Friendship advice

corklily05

Just looking to see what people think of this!

I'm very new to this site, but this problem has been niggling away at me for a while now. I was home for christmas and on a night out with friends. Same old banter was had until suddenly 1 of the lads started 'slagging' me.

He started with 'you're not invited to my wedding', i said ya whatever but he kept it up. So then, i started giving it back to him as good as i was receiving it for a while until it became ridiculous. So, i got fed up with it all. 3 of us were walking home in the lashing rain and it was still going on.

I said nothing, it was way over the top what was happening, this was over the course of a few hours, the lads i was with said nothing, it just go to much. One of the lads finally flagged down a taxi and i refused to get in. I walked home as a result. I know the whole banter sh!t will be just said back to me if i ever confronted this person.

Thing is, we have a whats app group and i immediately deleted myself from it, i was added back the next day. There's in total 8 of us on the group and i havent posted a response to anything since that night. 2 of the lads have expressed concern and text me off the group to see what was going on! i explained in full my thoughts, both of them agreed it was way over the top what happened that night.

This guy's stag is coming up soon and ive been invited but havent responded, should i go?

Tiddlypeeps

Is this someone you would have been close with or has there always been tension?

If he was just acting up this one time and is normally a good friend then I'd be inclined to just have a conversation with him, ask for an apology and move on.

If this is normal behaviour and this is a person you don't really like very much then I personally wouldn't be attending their stag or wedding. I'd continue being pleasant but passive with them in order to keep the peace and remain friends with the rest of the group, but I wouldn't be going out of my way for them or putting up with abuse from them.

corklily05

Hi tiddlypeeps,

We don't see each other that often but ill find it hard if i ever want to meet up with the others and he is there. To be fair the other lads have checked in so i cant say they dont care. The fact he hasn't apologised makes me wonder. Eventhough, he has been told that he was way over the top. It happened once before but it was years ago, i only thought of this after it happened.

I've 2 questions, firstly, why me?

Secondly, should i be a mug for anyone?

wiggle16

Hi OP

One thing first: you say your other friends have checked in with you but he hasn't, even though he's been made aware of it - it's a really bad idea to hope friends will be go-betweens. It's nothing to do with them. If you want to sort this out you have to do it yourself.

If you haven't spoken to him, how is he to know how annoyed you are? You don't know if those lads told him what you said, or told him they thought it went too far, or even spoke to him about it. You can't expect them to. So far, all you've done is removed yourself from a whatsapp group without an explanation.

It's hard to tell if you like him at all or if you're only angry over this. Long and short of it is, pair of you had a slagging match and you felt it went too far. That happens. But you said it's only happened once before, years ago, so it's not like it's regular behaviour from this lad. In all honesty, what I'm getting from your post is that he went too far with slagging you and you're giving him the silent treatment and waiting for him to approach you, and it's festering now because he hasn't. You're not going to get an apology if he doesn't know you're annoyed, and you can't rely on others to tell him how you feel.

If you are this angry about it, you should say it to him that you didn't enjoy that "banter", it went too far and it's really after annoying/hurting you. Then see what he says and make your decision based on that.

I've 2 questions, firstly, why me?
Secondly, should i be a mug for anyone?

He's the only person who can answer the first question, and to do that, you'll have to talk to him.

Your second question is a truism and not a good way to approach this kind of thing. Don't let your pride get in the way of your friendships. Don't skip the stag just because you want to use it as a "f*ck you" to him. You'll come off looking worse.
Talk to him and see what he says. Then you'll know if you want to go to the stag or not. Good luck

corklily05

wiggle16 wrote: »

Hi OP

One thing first: you say your other friends have checked in with you but he hasn't, even though he's been made aware of it - it's a really bad idea to hope friends will be go-betweens. It's nothing to do with them. If you want to sort this out you have to do it yourself.

If you haven't spoken to him, how is he to know how annoyed you are? You don't know if those lads told him what you said, or told him they thought it went too far, or even spoke to him about it. You can't expect them to. So far, all you've done is removed yourself from a whatsapp group without an explanation.

It's hard to tell if you like him at all or if you're only angry over this. Long and short of it is, pair of you had a slagging match and you felt it went too far. That happens. But you said it's only happened once before, years ago, so it's not like it's regular behaviour from this lad. In all honesty, what I'm getting from your post is that he went too far with slagging you and you're giving him the silent treatment and waiting for him to approach you, and it's festering now because he hasn't. You're not going to get an apology if he doesn't know you're annoyed, and you can't rely on others to tell him how you feel.

If you are this angry about it, you should say it to him that you didn't enjoy that "banter", it went too far and it's really after annoying/hurting you. Then see what he says and make your decision based on that.


He's the only person who can answer the first question, and to do that, you'll have to talk to him.

Your second question is a truism and not a good way to approach this kind of thing. Don't let your pride get in the way of your friendships. Don't skip the stag just because you want to use it as a "f*ck you" to him. You'll come off looking worse.
Talk to him and see what he says. Then you'll know if you want to go to the stag or not. Good luck

Thanks for your input. Sometimes you need to get an outside perspective on things. I'm living away from home for a long time now and those lads are still at home.

I feel like i'm on the periphery of things for a while now as i've made friends elsewhere and don't see the lads as much. Maybe, you're correct about the apology part, a few home truths never does anybody any harm.

