Garda and sunstrip and L plates problem

yamaha4life

so i was on my way home the other day and there was a check point, i drove upto with no worried iv everything cover tax insurance ect, so the garda said are you a learner and i replyed no, to which he said why do you have L plates displayed, i told him i have a learner named on my car and we share it, to which he replyed that i shouldnt have them up while im driving. i never heard that before is that a new thing?

the next thing is ive a sun strip on the windscreen approx 6 inches long, he enquired why i have it i told him it keeps the sun out of my eyes and he replyed no its a sticker your not allowed to have any stickers on your windscreen quoted some law and told me that he will sieze the car next time he sees me with it.

fair enough there might be some law i dont know but is siezing the car not a bit excessive i couldnt belive it anyway seems they can sieze a car for anything nowadays

Mint Sauce

yamaha4life wrote: »

so i was on my way home the other day and there was a check point, i drove upto with no worried iv everything cover tax insurance ect, so the garda said are you a learner and i replyed no, to which he said why do you have L plates displayed, i told him i have a learner named on my car and we share it, to which he replyed that i shouldnt have them up while im driving. i never heard that before is that a new thing?

the next thing is ive a sun strip on the windscreen approx 6 inches long, he enquired why i have it i told him it keeps the sun out of my eyes and he replyed no its a sticker your not allowed to have any stickers on your windscreen quoted some law and told me that he will sieze the car next time he sees me with it.

fair enough there might be some law i dont know but is siezing the car not a bit excessive i couldnt belive it anyway seems they can sieze a car for anything nowadays

The L/N plates thing is nothing new. The Sunstrip, there is rules in regard to having certain parts of the windscreen un obscured. If the car is unsafe to drive say due to a Sunstrip taking up to much of the screen, then yes, it could be reason to seize.

ohnonotgmail

Does the strip come below the tops of the wipers? If so it is considered to be in your line of vision and that is an NCT fail.

Alanstrainor

Yes, nothing new there with the L/N plates. They are only supposed to be displayed when the applicable driver is driving. But at the same time I've never heard of anyone being pulled up on that, it's extremely common. But then it causes the situation where you see a car on the motorway with bot N + L plates, how are the gardai supposed to determine who is driving and whether they are supposed to be there?

the_pen_turner

I have a beeline van. There is no rear view mirror due to no rear windows. As a result there is a huge section in the middle where the sun will blind you and there is nothing you can do. I asked a local guard who is a stickler for knowing about that sort of stuff and he told me I could get in trouble for putting anything across it.
He told me there could be insurance issues too if there was an accident

Crazy

seamus

Afaik, the law requires that your windscreen is kept clear of anything unnecessary which may disrupt visibility.

This means that necessary things like your mirror and your discs may be stuck to the windscreen. Parking badges are also OK.

But a tinting sticker is not necessary and an L plate is not necessary unless you're a learner, so these should not be attached.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

I have a sunstrip fitted to my car, got it fitted after the nct granted, when the sunvisor is down you can’t see the strip. I rarely use the car so haven’t been stopped, I’ll be interested for the next nct though.

bazz26

OP, what type of car were you driving, was it modified in any other way? My initial thought was that you or your car may have fitted a certain profile with the AGS so they may have been focusing on you and the car at the check point.

yamaha4life

well i guessed id hafta remove the visor but i still think siezure of the car would be excessive for such a trivial thing?

as for the l plates i lts not always practical to take them down and put them up i mean seriously im driving with ten years and this thr first ive heard of either of those things

yamaha4life

bazz26 wrote: »

OP, what type of car were you driving, was it modified in any other way? My initial thought was that you or your car may have fitted a certain profile with the AGS so they may have been focusing on you and the car at the check point.

it has just alloy wheels, no loud exhausts or window tints, its a small hatchback car i wouldnt like to post much more details online tbh

Henry Ford III

yamaha4life wrote: »

well i guessed id hafta remove the visor but i still think siezure of the car would be excessive for such a trivial thing?

as for the l plates i lts not always practical to take them down and put them up i mean seriously im driving with ten years and this thr first ive heard of either of those things

Get magnetic L plates. Lack of practicality is no excuse for the Gardai.

