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Does the Irish Times have a future?

13

Comments



  • xieann wrote: »
    I used to be a somewhat regular reader of the printed media IT.
    I have now discontinued buying the IT primarily because about 10 years ago thereabouts, a few IT journos embarked on this crusade to really straighten out good & proper the HSE and knock it into shipshape

    ten years on, the HSE is still plagued by the same levels of waiting lists, fekups, litigation - Plus ca change.

    No longer an IT patron.

    So in short you stopped buying the Irish Times because the HSE is a basket case.




  • https://www.broadsheet.ie/2016/08/23/five-years-after/

    The IT is just another scummy rag, the only difference is it's codwinked a lot of people into thinking otherwise.




  • If Una Mullally had a gag it might be ok. lol.




  • Proddy paper!




  • elperello wrote: »
    So in short you stopped buying the Irish Times because the HSE is a basket case.

    Well, ok, bonus just for you mate, the IT tirelessly promotes the "Young Scientist competition"

    Now one the young scientist was actually very good for IT engineers to visit.

    A long time ago.

    Nowadays the same competition has entrants waffling on safely about their grandad who pioneered this..


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  • xieann wrote: »
    Well, ok, bonus just for you mate, the IT tirelessly promotes the "Young Scientist competition"

    Now one the young scientist was actually very good for IT engineers to visit.

    A long time ago.

    Nowadays the same competition has entrants waffling on safely about their grandad who pioneered this..

    Well at least we agree that the HSE is a basket case.
    What's wrong with the Young Scientists Competition?




  • Really? Why don’t you refute my point then with evidence - any article/opinion piece that is balanced and not a PC soapbox full of woke will do. Good luck finding one.

    There's articles and Opinion pieces published in every day that have absolutely nothing to do with any of that.

    Breda O' Brien has a weekly column there and everything she writes about is the complete opposite of PC and woke: whatever buzzwords you want to use. They'll also carry articles/opinion pieces written by members of the clergy.

    The paper is quite middle of the road on many issues, particularly related to economics or public/social policy. It does lean left on social issues, but not markedly so compared to many other Irish media outlets. To say it's "as far left as you can go" is laughable and hyperbolic. It's nowhere near as left as The Guardian, for instance, and I don't know if you've been reading any recent editions of Socialist Worker or An Phoblacht - now that's left.

    The Irish Times is a centre left paper, let's not exaggerate its position on the political spectrum here.




  • I buy the Sunday times n find it decent. The folks get the Sunday Indo n I think it has dropped an awful lot. I used to read it when dropping kids over but don't bother anymore.
    Every journo seems to be left wing, politically correct on all matters. Don't mind the majority being so but not one alternative viewpoint gets a look in.




  • enricoh wrote: »
    I buy the Sunday times n find it decent. The folks get the Sunday Indo n I think it has dropped an awful lot. I used to read it when dropping kids over but don't bother anymore.
    Every journo seems to be left wing, politically correct on all matters. Don't mind the majority being so but not one alternative viewpoint gets a look in.

    If you don't read the Sunday Independent anymore, how do you find out what Kathryn Thomas is up to?




  • If you don't read the Sunday Independent anymore, how do you find out what Kathryn Thomas is up to?

    Im torn on it, I still don't know if it's a price worth paying! And Barry Egan filling me in on some artist with a ponytail, Gucci? Or something.

    Sod it, I'm going back to it, life is to short to be missing out on this stuff!


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  • My two cents as someone still scrounging off the free student subscription:
    • Opinion pieces always have an element of phoning it in but lately I tend to ignore anything written by Una Mullaly or Fintan O'Toole as they're total broken records at this point.
    • In the long term, the bad flowery prose across the paper is obnoxious (this is more of a general problem with journalism as a whole).
    • The Inside Politics daily rundown to be consistently high quality.
    • Cliff Taylor's Smart Money column is good.
    • David McWilliams has the air of someone with a high opinion of themselves but does produce interesting content.




