Wife Spending Issues

LegacyUser

Hello all. I am married with three kids and myself and my wife both work full time. I earn a very good salary and my wife earns a far more modest salary although I don’t think that matters in relation to my issue.

I am a saver by nature while my wife can only be described as profligate with money and things in general. Her family would agree with this so it’s not just me. She is a fabulous person but her spending habits are starting to really annoy me. We should be very very comfortable as we have a small mortgage and a good income coming in to the house, yet we seem to be always struggling and constantly dipping in to savings. I have put all our expenses down on a spreadsheet and it actually looks quite healthy overall but what I can’t account for is her casual spending. She is continually buying clothes and make up online, going out for meals and coffees etc on her days off, and generally spending freely as if money was no issue. She spends an absolute fortune on the kids clothes, their wardrobes are full to bursting and when we do a periodic clear out the amount of stuff we give away with the tags still on is unreal.

She is now talking about going to Paris for a weekend before Christmas with her family and I am wincing at the thought of what that will cost with Xmas around the corner and three kids writing proverbial Santa lists as we speak. She also wants to change her perfectly good car which is only five years old and fully paid for which will mean a loan and more money going out. Some of her extended family are quite well off and I think there is an element of keeping up with the Jones in all of this, although she will never admit that and ironically will sometimes criticise the way they live with new cars and multiple family holidays etc.

I have sat her down a few times and she gets fiercely defensive at any suggestion that she needs to be careful about what she is spending. I do all the grocery shopping and pay all the bills and basically manage the house so I think in her mind she sees that I spend the majority of the household money and she is entitled to spend some too. I have no issue with that but her spending seems to escalate with each passing month at this stage and is now running in to many hundreds each month. I have also tried a firmer approach and pointed out the waste and her behaviour will improve for a while before she reverts to type.

Our eldest is only a couple of years away from third level and I thought we would have a substantial sum saved at this stage to help with that but the way we are going I don’t think we will be adequately prepared for college at all. The kids are all close together in age and we could conceivably have three of them in college together at the same time for a year or two if they all go and we won’t qualify for any state grants. My wife only sees today and wilfully ignores the issue, she also has very little interest in the family finances generally and doesn’t even know how much our mortgage is as that’s ‘my’ thing. I have tried to involve her in decisions but her stock response is ‘whatever you think’.

I know she won’t change but has anyone any advice to help manage this situation? I am not a miser and enjoy things myself like a gym membership and a few drinks at the weekend etc., but It wouldn’t be a patch on my wife’s lifestyle. I am very concerned that we are walking in to financial hardship in the future if we don’t start cutting back on some of the discretionary spending. Any advice is welcome.

facehugger99

It's not ideal but set up a separate bank account for her and give her a debit card.

Agree a set amount each month that she gets to spend. Do not give her access to the joint accounts or credit cards, it sounds like she can't be trusted to manage money in any mature way so she needs to be treated like a child.

Also tell her you're not getting a new car.

Springfields

I would approach it from the college fund aspect. Pull up some info on how much realistically it will cost you to potentially have 3 kids in college. Include everything. Put it all on paper and then ask her how ye are going to pay for it all if she continues to flit away the money on unnecessary things. Let her come up with the answers. Seems like while you are being the grown up and taking responsibility for household budget she has her head in the sand. Time for her face reality. Get her to come up with the suggestions. Also clarify that you don't have problems with her spending -when she needs to - but wasteful spending needs to stop..for the sake of the kids future
Might sound harsh but also sounds like she needs a serious wake up call. Best of luck

Richard308

Look at the spreadsheet, divide house hold bills 60/40 over the last year, electric, heat, mortgage, grocery, modest amount for kids close etc etc Work our what she has to put into joint account to cover her 40%. Keep Her own bills separately. Do it logically and sympathetically talk to her. No need for a big argument. She can keep what she has left over. Let her manage her own money, will teach her the value of it. It’s going to be difficult. Best of luck

Dtp1979

facehugger99 wrote: »

It's not ideal but set up a separate bank account for her and give her a debit card.

Agree a set amount each month that she gets to spend. Do not give her access to the joint accounts or credit cards, it sounds like she can't be trusted to manage money in any mature way so she needs to be treated like a child.

Also tell her you're not getting a new car.

