The Dominance of Dublin GAA *Mod warning post#1*

tritium

Ah you’re back on the time travel again! That’s easy to find in the search function too!

phillys nearly 34 by the way! He would have been a teenager when the funding started and it’s pretty difficult even for you to argue that grassroots funding is behind his involvement and success. If we take the like of Offaly and Kildares current progress to assess how long before grassroots development begins to regrow the talent pool in area where the GAA has slipped down the pecking order then there’s actually quite a lot of that dublin team who appear to really be a golden generation that dublin were very fortunate to get together at the one time.

I know btw that dublin are doing a fine job of looking to get kids in disadvantaged areas involved. It helps to have lads like Philly, from those areas, who actively give a lot back. You’re actually being completely disingenuous on the facilities piece- again use the search function and you’ll see the long discussion on the availability of land in Dublin. Dublin I’m afraid have to find solutions to problems other counties simply don’t have.

if seems to eat you away that dublin are successful. Perhaps it’s that you’re own county isn’t and it’s easier to blame someone else. Maybe you could try investing your energy in helping your own county prosper rather than bad mouth others. Possibly you could propose a split or indeed amalgamation of your own county as a solution to your county board?

Enquiring

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117771192#Comment_117771192

Yet again you show that you are uncapable to answer a question posed to you. It's a long list now. Let's give some examples. The most recent one:

What evidence have you provided for the financial imbalance prior to the Dublin funding scandal? No other county had access to the scheme and huge resources. Do you have anything to back up your claim to the contrary?

Why do Cork with a similar number of teams and half the population get nowhere near half the development funding Dublin get?

How did Dublin GAA see an unprecedented increase in standards across men's and women's football and hurling at senior, u20/21, minor and club level, all at the same as they received an unprecedented level of funding but it had nothing to do with that funding?

Let's start with those and see if you could give an answer. Or will you hide behind the search function again?

Phillip McMahon is 33 and he very much gained the benefit of professional coaching as it began in 2002. You seem to be trying to peddle a version of the primary school myth that has been busted many times over. The funding paid for coaches to look after many areas and age groups within clubs. One of their targets was to identify elite talent to send to development squads. These squads were and are highly financed with professional level facilities and coaching. This is what Offaly, Kildare, Meath etc are getting the benefit from now, nearly 2 decades later.

With the price of club membership in Dublin, it's clear that Dublin GAA have turned to the middle class to the detriment of working class areas. Another question you failed to answer is in relation to new clubs established in working class areas. They've been abandoned in search of elite level gains. If land was such an issue for clubs, why are the Dublin County Board spending over 20 million to purchase land that will only be used for elite performers?

Dublin being successful is not the issue. You've been told this. Even if Dublin won 0 titles from the millions pumped into them, I'd be saying the same stuff. One county having a development plan drawn up and funded for them is wrong. The huge increase in titles is just an obvious conclusion to a county being set up on a professional basis in amateur games. If it was any other county, people would be calling for them to be split as well.

FileNotFound

So have we all moved on now that Dublin have lost a game?

Gotten over the natural imbalances that nobody has a real solution to.

Now I expect Dublin to be back and challenging year on year but seeing a young enough Kerry and young Mayo gives me hope the coming years will be good and competitive.

Not sure what happened to the Dubs last weekend (From a may supporter here), seemed to fade and never recover, all credit to the mayo lads for keeping the heads up despite an truly awful first half performance. For Mayo it's great, for GAA it's great and for Dublin it's just one bad day in a few great years.

In my mind it does show that Dublins advantages do not guarantee victory (Good management and a great squad for a few years there did more), a past there best on the rebuild mayo were able for the challenge.

Having attended all the games between the sides in recent years (covid exceptions) I was always of the opinion that Dublin were not as far ahead as most will claim, few points in it most days. Maybe we can start putting pressure on GAA to use funding for other counties to help the imbalance rather than just focusing on Dublin itself.

GalwayMark

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117772470#Comment_117772470

Antrim plus Down need more dosh for the Gaelfast Project and that's not including the establishment of new clubs since both counties especially the former suffered from the stormont regime and then 'The Troubles' so Dublin should set up a fund paid by their various sponsors if they wish to maintain current spending patterns.

