Clare GAA Discussion part 2 , No Purple Jumpers Allowed !!

mountgomery burns

Clareman wrote: »

A guy with 7 All Ireland medals versus a guy with none, even if he was just a sub on every team I'd pick him every day of the week, that kind of winning expierence/mentality trumps almost everything else.

I'd have TJ well ahead of Dan don't get me wrong, but that is complete nonsense.

Actually playing and winning individual accolades at the highest level would trump a bench warmer any day.

Clareman

mountgomery burns wrote: »

I'd have TJ well ahead of Dan don't get me wrong, but that is complete nonsense.

Actually playing and winning individual accolades at the highest level would trump a bench warmer any day.

I guess it's all open to debate and everyone is entitled to their own opinion and it could go to any sport, for example would you prefer Tger Woods or Colin Montgomery, Giggs or Gerrard, etc. etc. even the player with no wins would be better than 99.999% of other players.

mountgomery burns

Clareman wrote: »

I guess it's all open to debate and everyone is entitled to their own opinion and it could go to any sport, for example would you prefer Tger Woods or Colin Montgomery, Giggs or Gerrard, etc. etc. even the player with no wins would be better than 99.999% of other players.

Tiger Woods or Colin Montgomery, is this a wind up?

Feenie

It's a hurling thread lads, don't lose the run of it.

Clareman

I was speaking to someone earlier who was telling me that the poll on that site is a mockery, that the articles are already written about the results, thought I'd have a look at the results now and compare them to whatever is "releases"

Davy is on 83% of the vote
Brian Quinn on 44%
Brian Lohan on 88%
Frank Lohan on 79%
Liam Doyle on 58%
Seanie on 93%
Daly on 90%
Ollie on 49% (1,139 votes vs Galvin on 39% with 907)
Lynch on 49% (1,195 votes vs Kelly on 48% with 1,174)
Peter Duggan on 57%
Fingers on 48% (I think he's the only 1 that actually played 11)
Jamesey 88%
Shane O'Donnel (spelling from site) on 83%
Gilligan on 61%
Sparrow on 48%

Clareman

The couple of things that jumped out at me looking at the voting is that Duggan has only been intercounty a couple of years and he's by far our best 10, Jamesey on 1 wing and Ryan on the other would have been a better option. Conor Clancy to me was an under appreciated player, the amount of "dirty" work he did was unbelievable, watching back the 95 All Ireland I would nearly have him man of the match, for the second half of the 97 final he completely nullified the Tipp centre back who was cleaning up in the first half.

Figerty

Clareman wrote: »

The couple of things that jumped out at me looking at the voting is that Duggan has only been intercounty a couple of years and he's by far our best 10, Jamesey on 1 wing and Ryan on the other would have been a better option. Conor Clancy to me was an under appreciated player, the amount of "dirty" work he did was unbelievable, watching back the 95 All Ireland I would nearly have him man of the match, for the second half of the 97 final he completely nullified the Tipp centre back who was cleaning up in the first half.

The one thing Loughnane had going for him was he wasn't afraid to mix styles of hurlers.
If Clancy was in trouble as Centre forward. Fingers was put in there, Clancy went to FF. Touhy was different again, he mixed it up a different way. Any back worth their salt will figure any forward and nullify. That changing around would make a back have to mark the new man, and style. It's like Honan, vs Conlon vs Podge vs Conor McGrath vs O'Donnell..all different. if of course they weren't chasing 3 full backs on a two man full forward line. We never saw the destructive power of those players.

Clareman

We had a great mix alright but I always wonder how much better they would have been with some kind of puck out strategy, back then Fitzy just hit the ball as far as he could and they all fought for it, if the backs won the ball they played a diagional ball, Stephen Mc and Sparrow were great corner forwards if they could run onto ball, Forde was a class act as well.

The ever switching of Fingers and Clancy was a great tool to have in the back pocket and 1 that was used extremely well. Someone told me a few years back that Clancy was the most decorated Clare intercounty hurler, he was on the minor team in 89, the Junior team in 93, both All Irelands and 3 Munster, no-one else was on all of them, although Lynch was on the junior panel

Feenie

Clareman wrote: »

We had a great mix alright but I always wonder how much better they would have been with some kind of puck out strategy, back then Fitzy just hit the ball as far as he could and they all fought for it, if the backs won the ball they played a diagional ball, Stephen Mc and Sparrow were great corner forwards if they could run onto ball, Forde was a class act as well.