  • Can I ask what is wrong being woke, especially super woke? I think what you're getting at is that they're doing it wrong somehow... could you clarify your point?

    (Woke: alert to injustice in society, especially racism)

    What I'm getting it is that the paper is clearly going down a very PC route to attract the type of men that call themselves feminists or women with short pink hair and a repeal sweatshirt. You know the type.

    The problem with that clientele is just say you run a story on immigrant crime, you'll lose readers and you'll never regain them. Or if somebody who writes for the paper writes a negative story about a beloved lefty politician, the journo will be labeled far right and theyll lose readers, never to be regained. Or if trans man is playing women's sport and beating up the women, run that story and they'll be viewed as "Transphobes", they'll lose their clientele.

    The bar on getting offended is lowering every year. If they are going down that route then firstly they've lost normal readers, but then eventually they'll lose the nutters that they were trying to cater for because if everything is not on a tee "woke", they'll brand you as Far Right.

    Even the Guardian suffers from it. The nutters call them Anti-Corbyn.

    Whereas papers like the Telegraph and Daily Mail will go on for a long time because they latch into human instincts. We're Conservative at heart, we don't like new things, we don't like outsiders and we don't like being told what to do and how to think.

    Woke-ism isn't natural. It's just over compensating for internal prejudices.




  • The Irish Times really should be renamed the Dublin 4 Times, since it reflects not Ireland as a whole, but an ideological perspective prevalent mostly in select areas of the capital.

    It will probably limp along as the "paper of record" in Ireland, for lack of meaningful competition, but there are many better newspapers out there, especially for international and business news.

    Perrmabear going after the Dublin 4 elite. A man of the people!




  • Saw a peak Guardian moment this morning, albeit light hearted. Reading an article about how neanderthals may have just reached an evolutionary dead end randomly rather than being supplanted by homo sapiens and the writer popped in that any homo sapiens 'encumbered by survivors' guilt may have good reason to unburden themselves'.

    I can rest easy now as it was definitely playing on my mind :D




  • What I'm getting it is that the paper is clearly going down a very PC route to attract the type of men that call themselves feminists or women with short pink hair and a repeal sweatshirt. You know the type.

    The problem with that clientele is just say you run a story on immigrant crime, you'll lose readers and you'll never regain them. Or if somebody who writes for the paper writes a negative story about a beloved lefty politician, the journo will be labeled far right and theyll lose readers, never to be regained. Or if trans man is playing women's sport and beating up the women, run that story and they'll be viewed as "Transphobes", they'll lose their clientele.

    The bar on getting offended is lowering every year. If they are going down that route then firstly they've lost normal readers, but then eventually they'll lose the nutters that they were trying to cater for because if everything is not on a tee "woke", they'll brand you as Far Right.

    Even the Guardian suffers from it. The nutters call them Anti-Corbyn.

    Whereas papers like the Telegraph and Daily Mail will go on for a long time because they latch into human instincts. We're Conservative at heart, we don't like new things, we don't like outsiders and we don't like being told what to do and how to think.

    Woke-ism isn't natural. It's just over compensating for internal prejudices.

    ...to attract "women with short pink hair and a repeal sweatshirt.." Really? You're talking in extreme stereotypes that really has no basis in reality. Seriously- to begin with, what % of the population of women have short pink hair? It's very hard to take anyone seriously who reduces women to a caricature.
    Everyone should be a feminist. Feminism pushes for political, economic, and social equality of the sexes. Stereotypes aside, who should be against that regardless of your gender? Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie (a best selling author) talks about this brilliantly, highly recommend her books/Ted talk.

    Perhaps the problem is with stereotypes and misinformation around the word feminism/feminist, and what it is and who embodies those ideals. And comments like yours highlight exactly why it's a problem.

    Your bit about the clientele that is allegedly being lost forever at the publication of certain articles; do you have the link(s) to back up these claims? Otherwise it reads like personal opinion, your own take on those articles.

