Public servants' inability to afford to pay rent in Dublin.

spurious

The starting rate for a teacher is neither here nor there if they cannot get full-time positions, which has been the case for years. Older teachers retire and their job is split into three.

Suddenly people can't afford rent? Hardly a surprise on a 1/3 or less of a full salary.

facehugger99

political analyst wrote: »

Uhhhhh... public-sector workers are taxpayers, too, you know!

Yeah, paying taxes with money they been given by the State - like the dole-bludgers.

Get real.

Assetbacked

Deleted User wrote: »

For all the midget brains who fight over the crumbs/fail to see the big picture:

Wealth inequality is soaring – here are the 10 reasons why it’s happening

Richest people work system to pay less tax than those on average wages

Ireland in top six for helping companies avoid taxes according to Oxfam report: Ireland has been ranked sixth in a new Oxfam developed league table of the world’s worst corporate tax havens.

World's richest 0.1% have boosted their wealth by as much as poorest half: Inequality report also shows UK’s 50,000 richest people have seen their share of the country’s wealth double since 1984

Many of Ireland's wealthiest taxed at rate below average worker: C&AG report shows huge variation in tax paid by 334 high net worth individuals:

This is absolutely crucial for people to accept - wealth inequality is at disgusting levels and nothing meaningful is being taken to address it. If you are a capitalist proponent, you would believe in 1000 millionaires over 1 billionaire. What we have now is a broken system and a recalibration is required.

As wealth inequality grows and grows we will have more extreme political events occurring as a means of protest against the system. Things like Trump, Brexit and far right parties gaining momentum are all completely understandable. It will only get worse and I think, honestly, a war is the scale of an event which would lead to a correction in the system and this does not seem to be an unlikely outcome with what voters will be voting for in the coming decades.

All of this is the over-arching context for Ireland's housing crisis - politicians who have lead us to the cliff edge, who have allowed a situation where we are told the economy is strong and yet, with every passing year, people are left with less cash i.e. people are getting poorer each year for the last few years in Ireland. The only wealth gains are being felt at the top. The workers turn on each other, they turn on different religions, races etc. when in reality, there is a common enemy and it is the extreme inequality. This infighting among the proles leads to disorganisation and difficulty in mobilising the masses but that of course suits the top .1% who make more money regardless.

wrangler

wrangler wrote: »

Alright then, all revenue originates from the private sector......apart of course from what we're borrowing to run the country

go make some money appear in a country without a government.

we'll be waiting when you come back with your success story.


ah lads, as a highly paid civil servant lemme tell ya it's threads like these that are the best part of the gig. like being a WWE heel but with bonus anonymity and apparently better pay. i love it.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

limnam wrote: »

From march last year.


Davy stockbrokers have today released a report on public sector pay in Ireland.
The report has found that average public sector wages are €47,400 in Ireland, 40% higher than in the private sector


I don't know how they survive.

You do realise that 'average' pay figures are usually seriously skewed by the huge salaries of the top layer. So while CEOs and DGs of Public Sector Organisations and very senior managers may be getting very very generous salaries, your average PS worker is getting anything but.

cgcsb

political analyst wrote: »

If paying public-sector workers who live in the cities extra is OK in Britain then why is it not OK in our country?

Because of the UK's unprecedented inability to adapt to the 21st century and the impending collapse of that country. It is not a model to follow. The solution isn't MORE regional disparity, MORE inequality and MORE house price inflation.
The solution is to build homes.

cgcsb

Electric Sheep wrote: »

She will survive it the same way we did in the 80s on civil service entry level wages.

With mass emmigration, perpetual recession and low living standards? you're grand there boomer man. There's better solutions.

Ush1

Do some people think that total equality(of outcome) is achievable or desirable??:pac:

facehugger99

facehugger99 wrote: »

Yeah, paying taxes with money they been given by the State - like the dole-bludgers.

Get real.

Get a real job, you mean. Get out of that private sector nonsense.

www.publicjobs.ie, baby. Plenty of room for more snouts in the trough.

facehugger99

facehugger99 wrote: »

Yeah, paying taxes with money they been given by the State - like the dole-bludgers.

Get real.

And none of that money makes its way back into the private sector either. They shop in stores with huge signs over them saying "Public Sector Workers Only"........

cgcsb

Deleted User wrote: »

For all the midget brains who fight over the crumbs/fail to see the big picture:

Wealth inequality is soaring – here are the 10 reasons why it’s happening

Richest people work system to pay less tax than those on average wages

Ireland in top six for helping companies avoid taxes according to Oxfam report: Ireland has been ranked sixth in a new Oxfam developed league table of the world’s worst corporate tax havens.

