Is work place bullying common and what are your experiences with it?

freshpopcorn

I have seen two cases in the news lately where men have committed suicide and they were being bullied at work according to their families.


At the moment I work on the family farm. So, we have the occasional argument but I don't think bullying happens.(In my situation).
However when I did work in hotels/restaurants and at college I saw a good bit of it. It was mixture of people trying to get ahead and some people just liked mocking/putting people down.
I do think work place bullying can be hard to prove. It's really one persons word against another's and it can be hard to pin it down. Even with people taking notes of incidents/etc.
I have heard of one woman and she was a bully at work and she used always try and get her colleagues in trouble.


Is work place bullying common and what are your experiences with it?

Passive aggressive behaviour is a regular occurrence, I don't validate it.

EmmetSpiceland

Yes, it’s common enough. There are some horrible people promoted into management positions who have no business being there but there are also those out there who feel that being expected to do work is a form of bullying.

chrissb8

A new person was hired in our place and started talking to our boss about how one of the loyal staff members was looking for a job and had gone for interviews.

This loyal staff member is in the throws of organising a wedding and is not moving anywhere for anytime yet and ultimately ended up saying to the new woman, in passing, as you do that she wants to work with animals in the future and my boss knows this already. My boss rang said loyal staff member and she had to explain it was all lies as she wasn't looking for a new job or went to any interviews.

No idea why the new person was making up lies, anyway she was told she could forget about continuing on in our place or even her probation and sent her packing. She was a snake from the get go and I'm glad my boss knew what was up right away. Someone like that is just going to push and bully as they can't function as a normal social person. Pathetic if it wasn't so sad. No wait it is just pure pathetic.

Mr. Incognito

I work in law.

I also volunteer in employment in FLAC centres.

Its very common. There are a lot of large cases.

In my experience it is a huge problem in the public sector as no one can be fired and HR are not very good at dealing with it and in fact can make it much much worse essentially blaming the victim which exaserbates the problem.

gaelwave

Scum who prey on the weak.

kravmaga

Just like in the school playground, Bullying continues into adult life and in the workplace , it goes on in all sectors of society, public and private sectors

Always Tired

IME it's worse in Ireland than in the other 2 countries I've worked in, by far. Seen other people get a terrible time, and had some managers try it on me, when I stood up to them I was either fired or hours cut or something like that.

Irish society has a very ingrained sense of 'you must kiss the feet of those in authority' and people get massive power trips if they become the assistant to the assistant manager's dog's secretary. I guess it's the old Catholicism.

If it happens to you, write down exactly what is said/happens and times and dates. Keep the log updated as it will be your only ally and best evidence. Don't expect HR to help, they're there to protect the employer, not you. And don't expect any other employees to have your back, most likely when push comes to shove they will leave you swinging in the wind. Big reason the bullying is so rife in Ireland is that the workers have no balls and won't stick up for themselves, they'll complain but when it comes down to actually taking action they won't want to know, they will be happy to let you stick your neck out while they save their own.

tritium

Yes I think it’s pretty common. Gaslighting, put downs and generally trying to belittle other employees to build yourself up are all things I’ve seen across a variety of industries. Sadly it’s very common in management and senior management, where in many cases a business is far less likely to actually take action against it

ArnoldJRimmer

EmmetSpiceland wrote: »

Yes, it’s common enough. There are some horrible people promoted into management positions who have no business being there but there are also those out there who feel that being expected to do work is a form of bullying.

Agree with this. There are some people out there who seem to take joy in making others miserable. The worst case I saw was from a junior employee bullying her manager on a daily basis, but getting away with it as Daddy was high up in the company. And her manager was both too embarrassed and too nice a person to pursue a complaint

But I've also worked with some absolutely useless ****s who believe that any form of instruction or criticism is bullying, and run to HR at the drop of a hat

mad muffin

Yes very common… when I’m around.

Tacklebox

mad muffin wrote: »

Yes very common… when I’m around.

Is that your good self Brian

James Bond Junior

Extremely common in schools amongst teachers and impossible to stamp out. There is no HR worth talking about either in which to take a complaint to.