ArielAtom

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117772996#Comment_117772996

There have been some out there ideas, but this, you win the thread with this one. Good man, keep it up. Even the bould Equiring missed this one!!!

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117758892#Comment_117758892

I think that post confirms it. ;)

flasher0030

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117771192#Comment_117771192

I've been training the underage kids in our local dublin club for the past number of years. It's fantastic, and very exciting the number of kids involved and we do our best to make sure that they get enjoyment out of it.

But there's a massive level of resources involved. We have numberous footballs, hurling helmets, smaller sized goals, and an abundance of all of the items needed for a decentI training session for 60 kids. We have 2 paid coaches - are they the development officers referred to?? I don't know, I haven't really been following this thread much for the past while. All I know is they get paid - and for that they organise the various sessions and who will do what. It is a fantastic set-up. I was talking to one of these coaches recently. I was asking him about the money and the equipment etc. And he said they don't need to worry about it. That most of it is provided to them .I don't know if he meant from the GAA or for example sponsors. But from what I see, extra funding is a big factor.

ArielAtom

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117783848#Comment_117783848

Sounds like a great set up. Who pays the coaches? Not many clubs have two.

flasher0030

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117784819#Comment_117784819

Haven't a clue. And it could be buttons for all I know. But I thought it was fairly impressive to be able to get 2 people on board. And they seem to have a very good interest in it as well. Doing a really good job. From what I can see anyway. Fantastic club.

I'm a bit on the fence on the funding issue. It has obviously made a big difference to get a very good push-start for the county. But from what I have seen, the people involved in our local club anyway are brilliant at keeping that momentum going.

I know those comments are a bit vague and probably pointless overall!!!! But just my tuppence worth.

ArielAtom

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117784888#Comment_117784888

Do you mind me asking what club you are with?

Enquiring

Limerick winning another All Ireland with ease. This along with the improvements in Offaly, Meath, Kildare etc are making a mockery out of those who said funding had nothing to do with the improvement in results within Dublin GAA.

Enquiring

Another nail in the coffin to the argument that a large increase in professional coaches doesn't lead to improved standards. Meath's first All Ireland minor title since 1992. This hot on the heels of Offaly winning only their 2nd ever u20/21 All Ireland.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117772470#Comment_117772470

Dublin have turned to the middle classes , for what? How do you reckon when most of the players and just using the senior footballers as an example are from distinctly working class areas and backgrounds Ballymun, Coolock, Raheny, Glasnevin, etc... either way a person being middle class is some pariah now ? Haha All the Dublin players ‘work’ or are students."

an increase in standards are a result of hard work, teamwork, organization,

where other some other counties set low standards and fail to meet them, Dublin have raised the bar continuously, stood up..hard work, dedication, nurturing of talent from youth up to seniors, it’s paid off and will continue to.

tritium

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117815196#Comment_117815196

Man complains dublin are going to win forever and need to be split and hobbled.

Leinster council sees weaker counties need to have the game grown and developed at grassroots levels and uses a targeted model based on the parts of the dublin project that worked well. A dublin project that itself was a risky new take on games development that took many years to see its benefits

Other counties start to win and game begins to regrow in those counties from grassroots level up.

man complains it’s still not fair and just proves his point????? Even though his point was the exact opposite????

mind boggling- I commend the Leinster council for having the vision to develop the game in Leinster. In spite of the bitterness of the John Connellans of this world we’re actually seeing now how a targeted grassroots initiative can regrow the game in areas where it’s fallen behind. Leinster are seeing more spend per child than dublin by a considerable margin and we’re seeing that accelerate the resurgence. In time I expect Offaly or Kildare may have their own golden generations much as dublin were fortunate enough to, based on talented kids who would otherwise have been lost to the game.

perhaps that will create a competitiveness for the AI that the GAA has severely lacked for over a century. Certainly the only competitive provinces historically have been Leinster and Ulster, and neither province reflected that internal competitiveness in terms of consistently winning Sam. Perhaps raising all boats in Leinster will change that- I certainly hope so

the real shame is that other provinces are so happy to maintain their status quo and not grow their weaker members. I guess when your province is doing alright and one or two counties are the 800pound gorillas there’s no incentive to change. Certainly I think some hard questions should be asked if the likes of the Munster council.