World's richest 0.1% have boosted their wealth by as much as poorest half: Inequality report also shows UK’s 50,000 richest people have seen their share of the country’s wealth double since 1984

Many of Ireland's wealthiest taxed at rate below average worker: C&AG report shows huge variation in tax paid by 334 high net worth individuals:

Getting poor people to fight with slightly poorer people over a few €s is a great trick of the elite. Indeed it is the oldest trick in the book for extremely unequal regimes.

thegetawaycar

Why don't the councils use some of the public housing that they already have to provide accommodation to front line public service staff at a reasonable rent and the non contributing members of society can be housed in less over subscribed areas. This could be taxed as a BIK and they would provide a benefit to their local areas.

limnam

limnam wrote: »

so 6k less for Dublin starter


and we can bring outside of Dublin down by 13k


I'll take that.

grand so, off with you to the bargaining table and ....

oh wait....

you're not at the table are you?

sorry bud. wailing into the void for you im afraid.

cgcsb

Trigger Happy wrote: »

It feels like people expect to leave school and be able to rent on their own from their first pay packet.
But yeah, house share was the norm for the first few years before getting settled.

Well, leave university with a good degree and do same, yeah, which is standard in most of Europe, except the broken UK, and maybe Paris. You can rent decent places in Copenhagen (a country where the general cost of living is eye watering) for a lot less than Dublin. Policy is flawd, expectations are not.

end of the road

limnam wrote: »

Sure it is.










No public sector worker has lost their home due to losing their public sector job. So they wouldn't know anything about losing thier job in the PS as no there was no one made redundant from the PS during the "cut backs"


Is this really such a hard concept to understand?

it doesn't matter the circumstances, losing a home is losing a home, it's not unique to the private sector. there will be people no doubt who joined the public sector who were previously in the private sector, who know about losing a job also. public and private sector workers married to each other, or in a long term relationship, effected by either cuts or job losses.

political analyst wrote: »

If paying public-sector workers who live in the cities extra is OK in Britain then why is it not OK in our country?

i personally don't think it's okay in britain either.

Electric Sheep wrote: »

She will survive it the same way we did in the 80s on civil service entry level wages. Rent a 3 bedroom house between five friends/coworkers. Two girls to each of the large bedroom, 1 in the small one. Girl with her own room pays a bit more. Split bills, all chip into a fund for household necessities like loo paper, cleaning materials, milk, bread, butter, etc.

It was never easy starting out, apart from the blip of the celtic tiger, which so many on boards seem to think was the norm.

times have changed. what was fine in the 80s isn't necessarily exceptible now for better or worse.

facehugger99 wrote: »

Indeed, one of the more cynical vote-buying exercise of FF - using our money of course.

The amount of debt this country has had to take on during the recession to keep the PS in the style they've become accustomed to, makes the banking bail-out look like the Teddy Bear's Picnic.

It absolutely outrageous that at the first signs of economic recovery they've their hands out again trying to take more.

They should agree to a pay-freeze for the next 15 years to show some gratitude to the private sector that kept them in employment at overly-generous rates for the last decade.

they are showing grattitude to the private sector by doing the job they get paid for.

facehugger99 wrote: »

Yeah, paying taxes with money they been given by the State - like the dole-bludgers.

Get real.

they are paying tax.

cgcsb

Assetbacked wrote: »

This is absolutely crucial for people to accept - wealth inequality is at disgusting levels and nothing meaningful is being taken to address it. If you are a capitalist proponent, you would believe in 1000 millionaires over 1 billionaire. What we have now is a broken system and a recalibration is required.

As wealth inequality grows and grows we will have more extreme political events occurring as a means of protest against the system. Things like Trump, Brexit and far right parties gaining momentum are all completely understandable. It will only get worse and I think, honestly, a war is the scale of an event which would lead to a correction in the system and this does not seem to be an unlikely outcome with what voters will be voting for in the coming decades.

All of this is the over-arching context for Ireland's housing crisis - politicians who have lead us to the cliff edge, who have allowed a situation where we are told the economy is strong and yet, with every passing year, people are left with less cash i.e. people are getting poorer each year for the last few years in Ireland. The only wealth gains are being felt at the top. The workers turn on each other, they turn on different religions, races etc. when in reality, there is a common enemy and it is the extreme inequality. This infighting among the proles leads to disorganisation and difficulty in mobilising the masses but that of course suits the top .1% who make more money regardless.

The elite in the UK managed to convince the working class, through the tabloids, that the source of their woe was the EU. It'll be interesting to see what external foe the Irish elite will try to pin our collective poverty on and will it be successful.

cgcsb

Ush1 wrote: »

Do some people think that total equality(of outcome) is achievable or desirable??:pac:

No, people think that middle earners should easily afford a roof over their head and low earners should easily afford to rent a roof over their heads. As is the case in most of Europe and the case in Ireland before Goldman Sachs set our housing policy.

end of the road

thegetawaycar wrote: »

Why don't the councils use some of the public housing that they already have to provide accommodation to front line public service staff at a reasonable rent and the non contributing members of society can be housed in less over subscribed areas. This could be taxed as a BIK and they would provide a benefit to their local areas.

because the supposibly less over-subscribed areas are still over-subscribed as they have their own people having issues with housing.

cgcsb

thegetawaycar wrote: »

Why don't the councils use some of the public housing that they already have to provide accommodation to front line public service staff at a reasonable rent and the non contributing members of society can be housed in less over subscribed areas. This could be taxed as a BIK and they would provide a benefit to their local areas.

