Polish Mayor murdered on stage

circadian

Edgelords out in force on this one.

Franz Von Peppercorn

batgoat wrote: »

So you view hijacking the judiciary as okay? What view would you hold on the enabling act?


Was actually a reduction of the age of retirement to 65 from 70. It would have resulted in a third of supreme court judges retiring. The government could then replace one third of judges with those that they wanted in. The argument that the Polish government used was that it would allow for the removal of communist era appointments.

The reason they're being brought to the ECJ is because the EU view the intent to be to undermine the judiciary and it violates two EU treaties.

The communist era justices should be on trial or in jail. They either presided over a totalitarian state’s justice system as regime supporting prosecutors, defense lawyers or justices - in a state that jailed people for non orthodox beliefs or civil association.

Should have happened years ago. Might have been better to get rid of them for communist era sympathies though.


It’s not a good look for the EU.

Sonic Youth

batgoat wrote: »

So you view hijacking the judiciary as okay? What view would you hold on the enabling act?

Couldn't give a toss how they run their affairs. Perhaps the Fuher Merkel should do the same?

I admire the Poles for their nationalism.

Franz Von Peppercorn

Anyway looks like Poland has backed down.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/11/21/poland-bows-eu-pressure-controversial-judicial-reforms/

batgoat

Lefty Bicek wrote: »

In the first place, it's quite cynical of you to lump your agenda in there. None of your screed has any real prominence in the article you linked to.

In the second place, as much as you are hostile to 'right wing', when Poland was soi disant left-wing, do you think you would have thrived ?

Poland's has problems and issues to face, but the fact that it is a substantially mono-ethnic and mono-cultural society is not one of them.

I'd paint it as pretty relevant, the far right made him into a figure of hate in Poland. A far right politician said he was a "traitor to the nation", after he was killed.

His liberal stance cast him as a hate figure for government supporters and the far right. In a 2017 publicity stunt, the All-Polish Youth movement published a series of “political death certificates” of pro-European politicians; on Adamowicz’s certificate, they put his “cause of death” as “liberalism, multiculturalism, stupidity”. Observers say he was regularly subjected to personal attacks and abuse on social media and from rightwing media outlets.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jan/15/gdansk-polish-city-mourning-mayor-pawel-adamowicz-stabbing

So the parallels between him and the likes of Jo Cox is entirely relevant.

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

The communist era justices should be on trial or in jail. They either presided over a totalitarian state’s justice system as regime supporting prosecutors, defense lawyers or justices - in a state that jailed people for non orthodox beliefs or civil association.

Should have happened years ago. Might have been better to get rid of them for communist era sympathies though.


It’s not a good look for the EU.

It's not a good look for the EU that they expect Poland to abide by the law and not attempt to undermine the judiciary? This led to national protests btw. For example the head of the Supreme Court gets taken out by this law, she's post communist era. Anyway, here's a chronology of all the other dodgy things that the Polish government did in relation to the judiciary.. Communism is not their government's concern.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu-poland-chronology/chronology-poland-clashes-with-eu-over-judicial-reforms-rule-of-law-idUSKBN1JU25U

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

Anyway looks like Poland has backed down.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/11/21/poland-bows-eu-pressure-controversial-judicial-reforms/

Pretty irrelevant since they've already undermined the judiciary as outlined in the above article. There's still an inquiry into the government for all the other ways they've undermined their judiciary.

AndyTheDude

strandroad wrote: »

Sure, it's a family picnic.

Well, looks like it is:

batgoat

Leaving out the photos of those wearing Balaclavas. The fact that the 'National Radical Camp' were present, they're most definitely fascists. The fact that the Mayor of Warsaw opposed the march due to hate speech. So yeah, I'm sure you'll find pictures of parents at Nazi Rallies back in the day too, doesn't change what they were.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/poland-independence-day-far-right-march-protest-banned-warsaw-court-ruling-a8625506.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Radical_Camp

skooterblue2

Captain Obvious wrote: »

A what now?

When the government want to do something unofficially, they either use a patsi or criminal element. Afterwards they can be disposed of without any great concern.

Sonic Youth

batgoat wrote: »

Leaving out the photos of those wearing Balaclavas. The fact that the 'National Radical Camp' were present, they're most definitely fascists. The fact that the Mayor of Warsaw opposed the march due to hate speech. So yeah, I'm sure you'll find pictures of parents at Nazi Rallies back in the day too, doesn't change what they were.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/poland-independence-day-far-right-march-protest-banned-warsaw-court-ruling-a8625506.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Radical_Camp

Get a life you spa.


Mod-Banned

pjohnson

skooterblue2 wrote: »

When the government want to do something unofficially, they either use a patsi or criminal element. Afterwards they can be disposed of without any great concern.

So you escaped CT yourself.

strandroad

AndyTheDude wrote: »

Well, looks like it is:

Sadly it only shows how widespread this mindset is in the society if people think it's good judgment to bring their children into the above.

Sonic Youth

strandroad wrote: »

Sadly it only shows how widespread this mindset is in the society if people think it's good judgment to bring their children into the above.

Why do western euros get so assravaged when they see Eastern Europeans who love their countries?

There's no need to project you own self hatred onto them.

strandroad

Sonic Youth wrote: »

Why do western euros get so assravaged when they see Eastern Europeans who love their countries?

There's no need to project you own self hatred onto them.