I do feel a little let down by the whole thing, the 2 lads i've been talking about it to have agreed with me that he took it to far and have confirmed that they spoke to him about this issue.

But, in saying that the person in question is not the only one i've given the silent treatment to, its the whole group. I feel like i've been the mug for this group for quite sometime and my wife pointed it out to me before but i just brushed it off.

This could very well be the straw that broke the camel's back and the reaction of the lads who did contact me seems to me like as a whole, they've pushed it to far. The best thing to do at the time for me was to take a step back and not crawl back for more punishment.

This may come across as extreme to people but no exaggeration

wiggle16

corklily05 wrote: »

I feel like i've been the mug for this group for quite sometime and my wife pointed it out to me before but i just brushed it off.

If this is how you feel then I think you have your answer, unfortunately.

What do you mean when you say you've been the mug for the group? Like I know what the phrase means, but what is happening that's made your wife notice it too? Like do you end up being the butt of every joke, or?

corklily05

wiggle16 wrote: »

If this is how you feel then I think you have your answer, unfortunately.

What do you mean when you say you've been the mug for the group? Like I know what the phrase means, but what is happening that's made your wife notice it too? Like do you end up being the butt of every joke, or?

Yes, butt of the joke. The way they've spoken to me in the past in front of her, just a little older now and just maybe a little wiser so not willing to put up with as much.

Also, i feel there's a click in the group and if you're not in it its just if you're around well in good, if not it dosen't matter.

I've known these people half my life so a lot has changed since then, people change also and i feel i've changed the most

Wanderer2010

corklily05 wrote: »

Yes, butt of the joke. The way they've spoken to me in the past in front of her, just a little older now and just maybe a little wiser so not willing to put up with as much.

Also, i feel there's a click in the group and if you're not in it its just if you're around well in good, if not it dosen't matter.

I've known these people half my life so a lot has changed since then, people change also and i feel i've changed the most

People do change and that's normally the case and friends also drift apart when someone moves on to a different area, or perhaps they have matured and no longer wish to get p!ssed or they find different things funny. Its perfectly natural and I think in this regard, women are better at making a decision to cut a friendship because they talk more about their feelings and tune into possible nastiness from their friends more than men.

Men tend to slag each other a lot and there is definitely this social pressure to just be "one of the lads" or just "take it on the chin" but you have the right to be respected as well and if you feel excluded or disrespected, then there is your answer. Its your feelings, they are valid and real so there is an issue there. I would ask yourself OP to take 5 minutes and think really hard about "Would I want this person at my wedding?" in relation to your friends. Would you want their company and do you feel respected by this person? If the answer is no, you need to either cut all contact or say in a text to this person "I don't want your company anymore, we have drifted apart. I wish you the best". Its hard but necessary, best of luck!

orourkeda1977

I had a couple of thoughts.

If he is like this on a night out then whats he going to be like when the wedding day comes around?


This behaviour strikes me as immature. What age is this guy exactly? This goes on all the time among young blokes but at a certain age people should start growing up and afford your peer a certain level of respect. We all drop in the odd slag here and there but doing it to this level suggest either immaturity or an underlying problem.

Do you know this guys future wife? Where does she fit in to all of this?

corklily05

orourkeda1977 wrote: »

I had a couple of thoughts.

If he is like this on a night out then whats he going to be like when the wedding day comes around?


This behaviour strikes me as immature. What age is this guy exactly? This goes on all the time among young blokes but at a certain age people should start growing up and afford your peer a certain level of respect. We all drop in the odd slag here and there but doing it to this level suggest either immaturity or an underlying problem.

Do you know this guys future wife? Where does she fit in to all of this?

Well, i'm presuming he'll be busy on the wedding day! Photos, speeches, talking to everyone etc..

This guy is 35 and to be honest if there is an underlying problem i wouldn't have a clue what it is. I know his future wife quite well, i knew her before they got together.

She was not in attendance for the night in question and i doubt if he really told her anything, if so, he's put his own spin on it no doubt,

corklily05

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

People do change and that's normally the case and friends also drift apart when someone moves on to a different area, or perhaps they have matured and no longer wish to get p!ssed or they find different things funny. Its perfectly natural and I think in this regard, women are better at making a decision to cut a friendship because they talk more about their feelings and tune into possible nastiness from their friends more than men.

Men tend to slag each other a lot and there is definitely this social pressure to just be "one of the lads" or just "take it on the chin" but you have the right to be respected as well and if you feel excluded or disrespected, then there is your answer. Its your feelings, they are valid and real so there is an issue there. I would ask yourself OP to take 5 minutes and think really hard about "Would I want this person at my wedding?" in relation to your friends. Would you want their company and do you feel respected by this person? If the answer is no, you need to either cut all contact or say in a text to this person "I don't want your company anymore, we have drifted apart. I wish you the best". Its hard but necessary, best of luck!

Yes there's a huge pressure to take it on the chin and move on. It brings me to a point where i ask myself what am i even doing here in this social circle as i have less and less in common with them.

The fact i'm living away for quite a while, has added to this so i'm not aware of all the inside jokes they have. So, after this incident i wonder even if i gain respect from this, in a few months time will everything just go back to normal?