Tacklebox

tritium wrote: »

Yes I think it’s pretty common. Gaslighting, put downs and generally trying to belittle other employees to build yourself up are all things I’ve seen across a variety of industries. Sadly it’s very common in management and senior management, where in many cases a business is far less likely to actually take action against it

Oddly these bullies are either quite attractive looking or as rough as road kill on a wet morning....

freshpopcorn

James Bond Junior wrote: »

Extremely common in schools amongst teachers and impossible to stamp out. There is no HR worth talking about either in which to take a complaint to.

I've heard of so many teachers being bullied at work.
Mainly because one teacher puts in a big effort to do something and they get jealous!

James Bond Junior

freshpopcorn wrote: »

I've heard of so many teachers being bullied at work.
Mainly because one teacher puts in a big effort to do something and they get jealous!

Huge rivalries can develop along with cliques and a heavily tipped gender balance thrown in means they can be pretty toxic environments. That said I've made friends for life on school staffs I've worked on so it's not all bad.

Your Face

Yes it's common and no, nothing will be done about it.

Always Tired

Always Tired wrote: »

If it happens to you, write down exactly what is said/happens and times and dates. Keep the log updated as it will be your only ally and best evidence. Don't expect HR to help, they're there to protect the employer, not you. And don't expect any other employees to have your back, most likely when push comes to shove they will leave you swinging in the wind. Big reason the bullying is so rife in Ireland is that the workers have no balls and won't stick up for themselves, they'll complain but when it comes down to actually taking action they won't want to know, they will be happy to let you stick your neck out while they save their own.

This. It's absolutely imperative that people note everything - dates, times, locations, witnesses. I would add: note where the cctvs are around the premises, and be aware that there are often cctvs on a premises whose location is only known to senior or security people.

Keep your office or whatever door open and always try to avoid being alone with the person. Move the 'Record' button to the front of your phone and press it if said person approaches (whether it will be permissible or not to enter it in a court of law is not relevant at this stage; you will be able to play it for more important people so that they understand what's happening). Similarly, if it's necessary and you can discreetly have the camera on your laptop recording, go for it. The employer has a legal duty to provide a safe working environment and you have a legal right to work free from fear, threats, etc.

Lastly, in my experience it is not true that there's some Irish cultural worldview where everybody keeps their heads down. If you really need the job and your position is not secure, this may well be the best course of action for you. However, plenty of people in secure positions in the workplace have no problem keeping an eye out for more vulnerable colleagues. Bullies have patterns, and they choose their targets. Senior management very often are aware of past behaviour because there have been previous complaints. In every workplace, the bully will have enemies who'll be delighted to see their destruction. Workplaces are not some monolithic entity. Talk to people and you'll get a feel for past behaviour, the politics of the company/organisation, and if you keep asking the right questions names of previous victims. A union representative is often a repository of information in this regard. If anybody remembers the Kate Fitzgerald suicide back in 2011, following a piece she wrote about being bullied at work, very shortly after her death another employee's claim of bullying by a manager in the same firm was quickly settled. A coincidence? Be assured you're not alone and that there are people who are at the stage in their careers where they'd be keen to settle scores by helping you. There are still, despite the cynics, also very many people who genuinely revile bullies and would feel ethically compelled to help you. Record everything.

Snow Garden

Very common in US multinationals. So many people stupidly buy into the Corporate Dream with the promises of band/title promotions and bonuses and payrises whilst unknowingly giving their soul and the best part of their lives to Corporations and managers that do not care about them or their families.

These people are working 50+ hours a week, checking/sending emails in the evenings and weekends and getting so stressed that they (a) don't notice they are being bullied and (b) don't notice they are bullying others in order to climb that magical corporate ladder....

The Americans love the Irish because they buy into the Corporate nonsense hook, line and sinker. Something to do with our colonial past methinks. They don't get the same obedience from mainland Europe, India, Mexico, Malaysia, China etc.

petes

Reckon I got lucky, was in one place for 8 years and 11 in current job. Haven't seen any of it!

JupiterKid

Endured horrendous bullying from my boss about a decade ago...

...led to me having a complete breakdown. Took a very long time to recover from. Rebuilt my life and career since.

I still have anger at what happened but he did get his comeuppance.

IAMAMORON

It is everywhere, it always has been, it always will be. Bullying is a fact of life. Everyone goes through it. I learnt how to deal with bullies when I was in school. If you do not stand up to a bully your done. That is what they do, they bully.