The ever switching of Fingers and Clancy was a great tool to have in the back pocket and 1 that was used extremely well. Someone told me a few years back that Clancy was the most decorated Clare intercounty hurler, he was on the minor team in 89, the Junior team in 93, both All Irelands and 3 Munster, no-one else was on all of them, although Lynch was on the junior panel

I'd imagine today David Mc or Tony Kelly, someone like that, might have the run on him, with the amount of underage success they've had. Plus quite abit at senior.

Clareman

Feenie wrote: »

I'd imagine today David Mc or Tony Kelly, someone like that, might have the run on him, with the amount of underage success they've had. Plus quite abit at senior.

Only 1 senior, no junior and no Munster titles.

Feenie

Clareman wrote: »

Only 1 senior, no junior and no Munster titles.

For tony:
All Irelands Senior: 1
U-21 All-Irelands:3
Munster under 21:3
Munster Minor: 2
NHL:1
Not to mention Fitzgibbon titles, individual accolades, etc. Minor things aswell like Munster hurling league not included.

Clareman

Feenie wrote: »

For tony:
All Irelands Senior: 1
U-21 All-Irelands:3
Munster under 21:3
Munster Minor: 2
NHL:1
Not to mention Fitzgibbon titles, individual accolades, etc. Minor things aswell like Munster hurling league not included.

We should start a Top Trumps type game, could be very interesting for example a lot of the players of the 90s have 3 Munsters but no league or 21s, the players now have under 21s, and a league

Figerty

Feenie wrote: »

For tony:
All Irelands Senior: 1
U-21 All-Irelands:3
Munster under 21:3
Munster Minor: 2
NHL:1
Not to mention Fitzgibbon titles, individual accolades, etc. Minor things aswell like Munster hurling league not included.

For Clancy or that Generation,.
2 All-irelands- Ground breaking
3 Munster champs- Ground breaking
1 Munster minor- Ground breaking
Harty? Not sure
Clare Club Champion

Not taking from any current clare player at all. but the context of the 90's team has also to be seen in breaking the mould.

Clareman

Figerty wrote: »

For Clancy or that Generation,.
2 All-irelands- Ground breaking
3 Munster champs- Ground breaking
1 Munster minor- Ground breaking
Harty? Not sure
Clare Club Champion

Not taking from any current clare player at all. but the context of the 90's team has also to be seen in breaking the mould.

Flannan's won the All Ireland colleges in 91 and were runners up the year before (I think), Jamesey was definitely on 1 of those teams, as was Martin Daly and a lot of the 90s team. There's a lot of club medals going around for the teams of the 90s as well but Tony would have a Munster Club medal as well, Clancy wouldn't

Clareman

Wow, looking at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dr._Croke_Cup Flannan's had some roll in the late 80s/early 90s, contested 4 All Ireland finals

Feenie

Clareman wrote: »

Flannan's won the All Ireland colleges in 91 and were runners up the year before (I think), Jamesey was definitely on 1 of those teams, as was Martin Daly and a lot of the 90s team. There's a lot of club medals going around for the teams of the 90s as well but Tony would have a Munster Club medal as well, Clancy wouldn't

In fairness it always looked like Clare we going to dominate from the outset of the 90s.
Minor AI final in 89', Junior success as before mentioned, clubs and schools, etc. At the outset of the decade it looked the same for us with all the under 21 success we had and aswell minor. In the 90s we were alot more lucky. Their generation weren't struck by illnesses, injuries, retirements and everything else that struck our 2013 crop.

Clareman

The 90s were a very strange times, as you said you had the ground work done in the 80s and had some very strong clubs teams, but I think we made a lot of our own luck, especially in the dressing room, speaking to former players you'd often hear of teams in the 80s who didn't get along with cliques in the dressing room, that all went out the window in the 90s. We also had a manager who wasn't willing to make changes or trust players, after the league final in 95 it was clear we needed more speed in the forwards so Gerry Mc and Cyril Lyons were dropped, other players had nightmares in Munster finals the previous years but they were stood by.

