46a to go to town. It's closer to a lot of areas in town than the DART and you have a higher chance of getting a seat (some people can't stand for prolonged periods of time). Living up towards the N11, your commute is longer getting to and from the DART and/or to and from work from the DART. The 7a is not in fact quicker, it is less frequent (every 20 minutes as opposed to every 8) and the bottleneck of Blackrock means you can sit on the bus from one side to the other for up to 20 minutes to get down past the Frascati. So, if you add all that together, the stress is far less to go for a 46a, maybe miss it and still get one in 8 minutes. There is a bus lane most of the way bar a small part of Deansgrange. In my time commuting from DL to town, the 46a is the best option. And it's always packed. Usually full from Park Pointe.

    So not as bad as the article made out. The fact is the journalist in question used the 46a to go all the way from the terminus at DL DART station to O'Connell Street when they could have just used the Dart and done the journey in nearly half the time. But hey saying good things about buses and trains in Ireland isn't going to sell newspapers or subscriptions now is it?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,677 ✭✭✭ strandroad


    Joker2019 wrote: »
    Because it serves more of a purpose for local journies that are not going into the city centre from DL to Deansgrange. I know some use it to go to the city centre but many are only using it to go from DL to Deansgrange, Stillorgan or UCD. Not everyone using N11 buses are going into the city centre.

    It's not woefully slow either it takes me around 45 mins to an hour to get from Foxrock Church to the city centre at 7.45 in the morning which seems ok.

    So it takes you up to an hour to cover 10km. 10km/h bus speed is woefully slow in my book, but feel free to disagree.

    The point of the article is that if the QBC service is so slow, how slow are the regular ones... the system is not fit for the purpose.


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 114 ✭✭ Joker2019
    Banned


    strandroad wrote: »
    So it takes you up to an hour to cover 10km. 10km/h bus speed is woefully slow in my book, but feel free to disagree.

    The point of the article is that if the QBC service is so slow, how slow are the regular ones... the system is not fit for the purpose.

    Well urban journies are typically the slowest type of journies. It's quicker than commuting by car personally I find it alright when you think about it. All journies to and from the city centre are going to be slow.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,677 ✭✭✭ strandroad


    Joker2019 wrote: »
    Well urban journies are typically the slowest type of journies. It's quicker than commuting by car personally I find it alright when you think about it. All journies to and from the city centre are going to be slow.

    With all due respect, I would really recommend trying to live in another city for a while, just to see what it feels like when standards are not so dreadfully low! You can actually have fast and efficient bus commutes, but we won't have them as long as passengers accept that 10km/h and two hours on the bus a day is grand.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 114 ✭✭ Joker2019
    Banned


    strandroad wrote: »
    With all due respect, I would really recommend trying to live in another city for a while, just to see what it feels like when standards are not so dreadfully low! You can actually have fast and efficient bus commutes, but we won't have them as long as passengers accept that 10km/h and two hours on the bus a day is grand.

    Where are these cities. An hour wouldn't nessecarily be the time spent on the bus but rather the time spent commuting from the time you get from your front door to your college or workplace. Urban buses can be a slow mode of transport the thing that sells the service for most people is frequency and reliability rather than journey times.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,104 ✭✭✭ Chris_5339762
    Registered User


    Flat Fare with a Leap/Oyster/contactless system.
    Make all current bus lanes 24 hour.
    Enforce traffic law re: boxes and bus lanes. Start with the Gardai, then move to cameras.

    Do all of that next week. Then sort out more bus lanes.


  • Registered Users Posts: 323 ✭✭ Tomrota
    Registered User


    strandroad wrote: »
    With all due respect, I would really recommend trying to live in another city for a while, just to see what it feels like when standards are not so dreadfully low! You can actually have fast and efficient bus commutes, but we won't have them as long as passengers accept that 10km/h and two hours on the bus a day is grand.
    Exactly, Dublin is tiny and has one of the worst congestion situations in the EU. I hate when people try to praise the NTA or the transport system we currently have as if it’s not being utilised or as if it’s something great but a hidden gem. It’s the worst transport of all the cities I’ve ever lived in/visited/experienced. Ever. There’s no way it would take you an hour to travel 10km in Paris, Amsterdam or Barcelona. Only DART/Metro can produce reliable journey times. There’s a ridiculous reliance on bus in Dublin.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,470 ✭✭✭✭ Dial Hard
    Registered User


    Joker2019 wrote: »
    Where are these cities. An hour wouldn't nessecarily be the time spent on the bus but rather the time spent commuting from the time you get from your front door to your college or workplace. Urban buses can be a slow mode of transport the thing that sells the service for most people is frequency and reliability rather than journey times.

    The 50-53 minutes to cover 9.7km in my example is literally the time it takes on the bus. My full commute takes around an hour and a half. It would genuinely be quicker for me to drive to work.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 114 ✭✭ Joker2019
    Banned


    Dial Hard wrote: »
    The 50-53 minutes to cover 9.7km in my example is literally the time it takes on the bus. My full commute takes around an hour and a half. It would genuinely be quicker for me to drive to work.

    And is there a bus lane on your commute? Remember that's at peak times most cities have a morning and evening peak it's far quicker off peak. I find the evening peak far worse than the morning peak.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,842 ✭✭✭✭ CIARAN_BOYLE
    Registered User


    Joker2019 wrote: »
    And is there a bus lane on your commute? Remember that's at peak times most cities have a morning and evening peak it's far quicker off peak. I find the evening peak far worse than the morning peak.

    He is referring to the 15 bus which had long stretches of bus lanes and periods of massive bottlenecks with no bus lanes.

    I take the route myself into town and have moved my hours of work to avoid the worst of rush hour as traffic can be so bad in the morning.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,470 ✭✭✭✭ Dial Hard
    Registered User


    Yep, 15. There are bus lanes for maybe half to two-thirds of the part I’m on. I get on it at 7.20 in the mornings, so I’m missing the worst of the schools traffic, etc. and it still takes that long. Drives me mental.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,842 ✭✭✭✭ CIARAN_BOYLE
    Registered User


    Dial Hard wrote: »
    Yep, 15. There are bus lanes for maybe half to two-thirds of the part I’m on. I get on it at 7.20 in the mornings, so I’m missing the worst of the schools traffic, etc. and it still takes that long. Drives me mental.

    I moved from a 9 o'clock start to an 8 o'clock start about a year ago to save myself 30 mins in the morning.


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