I have a degree in Business Management. At no stage did I ever study workplace bullying until I started working. You deal with it and get on with it. If you lie down with it, so be it.

99 times out of 100 the stakeholders of any business are well aware it is going on. The attitude will always be to look the other way as long as profits are made and productivity and budgets etc are working. In most cases top management encourage it.

Every employee handbook will give guidelines on how to address the problem. Every decent bully on the face of the planet works out how exactly to bully everyone by the book. That's how they do.

andekwarhola

Think I've also been lucky as in I've never been bullied myself or witnessed anything toward others outside of usual personality clashes since I started my career

I had a summer job in a factory years ago and a female manager really disliked me for no apparent reason but it was actually amusing to rile her up even more by being extra diligent, polite and pretending not to register any of the comments.

Toots

JupiterKid wrote: »

Endured horrendous bullying from my boss about a decade ago...

...led to me having a complete breakdown. Took a very long time to recover from. Rebuilt my life and career since.

I still have anger at what happened but he did get his comeuppance.

Same here. Two managers made my life complete hell and I ended up walking out of the job and straight round to my GP. I was so hysterical I could barely talk, and he just signed me off work straight away and it was a good few months before I went back, with a transfer to a different location.

Tell me how

It definitely exists in a lot of places but is by and large less of an issue I think now than years ago. I worked with a Fortune 500 company 10 years ago where it started at the very top with every layer of management beneath exhibiting similar personalities and therefore exerting similar pressures on people. A friend did an interview there and actually considered making a complaint after it given what was said to him during it but felt there was no point.
They did change their style some years ago after some public stories of the ethos that existed there.

On the other side, I've seen someone accuse their line manager of bullying them simply in asking them to perform their job as they were contracted to do, they then went on stress leave and even though the claim was found to be entirely unfounded, the line manager took the accusation badly and she left the company soon after.

Necro

It's incredibly common alright. And not just in the big multinationals.

I find retail, or my experiences with it anyways being a playground for the narcissistic types. Particularly in the family run businesses who have no issue in belittling their staff on a daily basis.

Worked for a former TD who ran a supermarket in my town before. It was commonplace for him to storm in and just single out one person on a daily basis for a tirade of abuse and berating.

Then in another place, a filling station - the owner would stagger over drunk from the pub across the road and scream and shout at staff for no reason.

And in yet another filling station, a bully of a boss who would regularly reduce the female staff to tears with abuse.

Strangely I was never targeted, although it came close once - ironically after I had handed in my notice to leave anyways.

One eyed Jack

Always Tired wrote: »

IME it's worse in Ireland than in the other 2 countries I've worked in, by far. Seen other people get a terrible time, and had some managers try it on me, when I stood up to them I was either fired or hours cut or something like that.

It wouldn’t be difficult for workplace bullying and harassment to be more common in Ireland than numerous other countries around the globe. Though in making the point you did say it was in your experience so there’s no way to quantify anecdotal evidence in relation to actual prevalence.

Irish society has a very ingrained sense of 'you must kiss the feet of those in authority' and people get massive power trips if they become the assistant to the assistant manager's dog's secretary. I guess it's the old Catholicism.

Bollocks, you imagine your observations are a uniquely Irish phenomenon? Is that based upon a comparison with the two other countries you worked in? Because there are whole sectors of Irish society where there is no ingrained sense of respect for authority, and there are sectors which do respect authority. In Irish workplaces as in workplaces around the globe, there is an understanding of respect for authority, fcukall to do with Catholicism :rolleyes:

If it happens to you, write down exactly what is said/happens and times and dates. Keep the log updated as it will be your only ally and best evidence. Don't expect HR to help, they're there to protect the employer, not you. And don't expect any other employees to have your back, most likely when push comes to shove they will leave you swinging in the wind. Big reason the bullying is so rife in Ireland is that the workers have no balls and won't stick up for themselves, they'll complain but when it comes down to actually taking action they won't want to know, they will be happy to let you stick your neck out while they save their own.

And that’s the kind of advice that nobody should listen to. By your own standards you claim Irish workers “have no balls”, and in the same breath you’re advising that people who are being bullied shouldn’t first go to HR, and shouldn’t expect support from their co-workers? So... record everything but don’t do anything about it, essentially?