Saying that, I think some players were hung onto a bit too long and when it was clear that their places weren't in trouble the rot set in, the fact that none of the players from the minor team in 97 made it shows what a lost opportunity it was, maybe a couple of illnesses/replacements might have kept things going a bit long, but if and or buts don't win anything

Feenie

I've been wondering a lot about some of the match ups at county level for Clare. It's a big thing to consider in the modern day who should mark who.
Any thoughts, lads?

Figerty

Clareman wrote: »

Flannan's won the All Ireland colleges in 91 and were runners up the year before (I think), Jamesey was definitely on 1 of those teams, as was Martin Daly and a lot of the 90s team. There's a lot of club medals going around for the teams of the 90s as well but Tony would have a Munster Club medal as well, Clancy wouldn't

1987-88? Shannon and Flannans final or semi final?

Clareman

Clareman wrote: »

I was speaking to someone earlier who was telling me that the poll on that site is a mockery, that the articles are already written about the results, thought I'd have a look at the results now and compare them to whatever is "releases"

Davy is on 83% of the vote
Brian Quinn on 44%
Brian Lohan on 88%
Frank Lohan on 79%
Liam Doyle on 58%
Seanie on 93%
Daly on 90%
Ollie on 49% (1,139 votes vs Galvin on 39% with 907)
Lynch on 49% (1,195 votes vs Kelly on 48% with 1,174)
Peter Duggan on 57%
Fingers on 48% (I think he's the only 1 that actually played 11)
Jamesey 88%
Shane O'Donnel (spelling from site) on 83%
Gilligan on 61%
Sparrow on 48%

https://www.clareecho.ie/clares-greatest-hurling-team-of-last-three-decades-selected/

Amazingly Kelly gets the same amount of votes as i saw Lynch on last night and won the position
1: Davy Fitzgerald (Sixmilebridge) (2,921)

2: Brian Quinn (Tulla) (1,787)
3: Brian Lohan (Wolfe Tones na Sionna) (2,539)
4: Frank Lohan (Wolfe Tones na Sionna) (2,109)

5: Liam Doyle (Bodyke) (1,332)
6: Seánie McMahon (St Josephs Doora/Barefield) (1,989)
7: Anthony Daly (Clarecastle) (1,899)

8: Ollie Baker (St Josephs Doora/Barefield) (1,128)
9: Tony Kelly (Ballyea) (1,195)

10: Peter Duggan (Clooney/Quin) (1,069)
11: PJ ‘Fingers’ O’Connell (O’Callaghans Mills) (882)
12: Jamesie O’Connor (St Josephs Doora/Barefield) (1,612)

13: Shane O’Donnell (Éire Óg) (1,372)
14: Niall Gilligan (Sixmilebridge) (1,010)
15: Ger ‘Sparrow’ O’Loughlin (Clarecastle) (765)

Figerty

Feenie wrote: »

In fairness it always looked like Clare we going to dominate from the outset of the 90s.
Minor AI final in 89', Junior success as before mentioned, clubs and schools, etc. At the outset of the decade it looked the same for us with all the under 21 success we had and aswell minor. In the 90s we were alot more lucky. Their generation weren't struck by illnesses, injuries, retirements and everything else that struck our 2013 crop.

You must be joking. I was at that age at that time. Cork were dominant, Tipp were flying, we were a poor relation, won on minor munster championship. No under 21 champions ship. We didn't win a munster Championship match betwee 88 adn 92?

The Junior final was against Kilkenny third team. They had won the final the year before. No discredit to the players involved. The only thing that changed in Clare was Loughnane driving wolfe Tones in Shannon, Clare minors and eventually Senior. We had improved because clare followed the Offaly underage model.
You also forget Flannans were half 'boarders' at the time as well with Galway, Limerick and Tipp. Brian Geary and Rory Gantley were some of the last names. David Forde even made if from Ogonesloe.

It's simple, Loughane was the key factor. A brilliant lunatic.