My best man at my wedding has expressed a lot of concern, he actually went to the bother of getting my wife's number to text her to see if i was ok, another guy text also. I can't tar them all with the same brush. Sound lads individually but together a little intimidating at times.

redfox123

Sounds like you don't enjoy the group, it's probably been the same since school years and you've outgrown the pack kind of mentality, it's immature and you don't feel the need for it anymore like you would have in your 20s when you were all probably single men. Some them sound decent so why not just meet up with those now and again, one or two of them for a pint. I think you're a bit beyond going out with a big group of 'de lads' for loads of pints, it sounds exhausting and annoying. And that guy with the constant slagging sounds an unfunny eijit.

jopax

He just sounds like a bully trying to put you down like that.
I definitely would not go on the stag or wedding.
Like the previous post said keep in touch with the 2 guys that sound like they are genuine.

It's very telling that your wife has mentioned this before so she could obviously see something wasn't right.

Save your time for decent people & if that means cutting a few cords so be it.

corklily05

redfox123 wrote: »

Sounds like you don't enjoy the group, it's probably been the same since school years and you've outgrown the pack kind of mentality, it's immature and you don't feel the need for it anymore like you would have in your 20s when you were all probably single men. Some them sound decent so why not just meet up with those now and again, one or two of them for a pint. I think you're a bit beyond going out with a big group of 'de lads' for loads of pints, it sounds exhausting and annoying. And that guy with the constant slagging sounds an unfunny eijit.

I suppose not everyone who's advising me can be wrong about this, yes the 2 lads are decent. Another guy in the group, his father passed away recently and i couldn't bring myself to travel down and attend the funeral.

I'm also doing a masters and working full time so i didnt really need this on my plate

corklily05

jopax wrote: »

He just sounds like a bully trying to put you down like that.
I definitely would not go on the stag or wedding.
Like the previous post said keep in touch with the 2 guys that sound like they are genuine.

It's very telling that your wife has mentioned this before so she could obviously see something wasn't right.

Save your time for decent people & if that means cutting a few cords so be it.

i think you're spot on with cutting a few cords, an outside perspective is what i needed. I'm also working full time and studying part time at the moment so this dilemma is just exhausting.

Wanderer2010

Male friendship is different from female friendship. Men don't really need deep connections with a friend, its more someone to hang out with, have a few beers and maybe a laugh or two so you can easily afford to cut people out as you wish. This guy probably wont even notice, and you are better off. Men don't need friends as much as women do.

corklily05

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Male friendship is different from female friendship. Men don't really need deep connections with a friend, its more someone to hang out with, have a few beers and maybe a laugh or two so you can easily afford to cut people out as you wish. This guy probably wont even notice, and you are better off. Men don't need friends as much as women do.

Apparently he's been asking about me through others but you're probably right. Over time, ill be a distant memory

wiggle16

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Male friendship is different from female friendship. Men don't really need deep connections with a friend, its more someone to hang out with, have a few beers and maybe a laugh or two so you can easily afford to cut people out as you wish. This guy probably wont even notice, and you are better off. Men don't need friends as much as women do.

Maybe you enjoy your own company and that's fine, but this is definitely not the case for men generally.

The OP shouldn't base his decision to cut off these lads on whether or not he needs freinds at all, it's whether or not these are friends worth having.

Men defininitely need friends just as much as women. Life is too long to spend it alone.

Ursus Horribilis

Out of curiosity, what does your wife think you should do? She was sharp enough to spot what was going on before this issue arose.

corklily05

wiggle16 wrote: »

Maybe you enjoy your own company and that's fine, but this is definitely not the case for men generally.

The OP shouldn't base his decision to cut off these lads on whether or not he needs freinds at all, it's whether or not these are friends worth having.

Men defininitely need friends just as much as women. Life is too long to spend it alone.

I definitely need friends, everybody does. I have other friends for sure, its just hard to let go but now, i'm starting to see things a lot clearer. Life is just to short to put up with the crap and politics that comes with a large group of friends.

It makes me sad as we've had really good times, but i don't think it'll be the same again no matter what the outcome is.

corklily05

Ursus Horribilis wrote: »

Out of curiosity, what does your wife think you should do? She was sharp enough to spot what was going on before this issue arose.

She said she supports whatever i do. The 2 lads who have contacted me are real friends as they've proved and she was impressed by that. I'm actually talking to someone aswell which is helping, wife encouraged this. this is not the only issue, work is sh!t, family, studying etc..

It just came all a little overwhelming when this happened

Panthro

Does his missus get on well with your missus?
Behind the scenes the bride to be might be saying "I don't want that so and so coming" if they didn't get on. Just a thought.

I'd knock it on the head and ask him straight out whys he saying you're not invited to the wedding. If they don't want ya there fine, line in sand drawn you'll owe him nothing. If he says he's only messing say grand but please tone town the slagging as its not on.
Yer grown men. Remind him of it.

corklily05

Panthro wrote: »

Does his missus get on well with your missus?
Behind the scenes the bride to be might be saying "I don't want that so and so coming" if they didn't get on. Just a thought.

I'd knock it on the head and ask him straight out whys he saying you're not invited to the wedding. If they don't want ya there fine, line in sand drawn you'll owe him nothing. If he says he's only messing say grand but please tone town the slagging as its not on.
Yer grown men. Remind him of it.

His missus dosen't know my missus very well at all, they've already attended our wedding so, i think that's a non runner.