    I would argue that we are not conservatives at heart, though I do agree that I have seen many opinions and behaviors alluding to not liking outsiders, and not being told what to do or how to think. Which is really just signaling a lack of open-mindedness and compassion and inclusiveness. I actually think in general and over time society improves on rights and freedoms and changes accordingly. Thanks to feminism, women's rights (which are human rights) have greatly expanded and improved. The happiest countries in the world are the ones that are reported to have the most equality. The #metoo and movement is a global phenomenon that is picked up in over 80 countries worldwide. Gender roles are changing as more women have entered the workforce. Closing the gender pay gap is on the agenda for many of the world's most democratic societies. Change is often uncomfortable and slower to come than it should, but overall the pendulum swings in that direction. Just look at recent legislation in Ireland alone.




  • ...to attract "women with short pink hair and a repeal sweatshirt.." Really? You're talking in extreme stereotypes that really has no basis in reality. Seriously- to begin with, what % of the population of women have short pink hair? It's very hard to take anyone seriously who reduces women to a caricature.
    ...
    Stereotypes can be mirthful, as this one was. I wouldn't agree with any call to quash them in the style of some despotic regime.
    ...
    Your bit about the clientele that is allegedly being lost forever at the publication of certain articles; do you have the link(s) to back up these claims? Otherwise it reads like personal opinion, your own take on those articles. ...
    This forum is called After Hours, being inspired by the high-spirited occasion when one finds oneself able to buy and consume booze with pals in a bar after that bar has officially shut. That is to say not a scientific journal, at all. Let the opinions flow I say and to hell with stuffy inhibition.




  • Feminism pushes for political, economic, and social equality of the sexes.

    At Trinity College, the country's most prestigious university, 60 percent of the students are of one sex, and 40 percent are of the other sex. Can you show me where feminists are campaigning for equality?




  • I refuse to buy a sub for it so i don't really read it much anymore. Hopefully it's not as riddled with errors as the indo is




  • Whereas papers like the Telegraph and Daily Mail will go on for a long time because they latch into human instincts. We're Conservative at heart, we don't like new things, we don't like outsiders and we don't like being told what to do and how to think.

    Woke-ism isn't natural. It's just over compensating for internal prejudices.
    Telegraph is for sale and expected to be sold for less than 1/3 of what of was bought for in 2004. Maybe they will start to attract pink haired women because conservatives obviously aren't enough




  • At Trinity College, the country's most prestigious university, 60 percent of the students are of one sex, and 40 percent are of the other sex. Can you show me where feminists are campaigning for equality?

    What's your suggestion except blaming women for it.


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  • meeeeh wrote: »
    What's your suggestion except blaming women for it.

    The biggest one would be reforming the primary school environment to respect the kinesthetic learning styles of boys, rather than rewarding only the ability to sit still and focus.




  • Personally I don't really care who reads the paper that I read.
    The paper stands or falls on it's own merits.
    I can't be bothered trying to second guess which tribe I'm supposed to belong to.




  • The biggest one would be reforming the primary school environment to respect the kinesthetic learning styles of boys, rather than rewarding only the ability to sit still and focus.

    And that would quite an endeavor but what if it doesn't improve the gender balance in Trinity?




  • At Trinity College, the country's most prestigious university, 60 percent of the students are of one sex, and 40 percent are of the other sex. Can you show me where feminists are campaigning for equality?

    So, are you I'm favour of gender quotas?




  • So, are you I'm favour of gender quotas?

    He's in favour of anything that will take those women down a peg.




  • Nope, Irish Times and The Guardian are going to
    find out sooner rather than later that Get Woke = Go Broke

    think I just vomited in my mouth




  • lawred2 wrote: »
    think I just vomited in my mouth


    It rhymes, so it must be true! :)




  • The level of ignorance in this thread is comical.




  • clearly the Irish Times editors agree with equating 'ageing' and 'homophobia' as negative attributes



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  • I hope not.



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