+1 to the above. Combine both wages into 1 account. From this, have a separate account that all bills/savings go out from, including an allowance to her and you.

Teyla Emmagan

She sounds a bit like me (to my shame). I will also spend money until there's none left. The only thing that stops me is running out of money. So I think giving her an allowance every month for personal spending is the way forward. In fact you might need your money, her money, your savings, the house's money and the kids` money. And no personal spending to be taken out of the house's account. So she gets two cards, one for her and one for the kids. If you are being left making all the decisions then you get to put your foot down.

KevinCavan

facehugger99 wrote: »

It's not ideal but set up a separate bank account for her and give her a debit card.

Agree a set amount each month that she gets to spend. Do not give her access to the joint accounts or credit cards, it sounds like she can't be trusted to manage money in any mature way so she needs to be treated like a child.

Also tell her you're not getting a new car.

I agree with the above advice, she mightn’t be as quick to spend her own money. Your wife sounds similar to my own mother, she will ruin you financially believe me. I’d also hand her a copy of what ye owe on the mortgage. My mother too would plead ignorance when my dad was left up sh1t creek without a paddle. It’s very handy not knowing what’s owed on a mortgage when you are blowing money like there is no tomorrow.

LegacyUser

Do you have one joint account or do you both keep separate accounts? My parents had a similar issue when they got married - my mum would have had a much higher salary at the time. They had one account for everything but my mum discovered that my dad was really bad with money - if there was money in the account he would spend it, just didn't think and at the end of the month they'd have nothing left in the account. So my mum switched back to separate accounts and they had a joint account for all the bills etc and a savings account they each paid into then what was left in your own account was for you to spend as you liked. Over the years they each earned less or more then each other so would regularly chat about who should pay little more towards things etc and they had a minimum amount they agreed for savings - my mum always put in more and my dad put the minimum.

Sit down with your wife and discuss switching to separate accounts with a joint account for bills and maybe a savings account. If she wants a new car she gets the loan from her own account and pays it out of her own account etc etc She may get angry at you but do you want to be in the situation were you go to pay for something basic like a cup of coffee and your card is declined as you've no money in the account?

AndrewJRenko

can't log in wrote: »

She may get angry at you but do you want to be in the situation were you go to pay for something basic like a cup of coffee and your card is declined as you've no money in the account?

Good advice in this post above. In fact, if you can facilitate a situation where HER card gets declined a few times when she goes to make purchases, this might help to bring some reality to the situation.

LegacyUser

Thanks for all the replies people.

Just to clarify, I have a household account where all bills, insurance and mortgage are paid, as well as a regular monthly saving amount. The rest is put in a day to day joint account to pay for groceries and other stuff but this is often blown before the end of the month meaning we dip in to savings or eat whatever is in the back of the freezer until pay day. There is a fairly generous amount available in my view and this account should cover things like car services or attending weddings etc but it’s cleaned out every month meaning any big one off expenses cause a mini crisis and the standard fix is to take money from savings.

The child benefit (over €400pm for three of them) is paid to my wife in addition to this and we had agreed that most of this would be saved towards a college fund, we opened an account for this but not a penny has been put aside to date, my wife currently uses it as pocket money. When reminded of the initial agreement there is always an excuse and the saving will start next month.

I know I am letting her run rings around me at the moment but I really don’t want to go down the road of micro managing her spending I think that would be a slippery slope for the marriage.

I was thinking about this last night after I wrote the OP and I think what I will do is agree with her that we will reduce what is going in to the day to day account and let an emergency fund build up in the household account. We will need to adjust our spending accordingly, obviously this will require an acknowledgment on her part that not all or spending is entirely sensible at the moment. This should help cover the once off stuff. I will also ask her to set up a standing order for the day after the child benefit come in and even if she put away half of it there would be a nice sum building up. She will also need to get a better understanding of the finances in the house. Any other suggestions are very welcome.

We had a few tough years not that long ago where I was building my career and was on a modest wage while my wife was at home with the kids. We had to live on a shoestring and I know she was miserable at that stage but thankfully things are much better now. I don’t want to go back to watching every penny, the ideal thing would be to eliminate wasteful spending and adopt a sensible approach to money that we can both agree on. Perhaps I am naive but I think it’s worth a try.

The trip to Paris and the new car will have to wait until we see how we go over the next while. If we could meet in the middle generally speaking I would be happy enough.