Enquiring

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117818374#Comment_117818374

"What evidence have you provided for the financial imbalance prior to the Dublin funding scandal? No other county had access to the scheme and huge resources. Do you have anything to back up your claim to the contrary?

Why do Cork with a similar number of teams and half the population get nowhere near half the development funding Dublin get?

How did Dublin GAA see an unprecedented increase in standards across men's and women's football and hurling at senior, u20/21, minor and club level, all at the same as they received an unprecedented level of funding but it had nothing to do with that funding?"

Being unable to answer any questions put to you is a sure sign that your argument is weak, having to resort to lies and misrepresentation shows your argument is in tatters. Can you even attempt to answer the questions?

Dublin winning titles has never been the issue, having a development scheme drawn up and funded for them alone has been the issue. The titles gained off the back of the millions of euros were just the inevitable conclusion. The scandal was not that the coaching scheme came into being, it was that it was limited to one county only. I've always said this scheme should be spread country wide and it should continue in our capital within the 4 established counties. The only people opposed to the spreading of funding has been Dublin supporters who felt they deserved it above all others. The defenders of the financial disparity claimed that the funding had nothing to do with the incredible upturn in fortunes across all levels and codes within Dublin GAA. The money was just for school kids etc, this was clearly nonsense and the success of Offaly, Kildare, Meath etc just confirm it.

The millions of euros and huge influx of coaches, one per every senior club, led to over 100 titles won across men's and women's senior football and hurling, underage football and hurling and club football and hurling for Dublin GAA representatives. This is now undisputed and why there will always be an asterisks beside those titles.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117820244#Comment_117820244

Your arguments look very bare when Dublin aren't winning. The sooner weaker counties are amalgamated to bring a real challenge to the likes of Mayo, Tyrone, Donegal, Kerry, Dublin etc., the better as that is the only solution to bringing competitiveness. This year we have had those 5 teams being capable of winning the Championship which is more than most years.

Enquiring

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117823675#Comment_117823675

Dublin winning over 100 titles post funding very much backs up my arguments as well as the blindingly obvious. A huge increase in professional coaches leads to improved standards. Dublin were the only county given the funding to hire a huge number of coaches, one per every senior club. The results of this have been pointed out. First ever provincial hurling title with mostly their own players and a national league title, first ever women's All Ireland football title, they now are about to win 6, first ever All Ireland u20/21 title, they've won 5 in total now, first ever All Ireland club hurling title, 2 All Ireland's now, all this along with incredible improvements in men's football, underage football and hurling and club football and hurling.

Almost two decades later, some other counties have been provided with some additional funding to pay for coaches and guess what? Their standards have improved. Who would have thought? So as I and many others have pointed out numerous times, we have the blueprint on how to improve the level of Gaelic Games across the country. It's not amalgamations, it's not kicking counties out of the real championship, it's providing them with the resources and the plan to develop Gaelic Games in their county. It works. Along with increased funding across the board, we need to look at pooling sponsorship, limiting the spend on team preparations, splitting Dublin into 4 and restructuring our championships. We then are on our way to having competitions where participants are competing on an equal footing. Fair competitions in other words. These changes will improve the health of our games in every single county. It's what we should be aspiring to.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117824038#Comment_117824038

You are still not making sense. A decaying Dublin team won the senior Leinster this year, but were beaten at other grades, showing that the other counties are catching up quickly. Surely that means that you are only moaning about Dublin's historical success and that your arguments are now outdated and overtaken by events?

As I said already, the ONLY way to get more counties competitive is through amalgamations.

Enquiring

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117824874#Comment_117824874

You are completely missing the point. This is about every county competing on a level playing field. Dublin aren't and haven't been. They've been over funded which has led to huge levels of resources far beyond any other county. They spend 6 or 7 million more than most other counties. As I've said many times, the only surprise is that Dublin haven't won more than 100+ titles post funding.