What would happen if i said this to him, knowing him well, he'd pawn it off as a joke. I understand what you're saying about saying it to him but i don't see him and i'm to tied down with other stuff to put this as a priority.

Everybody is thinking along the same lines, life is to short, ditch him, that sort of thing. I reckon it's pretty sound advice.

Woolly_Jumper

It sounds like you have had a really hard time of it. This has happened me a few times in my life and I've taken different approaches depending on how much I valued the friendship. In one case I slowly withdrew and moved them into acquaintance territory. However in cases where there is a group and I know that I will see them on an ongoing basis. The best way is to stand up for yourself and say something. Arrange to meet on a one to one, without drink and talk about how you felt. Keep it focused on this isn't really acceptable behaviour and try not to blame. Empathise and give them space to explain but without compromising your truth. I think that if you cut off this friend without explanation it will affect the other friendships too. Friendship groups go through phases and sometimes you can be closer to others at varying points. I'm guessing that you have been friends more than 20odd years. Thats a long time! Many people would kill to have a group like that. By standing up for yourself with integrity and being aware of the other person it will change how your viewed in the group. If he doesnt reciprocate or just brushes it off then its up to you what next but at least you can have your head held high. Finally regarding your other friend in the group who's father passed away, if you have the headspace. It would be good to apologise that you werent there for him and explain why...people remember things and it can really really mean a lot for someone bereaved to hear that they matter. Anyway best of luck with it

Faith

It sounds like you’re pretty overwhelmed in general at the moment. When I get like that, I can’t handle the politics of friendships! In the last few months, I’ve been busier than I ever have and I’ve had to text one group of friends and tell them I’d be AWOL for a few months and I’m sorry that I can’t be there for their life stuff right now, and I’ve pulled away completely from friends that drain me. I’ve kept up with a handful of close, local friends and I’ve been more engaged with acquaintances who don’t ask anything of me.

Maybe you could take a step back from this group for a bit without cutting all ties? Text the big WhatsApp group and say something like “Hey guys, I’m completely up the walls for the next while and won’t be around. I’ll catch up with you all again when things settle down” and then you can still keep in contact with the couple of mates you’re closest to in a 1:1 or smaller group way?

corklily05

Faith wrote: »

It sounds like you’re pretty overwhelmed in general at the moment. When I get like that, I can’t handle the politics of friendships! In the last few months, I’ve been busier than I ever have and I’ve had to text one group of friends and tell them I’d be AWOL for a few months and I’m sorry that I can’t be there for their life stuff right now, and I’ve pulled away completely from friends that drain me. I’ve kept up with a handful of close, local friends and I’ve been more engaged with acquaintances who don’t ask anything of me.

Maybe you could take a step back from this group for a bit without cutting all ties? Text the big WhatsApp group and say something like “Hey guys, I’m completely up the walls for the next while and won’t be around. I’ll catch up with you all again when things settle down” and then you can still keep in contact with the couple of mates you’re closest to in a 1:1 or smaller group way?

Yes, i've taken a complete back step from them and have only contacted the lads who contacted me individually. The politics in a large group of friends is draining and i don't need this crap right now.

Working nights, studying for a masters, work is as worse as its ever been, not getting on well there at all for the last 6 months. This sort of tipped me over the edge a little which led to me coming on here

jopax

corklily05 wrote: »

Yes, i've taken a complete back step from them and have only contacted the lads who contacted me individually. The politics in a large group of friends is draining and i don't need this crap right now.

Working nights, studying for a masters, work is as worse as its ever been, not getting on well there at all for the last 6 months. This sort of tipped me over the edge a little which led to me coming on here

I'm glad to hear your thinking that way, you don't deserve to be treated that way.
Life is hard enough at the best of times, you have to mind yourself & anyone that treats you that way is toxic.
You are standing your ground now & I understand things are tough ATM but things will get better.

corklily05

jopax wrote: »

I'm glad to hear your thinking that way, you don't deserve to be treated that way.
Life is hard enough at the best of times, you have to mind yourself & anyone that treats you that way is toxic.
You are standing your ground now & I understand things are tough ATM but things will get better.

Ya, i need to get to the bottom of this, working nights and doing an engineering masters have me pretty tied down. I really didn't need this at anytime, never mind now.
I know they'll get better, sometime you need somebody to say it

oil painting

Hi,

Firstly you should be really proud of yourself that you stood up for yourself and didn't get in the taxi and walked home alone. Your other friends should not have allowed him go too far he sounds like he has too much influence in the group. People who stand by and do nothing are just as much responsible, but you saw who your true friends were and they came back to you, you standing up for yourself may have made them think too.

There is an old quote someone said, you have enemies? Good, it means you stood up for something.

Secondly these trying times are blessings in disguise, use it for change. Your not like him and i think you should validate your experience and use it to step back from the pack. Leave the group again. Allow the true friends to contact you individually. These groups can be time consuming and pointless sometimes and it doesn't make for close friendships. Don't let anyone minimize how important this is to you and your life right now. If you didn't have to see what was going on in that group, getting notifications about it etc it would make your life a lot easier with the amount of pressure you are under.

The beauty of life is that we get to teach people how to treat us and who we want in it. You have a loving wife and network of friends, its OK to see where the value is and also let go of anyone that doesn't have your well being at heart. Your friends should be supporting you at this time not making your life worse.

