About to rent the apartment again, suggestions on vetting.

Samuel T. Cogley

So I think I'm going to knock the AirBnB on the head, I don't want to get caught with having to cancel bookings, which have dropped off a cliff anyway coming into the winter. So here's the vetting plan - is there anymore I should be doing - I won't be doing less.


- Last two LL references cross check addresses with RTB.
- Work Reference, phone going through the main switchboard rather than the number given. (Where applicable or social walfare paperwork)
- Bank Statements to cross check that rent was paid, they can redact everything else*.
- First and Last Months rent + Security Deposit.
- Going with my gut
- Edit: Is there anyway to search the RTB cases for previous claims?
- Score all teants on same scale

Anything I'm missing here?

* And yes they are more than welcome to mine to see the mortgage is being paid.

Edit: Updated due to suggestions, thanks!

wersal gummage

Exercise caution on the landlord reference, particularly if they are currently in the landlord's property.

I would ask for more than a month's deposit to be honest, particularly if the market is what it's reported to be and tenants are competing for a property. My last experience left me with damage to the property to the tune of approx 6 months rent. Personally I'd be inclined to ask for 2 or 3 months deposit (not that I'd ever do it again).

pc7

Are you going to go for 5 month contract to give you the option to go again with AirB&B? I know you can search RTB by address, not sure if by name?

Depending on where the property is some multinationals are taking on leases that could leave you less open to issues.

I'd make sure you ring the work reference (google company number don't go by number printed).

Check all social media platforms to see what they seem like, we went to give a house to tenants before and checked social media every single post was a drunk party photo one so we went with next tenants on the list.

I'd ask for 2 previous landlords if some have it, as the latest one might just want to be rid of them. If you aren't getting bites go back to 1.

After that it really is just your gut instinct, for all parties concerned its a pity there aren't more safeguards.

zl1whqvjs75cdy

3 months security deposit plus a month's rent? Assuming Dublin that's nearly 6k tenants will have to put up? That's a lot to be trusting a landlord with (no offense op).

appledrop

I remember we had some type of a scoring sheet when we were doing it.

We had so many people interested + so much information that this one page document for everyone was really useful for comparing everyone.

I know you have mentioned it but I really think going with your gut is the number 1 if you had loads of people who tick all the boxes. It's one of the reasons we never used a letting agency. We interviewed everyone ourselves.

I recommend setting up a new email address as the amount of enquiries you will get will be unbelievable!

davindub

If you bother with LL references ask for the addresses of the property and ask the LL what address their reference relates to, you can cross check if the tenancy was registered, easy enough to fake as well, but you might catch out a few.

Searching the RTB database is next to useless unless they have a distinctive name, otherwise you don't know if they are the same person.

donkeyoaty0099

Give no lease at all or if you must 5 months max so that you can get rid of the tenants if needs be before part 4 kicks in.

donkeyoaty0099 wrote: »

3 months security deposit plus a month's rent? Assuming Dublin that's nearly 6k tenants will have to put up? That's a lot to be trusting a landlord with (no offense op).

200k (and likely far more of assuming Dublin) is a hell of a lot more to be trusting a tenant with.... 6k is loose change in comparison.

Samuel T. Cogley

appledrop wrote: »

I remember we had some type of a scoring sheet when we were doing it.

We had so many people interested + so much information that this one page document for everyone was really useful for comparing everyone.

I know you have mentioned it but I really think going with your gut is the number 1 if you had loads of people who tick all the boxes. It's one of the reasons we never used a letting agency. We interviewed everyone ourselves.

I recommend setting up a new email address as the amount of enquiries you will get will be unbelievable!

Great idea and shows all tenants were considered should I get a discrimination complaint!

Pkiernan

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

- Work Reference, phone going through the main switchboard rather than the number given....

Careful with this one. This will be deemed as discrimination against Social Welfare renters.

the_syco

Pop into Vodafone, and get a new pre-pay sim, and the cheapest phone they sell. Once the apartment is rented, put said sim into a drawer until next time.

Create a Facebook profile, put in a few pictures of the area, and advertise the place on some of the local Facebook pages, for example; https://www.facebook.com/groups/RentalDublin/ and/or on the Facebook Marketplace. You'll see their Facebook profile when they contact you, and you'll get a gist of the type of people that they are. When I was looking for a housemate in Toronto, I found the bad apples would post crap on their profiles/feed that ruled them out very quickly.

Regarding the employer reference; it's usually HR that you call confirming that the tenant works there. If it's a mobile number, it could their best mate.

appledrop

the_syco wrote: »

Pop into Vodafone, and get a new pre-pay sim, and the cheapest phone they sell. Once the apartment is rented, put said sim into a drawer until next time.

This is great advice. We were nearly driven mad with all the calls day + night the last time + biggest lesson we learned was to never give out our number again.

