Is anyone else starting to become a bit excited?

cnocbui

FFVII wrote: »

What signs?

Er, current world debt is at 350% of global GDP. It's currently about US$58.28 Trillion. The 2007 GFC happened because the debt bubble burst, and that was when global debt was 'only' US$24.46 Trillion.

The size and scale of the current debt bubble, thanks to endless quantitative easing and 'cheap' finance, is more than twice the size.

There will shortly be mass layoffs and company bankruptcies on a terrifying scale. I doubt there is a medium to large airline on the planet that won't be insolvent inside a month. I have already withdrawn cash from the bank and will do so again until I only have an operating expenses float. It wouldn't surprise me if the Cyprus crew-cut becomes a new fashion statement. Someones got to pay for all the virus consequences, and I think I know who will be put in the frame for that.

JohnnyFlash

Apple produced goods and services that people wanted to buy.

Bitcoin produces nothing only lols and grotesque amounts of CO2 emissions. It’s a terrible store of value, useless as digital currency, and offers no anonymity at all.

Stupid comparison.

cnocbui

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Apple produced goods and services that people wanted to buy.

Bitcoin produces nothing only lols and grotesque amounts of CO2 emissions.

Stupid comparison.

There is a report that claims at least 70% of bitcoin mining is done using renewables and so does not result in CO2 production. You know about Iceland Geothermal and the Hydro power in China, for example?

But leaving that non-issue aside, Do tell me what the Euro notes in my wallet or bank account 'produce'? What does a gold ingot 'produce'?

How was Cheltenham, you little virus spreader, or was that Pintman Paddy..?

JJJJNR

How much C02 does apple produce building and shipping and don't give me they're recent green credentials either when you consider they have been net producer's since the 70s.

FFVII

cnocbui wrote: »

Er, current world debt is at 350% of global GDP. It's currently about US$58.28 Trillion. The 2007 GFC happened because the debt bubble burst, and that was when global debt was 'only' US$24.46 Trillion.

The size and scale of the current debt bubble, thanks to endless quantitative easing and 'cheap' finance, is more than twice the size.

There will shortly be mass layoffs and company bankruptcies on a terrifying scale. I doubt there is a medium to large airline on the planet that won't be insolvent inside a month. I have already withdrawn cash from the bank and will do so again until I only have an operating expenses float. It wouldn't surprise me if the Cyprus crew-cut becomes a new fashion statement. Someones got to pay for all the virus consequences, and I think I know who will be put in the frame for that.

Where have all those trillions gone this time?

They doubled the debt to cover 2007...so they double it again to cover the next one....then what happens?

I don't have much, it's a rich mans worry. Unless now is when society breaks down.....then you'll just hear me saying I told ye so....while I'm down in New Zealand burning down that billionaire town they've built down there.

cnocbui

FFVII wrote: »

Where have all those trillions gone this time?

They doubled the debt to cover 2007...so they double it again to cover the next one....then what happens?

You're looking at it - or the start of 'it', anyways. The trillions, or part thereof, have gone into the pockets of the flash traders and whales who sold their shares before the crash. The rest was illusory value evaporating.

makeorbrake

cnocbui wrote: »

There is a report that claims at least 70% of bitcoin mining is done using renewables and so does not result in CO2 production. You know about Iceland Geothermal and the Hydro power in China, for example?

It's a non argument. Miners can only use the most competitively produced power and more often than that, that's renewable. Stranded power exists in abundance. Crypto miners can make use of it when nobody else can. In remote oil fields in Canada, flared off gas is now been harnessed to mine crypto. Fossil fuel power stations around the world waste boundless energy daily - having to keep those systems ticking over during off-peak times. Crypto mining can make use of this. The very same with the peaks and troughs of solar/wind, etc.

makeorbrake

Bob24 wrote: »

Recession is pretty much a given at this stage.

But how it will play out for BTC is very hard to predict.

As the QE cranks up, it will represent a great opportunity for people to examine what hard money is. When gold goes up, bitcoin will also.

Dohnjoe

cnocbui wrote: »

Shares being a 'share' in the company is meaningless, as is the 'technical value'. You can not demand that someone purchase your share for it's fraction of the company's NAV or 'fair value' or any other metric.

Share value is calculable. If a company is calculated to be worth around X, then a 100th share of that is X/100. You can literally look at their balance sheet for this.

The values of most cryptos are not calculable. They are not the same types of instruments at all.

Dohnjoe

Buffet is sitting on 125 bn of cash - now people get why. The market is currently going to safe bonds and cash.

grindle

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Share value is calculable. If a company is calculated to be worth around X, then a 100th share of that is X/100. You can literally look at their balance sheet for this.