And lastly i wouldn't go to that wedding.

SirChenjin

I'm inclined to think...let him off with himself and his wedding. It sounds like what a child would say 'you are not coming to MY party'.

Friendships change and move on. That's life. In your shoes, I would be focusing on what is important right now. It's not him. Or his wedding.

Mind yourself.

corklily05

SirChenjin wrote: »

I'm inclined to think...let him off with himself and his wedding. It sounds like what a child would say 'you are not coming to MY party'.

Friendships change and move on. That's life. In your shoes, I would be focusing on what is important right now. It's not him. Or his wedding.

Mind yourself.

oil painting wrote: »

Hi,

Firstly you should be really proud of yourself that you stood up for yourself and didn't get in the taxi and walked home alone. Your other friends should not have allowed him go too far he sounds like he has too much influence in the group. People who stand by and do nothing are just as much responsible, but you saw who your true friends were and they came back to you, you standing up for yourself may have made them think too.

There is an old quote someone said, you have enemies? Good, it means you stood up for something.

Secondly these trying times are blessings in disguise, use it for change. Your not like him and i think you should validate your experience and use it to step back from the pack. Leave the group again. Allow the true friends to contact you individually. These groups can be time consuming and pointless sometimes and it doesn't make for close friendships. Don't let anyone minimize how important this is to you and your life right now. If you didn't have to see what was going on in that group, getting notifications about it etc it would make your life a lot easier with the amount of pressure you are under.

The beauty of life is that we get to teach people how to treat us and who we want in it. You have a loving wife and network of friends, its OK to see where the value is and also let go of anyone that doesn't have your well being at heart. Your friends should be supporting you at this time not making your life worse.

And lastly i wouldn't go to that wedding.

Enough people have advised me on the stag and the wedding at the stage and i'm going to take them up on it.
It has had a lasting impression on me, i'm not actually the first person to be isolated from this group, there's been a few others over the last few years that have fallen by the wayside.

You're right about him having influence over the group, he's in that inner circle and to be honest, i was never really interested in being there due to having other friends and also the politics is so draining. As i see these reply's more and more it gives me a sense if relief that i'm making some good choices for my own welfare and not putting a lot of time into something and getting hardly anything back

valoren

Is this guy really a friend? There is a distinct difference between banter and abuse. The difference being that with banter you get it, you laugh along with it. The guy sounds like a social bully, one who attempts to mask his verbal abuse with the "it's just banter" excuse. When you call out inappropriate, below the belt, disrespectful comments they typically say "It's just banter". It is, as such, victim blaming i.e. you are the one deemed causing an argument, not them. It's the kind of insidious manipulation a social bully exploits.

I think what this dope was doing was taunting you, provoking you into an argument and it worked. It's interesting the others stayed quiet, he sounds like a head melting, **** stirring attention seeker tbh. I think what happened was perhaps intentional to cause an argument with the view of isolating you from the group i.e. he says something insulting, you react, give as good as you get, he plays victim in the 'clique' and the net result is you are further isolated and estranged.

Whenever you feel like you are getting slagged it's is helpful to probe and not deflect. Ask questions e.g. "What do you mean by that?". When he said "You're not invited to my wedding" instead of brushing it off with a whatever you should have said "Why?", "Did you go to my wedding?" etc. Question, question, question.

Calling them out on any BS helps hold up a mirror to them and it always embarrasses a social bully who must scramble to find coherent explanations and respectful answers to your legitimate questions. If they invoke the 'just banter' line just say "Do I look like I'm laughing?". If they have any peer respect for you then they'll take the hint and if it continues, if you standing up for yourself is not respected then, it's not only an indication for you to cut out one of your toxic friends, it might be an indication to cut off this particular group of friends. The mature, right minded one's you can still meet up with but not within the bigger group as other's mentioned.

corklily05

valoren wrote: »

Is this guy really a friend? There is a distinct difference between banter and abuse. The difference being that with banter you get it, you laugh along with it. The guy sounds like a social bully, one who attempts to mask his verbal abuse with the "it's just banter" excuse. When you call out inappropriate, below the belt, disrespectful comments they typically say "It's just banter". It is, as such, victim blaming i.e. you are the one deemed causing an argument, not them. It's the kind of insidious manipulation a social bully exploits.

I think what this dope was doing was taunting you, provoking you into an argument and it worked. It's interesting the others stayed quiet, he sounds like a head melting, **** stirring attention seeker tbh. I think what happened was perhaps intentional to cause an argument with the view of isolating you from the group i.e. he says something insulting, you react, give as good as you get, he plays victim in the 'clique' and the net result is you are further isolated and estranged.

Whenever you feel like you are getting slagged it's is helpful to probe and not deflect. Ask questions e.g. "What do you mean by that?". When he said "You're not invited to my wedding" instead of brushing it off with a whatever you should have said "Why?", "Did you go to my wedding?" etc. Question, question, question.

Calling them out on any BS helps hold up a mirror to them and it always embarrasses a social bully who must scramble to find coherent explanations and respectful answers to your legitimate questions. If they invoke the 'just banter' line just say "Do I look like I'm laughing?". If they have any peer respect for you then they'll take the hint and if it continues, if you standing up for yourself is not respected then, it's not only an indication for you to cut out one of your toxic friends, it might be an indication to cut off this particular group of friends. The mature, right minded one's you can still meet up with but not within the bigger group as other's mentioned.