My experiences of workplace harassment and how it is handled couldn’t be more different - from the support coming from Management, HR and from co-workers, they couldn’t have been more supportive once they were aware of what was going on. How did they become aware of it? Because unlike your advice I will always encourage people to out the person bullying and harassing them. People who are of a mind to bully and harass others, thrive on secrecy. They bank on their victims experiencing humiliation to the degree that their victims would be ashamed if anyone were to find out. Their victims aren’t the people who should be ashamed, they already feel like they “don’t have any balls” because they have been humiliated into submission. That’s why workplace bullying and harassment tends to go under the radar and thrive in secrecy - nothing whatsoever to do with people willing to do nothing. Many more times people simply aren’t aware of it until in the most extreme circumstances - it’s too late.

Upforthematch

One eyed Jack wrote: »

My experiences of workplace harassment and how it is handled couldn’t be more different - from the support coming from Management, HR and from co-workers, they couldn’t have been more supportive once they were aware of what was going on. How did they become aware of it? Because unlike your advice I will always encourage people to out the person bullying and harassing them. People who are of a mind to bully and harass others, thrive on secrecy. They bank on their victims experiencing humiliation to the degree that their victims would be ashamed if anyone were to find out. Their victims aren’t the people who should be ashamed, they already feel like they “don’t have any balls” because they have been humiliated into submission. That’s why workplace bullying and harassment tends to go under the radar and thrive in secrecy - nothing whatsoever to do with people willing to do nothing. Many more times people simply aren’t aware of it until in the most extreme circumstances - it’s too late.

Totally agree with this - it's so important for anyone bullied to talk about it - start first with trusted family and friends (not necessarily work colleagues). Use this to get your thoughts together, getting another person's perspective is critical.

Compare it to this comment earlier in the thread about bullies who are

gaelwave wrote: »

Scum who prey on the weak.

Someone being bullied is not weak - they are being intimidated.

Shine a light on it - and call it out directly/via HR/via your manager/solicitor.

StinkyMunkey

When I was young and naive I did take some ****, it would have certainly consistuted bulling.

Now I'll fcuk you to a height and take no **** off anyone. If I deserve a bollicking, I take it and move on. But I cannot abide a bully, I'll quiet happily go out of my way to fcuk one over as I have in the past.

Mad_maxx

freshpopcorn wrote: »

I have seen two cases in the news lately where men have committed suicide and they were being bullied at work according to their families.


At the moment I work on the family farm. So, we have the occasional argument but I don't think bullying happens.(In my situation).
However when I did work in hotels/restaurants and at college I saw a good bit of it. It was mixture of people trying to get ahead and some people just liked mocking/putting people down.
I do think work place bullying can be hard to prove. It's really one persons word against another's and it can be hard to pin it down. Even with people taking notes of incidents/etc.
I have heard of one woman and she was a bully at work and she used always try and get her colleagues in trouble.


Is work place bullying common and what are your experiences with it?

Even its clear as crystal what's happening, management will usually do nothing, they will often circle the wagons and if anything turn on the one complaining

Ineedaname

It's quite common. Never experienced it myself thankfully but I've witnessed it. Family run businesses in particular are the worst for it.

My GF experienced some a while back. She worked in a business where her superior was a daughter of the owner. It started small but built up over time. It involved being given unrealistic deadlines, being blamed for failures, spreading rumors among staff, holidays cancelled last minute, exclusion from social events and (ironically) a false accusation of bullying. Brought it to the powers that be only to be told to "toughen up". It got so bad that some mornings she was in tears going to work. Eventually enough was enough and she handed in her notice.

My GF is no pushover and well able to stand up for herself but bullying is something that can really wear you down and destroy your self-esteem.

Mad_maxx

chrissb8 wrote: »

A new person was hired in our place and started talking to our boss about how one of the loyal staff members was looking for a job and had gone for interviews.

This loyal staff member is in the throws of organising a wedding and is not moving anywhere for anytime yet and ultimately ended up saying to the new woman, in passing, as you do that she wants to work with animals in the future and my boss knows this already. My boss rang said loyal staff member and she had to explain it was all lies as she wasn't looking for a new job or went to any interviews.

No idea why the new person was making up lies, anyway she was told she could forget about continuing on in our place or even her probation and sent her packing. She was a snake from the get go and I'm glad my boss knew what was up right away. Someone like that is just going to push and bully as they can't function as a normal social person. Pathetic if it wasn't so sad. No wait it is just pure pathetic.