The values of most cryptos are not calculable. They are not the same types of instruments at all.

Calculable to an extent, P/E ratios vary wildly and made no sense with Apple or Facebook for the first 5-ish years of the bullruns those companies had this century, just hopes and dreams promised for the future.

Most cryptos are abysmal shítcoins, others are oil-alikes except without a monarchy setting prices at a whim. Everybody beyond moonbois should actually want the prices to bottom out as low as they can possibly go because then we all have a good picture of what utility means to the price of [whichevercrypto]

Dohnjoe

grindle wrote: »

Calculable to an extent, P/E ratios vary wildly and made no sense with Apple or Facebook for the first 5-ish years of the bullruns those companies had this century, just hopes and dreams promised for the future.

Most cryptos are abysmal shítcoins, others are oil-alikes except without a monarchy setting prices at a whim. Everybody beyond moonbois should actually want the prices to bottom out as low as they can possibly go because then we all have a good picture of what utility means to the price of [whichevercrypto]

Indeed, same with property, 5 different estate agents won't give you the exact same estimate, but they will be within a calculable window

Crypto is completely outside that sphere. One of the only "measures" we can go on is max supply, and that's super-flaky at best.

Stewball

Lads, sorry for hijacking the thread but I got a question and this seems the busiest thread.

I set up an account with Kraken. I've being trying to get verified for an intermediate account and there was an issue with my ID and I got an email from them saying this:

Thank you for clarifying your address and for forwarding the requested images.

However we've encountered an issue which is preventing the verification of your account.

For this reason, we must ask you to provide an ID Confirmation Photo. This is a picture of you holding the same ID that you've already uploaded, along with a handwritten note which shows your signature, the current date, and a message stating “Only for trading digital currency on www.kraken.com”;.

Please upload your ID Confirmation Photo by navigating to the Get Verified page of your Kraken account and selecting the Intermediate > Get Verified button. Once complete, please reply to this email and we will help expedite your verification.

Is this the norm?
Sounds a bit strange to me.

FFVII

Stewball wrote: »

Lads, sorry for hijacking the thread but I got a question and this seems the busiest thread.

I set up an account with Kraken. I've being trying to get verified for an intermediate account and there was an issue with my ID and I got an email from them saying this:



Is this the norm?
Sounds a bit strange to me.

Must be new. Some dose in fairness.


Go to Bitstamp instead.

Vico1612

Stewball wrote: »

Lads, sorry for hijacking the thread but I got a question and this seems the busiest thread.

I set up an account with Kraken. I've being trying to get verified for an intermediate account and there was an issue with my ID and I got an email from them saying this:



Is this the norm?
Sounds a bit strange to me.

Binance used to do that so no real big surprise. It's to avoid scammers who manage to scan people's ID and use it to open fake accounts

unkel

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Bitcoin produces grotesque amounts of CO2 emissions.

It has been explained to you several times on this forum, JohnnyFlash, that this is not the case. Yet you keep coming out with that same mantra over and over again

To put it in the most diplomatic way I can - you're not building up any credibility here. Take from that what you will.

grindle

unkel wrote: »

To put it in the most diplomatic way I can - you're not building up any credibility here. Take from that what you will.

Some sadlumps out there read his crap and think it has credibility because they read nothing else and aren't willing to. He and cohorts shítpost when prices drop, visitors go "oh, must be right". That's all he needs, it's his crypto-shítpost oxygen.

Bob24

makeorbrake wrote: »

As the QE cranks up, it will represent a great opportunity for people to examine what hard money is. When gold goes up, bitcoin will also.

That’s the theory yes and I agree with it, but let’s say how it plays out in practice.

Gold only took fairly small hit in the last couple of days as traders had to sell the last strong asset they had to cover there massive losses. But it is minor and it will recover.

Bitcoin however completely tanked. This kind of broke the safe heaven argument for now.

Doesn’t mean I don’t think Bitcoin has a future, but this clearly showed that gold still is king in terms of hard money and Bitcoin still needs to prove itself.

makeorbrake

Bob24 wrote: »

That’s the theory yes and I agree with it, but let’s say how it plays out in practice.

Agreed...acid test awaits.

Bob24 wrote: »

Gold only took fairly small hit in the last couple of days as traders had to sell the last strong asset they had to cover there massive losses. But it is minor and it will recover.

It still closed 9% down over the course of the week.

Bob24 wrote: »

Bitcoin however completely tanked. This kind of broke the safe heaven argument for now.

I'm not so sure it has if we are still treating gold as a safe haven. If there's a sell off of bitcoin, its logical to me that it will run down faster than a sell off on gold.