GM228

Too few people are aware that a sun-strip is technically illegal.

Any "inessential" object or sticker placed on a window is illegal. In other words if it is not an absolutely essential like an insurance/tax/NCT disc then it should not be there.

The problem with the law however is strictly speaking you could also say things such as window tinting or placing your toll tag, sat nav or phone cradle in the window are also illegal. Grey area.

ohnonotgmail

GM228 wrote: »

Too few people are aware that a sun-strip is technically illegal.

Any "inessential" object or sticker placed on a window is illegal. In other words if it is not an absolutely essential like an insurance/tax/NCT disc then it should not be there.

The problem with the law however is strictly speaking you could also say things such as window tinting or placing your toll tag, sat nav or phone cradle in the window are also illegal. Grey area.

There is no grey area with regards to window tinting. The windscreen must have a light transmission level of 65%.

Del2005

Mint Sauce wrote: »

The L/N plates thing is nothing new. The Sunstrip, there is rules in regard to having certain parts of the windscreen un obscured. If the car is unsafe to drive say due to a Sunstrip taking up to much of the screen, then yes, it could be reason to seize.

Where's the legislation to remove the L or N plate when it's not required? All I know is that you have to display if you are a learner or novice, I know of no law which says that you can't display it when neither are driving.

GM228

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

There is no grey area with regards to window tinting. The windscreen must have a light transmission level of 65%.

Yes, however the VLTs for vehicles are set by EU law in relation to the NCT and also Taxi Regulations for SPSVs. All they say is how much light must be able to pass through a window (not how much light can pass through window tint), that is separate to the fact that any "inessential" sticker is not permitted to be put on a vehicle and most third party window tinting is via sticker as opposed to manufacturer chemically tinted windows.

The law specifically uses the word inessential as opposed to non-essential which creates a higher standard, meaning anything not absolutely essential is forbidden and lets face it sun strips and window tint are not absolutely essential.

GM228

Del2005 wrote: »

Where's the legislation to remove the L or N plate when it's not required? All I know is that you have to display if you are a learner or novice, I know of no law which says that you can't display it when neither are driving.

There is none.

ohnonotgmail

GM228 wrote: »

Yes, however the VLTs for vehicles are set by EU law in relation to the NCT and also Taxi Regulations for SPSVs. All they say is how much light must be able to pass through a window, that is separate to the fact that any "inessential" sticker is not permitted to be put on a vehicle and most third party window tinting is via sticker as opposed to manufacturer chemically tinted windows.

The law specifically uses the word inessential as opposed to non-essential which creates a higher standard, meaning anything not absolutely essential is forbidden and lets face it sun strips and window tint are not absolutely essential.

i think we are talking at crossed purposes. To me a window tint is inherent in the glass itself. A coloured piece of plastic placed on top of a window is not a tint.

jimgoose

Alanstrainor wrote: »

Yes, nothing new there with the L/N plates. They are only supposed to be displayed when the applicable driver is driving. But at the same time I've never heard of anyone being pulled up on that, it's extremely common. But then it causes the situation where you see a car on the motorway with bot N + L plates, how are the gardai supposed to determine who is driving and whether they are supposed to be there?

By inspecting the current driver's driving license, the same as any other vaguely similar scenario. Last time I checked, it was illegal in the UK to have plates up that were not required by the driver, but it's quite alright here.

Isambard

Del2005 wrote: »

Where's the legislation to remove the L or N plate when it's not required? All I know is that you have to display if you are a learner or novice, I know of no law which says that you can't display it when neither are driving.

I too thought that there was no Law in Ireland to require only the relevant drivers to display L or N plates.

When my Son was learning I fitted magnetic plates and removed them after each session.

colm_mcm

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

A coloured piece of plastic placed on top of a window is not a tint.

That’s pretty much the definition of a tint?

creedp

seamus wrote: »

Afaik, the law requires that your windscreen is kept clear of anything unnecessary which may disrupt visibility.

This means that necessary things like your mirror and your discs may be stuck to the windscreen. Parking badges are also OK.