Is this guy really a friend?
Yes, i thought so anyway, i wouldn't be as close to him as some of the others but he is influential in the group and lives at home so sees the lads more often than i do. There's a lot of s**t talk on the whats app group with lots of in jokes, i haven't got a clue what they're talking about half the time. It can be exhausting.

If he wanted to isolate me from the group well, he was very successful. I'm now on the brink of loosing a whole group of friends in one go that i've been part of for nearly 20 years. I know i can meet the decent lads individually but its not the same.

It kills me but i think you're right, as hard as it is, its time to delete myself from the whats app group and move on.

oil painting

OP take your time with it all, you dont have to act ASAP with the group when all this sinks in you will make the best decision for you.

It sounds like you have gone off and become quite successful and grown a lot, if this main guy knows that and then he might have always wanted to be someone like you with the confidence to leave where your from and make a new life.

People hate you for 1 of 3 reasons.
1.) They hate themselves
2.) They want to be you
3.) They see you as a threat

If his identity is all about who he was as a kid then hes holding on tightly to that and feels threatened by you and others like you. This can help with maybe how directly personal he is making it toward you, he would treat anyone like that who he was threatened by.

There can be a deep sense of loss when you have to step away from where these friendships are at now and the buzz of a group, but what the evidence now shows is that it changed a long time ago and you have matured enough to see it. BY addressing this you are closing some doors to make way for an even better outcome. Without realising it you have dealt with the problem, the outcome will take care of itself, if that helps any with how big it all seems right now.

Satta Massagana

corklily05 wrote: »

I suppose not everyone who's advising me can be wrong about this, yes the 2 lads are decent. Another guy in the group, his father passed away recently and i couldn't bring myself to travel down and attend the funeral.

I'm also doing a masters and working full time so i didnt really need this on my plate

I agree with the advice given. If it was me I'd say good to luck to this fella, let him on his way. Dont go to his poxy stags & wedding. Block yourself out of that "whatsaps" group. Stay in contact individually with the ones whom you are closest to.

Is the lad whos father passed away and you didnt bother going to the funeral still cool with you?
Sounds to me like you've definitely moved on from this group if you make excuses like "having a full time job" and "not needing it on your plate" to not go to one of their dads funerals.

corklily05

oil painting wrote: »

OP take your time with it all, you dont have to act ASAP with the group when all this sinks in you will make the best decision for you.

It sounds like you have gone off and become quite successful and grown a lot, if this main guy knows that and then he might have always wanted to be someone like you with the confidence to leave where your from and make a new life.

People hate you for 1 of 3 reasons.
1.) They hate themselves
2.) They want to be you
3.) They see you as a threat

If his identity is all about who he was as a kid then hes holding on tightly to that and feels threatened by you and others like you. This can help with maybe how directly personal he is making it toward you, he would treat anyone like that who he was threatened by.

There can be a deep sense of loss when you have to step away from where these friendships are at now and the buzz of a group, but what the evidence now shows is that it changed a long time ago and you have matured enough to see it. BY addressing this you are closing some doors to make way for an even better outcome. Without realising it you have dealt with the problem, the outcome will take care of itself, if that helps any with how big it all seems right now.

I've probably matured into a person they don't really recognise anymore and still think i'm the same person i was a few years ago. I feel sometimes people cant understand that i've changed a lot, and out of all the people in the group, i've changed the most.

I understand what you say about being a threat but how exactly would you be a threat if you're not around most of the time?

corklily05

Satta Massagana wrote: »

I agree with the advice given. If it was me I'd say good to luck to this fella, let him on his way. Dont go to his poxy stags & wedding. Block yourself out of that "whatsaps" group. Stay in contact individually with the ones whom you are closest to.

Is the lad whos father passed away and you didnt bother going to the funeral still cool with you?
Sounds to me like you've definitely moved on from this group if you make excuses like "having a full time job" and "not needing it on your plate" to not go to one of their dads funerals.

I agree that maybe i have. Yes, i was talking to him and told him i had a deadline to make (which was true) and he was ok with it. I felt bad for not being there but i wasn't in the mood for small talk.

All i can say that the politics of the group is crazy! So much so, people use it to feel important and to acknowledge what you said about being done with them, yes, i believe i am. Its for my own mental health and well being that i'm done with them aswell.

There's also, a big bunch of girls aswell which complicates things even more and adds to the politics. When i think actually as i type this, i was screwed over for my wedding. My wife to be pointed this out to me and of course i brushed it off.

My wedding was booked for such a date long before anybody else in the group. Next thing all of a sudden, 1 guy books a wedding 2 weeks before mine and then another girl books hers 2 weeks after mine.

Now, this part may be my own fault as it wasn't on the invitation, but none of the lads showed up to the night after, even though they went to the night after of the other 2 (it was on theirs). Am i overthinking this? Was booking the wedding around mine and therefore 'sandwiching' mine in between the other 2 a lack of respect?

Should i of walked away ages ago and this incident was the straw that broke the camels back?

wiggle16

corklily05 wrote: »

Should i of walked away ages ago and this incident was the straw that broke the camels back?