Figerty

Clareman wrote: »

https://www.clareecho.ie/clares-greatest-hurling-team-of-last-three-decades-selected/

Amazingly Kelly gets the same amount of votes as i saw Lynch on last night and won the position
1: Davy Fitzgerald (Sixmilebridge) (2,921)

2: Brian Quinn (Tulla) (1,787)
3: Brian Lohan (Wolfe Tones na Sionna) (2,539)
4: Frank Lohan (Wolfe Tones na Sionna) (2,109)

5: Liam Doyle (Bodyke) (1,332)
6: Seánie McMahon (St Josephs Doora/Barefield) (1,989)
7: Anthony Daly (Clarecastle) (1,899)

8: Ollie Baker (St Josephs Doora/Barefield) (1,128)
9: Tony Kelly (Ballyea) (1,195)

10: Peter Duggan (Clooney/Quin) (1,069)
11: PJ ‘Fingers’ O’Connell (O’Callaghans Mills) (882)
12: Jamesie O’Connor (St Josephs Doora/Barefield) (1,612)

13: Shane O’Donnell (Éire Óg) (1,372)
14: Niall Gilligan (Sixmilebridge) (1,010)
15: Ger ‘Sparrow’ O’Loughlin (Clarecastle) (765)

Lynce was far better at midfield than Baker!

Clareman

Figerty wrote: »

1987-88? Shannon and Flannans final or semi final?

89 final in the Park, terrible match if I remember correctly, Shannon had a serious team, Lohan was only a sub....

Clareman

Figerty wrote: »

Lynce was far better at midfield than Baker!

They did it number against number, Baker at 8, Lynch & Kelly at 9

Figerty

Clareman wrote: »

They did it number against number, Baker at 8, Lynch & Kelly at 9

Ya and that makes a mockery of it!

letowski

The nominations of the positions are all over the place. Kelly at midfield and Podge at center forward make no sense, you could count their career championship appearances in those positions probably in 1 hand combined.

I think the format is done all wrong for the forwards. There should be just a vote for your 6 best forwards and just organize them into positions after. Fingers was a good player for us but he is clearly not in the top 6 best forwards we have produced in the last 3 decades.

Lynch is easily the best midfielder we have produced in the last 3 decades in every department (performances, consistency, longevity, individual honours, etc).

Its nonsense to be honest, just a bit of a laugh.

Clareman

The fact that they've the votes still up and Lynch won with 1,255 votes vs 1,197 for Kelly shows how it was never a vote but an article

Banner fights back

Clare GAA have announced details for the formats of the respective county club competitions for both hurling and football. A lot to digest but the main stories are as follows.

At least 2 games for every club participating in the respective hurling and football championships.

There will be no relegation in 2020 but there will be promotion for the respective intermediate and junior club winners in both codes. Two teams will get relegated for the 2021 championships though.

The possibility of both the senior hurling and football finals to be played on the same weekend of the last weekend of September.

All games to finish on the day. No replays. Potential of penalty shoot outs also.

I'm sure that they will be some quite interesting debate in the coming days re championship structures. Next weeks virtual county board meeting will be rather interesting I'd say.

Gael85

Banner fights back wrote: »

Clare GAA have announced details for the formats of the respective county club competitions for both hurling and football. A lot to digest but the main stories are as follows.

At least 2 games for every club participating in the respective hurling and football championships.

There will be no relegation in 2020 but there will be promotion for the respective intermediate and junior club winners in both codes. Two teams will get relegated for the 2021 championships though.

The possibility of both the senior hurling and football finals to be played on the same weekend of the last weekend of September.

All games to finish on the day. No replays. Potential of penalty shoot outs also.

I'm sure that they will be some quite interesting debate in the coming days re championship structures. Next weeks virtual county board meeting will be rather interesting I'd say.

When are championship draws been made?

Will Gary Brennan and Jamie Malone be togging out with Clare footballers now?

Banner fights back

Gael85 wrote: »

When are championship draws been made?

Will Gary Brennan and Jamie Malone be togging out with Clare footballers now?

I've no idea 're championship draws.

As for Gary Brennan and Jamie Malone returning to don the saffron and blue for Clare? Jamie doesn't think that it would be fair for the other lads that have been slogging it out since late October of last year if he were to return to the set up according to an interview he did with the Clare Echo.

As for Gary while I don't have definitive info 're his intentions, IMO I'll be surprised if he returns this year. 2021 looks like the year both lads will return all being well.