The strange affair of Dimmy Tooley

salmocab

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

And Maria Bailey went on national radio and gave a frankly bizarre interview about "humanity being crossed", so yep there's an underlying problem of a lack of accountability in general.

In fairness to the UK, at least their MP's stand down and resign, sometimes even in protest against their own party. Almost never happens here.

Our TDs do not take any responsibility and the party’s don’t care as it’s party before country (that’s every major party by the way)
They consider their jobs as a right not a privilege.

_Kaiser_

Flanagan on Newstalk at the moment talking about it trying to call it out as a very serious issue that leads legislation passed possibly open to legal challenge.

Getting a bit stuck when called out about similar examples though that would also be wrong.

Hardtochoose

Chambers on rte 1 now trying to explain this. Does she really expect anyone to believe her excuses

_Kaiser_

lola85 wrote: »

Why is everyone bringing up Maria Bailey here?
We know she is a lying so and so?
And hopefully she is voted out.
This thread is about FF although they are both the same.

Because it's a bit rich for FG to be trying to claim some sort of high ground on this one when their own members aren't exactly spotless.

It'll be interesting if it turns out that other parties are at the same thing.

Beechwoodspark

Chambers spinning furiously on RTÉ at mo

It honestly is like an episode of callans kicks

Colonel Claptrap

She must go.

Sorry about that

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Chambers spinning furiously on RTÉ at mo

It honestly is like an episode of callans kicks

"What happened to me..." vom

Snow Garden

What were they voting on? Chambers sounds like another fool. I suspect it happens a lot.

Beechwoodspark

Snow Garden wrote: »

What were they voting on? Chambers sounds like another fool. I suspect it happens a lot.

She’s digging holes left right and centre

She said a few mins ago that more tds have done it as well. I’d say it’s widespread and not just FF side

_Kaiser_

Snow Garden wrote: »

What were they voting on? Chambers sounds like another fool. I suspect it happens a lot.

She's suggesting it's pretty common practice anyway if I'm hearing it right

Boggles

They are all at it.

Any other TD scolding them will soon be apologizing themselves.

Sir Oxman

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/phantom-votes-fianna-fil-in-chaos-as-more-tds-dragged-into-scandal-38614256.html
"Timmy Dooley greets FF leader Micheal Martin to the Fianna Fail think in at the Louis Fitzgerald hotel in dublin yesterday, also included in centre is Niall Collins"

Colonel Claptrap

Now is the time for other TD's to come clean. The longer they leave it, the more silly they look.

The newspapers are probably tearing through Dail attendance records.

No doubt party whips are frantically making phone calls. Squeaky bums time.

I predict most, if not all major parties are involved.

BarryD2

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Chambers spinning furiously on RTÉ at mo

It honestly is like an episode of callans kicks

That's what I thought too and I reckon that the bould Oliver will get great miles out of it as well.

It was bizarre, she was asked a straight question yesterday - said she'd never done such a thing. Then it turns out today that she did vote for another colleague and only a few days ago.

The excuses were embarrassing to hear, does she think the public are complete eejits altogether? You could possibly understand her mistakenly pressing a button on the wrong seat but to then go and press her own button and not tell anyone she voted twice, is frankly deceitful.

Vote early and vote often seems to be story, probably all at it.

osarusan

Colonel Claptrap wrote: »

Now is the time for other TD's to come clean. The longer they leave it, the more silly they look.

The newspapers are probably tearing through Dail attendance records.

No doubt party whips are frantically making phone calls. Squeaky bums time.

I predict most, if not all major parties are involved.

This is what I think too.


I'd say the other parties are desperately trying to find out just much their own party is guilty of the same thing, so they will know what they can and can't criticise without it coming back to bite them.

Martin has set a precedent for himself, and the other parties, by suspending the members.

suicide_circus

In an unusual move for Irish politics, Martin did the right thing, applied actual consequences, in suspending Dooley and his buddy. Does he have the back bone to continue doing the right thing and suspend Chambers?

Snow Garden

BarryD2 wrote: »

That's what I thought too and I reckon that the bould Oliver will get great miles out of it as well.

It was bizarre, she was asked a straight question yesterday - said she'd never done such a thing. Then it turns out today that she did vote for another colleague and only a few days ago.