Not being smart but what difference does it make to ask that question? Point is you didn't walk away at the time. You've decided to do so now. There's no point in mulling over what you put up with in the past, it makes you bitter you're just raking over the coals.

corklily05

wiggle16 wrote: »

Not being smart but what difference does it make to ask that question? Point is you didn't walk away at the time. You've decided to do so now. There's no point in mulling over what you put up with in the past, it makes you bitter you're just raking over the coals.

I feel a little stupid and taken advantage of. But, i get the point

jopax

corklily05 wrote: »

I agree that maybe i have. Yes, i was talking to him and told him i had a deadline to make (which was true) and he was ok with it. I felt bad for not being there but i wasn't in the mood for small talk.

All i can say that the politics of the group is crazy! So much so, people use it to feel important and to acknowledge what you said about being done with them, yes, i believe i am. Its for my own mental health and well being that i'm done with them aswell.

There's also, a big bunch of girls aswell which complicates things even more and adds to the politics. When i think actually as i type this, i was screwed over for my wedding. My wife to be pointed this out to me and of course i brushed it off.

My wedding was booked for such a date long before anybody else in the group. Next thing all of a sudden, 1 guy books a wedding 2 weeks before mine and then another girl books hers 2 weeks after mine.

Now, this part may be my own fault as it wasn't on the invitation, but none of the lads showed up to the night after, even though they went to the night after of the other 2 (it was on theirs). Am i overthinking this? Was booking the wedding around mine and therefore 'sandwiching' mine in between the other 2 a lack of respect?

Should i of walked away ages ago and this incident was the straw that broke the camels back?

I would trust your wife's instinct on this, sometimes when your in a situation it's hard to see the bigger picture.

Also you come across as a decent & genuine guy & because your not like them your looking through a different filter.

As to whether you should have walked away before is not important now, it's probably better because they've had enough chances so you know your doing what's best for you.

oil painting

corklily05 wrote: »

I've probably matured into a person they don't really recognise anymore and still think i'm the same person i was a few years ago. I feel sometimes people cant understand that i've changed a lot, and out of all the people in the group, i've changed the most.

I understand what you say about being a threat but how exactly would you be a threat if you're not around most of the time?

because you just said your the one who changed the most, and your the one he targeted the other night regarding his wedding. Like as if he wanted to put you in your place or make you feel your getting too big for your boots.

It seems there is a large extended group there but even if people are bitchy behind your back they can still respect you for how you choose to live your life, and you do get more comfortable as time goes on to not give a sh1t, also you pave the way for others to choose the same because you can bet that within such a big group you wont be the first or last to step back from it, others will have partners too and be feeling the same as time goes on.

Have you decided what your gona do next?

If a lot of your friends are getting married and are that age then it is really the time when you find out who your real friends are. Quality of quantity like.

valoren

corklily05 wrote: »

I've probably matured into a person they don't really recognise anymore and still think i'm the same person i was a few years ago. I feel sometimes people cant understand that i've changed a lot, and out of all the people in the group, i've changed the most.

I understand what you say about being a threat but how exactly would you be a threat if you're not around most of the time?

You can be a threat for attention. You mentioned that this guy seems to be a major influence of the clique within the bigger group. There can be a sort of crab mentality at play here as you are not around all the time. You are away much of the time and when you come back into the group dynamic having been away for a period of time, who will people be interested in? Who will they pay attention to, asking questions out of sheer curiosity? You naturally. You haven't been around, you've been away, you've got stories to tell etc.

You can be a target merely for being yourself and going about your business. For small minded, turf protectors like that guy it can be seen as a threat whereas you can be understandably blind to that group dynamic shifting in your favor. A social bully will look to clip your wings, protect their turf so to speak. The process of isolating you seems to be underway. Since you are considering ditching the group then that plan has succeeded.

You also mentioned that they make references and jokes in the whatsapp which go over your head. Look up 'dog whistling' as they could have been making in-jokes between themselves at your oblivious expense. A cowardly, pathetic practice but it's pretty common.

Sunny Dayz

To be honest I think there's a guy like that in a lot of social groups. Doesn't quite know when things go from friendly banter to something that might be hurtful. There's someone like that in my social circle. He didn't like being called out and got into a snit over it, "can you not take a joke sure I was only having a bit of craic". The dust settled on it over time, he has been a good friend down through the years and these misunderstandings once in a while were not worth losing his friendship over.


Is this guy in anyway a friend to you? Would you miss him? you haven't mentioned anything positive about him in your posts?

SirChenjin

corklily05 wrote: »

Is this guy really a friend?
Yes, i thought so anyway, i wouldn't be as close to him as some of the others but he is influential in the group and lives at home so sees the lads more often than i do. There's a lot of s**t talk on the whats app group with lots of in jokes, i haven't got a clue what they're talking about half the time. It can be exhausting.

If he wanted to isolate me from the group well, he was very successful. I'm now on the brink of loosing a whole group of friends in one go that i've been part of for nearly 20 years.I know i can meet the decent lads individually but its not the same.

It kills me but i think you're right, as hard as it is, its time to delete myself from the whats app group and move on.

There seems to be a lot of negatives overall, in relation to the group. Just look back at the two pieces I have bolded there. Is it a big loss? I'm not saying yay or nay, just saying step back a bit and evaluate things.

Take your time. You have other pressures, other stuff going on. Back away a bit from the drama that this person seems to be creating. Don't rush to break contact...because of one person. Put yourself back in charge here.