Worked on a dairy farm in new Zealand twenty years ago for six months, owner was rarely there so had two managers running each side of a two thousand acre farm, I answered to a ferociously anti Catholic scot who used to drive straight into me with her quad bike on a regular basis, she also used to regularly tell me she would p1ss herself laughing if I got attacked by the bull, the day omagh was bombed and twenty nine people were killed, I heard a report on the radio in the milking shed and went to turn it up, this delightful human asked me

" why are you listening to that, none of that effects us milking cows here"

Would take an hour to list all the incidents and utterings

Some people are just evil

Dalomanakora

Long post -

I've experienced it, unfortunately, along with sexual harassment in the same place. Reports to HR led to me being dragged into a meeting with no warning, with the HR manager and my area manager, and told I just wanted to get money from them when I reported my manager.


From certain male staff, I'd be told things like "best place for you" when kneeling down to get something, if they called the place to ask about their roster and i answered, they'd tell me they were masturbating to my voice. One of them came in drunk one night (he wasn't on shift) and grabbed my backside twice while my manager laughed. After reporting these things, I had my hours cut in half, then again down to 8 hours a week (from 48-60).

It culminated in a manager physically assaulting me. I walked out on the spot. I sent my resignation, and the same HR manager as before withheld my final wages and annual leave owed (about 3k all in) because she wanted me to talk to her about coming back to work. Probably because she knew I had enough evidence to sue, having been there a few years.


Unfortunately I was a scared, depressed 21 year old with anxiety so rather than take it much further, I sought counselling because I couldn't cope any longer. That was an enormous Irish company.



Nowadays, it doesn't happen. I'm a much more confident woman and I'm not a mentally unstable wreck :pac: if someone makes a snarky comment, i immediately question what they mean, and keep asking them to repeat it, until they drop the subject because they know I've called them out.

In the company I work for now (another large Irish one), HR while obviously being there to protect the company, fully understand the need to support their staff. Any issue I've raised with my area manager has been immediately discussed, dealt with and resolved to my satisfaction. The HR staff engage with us, the CEO comes to visit semi-regularly, and rather than try to catch anyone out, he'd give us a hug and tell us how great we're doing. The level of support is enormous in comparison to any job I've had tbh and I've never heard of bullying being an issue in the company thankfully!

Sheep Shagger

Snow Garden wrote: »

Very common in US multinationals. So many people stupidly buy into the Corporate Dream with the promises of band/title promotions and bonuses and payrises whilst unknowingly giving their soul and the best part of their lives to Corporations and managers that do not care about them or their families.

These people are working 50+ hours a week, checking/sending emails in the evenings and weekends and getting so stressed that they (a) don't notice they are being bullied and (b) don't notice they are bullying others in order to climb that magical corporate ladder....

The Americans love the Irish because they buy into the Corporate nonsense hook, line and sinker. Something to do with our colonial past methinks. They don't get the same obedience from mainland Europe, India, Mexico, Malaysia, China etc.

This is absolutely bang on the mark.

Experienced it first hand, got out and I still look back and think what the fook was I doing - never ever again.

freshpopcorn

The two cases I was referring to in my OP are here about the suspected bullying happening!

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/family-of-man-who-took-own-life-after-alleged-bullying-at-work-accuse-hse-of-airbrushing-his-case-38046441.html


https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/father-took-own-life-over-bullying-inquest-hears-coworkers-evidence-38063185.html

Sir Oxman

Ineedaname wrote: »

It's quite common. Never experienced it myself thankfully but I've witnessed it. Family run businesses in particular are the worst for it.

My GF experienced some a while back. She worked in a business where her superior was a daughter of the owner. It started small but built up over time. It involved being given unrealistic deadlines, being blamed for failures, spreading rumors among staff, holidays cancelled last minute, exclusion from social events and (ironically) a false accusation of bullying. Brought it to the powers that be only to be told to "toughen up". It got so bad that some mornings she was in tears going to work. Eventually enough was enough and she handed in her notice.

My GF is no pushover and well able to stand up for herself but bullying is something that can really wear you down and destroy your self-esteem.

BiB


Too many memories, especially the last decade at a family run business.

However, I wasn't being bullied. I stopped the notion of that dead in its tracks after week 4.