The excuses were embarrassing to hear, does she think the public are complete eejits altogether? You could possibly understand her mistakenly pressing a button on the wrong seat but to then go and press her own button and not tell anyone she voted twice, is frankly deceitful.

Vote early and vote often seems to be story, probably all at it.

Did she vote twice? Thats way more serious. I could understand her voting at the wrong seat but voting twice just compounds the issue. Our main party politicians are frauds and yet they paint the smaller parties as the dodgy ones.

suicide_circus

is this FF's Swing-gate?

Harry Palmr

Listening to the female TD who voted incorrectly I wondered by the seats are not numbered and assigned for the term.

Colonel Claptrap

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Listening to the female TD who voted incorrectly I wondered by the seats are not numbered and assigned for the term.

Mary Lou supports this message.

McMurphy

suicide_circus wrote: »

is this FF's Swing-gate?

Arguably this is worse, however I highly doubt FF will be the only ones who've been at it.

Tim nice but Dim just has been the first lad caught out, more to come from lots of party's would be my guess, watch this space.

Macy0161

Colonel Claptrap wrote: »

Now is the time for other TD's to come clean. The longer they leave it, the more silly they look.

The newspapers are probably tearing through Dail attendance records.

No doubt party whips are frantically making phone calls. Squeaky bums time.

I predict most, if not all major parties are involved.

It'd be strange for other parties to be so strong on the condemnation, unless they were fairly sure though?

Varadkar has said it happens when people are in the chamber, as did McDowell regarding the Seanad yesterday.

sliabh 1956

Loved Willie O Deas response Last night," Mr O'Dea said the issue had nothing to do with him and said he didn't hear what Mr Dooley said." and the three boys whispering together you just have to love Willie and his utter loyality to the Soldiers Of Destiny

Sir Oxman

Colonel Claptrap wrote: »

Now is the time for other TD's to come clean. The longer they leave it, the more silly they look.

The newspapers are probably tearing through Dail attendance records.

No doubt party whips are frantically making phone calls. Squeaky bums time.

I predict most, if not all major parties are involved.

Varadkar said he knows it goes on, other TDs voting on behalf of colleagues when in the chamber.
I don't think that's right either.
The easiest thing to do, press your own voting button ensuring it is your decision and half of them are gossiping about the place or not even there.
It's not as if the Dail Chamber is the size of the Phoenix Park and it's too difficult to waddle back to their seat.

Harry Palmr

Colonel Claptrap wrote: »

Mary Lou supports this message.

not sure what that means - the seats should be linked to the vote with a swipe card - so it's triggered fro that vote by the right TD in the right seat. Hell put in a fingerprint reader the seat arm!

careless sherpa

Justice minister now guilty as well

Colonel Claptrap

Charlie Flanagan is at it too.

suicide_circus

look at the state of Irish politics

fraudulent expenses claims

fraudulent voting in parliament

fraudulent injury claims

Boggles

They are all at. Flanagan just admitted to doing it, all though the example he gave was as funny as it was bull shít.

Ger Roe

Snow Garden wrote: »

Did she vote twice?

Yes... admitted it this morning, on Morning Ireland RTE Radio.

She said that the seats are not numbered or identified and she sat in the wrong one (beside her). She noticed she had voted in the wrong identity when her name didn't appear on the vote screen, so she hopped into her own seat and voted in her own name (also). I don't buy it for one second. She made two 'mistakes' and didn't admit it until she was caught out.

She also said that it's an easy 'mistake' to make and others have done it too. Even Cinema seats are numbered so that you take the right one - it's very convenient that the seats in the Dail aren't, particularly when it seems it was widely known that 'confusion' could and does arise.

There should be further independent investigation of this and heads should roll.

But will they?.... sure anyone can make a 'mistake', particularly when the system is set up to practically encourage it.

Colonel Claptrap

Lisa Chambers on newstalk now. Tongue tied.

McMurphy

Colonel Claptrap wrote: »

Charlie Flanagan is at it too.

The justice minister.

Just let that sink in.

sliabh 1956

Sean O Rourke now Fionan Sheehan really funny interview

Colonel Claptrap

Chambers trying to argue that because the vote wasn't close, her mistake was insignificant.

There is a formal record of how our public representatives have voted throughout history. We're constantly reminded of their voting record in leaflets through the letterbox.

If a vote is insignificant, why bother show up?

Bring back the division lobby I say!

lola85

This is serious.

It amounts to voting fraud.