But a tinting sticker is not necessary and an L plate is not necessary unless you're a learner, so these should not be attached.

IMO this is the kind of stuff that brings the law into disrepute ... if L plates are only essential when car is being driven by L driver then surely parking badges are only essential when parking!! Why not get a magnetic holder and stick it up every time you park?

I sometimes despair when I see up to 4 disc holders placed horizontally at bottom of screen given how badly it obscures visibility. Combine this with an essential L plate or even more essential N plate and the most inexperienced drivers on the road have very badly obscured visibility on that side of car. However it's fine as these are essential items for road safety purposes.

However if some poor sod has the temerity to put a sun strip.along the top of the windscreen to try and avoid being blinded by the sun he is considered a menace even though the only thing it will obscure is a view of the birds.

Isambard

creedp wrote: »

IMO this is the kind of stuff that brings the law into disrepute ... if L plates are only essential when car is being driven by L driver then surely parking badges are only essential when parking!! Why not get a magnetic holder and stick it up every time you park?

I sometimes despair when I see up to 4 disc holders placed horizontally at bottom of screen given how badly it obscures visibility. Combine this with an essential L plate or even more essential N plate and the most inexperienced drivers on the road have very badly obscured visibility on that side of car. However it's fine as these are essential items for road safety purposes.

However if some poor sod has the temerity to put a sun strip.along the top of the windscreen to try and avoid being blinded by the sun he is considered a menace even though the only thing it will obscure is a view of the birds.

I can never understand why people put an L plate on the glass anyway,

Blazer

yamaha4life wrote: »

so i was on my way home the other day and there was a check point, i drove upto with no worried iv everything cover tax insurance ect, so the garda said are you a learner and i replyed no, to which he said why do you have L plates displayed, i told him i have a learner named on my car and we share it, to which he replyed that i shouldnt have them up while im driving. i never heard that before is that a new thing?

the next thing is ive a sun strip on the windscreen approx 6 inches long, he enquired why i have it i told him it keeps the sun out of my eyes and he replyed no its a sticker your not allowed to have any stickers on your windscreen quoted some law and told me that he will sieze the car next time he sees me with it.

fair enough there might be some law i dont know but is siezing the car not a bit excessive i couldnt belive it anyway seems they can sieze a car for anything nowadays

He's a nob with nothing better to be doing. No fear he'd stop some people with no tax and insurance. Probably wish them well and on their way.

Guy:Incognito

Blazer wrote: »

He's a nob with nothing better to be doing. No fear he'd stop some people with no tax and insurance. Probably wish them well and on their way.

So you reckon they set up a check point and spent their time waving through everyone with no tax and insurance while waiting for someone with a sunstrip to come along.............

Cuddlesworth

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

So you reckon they set up a check point and spent their time waving through everyone with no tax and insurance while waiting for someone with a sunstrip to come along.............

No, he pulled him in because he thought he was a learner driving unaccompanied. Once that was cleared up, he looked for something to give out to the OP about to justify his time.

V8 Interceptor

yamaha4life wrote: »

well i guessed id hafta remove the visor but i still think siezure of the car would be excessive for such a trivial thing?

But he didn't seize the car. He told you to get it sorted.

Guy:Incognito

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

No, he pulled him in because he thought he was a learner driving unaccompanied. Once that was cleared up, he looked for something to give out to the OP about to justify his time.

He didn't pull him in. It was a checkpoint. And the person I quoted said they wouldnt stop people for tax and insurance, so the whole thing must have been a sting operation to catch the op and his sunstrip so, no?

Anyway, should they be ignoring unaccompanied drivers or should there be an effort made to have a functioning system of learning to drive?

Explosive_Cornflake

Henry Ford III wrote: »

Get magnetic L plates. Lack of practicality is no excuse for the Gardai.

These won't work if you have aluminium panels though.

KevinCavan

My old man told me to always be polite to them. If you piss them off, or give them attitude, they can easily find fault with a second hand car.

Henry Ford III

Explosive_Cornflake wrote: »

These won't work if you have aluminium panels though.

Then use blue tac or araldite or just nail them on!