Fol20

Pkiernan wrote: »

Careful with this one. This will be deemed as discrimination against Social Welfare renters.

Is this really discrimination. He isn’t saying no rent allowance allowed. He is just asking for work references. People on hap can still work you know.

Pkiernan

Fol20 wrote: »

Is this really discrimination. He isn’t saying no rent allowance allowed. He is just asking for work references. People on hap can still work you know.

And a lot of them don't work.
10 grand fine if you are deemed to have discriminated based on employment status.
Not saying it's right, it's just how it is.

GGTrek

Pkiernan wrote: »

Fol20 wrote: »

Is this really discrimination. He isn’t saying no rent allowance allowed. He is just asking for work references. People on hap can still work you know.

And a lot of them don't work.
10 grand fine if you are deemed to have discriminated based on employment status.
Not saying it's right, it's just how it is.

Totally agree. Just ask for any type of references. Clever working professionals will send work references voluntarily. HAP recipients will instead send a sob story or no story at all. OP can then take it from there. RTB and court search are a strong suggestion if name and surname match you check the address of the rented property in the determination order and even for common names the chance you have a prospective player becomes something that should be considered and should require further in depth investigation. I have a few properties and on average every 40-50 requests for viewing I get a match. Not high frequency but definitely an issue to consider given the massive problems the players can cause.

troyzer

This thread is really grim. I make good money and I've rented a few places, never had any issues.

I couldn't tick all of these boxes. It's just as well I'm not looking for a place to rent right now, Christ.

Fol20

Pkiernan wrote: »

And a lot of them don't work.
10 grand fine if you are deemed to have discriminated based on employment status.
Not saying it's right, it's just how it is.

It could be argued that your not discriminating against HAP as some do work and people might be open to taking them on while if you don’t work, your at home more often which means greater wear and tear in the property.

5uspect

So you go through all of this to find good tennants and still hammer them for a massive deposit on top of the high rents they will have to pay?

I can appreciate that you want to protect your property but this approach is combative and will leave a sour taste in the mouth of any prospective tennants already struggling to save money. This is exactly the practise that gives landlords their current reputation.

The vast majority of tennants are going to be perfectly normal people. You’ll have no shortage of interest, at least offer them a partial refund of the deposit after a period of time.

For me this just continues to demonstrate why Ireland needs to move to completely unfurnished long term rentals like in the rest of Europe. Rent white painted empty rooms and bring your own furniture and kitchen with you.

troyzer

5uspect wrote: »

So you go through all of this to find good tennants and still hammer them for a massive deposit on top of the high rents they will have to pay?

I can appreciate that you want to protect your property but this approach is combative and will leave a sour taste in the mouth of any prospective tennants already struggling to save money. This is exactly the practise that gives landlords their current reputation.

The vast majority of tennants are going to be perfectly normal people. You’ll have no shortage of interest, at least offer them a partial refund of the deposit after a period of time.

For me this just continues to demonstrate why Ireland needs to move to completely unfurnished long term rentals like in the rest of Europe. Rent white painted empty rooms and bring your own furniture and kitchen with you.

I absolutely agree with you but the way the market is, the OP will have no problem finding tenants who can stump up.

So from his perspective, why wouldn't he ask for it?

I didn't have any landlord references when I was looking to rent.
Neither do I have a facebook profile, never did, never will.
I do have twitter, Just to follow others.
So I guess I would be out of the running for most of you!

troyzer

bubblypop wrote: »

I didn't have any landlord references when I was looking to rent.
Neither do I have a facebook profile, never did, never will.
I do have twitter, Just to follow others.
So I guess I would be out of the running for most of you!

I'd be out of the running based on the fact that I've never rented in the Republic, only overseas. I also don't have €6k I could easily, or at least comfortably, trust a landlord with given my past experiences.

Pelvis

Aiden Happy Butterfly wrote: »

200k (and likely far more of assuming Dublin) is a hell of a lot more to be trusting a tenant with.... 6k is loose change in comparison.

The property and it's value isn't at risk, unless you think the tenant is going to covertly remove one brick at a time and rebuild the house on their own land?

The Student

Pelvis wrote: »

The property and it's value isn't at risk, unless you think the tenant is going to covertly remove one brick at a time and rebuild the house on their own land?

The issue is the damage the tenant could do and the difficulty in getting the tenant out and getting paid for any damage they may cause.

troyzer

The Student wrote: »

The issue is the damage the tenant could do and the difficulty in getting the tenant out and getting paid for any damage they may cause.

There has to be a balance of rights here, if a landlord can demand a non refundable €500 just to see the property and another €5-€6k deposit just to move in and only on a 5 month tenancy deliberately to remove any rights you might have something has fundamentally broken.