Let’s hope it’s the end of the government.

suicide_circus

pat kenny gave chambers an extremely easy ride there

lola85

suicide_circus wrote: »

pat kenny gave chambers an extremely easy ride there

We know where Pats political party beliefs lie.

Ger Roe

Pat Kenny on Newstalk just suggested that the vote buttons should not activate until a sensor on the seat rules that the assigned deputy is sitting in it....

How would the system know which particular elected arse it was? We seem to elect a lot of them.:)

NIMAN

Examples need to be made, the public are losing faith in politicians.

This admitting only when you're caught isn't on. Nothing would have been said if they had got away with it.

They sound like my kids when they have been caught out, making up daft stories. They are adults ffs. Admit you were caught and take the punishment.

It's a joke. I wouldn't be happy until I see heads roll. Deliberate fraud.

McMurphy

blanch152 wrote: »

I am certain Johnny Dogs will be along shortly with a long list of FG TDs who have done the same. If not, we can look forward to a funny gif or picture.

Thanks for the namedropping Blanch, but I currently don't have a list of them.



Yet.

Colonel Claptrap

Ten Pin wrote: »

The simple solution for Dail votes is to have one TD from each side have an arm wrestle to decide the result.

If they don't like the result then do a best of 3, 5, 7 etc

They could really get a huge audience on Oireachtas TV and possibly make it Pay Per View. Sky might even buy the rights when the "votes" get ugly and a mass brawl breaks out.

A few Fr Jack style sneaky left hooks would add to the drama. Ceann Comhairle to act is referee.

They could call it..

The War of the Buttons: This Time It's Serious

Tie breaker - drinking contest in the Dail bar.

Colonel Claptrap

I guarantee you this is rife in the Seanad.

Itssoeasy

I've listened back to Lisa chambers on morning Ireland today and that was hardly a good interview. If Michael Martin wants to be seen as being a leader he should suspend her like he did with the other two yesterday.

suicide_circus

if TDs and senators are going to be forced to actually be present for votes they're going to need some significant allowance increases

Boggles

Itssoeasy wrote: »

I've listened back to Lisa chambers on morning Ireland today and that was hardly a good interview. If Michael Martin wants to be seen as being a leader he should suspend her like he did with the other two yesterday.

The Minister for Justice just admitted to doing it from "time to time" which is politic speak for multiple times, he also said other members do it.

Should Leo suspend him?

If Leo himself has done it, should he suspend himself?

Itssoeasy

suicide_circus wrote: »

if TDs and senators are going to be forced to actually be present for votes they're going to need some significant allowance increases

Why ? It's the basis fundamental things they are elected to do. At the very least when you Vote for someone in a dail election and they get elected you expect them to take a few seconds to vote so as the dail voting record is acurate. Well be in a bad place if you can't rely on the official voting records of our national parliament.

keano_afc

Nice to see the normally smug Makey-Uppy Chambers having to scramble a bit.

The absolute state of Irish politics though.

uck51js9zml2yt

suicide_circus wrote: »

if TDs and senators are going to be forced to actually be present for votes they're going to need some significant allowance increases

That they should be present and earn their money......That's a scandalous thing to say ...people should be doing the job for which they are paid.
As for increases. They get paid enough to do their job.
Wish I could get allowances on top of my wages for just turning up to work.

Itssoeasy

So from having heard from several politicians over today and yesterday on the radio it appears that it's not uncommon for TDs and senators while in their respective chambers but not at their seat to ask a colleague next to their seat to press the vote button for them but the point they stress is that they are in the chamber and fully aware of what is being done.The difference here with deputies Dooley and Collins and chambers is that there were votes cast by them or for them which did not accurately reflect the reality of the people present in the chamber.

Boggles

Itssoeasy wrote: »

So from having heard from several politicians over today and yesterday on the radio it appears that it's not uncommon for TDs and senators while in their respective chambers but not at their seat to ask a colleague next to their seat to press the vote button for them but the point they stress is that they are in the chamber and fully aware of what is being done.The difference here with deputies Dooley and Collins and chambers is that there were votes cast by them or for them which did not accurately reflect the reality of the people present in the chamber.

Do you honestly believe no TD has ever done the exact same thing as those 3?

It's absolute rife and if we have learned anything, pretty much common practice.

It's not that big a deal in all honesty, unsavory yes, but with the whip system hardly major fraud.