Chances are that others in the group will start to see through him. They may be the next target. Keep in touch with the decent guys.

Mind yourself.

Ursus Horribilis

Maybe you're sad about losing the idea of this group of friends, rather than what it has turned into? I get the impression that a lot of this is being driven by sentimentality and it's blind-siding you. In reality, most people drift away from their old school friends once they grow up and move away. What kept a group of friends together during their teenage years is unlikely to be the glue that maintains their friendship as they move into their 20s and 30s. In other words, it's unrealistic that this larger group of friends are all genuinely good buddies. It probably is going to fragment over time, with you just being the first.

You've mentioned the politics of it a few times. Maybe that is as good a reason as any to step away from some of these people? Friends are supposed to be people whose company you enjoy and who like you back. There shouldn't be people being made mugs of or the politics that seem to be underlying Whatsapp groups and the likes. Most adults don't have oodles of friends so maybe it's time for you to do a quality vs quantity re-evaluation of your relationships with your old friends. Would it not be better to just stay in contact with the ones who are genuine, rather than grappling with the ones who are frenemies?

corklily05

Thanks for all the messages of support guys!
Just an update on this, i left the whats app group and messages of support have been coming in straight away.Not just, 'you ok?' messages but really meaningful messages. I think they get the idea that something was wrong and have expressed real concern. I replied to those who text outlining whats wrong and they have been more than supportive to be fair.
I have not asked to be put back on to the whats app group so i'm still keeping an arms length for the meantime. I've been taken back a little in the last day or 2 so i'm waiting to see what transpires in the weeks to come.
I'm not going running back to anyone but they have surpassed my expectation. Thing is, i don't know if its smoke and mirrors or that they've realised one guy in particular pushed it to far

wiggle16

corklily05 wrote: »

I'm not going running back to anyone but they have surpassed my expectation. Thing is, i don't know if its smoke and mirrors or that they've realised one guy in particular pushed it to far

I'd take them at face value. If they didn't care, you wouldn't be getting those messages.

corklily05

Just want to update people on this matter, the guy who i had the disagreement with at christmas text yesterday to ask for my address. I told him that unfortunately due to exams i wasn't able to attend the wedding, just being polite i wished him the best. I got a long text off him his evening saying that he hopes our disagreement at christmas didn't have a bearing on me attending his wedding, he also admitted things got out of hand and by the looks of things he's showing a little regret.

Thing is, i don't think i can ever look at this guy the same way and i can't help thinking that this text is some kneejerk reaction to my inability to attend his wedding.

Any thoughts?

Infonovice

go with your gut OP.

I wouldn't want to be friends with someone like that.
and I wouldn't feel a tiny bit bad for not attending the wedding either.

You don't owe him anything

Ursus Horribilis

I've re-read this thread and come away from it feeling a bit baffled. What exactly are you looking for from this guy? Or indeed, from this group? All we can go on is what you've told us here and quite honestly, I can't figure out whether you're being over-sensitive or if there is something else going on here. None of us was there at Christmas so it's impossible to read into what happened that night. Are you sure that it wasn't simply a drunk guy thinking his laddish banter was "hilarious" and accidentally going too far? When someone's struggling with their mental health, as you are, things can get blown out of proportion. That comment about not being able to bring yourself to go to your friend's father's funeral is striking.

That bit about them "sandwiching" your wedding date between theirs can be read in different ways but you're choosing to see the most negative one. It could've been perfectly innocent - you hadn't actually told them when the wedding was taking place. Where did you get married - was it local or would they have had travel to it? 2-3 weddings on the bounce is a real drain on most people's bank balances. And seeing as you've moved away, you are somewhat on the periphery of things now.

Anyway, going back on point. As things stand, things are civil between you and this guy. You've given him a legitimate reason why you can't attend his wedding and wished him well. He has apologised. Why he apologised in that text is anyone's guess. You don't seem to believe it's genuine though. You've got to understand here that none of us knows you, this guy, what happened that night or indeed the dynamics of this group of friends. If him being in your life is making you miserable, then now is the perfect time to downgrade him to being an acquaintance. Someone you'll pass the time with when you're socialising but won't be hanging out with. It's up to you to figure out where you stand and what it is you want. Forget all that "I've been friends with them for 20 years" stuff. People change a lot in 20 years and sometimes it's better to let some of them drift from your life. If the politics and sh*t stirring are contributing to your unhappiness, why would you want to be friends with all of these people? You're not 15 any more.

Big Bag of Chips

Regardless of what he says, or how he feels or anything else about him... You get to choose whether or not you accept the invitation to his wedding. You don't have to go. It's only a (very expensive) day out. There will be others who cannot attend for various reasons.

You do what feels right for you. If right now, you don't want to be in his company, or don't want to drop your guard around him that's fine. But if you feel like at some point you want to give the friendship another chance, that's also fine. If you have never had an issue with others in the group, then you shouldn't have any issue with them now.

Take time away from the other fella. Don't react or respond negatively to his messages. Keeping a dignified response will always be best. And it also leaves him in the awkward position of you actually having done nothing wrong, and him looking like an idiot for manufacturing a row!

Go with however you feel. No harm skipping the wedding. Yer man doesn't sound like someone I'd be happy handing a generous gift over to just for the pleasure of being in his company for a day.