If I have missed something or if someone has overcome this type of thing in a relationship before please do share your experience.

bobsbookcase

This situation sounds extremely annoying and I sympathise with you. Money issues are never an easy conversation and I would tread carefully if I were you. I agree with the sentiment of others here that you have every right to put your foot down over this but depending on the person its not always that simple. If she gets very defensive and her back is up then things may get difficult. You've described your wife as a wonderful person so the aim here is to just get her to understand the situation herself without criticising her too much. There are ways to approach this which may help your wife to better understand the issue herself without making it look like you are the boss whos putting the foot down.

I see the issue as a set of priorities that need to be clearly laid out and discussed with her:

Priority 1:
The essentials: mortgage, bills, kid's essential expenses (not including the piles of superflous fancy clothes etc) - things that must be paid for right now.

Priority 2:
Savings - a rainy day fund & savings for the kids college/future.

Priority 3:
Possibly paying mortgage off a bit earlier to leave yourselves more financially secure while you are earning good money.

Priority 4:
Disposable income: you and your wife spending money to enjoy life - gym, nights out, trips away, hobbies, holidays, etc. Also extra things you may want to spoil your kids with.

Priority 5:
All the extra things your wife likes to do/buy herself. I would place that new car she wants in this category.


The fact that you earn a lot more means you should be paying more towards bills, kids, savings etc.

So how about having 4 bank accounts - 1 joint account for bills, 1 savings account & 1 personal account each.
Work out the contribution both people will make to the joint and savings accounts, maybe its 60/40 split or something like that - from this account all bills, savings etc will go out.

After that, everything essential (Priorities 1 - 3) is paid off and you both are left with your own disposable income in your own accounts.

It sounds like if this was put in place it may help crystallize in your wifes mind how much disposable income she actually has left. However, it also sounds like she may still bleed herself dry and then come looking for more from you so I would expect that scenario and prepare for it.

One last thing - you mention you earn a lot more that your wife. Do you have a much more stressful job & work longer hours than her? In that case I would be even less inclined to put up with this behaviour.

punisher5112

Get her a revolut card.

Put money into it's account on phone app and that can be hers to spend online or when out.

You can always keep an eye on spending too.

KevinCavan

She probably needs to see a therapist, as she has some deep underlying issues. This is an addiction, just like any other.

LolaJJ

I'm a bit like this....

I live a very luxurious life for the first 2 weeks of the month and like a peasant for the latter 2.

I actually like this, but it's my money, so no skin off anyone elses nose.

That said, there are occasions which come up that have forced me to stop unecessary spending.

When I bought my home
When I needed to pay for a holiday
When I want to buy my boyfriend a nice gift etc...

So, maybe try making some plans with your wife that make her feel like she's working towards something, as in, there's a reward at the end of her sacrifice.

Like, "Yes, you can change your car but we're not going to borrow money in order to do it, lets see how much we can save if we really try" etc.

AndrewJRenko

You've got lots of good practical advice on how to manage the spending. I'm not sure you've got lots of good advice on how the manage the relationship.

This will be a very major relationship issue, possibly a make-or-break issue. If, as you suspect, she is concerned about 'keeping up appearances' with her family, this change will be very threatening for her.

I'm the last person to give advice on relationships, so I don't have much to offer here, but be prepared for very difficult situations.

Damien360

Sounds like my house. I am a saver and then spend on one big ticket item and that's my lot. She spends every cent that she has on crap from Dealz etc. But, we share bank account and I wouldn't want to change that.

I exported the transactions from the bank account over the year, put them into Excel, and because they are primarily bank card tap transactions, I could sort them and total by shop. Print that out. Not each transaction but totals and number of visits. There is no secret as to why the owner of Dealz is a millionaire. We sat down and discussed and she limited the nonsense spending for a long time.

I am guilty of silly spending also and the spreadsheet showed that up too.

If you share accounts now, you can't reverse that without antagonising her and really hurting your marriage.

GarIT

The way I handled it was a joint account nobody was to spend from except household expenses and we both got paid into the joint account and then when we needed money, transferred money to our personal accounts in equal amounts. If she wanted to add €100 to her account we would also add €100 to mine. Soon you'll find you're buying computers and phones with the same amount of money she spends on lunch and coffee.