I observed it from the owners to others and after about a year or so I started to call it out.
It made not a jot of difference there - either the victims moved on (young apprentice type positions, foot in the door stuff although some were older and experienced) or they just wouldn't pursue it.


Well, last year they dismissed me on a ridiculuous false allegation after I had spent a year training up an intelligent young bloke to do my job (a senior position which I was stepping down from)
I was also interviewing at the time to leave - they are that thick and spiteful they thought they'd get away with it.

Unlucky for them, that young guy had no intention of staying as he also saw the pathetic bullying, he had another job lined up and gave his notice in the day after I was sacked.


Last month, they settled my unfair dismissal for a very tidy 5 figure sum and to top it all in total they spent tens of thousand on barristers, solicitors, ex-Labour court chairmen in the process.


I would not have got half that sum if the case had been heard and the case awarded to me.


Proof, if proof is needed - bullies are thick as shít and cowards.


I would agree that note keeping is vital.
And go through the proper procedures even if HR is useless (mostly they are in small places)
And I would start interviewing almost immediately when the victim realises nothing will happen with the procedures.

anewme

I could not comprehend being bullied, as I am the narkiest bastard of narkiest badtards, but it does happen, usually by the jumped up wanna be manager types.

steddyeddy

freshpopcorn wrote: »

The two cases I was referring to in my OP are here about the suspected bullying happening!

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/family-of-man-who-took-own-life-after-alleged-bullying-at-work-accuse-hse-of-airbrushing-his-case-38046441.html


https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/father-took-own-life-over-bullying-inquest-hears-coworkers-evidence-38063185.html

Bord na mona sounds like it's full of d1ckheads to be honest.

EmmetSpiceland

anewme wrote: »

I could not comprehend being bullied, as I am the narkiest bastard of narkiest badtards, but it does happen, usually by the jumped up wanna be manager types.

The types who bully up as well.

Usually get recommended for promotion by their browbeaten manager who just wants them out of their hair or off their back.

Ursus Horribilis

There is such a thing as upwards bullying. The nastiness doesn't always come from a manager.

Yeah, I've worked in a place where there was bullying. A woman who was so subtle about her bullying, nobody really noticed it until we were told about it. I've also got a couple of friends who worked in places where there were bullying problems. Just like in my workplace, HR got themselves tied up in knots over procedures and ended up stressing everyone out. And the bullies kept their jobs. A slap on the wrist for a bully is meaningless when they've terrorised their targets.

Gloucester

Experienced it in a large organisation years ago. Ironically, it peaked during the year they won a 'Best Place to Work' award.
Horrific experiences that I'd never tolerate now. Sad to think when I was in my early twenties I reached out to HR but they turned a blind eye and like a poster above mentioned, they circled the wagons and made it out be my problem rather than address the issue with the staff members in question. Left when I was told I moving back to work under someone who I suffered abuse from prior to her maternity leave. Begged not to be put in there, but they tried to reassure me it was temporary and only because I was 'so good at what you do'.

The thoughts of dealing with someone who spent her day talking to 'the voices' that nobody else could hear & thinking about her exploding when I didn't answer her 3 am calls or messages about mundane stuff like upcoming mailings etc really took its toll & I ended up going on sick leave from a low-paying job that myself and my parent that I was a p/t carer for desperately relied on for money. Horrible experience.:(

I definitely think the the structure of the organisation with admins clearly lowest level on the ladder meant that we were just easy targets and any abuse that I reported, no matter how serious, was considered just whinging. Admins, I guess were disposable to them. Having someone reveal their weirdest sexual fetishes to me (in a closed situation he had called me into) in front of his female boss & senior female colleague and the women acting like it was perfectly fine and not supporting me was just the norm. That guy's female boss is now the director of the organisation so I guess that as an organisation, for all the training and focus on change and adapting to new business environments etc the place itself hasn't changed a bit.

The day that I (on sick leave) found out that I got the job in my current place was genuinely the best day ever. Just knowing I didn't have to go back was such a relief that I swore I'd never tolerate that behaviour again. if an employer wants to turn a blind eye, I'd turn my back and walk away. Work takes up so much of our time and our thoughts it's important to feel happy there. No matter how good a place you're in, being an employee means you are replaceable. Great as my current place is, salary wise, conditions, annual leave etc. I'd still put my own mental health and well-being before the job.