Because there is an abundance of social housing in Dublin???

Deebles McBeebles

facehugger99 wrote: »

Yeah, paying taxes with money they been given by the State - like the dole-bludgers.

Get real.

Ah man that's classic. Who would you prefer paid the public sector if not the government? Google might chip in a few quid maybe.

thegetawaycar

cgcsb wrote: »

Because there is an abundance of social housing in Dublin???

Short answer, yes. There is lots of social housing in Dublin. Not enough to house everyone that wants one but enough to house those who are necessary to have close to hospitals, schools and public services to keep them staffed.

Priority should be given to those that provide a service and benefit to the area firstly. Never going to happen but it should.

seenitall

Assetbacked wrote: »

This is absolutely crucial for people to accept - wealth inequality is at disgusting levels and nothing meaningful is being taken to address it. If you are a capitalist proponent, you would believe in 1000 millionaires over 1 billionaire. What we have now is a broken system and a recalibration is required.

As wealth inequality grows and grows we will have more extreme political events occurring as a means of protest against the system. Things like Trump, Brexit and far right parties gaining momentum are all completely understandable. It will only get worse and I think, honestly, a war is the scale of an event which would lead to a correction in the system and this does not seem to be an unlikely outcome with what voters will be voting for in the coming decades.

All of this is the over-arching context for Ireland's housing crisis - politicians who have lead us to the cliff edge, who have allowed a situation where we are told the economy is strong and yet, with every passing year, people are left with less cash i.e. people are getting poorer each year for the last few years in Ireland. The only wealth gains are being felt at the top. The workers turn on each other, they turn on different religions, races etc. when in reality, there is a common enemy and it is the extreme inequality. This infighting among the proles leads to disorganisation and difficulty in mobilising the masses but that of course suits the top .1% who make more money regardless.

Username : content curiosities...

thegetawaycar

cgcsb wrote: »

No, people think that middle earners should easily afford a roof over their head and low earners should easily afford to rent a roof over their heads. As is the case in most of Europe and the case in Ireland before Goldman Sachs set our housing policy.

What large European cities is it easy for low earners to rent and easy for middle income earners to buy? London? Frankfurt? Zurich?

cgcsb

thegetawaycar wrote: »

Short answer, yes. There is lots of social housing in Dublin. Not enough to house everyone that wants one but enough to house those who are necessary to have close to hospitals, schools and public services to keep them staffed.

Priority should be given to those that provide a service and benefit to the area firstly. Never going to happen but it should.

And the people who already live there and work nearby? I presume a large % of people living in social housing don't commute far out to work. Are the elderly living in social homes to be evicted also?

Why turn on other poor people to 'solve' a problem created by a greedy elite?

Cina

cgcsb wrote: »

No, people think that middle earners should easily afford a roof over their head and low earners should easily afford to rent a roof over their heads. As is the case in most of Europe and the case in Ireland before Goldman Sachs set our housing policy.

No, it really, really is not.

In most Western, developed countries is that their big and capital cities, or main financial cities, are exactly like Dublin.

Paris, London, Madrid, Zurich, Oslo, Helsinki, Stockholm, Amsterdam, Milan, Frankfurt, New York, Toronto, Vancouver, Tokyo etc etc.

Unfortunately these tend to be the prices you pay for living in the area of your country with the most jobs and most condensed population, because the competition is so fierce.

cgcsb

thegetawaycar wrote: »

What large European cities is it easy for low earners to rent and easy for middle income earners to buy? London? Frankfurt? Zurich?

Stockholm, Copenhagen, Oslo, Amsterdam, Madrid, Barcelona, Vienna, Berlin to name but a few

Frankfurt is actually not the worst if you live outside the center both it and Zurich are banking meccas full of the super high earners. Indeed nobody would be bothered living in a boring kip like frankfurt if it weren't for the high rolling jobs.

and London is part of a doomed nation that despises it's own population.

engiweirdo

thegetawaycar wrote: »

What large European cities is it easy for low earners to rent and easy for middle income earners to buy? London? Frankfurt? Zurich?

Vienna. I'd imagine despite Zurichs costs, their much higher salaries go a long way toward easing the burden too.

cgcsb

cgcsb wrote: »

...and London is part of a doomed nation that despises its own population.

Hehe.

thegetawaycar

cgcsb wrote: »

And the people who already live there and work nearby? I presume a large % of people living in social housing don't commute far out to work. Are the elderly living in social homes to be evicted also?

Why turn on other poor people to 'solve' a problem created by a greedy elite?

Nope, I'd just move the won't work class out and those with disabilities or elderly would not be moved out of their homes. You may presume that a number of those in social housing don't commute far for work but i find that not relevant, if you perform a service that is vital to the state then the state should give you priority for their housing (at a fair price) in my opinion.

No turning on anyone just doing what's sensible, if you don't need to be in the area closest to the most jobs and are not contributing positively to the community then you should be moved out. I'm not sure how you think the "greedy elite" can create more spaces for housing in the city centre when demand far outstrips supply.

Ash.J.Williams

You can't compare Dublin with those fancy European cities with transport links to the city