LegacyUser

From my experience with people like this, much like people who don’t clean up after themselves, they just never change. I went out with a girl like this once, it was a nightmare. All her wages would be gone after a week or so of the month, and then I had to pay for everything. Including her share of the rent and bills etc. I earned a bit more so I didn’t mind to some extent, but when I tried to discuss the issue with her or was hesitant to give her some of my own money when she ran out, I’d be called controlling etc. Hopefully your wife isn’t a total nutjob if you set up an account for her to use for spending, but that probably wont fix anything, she’ll just spend it till it’s ran out and then will need more from you to get by. I’m not sure what the solution is here. Is there therapy you can attend for this type of thing? It’s a serious design flaw in someone, and could ruin many a relationship.

witchgirl26

OP might be a bit of a radical change if you have been using one bank account up until now but would you consider having your own accounts that you both get paid into and a separate joint account? This way you can agree at the start of the month how much each person pays into the joint which should cover bills, household expenditure etc. That way whatever is left in your own accounts is yours to spend as you will. That puts a level of responsibility onto your wife as you're not going to be topping up her account and she can only spend what's in there. It also means that neither of you have to justify your extra spending to each other.

Honestly though even with this, you need to have a conversation without letting emotion get in the way at all about how this spending is affecting your lives. Maybe get her to do some of the bills and grocery shopping that you cover so that she can see that it's not like you're getting fun things out of this.

nikkibikki

How about getting a financial advisor for the both of you and they'll surely tell her to cop on. She'd probably be more inclined to listen to them than you.

Pelvis

Personally I'd just redirect my own salary into my own account. Split everything 50/50. Move savings into a savings account which requires notice in order to withdraw. If there's any joint credit accounts then cancel them. If she wants to spend stupid money then let her spend her own.

If talking to her doesn't change things, then it's time to put the foot down. It's a serious issue, if you're continually dipping into savings then it's only a matter of time until the savings are no more. If she acts like an irresponsible child with money then you need to treat her like an irresponsible child.

rob316

It's a common thing. My wife is hopeless with money too, never ever saves beyond a few weeks. It's how she was raised, she doesn't understand the value of it. I ask her how much was this? Shrugs shoulders. She genuinely doesn't know the cost of something she bought 10 mins ago.

The solution for my sanity was to a standing order to me a set amount each week into my account to contribute to bills, loans, household spending, savings. Then you can do whatever the hell you want with the rest.

OP I really think their needs to be someone in strict control of the finances in the relationship if one is a compulsive spender.

jlm29

I’m not great with money myself, so I can sympathise a little with your wife! and my OH is wonderful with it (I’m pretty sure he could live on a tenner a week!!). That said, I do remind myself often that the reason he could live on a tenner is that I cover some of the bigger weekly expenses like food and childcare.
Anyhow, your wife needs to cop on. My child benefit goes into my kids bank accounts. Lately I’ve had to dip into it a good bit (unpaid maternity leave, lots and lots of home improvements etc), but my kids are still in full time childcare, my intention is that I’ll be more diligent about saving it once they’re in school. My understanding is that once they’re 7, they would have to co-sign it. I’m sure it can be set up that both of you would have to sign to withdraw it. The other spending needs to be addressed, but this is the first thing I would tackle

LegacyUser

Thanks again for all the replies folks it’s very much appreciated.

A lot of people seem to be of the view that I need to put the foot down but I really do think that should be a last resort as it will undoubtedly cause enormous tension and resentment in our marriage. That said, I fully acknowledge that changes are urgently needed.

I’m going to try the diplomatic route first and try to bring her along with a better way of managing our money. I am already doing a lot of the things suggested in the thread but i just need to sell it to her in a way that gets the message across without causing a rift. She is a very reasonable person in most things and deserves that chance. Like I said earlier I have already sat her doywn a number of times but I have not had the determination and follow through myself to make it work in all honesty.

The child benefit probably annoys me more than anything else tbh and I am going to dig my heels in on that one, that money is meant for the kids and should not be fritted away in Brown Thomas and Costa.