Bob24 wrote: »

Doesn’t mean I don’t think Bitcoin has a future, but this clearly showed that gold still is king in terms of hard money and Bitcoin still needs to prove itself.

Gold was just shy of 10% down. It dropped 30% at the outset of the 2008 financial crisis. To me, it seems they're acting in the same way - just to different levels of intensity.

As regards the use of the phrase 'hard money', that's another matter. It could be that you're right insofar as bitcoin isn't a safe haven against pandemic induced firesales but that it is a hedge against FIAT-based and QE-induced inflation.

We're only at the end of the beginning here. Watch this space.

mcgucc22

Stewball wrote: »

Lads, sorry for hijacking the thread but I got a question and this seems the busiest thread.

I set up an account with Kraken. I've being trying to get verified for an intermediate account and there was an issue with my ID and I got an email from them saying this:



Is this the norm?
Sounds a bit strange to me.

It’s like that since at least 2018. I had to do it back then.

Arrival

Bob24 wrote: »

Recession is pretty much a given at this stage.

But how it will play out for BTC is very hard to predict.

Well we were hopeful people would transfer cash into BTC as a store of value to ride out any instability in the stock market but now, with the pandemic, so many people are selling to get emergency funds available as they'll need it now. There was no way anyone could've predicted this occuring at this time. I was so excited for May onwards but now it doesn't even really cross my mind as our day-to-day lives are ****ed

borderfox11

makeorbrake wrote: »

Agreed...acid test awaits.


It still closed 9% down over the course of the week.



I'm not so sure it has if we are still treating gold as a safe haven. If there's a sell off of bitcoin, its logical to me that it will run down faster than a sell off on gold.


Gold was just shy of 10% down. It dropped 30% at the outset of the 2008 financial crisis. To me, it seems they're acting in the same way - just to different levels of intensity.

As regards the use of the phrase 'hard money', that's another matter. It could be that you're right insofar as bitcoin isn't a safe haven against pandemic induced firesales but that it is a hedge against FIAT-based and QE-induced inflation.

We're only at the end of the beginning here. Watch this space.

Gold dropped in 2008/9 just as equities did, it seems to be doing the same thing again
Hearing rumours of a huge increase in demand for Physical Gold and Silver but that doesn't really tie in with last week's price drop...

Bob24

Well we now have another emergency rate cut from the Fed and the start of QE4. Let’s see it does to Bitcoin.

Lex Luthor

JJJJNR wrote: »

It's not over till the fat lady sings.

Even if the price of bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies are tanking it's under the holders control if they as weak hands want to sell. We are at the early stage of this corona virus and it's still to early to predict if there will be a run on the banks so belittle people all you want look at the signs they are there, mocking is catching as my mother used to say... the banking and social system is being held together with chewing gum at the moment.

What he said

Lex Luthor

Stewball wrote: »

Lads, sorry for hijacking the thread but I got a question and this seems the busiest thread.

I set up an account with Kraken. I've being trying to get verified for an intermediate account and there was an issue with my ID and I got an email from them saying this:



Is this the norm?
Sounds a bit strange to me.

Was you photo Id clear enough?

rapul

Some good prices to be buying now, wonder how much lower, been holding off for a while now! And I had to do that with binance when signing up aswell the photo id and piece of paper and all

machiavellianme

Sub 100 euro ETH.
My portfolio is now less than 1/3 of what I paid in.
No point selling now but I certainly can't justify buying.
If crypto is going to swing harder than all other stocks etc at every time there's trouble it has no purpose other than casual gambling.

Bob24

rapul wrote: »

Some good prices to be buying now, wonder how much lower, been holding off for a while now! And I had to do that with binance when signing up aswell the photo id and piece of paper and all

Just keep in mind what they say about falling knives. Crypto seems to be aggressively sold with the stock market at the moment and it is exacerbated but its natural volatility.

Bob24

machiavellianme wrote: »

Sub 100 euro ETH.
My portfolio is now less than 1/3 of what I paid in.
No point selling now but I certainly can't justify buying.
If crypto is going to swing harder than all other stocks etc at every time there's trouble it has no purpose other than casual gambling.

Yeah my view for someone who is already relatively heavily into crypto would be to keep tight and wait.

Someone who has little to no involvement and was waiting to join in can start doing it gradually.

jimmii

machiavellianme wrote: »

Sub 100 euro ETH.
My portfolio is now less than 1/3 of what I paid in.
No point selling now but I certainly can't justify buying.
If crypto is going to swing harder than all other stocks etc at every time there's trouble it has no purpose other than casual gambling.

Ouch that's harsh. I'm sure the vast majority here are hoping you're able to get out of that hole.