It's up to the driver to display L plates if a learner is driving, N plates if a novice is driving, and none if a fully qualified driver is at the wheel.

I see cars with both N and L plates displayed at the same time on motorways quite often. That means at best the driver is lazy and mistaken, or at worst they shouldn't even be on that road. I wouldn't blame a Garda for pulling over a car like that.

Wishbone Ash

Isambard wrote: »

I can never understand why people put an L plate on the glass anyway,

Probably because they are required to be placed on the most vertical surface of the front and rear of the vehicle. On the vast majority of cars, the windscreen is the most vertical part of the front of a car which is large enough to accommodate an L/N plate.

colm_mcm

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Probably because they are required to be placed on the most vertical surface of the front and rear of the vehicle. On the vast majority of cars, the windscreen is the most vertical part of the front of a car which is large enough to accommodate an L/N plate.

And 99% of the L plates on sale are designed to go onto glass. It’s not like years ago when you could tie the, to the steel bumpers!

Isambard

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Probably because they are required to be placed on the most vertical surface of the front and rear of the vehicle. On the vast majority of cars, the windscreen is the most vertical part of the front of a car which is large enough to accommodate an L/N plate.

most bumpers would be big enough and really are at the front and back. I suspect that the glass is the easy option.

Eoinbmw

Mad idea but maybe invest in a decent set of sunglasses for driving!

1hnr79jr65

Could such a law be enforced by guards against a driving instructor when no learner on board? (L Plates)

Just curious how far enforcement of this law could go.

oleras

Sour Lemonz wrote: »

Could such a law be enforced by guards against a driving instructor when no learner on board? (L Plates)

Just curious how far enforcement of this law could go.

They dont usually have them affixed to the glass though.

PapaOscar

Taking L plates on and off depending whos driving, utter bolloxology.

OldMrBrennan83

GM228 wrote: »

There is none.

Then could be not be told to ram it? More diplomatically, of course.

GrumpyMe

PapaOscar wrote: »

Taking L plates on and off depending whos driving, utter bolloxology.

When drivers change you normally have to adjust mirrors and seat position. Whats the big deal about removing an L/N plate?

PapaOscar

GrumpyMe wrote: »

When drivers change you normally have to adjust mirrors and seat position. Whats the big deal about removing an L/N plate?

Because there is absolutley no need for it. Its a long time since ive had to use an L plate but they were not exactly easy to get off.

I know of nobody that takes L plates off when their misses or whoever is finished driving the car. When was this law brought in?

GrumpyMe

PapaOscar wrote: »

...not exactly easy to get off...

Now that's bolloxology! FFS

PapaOscar wrote: »

...I know of nobody that takes L plates off when their misses or whoever is finished driving the car...

Well you do now - me!

PapaOscar wrote: »

...When was this law brought in?...

From what was posted in the thread there is no law covering the non display. The law on keeping the windscreen clear of unnecessary clutter can/could be used to end up with the same result.

PapaOscar

GrumpyMe wrote: »

Now that's bolloxology! FFS



Well you do now - me!


From what was posted in the thread there is no law covering the non display. The law on keeping the windscreen clear of unnecessary clutter can/could be used to end up with the same result.

Gimme a break on the grammar im just finishing a 13 hour shift ha.

So theres no law that says you have to take L plates off, that makes sense. Its not practical. Im sure if it was that big of a deal it would be deemed unlawful not to do it.

GrumpyMe

PapaOscar wrote: »

Gimme a break on the grammar im just finishing a 13 hour shift ha.

So theres no law that says you have to take L plates off, that makes sense. Its not practical. Im sure if it was that big of a deal it would be deemed unlawful not to do it.

Nothing to do with grammar - you said it wasn't easy to take on and off L plates. Two strips of masking tape, plate on in +/- 5 seconds include walking round the other end of the vehicle and install second plate, 15 seconds total. Removal, all on 5 seconds to remove both. Big deal! :rolleyes:


Specific law on removal? It seems not, but law about obscuring view through windscreen will/would suffice!


There can be no rhyme nor reason for a licensed driver to use a vehicle with an L plate displayed. They must be displayed by learners to alert other road users.