Paddy Cow

You should put the foot down now about saving the children's allowance. Fees are €3,234 per year. That's nearly 40 grand just in fees for all 3. Will the kids be staying at home or have to move city for uni? Your wife is in cloud cuckoo land and needs to face up to her responsibilities. Children's allowance stops at 18 so you won't have that to help you in the future.

c.p.w.g.w

Paddy Cow wrote: »

You should put the foot down now about saving the children's allowance. Fees are €3,234 per year. That's nearly 40 grand just in fees for all 3. Will the kids be staying at home or have to move city for uni? Your wife is in cloud cuckoo land and needs to face up to her responsibilities. Children's allowance stops at 18 so you won't have that to help you in the future.

Christ, when i was in college the fees were €1,500 if memory serves(circa 12 years ago)

qwerty13

“... should not be fritted away in Brown Thomas and Costa.”

Just wanted to reply on this bit. If she genuinely likes ‘nice things’, there’s ways of doing that. Making sure you use loyalty cards. Pay attention to special offers. For ex, I only buy expensive cosmetics when I know there’s an offer with gifts on. I love the food in M&S, but I only buy their meal deals and special offers. If your wife is like me, maybe she can still buy stuff she likes, but shop a lot smarter. I know people remark on expensive things I buy, but I only do it knowing that a) it’s something I genuinely have thought about and really want, and b) I wait until I get an offer / discount.

However, if she just buys ‘for the sake of it’, then the problem is way bigger. I don’t envy you in trying to sort that out. Tbh I’d steer the discussion to being around the kids future. That might be a bit manipulative, but it’s not a lie, and focusing on that might make her feel positive about curtailing her shopping habits, as opposed to being (rightly, in my eyes) criticised for her poor spending habits.

PS: and it’s just not fair that you have to be the ‘bad guy’ responsible one in your marriage. That would really annoy me. You’re her husband, not her father.

Aufbau

qwerty13 wrote: »

You’re her husband, not her father.

You'd never guess that from some of the replies.

Also " I do all the grocery shopping and pay all the bills and basically manage the house". Why do you do this? Is it not her house and her household too?

If I was married to someone who wanted to controll everything I'd probably go splash whatever cash I had too.

I may be way off base, but maybe a shift in power would give her more of a stake in managing spending.

LegacyUser

Aufbau wrote: »

You'd never guess that from some of the replies.

Also " I do all the grocery shopping and pay all the bills and basically manage the house". Why do you do this? Is it not her house and her household too?

If I was married to someone who wanted to controll everything I'd probably go splash whatever cash I had too.

I may be way off base, but maybe a shift in power would give her more of a stake in managing spending.

Thanks, and just to respond here, I do the grocery shopping because I do all the cooking in the house. I love cooking and I’m really good at it, my wife hates it but does other stuff like washing, school run, check homework etc so it balances out. She is more than happy with this and I don’t think its a control issue. She obviously does a bit of top up shopping here and there as well.

The bills are mostly all on DD so not really a lot of work there on an ongoing basis. When I said bills I meant that I take charge of things like ordering oil because she just wouldn’t ever think to do it or even know how to check the tank. I also book her car for services when due and check her tyres because it would never be done otherwise. Perhaps if I wasn’t around she’d have to take on these things but I don’t think she’d appreciate being left with these tasks as things stand in all honesty. Maybe I’m wrong.

The whole point of the thread is that I would like her to take more responsibility and I have stated twice that I have tried to involve her in financial planning but she just isn’t interested. Her mother asked her recently how much our mortgage was monthly and she hadn’t a clue despite the fact that it’s a joint mortgage and the account is on her online banking dashboard. She has never even clicked in out of curiosity or if she has she has forgotten what the monthly payment is. I know that probably seems unbelievable but there you go.

I would love if she took an interest and we could make decisions together. I don’t think I’m a miser and I am not looking to control anybody but I feel my hand is being forced somewhat.

qwerty13

Aufbau wrote: »

You'd never guess that from some of the replies.

Also " I do all the grocery shopping and pay all the bills and basically manage the house". Why do you do this? Is it not her house and her household too?

If I was married to someone who wanted to controll everything I'd probably go splash whatever cash I had too.

I may be way off base, but maybe a shift in power would give her more of a stake in managing spending.

Tbh my take on it is that you are very way off base. Of course we only have the info supplied to go on, but it sounds to me as though the OP is struggling to keep things going, and that his wife is taking no responsibility. In fact ignoring any responsibility, which is her doing a twisted form of control.

fits

Children’s allowance should go into a savings account requiring notice. You’ll need every penny of it if three children go to college.