Glad I'm in a much smaller organisation which is well-run and any behaviour that's out of line is dealt with directly and in a really fair manner by management. I sometimes look at current place and think it's karma (good kind) for all the cr*p endured in previous places. Sometimes I find it amazing that I got through the whole experience and ended up in such a sweet place. it obviously still has its odd dodgy character (the type who'll try to put others down to make themselves seem better during meetings before putting their hand over their mouth like a toddler and pretending to be all innocent, like 'oooh that comment just slipped out :rolleyes:) but they're kept in line by the really direct, honesty of others. Luckily there's enough good people there to outweigh the odd bad apple.

steddyeddy

I am funded by the American government to work in an American government lab and British academic lab on a particular research project. In my time in the British lab I watched as a technician there verbally bullied people calling them retarded, pansies ect ect. He’s recently taken to physical assault by kicking the back of legs of young students. For context he’s a 47 year old man who failed two PhDs and was kicked off a masters program. His friend is his supervisor and protected him through 7 complaints. In the American government labs one guy made a complaint against a guy who was verbally abusive to him and he was gone within a week. The UK has a real problem with bullying in academia and protecting the bullies.

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2018/sep/28/academics-uk-universities-accused-bullying-students-colleagues

steddyeddy

I'm not talking about illegalities but has anyone ever resorted to going around HR to solve a bullying problem?

Berserker

Ursus Horribilis wrote: »

There is such a thing as upwards bullying. The nastiness doesn't always come from a manager.

Upwards bullying is quite rare. It's usually middle managers, lifers who feel threatened by people with talent and inexperienced senior executives who just don't have the ability to do their job, who engage in it. I've witnessed bullying time and time again throughout my career.

Snow Garden

steddyeddy wrote: »

I'm not talking about illegalities but has anyone ever resorted to going around HR to solve a bullying problem?

Sometimes people have no choice. In my experience people in HR can be very 'weak' . Many HR managers are simply poor managers who could not survive a more functional/responsible role. They are the smallest shark in the shark tank. A good HR manager should have one basic trait - good common sense - but most don't and simply defend the organisation blindly.
If HR is useless and you cannot find a manager you can trust, it's often best to find a solicitor with employee law experience. They can bring the case to the WRC.

padd b1975

freshpopcorn wrote: »

I've heard of so many teachers being bullied at work.
Mainly because one teacher puts in a big effort to do something and they get jealous!

I've yet to meet a teacher that wasn't a complete and utter control freak.
I think they find it hard to adjust to not being the masters of all they survey outside of the classroom.

Same goes for doctors.

Snow Garden

padd b1975 wrote: »

I've yet to meet a teacher that wasn't a complete and utter control freak.
I think they find it hard to adjust to not being the masters of all they survey outside of the classroom.

I cant argue with that. They are also very delusional with a huge sense of entitlement. I reckon it's because many of them don't actually want to be teachers.

freshpopcorn

padd b1975 wrote: »

I've yet to meet a teacher that wasn't a complete and utter control freak.
I think they find it hard to adjust to not being the masters of all they survey outside of the classroom.

Same goes for doctors.

Snow Garden wrote: »

I cant argue with that. They are also very delusional with a huge sense of entitlement. I reckon it's because many of them don't actually want to be teachers.

I've met a mix bag of teachers.
The one's I've encountered who are bullied are generally the one's who want to be their, do extra curricarly activities with the kids, etc.
Those who bully see it as a 9am-4pm job or they were hammered into it by their parents.

Seanf999

Foreman said to myself and another apprentice 'you've got heads on ye like two stupid f*cking turkeys looking into a field".

Berserker

Snow Garden wrote: »

Sometimes people have no choice. In my experience people in HR can be very 'weak'.

They are not weak. HR are there to act in the best interest of the company, not the employee.

IAMAMORON

Seanf999 wrote: »

Foreman said to myself and another apprentice 'you've got heads on ye like two stupid f*cking turkeys looking into a field".

In fairness there is a difference between name calling and bullying. Everyone gets called a name in work. The fact that yours is "stupid ****ing turkey" is unfortunate. At least he said it to your face, I am sure you can deal with it.

When your foreman starts trying to make a fool of you to your colleagues, or when he threatens you with your job or makes you genuinely feel that you are worthless and you are genuinely hurt by this, that is bullying.