Henry Ford III

Compliance can be inconvenient or a royal pain in the ass, but there are good reasons for it.

p.s. Please don't ask what these are, as even if everyone agreed one or more was silly we won't change them. Resistance is futile.

dr.fuzzenstein

yamaha4life wrote: »

it has just alloy wheels, no loud exhausts or window tints, its a small hatchback car i wouldnt like to post much more details online tbh

OP, it's a small hatchback with L plates, a visor strip and alloy wheels.
To some Gards this will scream "Fcuk Me!". Not your fault, just unfortunate.

yamaha4life

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

OP, it's a small hatchback with L plates, a visor strip and alloy wheels.
To some Gards this will scream "Fcuk Me!". Not your fault, just unfortunate.

i have since removed the sunstrip but i have been stopped on two occasions for nothing both gards beside manner left a lot to be desired

corks finest

Mint Sauce wrote: »

yamaha4life wrote: »

so i was on my way home the other day and there was a check point, i drove upto with no worried iv everything cover tax insurance ect, so the garda said are you a learner and i replyed no, to which he said why do you have L plates displayed, i told him i have a learner named on my car and we share it, to which he replyed that i shouldnt have them up while im driving. i never heard that before is that a new thing?

the next thing is ive a sun strip on the windscreen approx 6 inches long, he enquired why i have it i told him it keeps the sun out of my eyes and he replyed no its a sticker your not allowed to have any stickers on your windscreen quoted some law and told me that he will sieze the car next time he sees me with it.

fair enough there might be some law i dont know but is siezing the car not a bit excessive i couldnt belive it anyway seems they can sieze a car for anything nowadays

The L/N plates thing is nothing new. The Sunstrip, there is rules in regard to having certain parts of the windscreen un obscured. If the car is unsafe to drive say due to a Sunstrip taking up to much of the screen, then yes, it could be reason to seize.

Bit much though? Sun strip is only a few inches

corks finest

Mint Sauce wrote: »

yamaha4life wrote: »

so i was on my way home the other day and there was a check point, i drove upto with no worried iv everything cover tax insurance ect, so the garda said are you a learner and i replyed no, to which he said why do you have L plates displayed, i told him i have a learner named on my car and we share it, to which he replyed that i shouldnt have them up while im driving. i never heard that before is that a new thing?

the next thing is ive a sun strip on the windscreen approx 6 inches long, he enquired why i have it i told him it keeps the sun out of my eyes and he replyed no its a sticker your not allowed to have any stickers on your windscreen quoted some law and told me that he will sieze the car next time he sees me with it.

fair enough there might be some law i dont know but is siezing the car not a bit excessive i couldnt belive it anyway seems they can sieze a car for anything nowadays

The L/N plates thing is nothing new. The Sunstrip, there is rules in regard to having certain parts of the windscreen un obscured. If the car is unsafe to drive say due to a Sunstrip taking up to much of the screen, then yes, it could be reason to seize.

Bit much though? Sun strip is only a few inches

Del2005 wrote: »

Mint Sauce wrote: »

The L/N plates thing is nothing new. The Sunstrip, there is rules in regard to having certain parts of the windscreen un obscured. If the car is unsafe to drive say due to a Sunstrip taking up to much of the screen, then yes, it could be reason to seize.

Where's the legislation to remove the L or N plate when it's not required? All I know is that you have to display if you are a learner or novice, I know of no law which says that you can't display it when neither are driving.

Same

Spook_ie

Silly question but who in their right mind at the RSA approved an ad to put N plates on the front windscreen?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zEfmPnUlIQ4

The amount of visibility lost by positioning a sticker like that is just criminal IMO
I mean you get bits n pieces occasionally about not putting mobile phones, sat navs etc. in your vision zones and then blank out a 20x20 square!

colm_mcm

Saw a newish Fiesta with N and L plates vertically stacked on the front windscreen, top of passenger side, then imagined how much visibility I’d lose on my own car if I had them, not good, and the Fiesta is smaller than my car.

kirving

I just leave the novice plates on my car all the time, as my girlfriend who is insured on the car sometimes uses it.

I get treated noticeably worse on the road because of it.