The Student

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

So I think I'm going to knock the AirBnB on the head, I don't want to get caught with having to cancel bookings, which have dropped off a cliff anyway coming into the winter. So here's the vetting plan - is there anymore I should be doing - I won't be doing less.


- Last two LL references cross check addresses with RTB.
- Work Reference, phone going through the main switchboard rather than the number given.
- Bank Statements to cross check that rent was paid, they can redact everything else*.
- First and Last Months rent + Security Deposit.
- Going with my gut
- Edit: Is there anyway to search the RTB cases for previous claims?
- Score all teants on same scale

Anything I'm missing here?

* And yes they are more than welcome to mine to see the mortgage is being paid.

Edit: Updated due to suggestions, thanks!

All of the above are right but for me the most important is your Gut and use facebook to see who the prospective tenants are friends with and the general tone of their posts.

I found facebook an enormous help for this. When a tenant is trying to rent a property they will be trying to impress you and will try hide those issues that will negatively impact on their chances of securing the property.

You might be surprised that you may know a friend of their friends and they will give you an insight into the person. I used this in one of my properties and ironically discovered that I worked with the mother of a good friend of my tenants and I was able to get information on the tenant before agreeing to rent to them.

Personal knowledge is invaluable in these situations.

A final word of warning, "remember if its too good to be true then it probably is not true".

Best of luck on your renting and if you want to pm me feel free to.

Fr Tod Umptious

bubblypop wrote: »

I didn't have any landlord references when I was looking to rent.
Neither do I have a facebook profile, never did, never will.
I do have twitter, Just to follow others.
So I guess I would be out of the running for most of you!

That could be a plus for you also remember

satguy

6k Deposit.

Are you all mad !

troyzer

satguy wrote: »

6k Deposit.

Are you all mad !

He'll get it.

cordy1969

The process I used before in another country without a rental/housing crisis:

3 x previous rental references.
Last 3 months banks statements.
Rent affordability: Rent must not exceed 30% of the gross pay of the applicant/s. (excluding any overtime or penalty rates).
Must be employed with same employer for the last 12 months or more.

Furnished: 3 months holding deposit. plus 1st months rent.
Unfurnished: 6 week holding deposit. plus 1st months rent.

The Student

troyzer wrote: »

There has to be a balance of rights here, if a landlord can demand a non refundable €500 just to see the property and another €5-€6k deposit just to move in and only on a 5 month tenancy deliberately to remove any rights you might have something has fundamentally broken.

Landlords are not demanding €500 non refundable amounts, even Threshold have acknowledged this.

Please check your facts before making them.

A balance does indeed need to be made to both, but at the moment it is all pro tenant and anti landlord.

Fol20

troyzer wrote: »

There has to be a balance of rights here, if a landlord can demand a non refundable €500 just to see the property and another €5-€6k deposit just to move in and only on a 5 month tenancy deliberately to remove any rights you might have something has fundamentally broken.

The news reporters spun the viewing cost and actually had to apologize for it.
Yes i agree with you that it has to be balanced and right now, it is severely one side in that tenants have all the rights.
The system is broken when ll are trying to circumvent the system by doing short term leases such as what you mentioned. They are doing this for a reason though and this should be looked at more so than just the government attempting to meddle in the industry again trying to force ll to do something when it will either cause more to leave the market or ll will find another way to get around it.

Samuel T. Cogley

On deposits I think the fairest way to do it is Security, First and Last, that way the only money I have left at the end of the tenancy is the security which will of course be returned, it's not my money. If everyone did this it would only ever be an issue on the first month of renting your first place as you wouldn't have had to pay the last month's rent in the old place.

Samuel T. Cogley

Anyone any experiance with rentassured.ie

Does anyone know if RTB determinations are registered with the Stubbsgazette or is it up to the indivdual claimants?

STB.

troyzer wrote: »

This thread is really grim. I make good money and I've rented a few places, never had any issues.

I couldn't tick all of these boxes. It's just as well I'm not looking for a place to rent right now, Christ.

Rented out ? Or rented as a tenant ?

Yes it is grim. Unfortunately there is little protection for landlords these days and unfortunately its become a situation for some landlords whereby they end up like a social housing body whether they like it or not with nobody paying rent and/or a place wrecked (in the absence of a social housing policy for the last 10 years)

Its very easy to have a cavalier attitude to the whole area when you don't have something that no one can destroy.

alias no.9

Don't do open viewings, select a manageable number, maybe 5. Show them the property individually and take the time to talk to each of them.

the_syco

alias no.9 wrote: »

Don't do open viewings, select a manageable number, maybe 5. Show them the property individually and take the time to talk to each of them.

Agreed. Otherwise all their answers will be similar. This happened to me when I was looking for a housemate; two were there at the same time. Answers were similar. Ended up picking neither.