You can always go on a family weekend break, cheap pints and you can bring out your kids to march with the nazis. Wins all around.

Sonic Youth

strandroad wrote: »

You can always go on a family weekend break, cheap pints and you can bring out your kids to march with the nazis. Wins all around.

Don't have to worry about Islamic terror attacks either

AndyTheDude

strandroad wrote: »

Sadly it only shows how widespread this mindset is in the society if people think it's good judgment to bring their children into the above.

From what I've read, the total damage caused during the march was a broken car mirror and a few overturned bins. Quite an impressive result for 200.000 people marching together. It was a very peaceful event.

SnakePlissken

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Interesting parallels to Jo Cox.

Interesting parallels to Pim Fortuyn.

MarkHenderson

Sorry to see this person murdered, inexcusable stuff.

Poland seems a country headed in the right direction in general though.

AndyTheDude

strandroad wrote: »

You can always go on a family weekend break, cheap pints and you can bring out your kids to march with the nazis. Wins all around.

Describing the Polish people as "nazis" or "fascists" only shows how little understanding you have about Poland and its history. Quite sad really.

batgoat

MarkHenderson wrote: »

Sorry to see this person murdered, inexcusable stuff.

Poland seems a country headed in the right direction in general though.

Then you don't know much about Poland unless you think a government undermining the judicial system is a good look?

Captain Obvious

skooterblue2 wrote: »

When the government want to do something unofficially, they either use a patsi or criminal element. Afterwards they can be disposed of without any great concern.

You think Jo Cox was killed by the government?

SnakePlissken wrote: »

Interesting parallels to Pim Fortuyn.

Indeed.

strandroad

AndyTheDude wrote: »

From what I've read, the total damage caused during the march was a broken car mirror and a few overturned bins. Quite an impressive result for 200.000 people marching together. It was a very peaceful event.

Sure, as they tend to be.

skooterblue2

Captain Obvious wrote: »

You think Jo Cox was killed by the government?

Well when an autistic guy with no previous history of violence and help migrants integrate...... it is a bit unusual. Also Autistic people and people with mental health difficulties are susceptible to brain washing.

I think Jo Cox was a sacrificial lamb for the remain campaign.

I definitely think this mayor was a concern to this government.

sk8erboii

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Well when an autistic guy with no previous history of violence and help migrants integrate...... it is a bit unusual. Also Autistic people and people with mental health difficulties are susceptible to brain washing.

I think Jo Cox was a sacrificial lamb for the remain campaign.

I definitely think this mayor was a concern to this government.

Ah yes. Project MKULTRA

strandroad

AndyTheDude wrote: »

Describing the Polish people as "nazis" or "fascists" only shows how little understanding you have about Poland and its history. Quite sad really.

Fortunately my reference was in relation to the nazi groups in the march.

Billy86

batgoat wrote: »

Leaving out the photos of those wearing Balaclavas. The fact that the 'National Radical Camp' were present, they're most definitely fascists. The fact that the Mayor of Warsaw opposed the march due to hate speech. So yeah, I'm sure you'll find pictures of parents at Nazi Rallies back in the day too, doesn't change what they were.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/poland-independence-day-far-right-march-protest-banned-warsaw-court-ruling-a8625506.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Radical_Camp

Yeah, but when you ignore the neo Nazi aspect, its as if there is no neo Nazi aspect at all!!

Like I said, politics as sports; reality is irrelevant to many of them.

Billy86

AndyTheDude wrote: »

Describing the Polish people as "nazis" or "fascists" only shows how little understanding you have about Poland and its history. Quite sad really.

Not really no, just look at Israel.

Lefty Bicek

batgoat wrote: »

I'd paint it as pretty relevant, the far right made him into a figure of hate in Poland. A far right politician said he was a "traitor to the nation", after he was killed.

Why am I not surprised that 'personal responsiblity' is nowhere in your analysis.

Earthsnotflat

What current government does and believes is one thing but it seems like they can't tolerate any opinion different than theirs, any opposition, any balanced debate. They allow to treat their political opponents as enemies hence very toxic rhetoric. point is there is place for different opinions in democracy and even some extreme groups but when government make one group feel as true patriots against others that are treated as enemies and traitors for short term political gain , that is highly irresponsible and dangerous. They want to rid country of 'communists' yet they are so like them at heart, fighting enemies everywhere and creating paranoid world view when only one side is always right

Billy86

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Well when an autistic guy with no previous history of violence and help migrants integrate...... it is a bit unusual. Also Autistic people and people with mental health difficulties are susceptible to brain washing.

People with MH issues are typically a lot more susceptible to violent rhetoric as you mentioned. Tommy Mair was big into his white supremacy, had links to National Front and the EDL, was big enough into far right publications that he regularly wrote to them, was a fan of Anders Breivik, and on and on the list goes.

It did not drive him to a 'moment of madness' type situation though, as he was declared sane at the time he committed the crime, and had likely been harvesting these thoughts for a while - having looked up other assassinated MPs and having literature on how to construct bombs lying around his house.

RandomName2

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Well when an autistic guy with no previous history of violence and help migrants integrate...... it is a bit unusual. Also Autistic people and people with mental health difficulties are susceptible to brain washing.

I think Jo Cox was a sacrificial lamb for the remain campaign.

I definitely think this mayor was a concern to this government.

'To say that I'm skeptical about all the above is an understatement' is an understatement.