Other counties also have access to resources that other counties can't gain. That's why pooled sponsorship, caps on spending etc needs to be introduced. We have hard evidence showing what funding can achieve. Dublin hurlers being a prime example. Going from minnows to competing at the top table. Amalgamating Dublin hurlers with someone else wasn't the answer, introducing effective coaching structures was. This costs money but this can be done across the country. I don't know why anybody would be against every county having an equal opportunity to compete?

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117825147#Comment_117825147

You can't have every county competing on a level playing field because of population. We are not like American franchises.

The only way, and it is the only way, to level the playing field is to amalgamate counties. Knocking one county off their perceived perch, in some sort of vindictive vendetta, so the three or four behind them can claim all the glory, doesn't level the playing field.

MayoAreMagic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117827880#Comment_117827880

Ths sport itself stands to benefit from a fair system. That is a good thing for the sport, therefore a good thing for everyone in the sport.

Who stood to benefit from loading one county up with cash while denying it to everyone else can you tell us?

MayoAreMagic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117828646#Comment_117828646

Not the greatest county team ive seen.

Greatest provincial team maybe? But then they never actually played another province to prove it.

Enquiring

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117826282#Comment_117826282

I'll tell you a way to guarantee a level playing field is not possible. You grant the county with largest population and already large resources their own personal development scheme and you pump millions into this scheme denying any other county access. It really bizarre when you think about it.

Funding works, we have evidence. Perennial whipping boys the Dublin hurlers turned things around dramatically off the back of a highly financed development plan. We see it all across Dublin GAA and now we see it with other counties who've received additional funding. This is the future! Funding counties fairly, splitting Dublin, pooling sponsorship and capping spending.

Enquiring

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117828646#Comment_117828646

In fairness, Limerick may be the greatest hurling team of all time but the JP money will always follow them. For Dublin it's worse because it was state funded as well as GAA funded. There will always be a few of these *** beside the 100+ titles Dublin have won post funding.

ShamoBuc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058005558/the-dominance-of-dublin-gaa-mod-warning-post-1

Mod Note

I've had to issue a few Warnings today. It might be an idea for posters to read the Opening Post above before posting again.

tritium

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117829039#Comment_117829039

Only in the head of a small number of folks who have no interest in the real story of this great team

for the rest they’ll agree with the record books that will call them the greatest of all time, just the same as they did for Kerry before them. A dominant team may get boring over time but that doesn’t take away from the talent that’s needs to stay at the top. They’ll realise that 15 lads went out and showed their brilliance against 15 other lads.

there won’t be any asterisks just because you wish it was so.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117832221#Comment_117832221

Fully agree.

The difference this year was the loss of Cluxton, McCaffrey, MacAuley, Mannion, O'Sullivan, Brogan, Connolly and other greats couldn't be carried anymore by Fenton, McCarthy, O'Callaghan and Rock.

We were really privileged to see the greatest of all time at their peak, but like all great teams, an era ends. Hopefully, it won't be long before Dublin rise again, as the core is still strong.

Enquiring

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117832221#Comment_117832221

Because you can't answer any questions to defend the funding disparity and you can't even mention the unprecedented turnaround in fortunes in areas apart from the men's senior footballers, it's obvious that you know the truth. It's all down to the millions of euros pumped into Dublin GAA by all of us.

Now, of course you're not going to admit to it. The same with many Dublin fans and it's understandable as to why that is. It's the same with many Limerick supporters now. It's hard to accept the fact that titles have been bought. But some people still believe the world is flat, that doesn't mean the rest of us have to go along with it.

The asterisk will always be there beside Dublin's 100+ titles this century. And Dublin fans who have read this thread know that more than most.

ArielAtom

The only asterisks are in the heads of a small number of die hard posters (who really dislike Dublin) in this thread. Lads, I wouldn't be worried about that. It's great to have it all in one thread. Long may it last.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117837068#Comment_117837068

Just checked on Wikipedia, and can't find any asterisks:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All-Ireland_Senior_Football_Championship_records_and_statistics#By_county

Checked a few other places as well, and can't find these fabled asterisks. You may be right that they are a temporary ethereal problem for a small number of people.