Range membership

GolfVI

Hi everyone,
Currently own a shotgun and .22 but looking to invest in a .223 in the near future for mostly target shooting and perhaps the odd fox.

When applying for the license im gunna tick vermin control and target shooting as my main reasons but im sure the firearms officer will look for range membership

My nearest range is the midlands, however it costs €600 i believe for first year membership

Is there a way to show “applied for range membership pending granting of licence” or something similar? I dont wish to spend €600 on a range that i wont use unless im granted the .223

Thanks for any advice!

Gravelly

GolfVI wrote: »

Hi everyone,
Currently own a shotgun and .22 but looking to invest in a .223 in the near future for mostly target shooting and perhaps the odd fox.

When applying for the license im gunna tick vermin control and target shooting as my main reasons but im sure the firearms officer will look for range membership

My nearest range is the midlands, however it costs €600 i believe for first year membership

Is there a way to show “applied for range membership pending granting of licence” or something similar? I dont wish to spend €600 on a range that i wont use unless im granted the .223

Thanks for any advice!

If you have land permissions you should be granted a .223 for vermin control without a range membership. I've a .223 granted for that - I have range membership but didn't bother putting it down on the form as the FO told me there was no need when I'd land permissions. I've actually never fired the .223 at any kind of vermin as I use it solely for target shooting!

GolfVI

Gravelly wrote: »

If you have land permissions you should be granted a .223 for vermin control without a range membership. I've a .223 granted for that - I have range membership but didn't bother putting it down on the form as the FO told me there was no need when I'd land permissions. I've actually never fired the .223 at any kind of vermin as I use it solely for target shooting!

Yes i was thinking id chance just using the land permissions, didnt want to leave them any excuses not to grant though was the only thing as my local FO can be a bit picky with things haha

Cass

The Midlands won't give you a permissory note because there is nothing stopping you getting the license on the strength of such a letter, then not actually joining. I don't believe any range would do it.

The way the law is you have to have everything you intend to do in place before applying. Like security, yu must have the safes, alarms, etc. before you can apply for the 4th, 7th or restricted firearm. Not after you are granted it.

The only thing about applying for it on permission/hunting only is ammo limit/legal shooting. You can shoot on a range under section 2(4)(d), but if you get an ammo allowance of say 100 and want more becaue you're shooting targets on a range then they [AGS] could ask you why you didn't apply for the firearm for targets, class it as a fraudulent application and revoke or refuse it.

Now the chances of that are slim to none, but it's just a heads up.

As for the ammo limit thing though, it'll be hard to make a case for a higher ammo limit if you don't put range membership down.


My thoughts would be this. If you want to shoot targets then join the range. The membership of the range will almost guarantee you get the license. In fact it'll make it easier for you to get it than using hunting as a reason or the only reason.

The first year fee is a lot of money, but considering what you get, and that each consecutive year is only €300 it's quite a price. I know clubs in Dublin with only rimfire ranges that charge as much as €1,000 per year, each year. For your fee you get:

• 10 - 25 yd pistol,
• 25 yd zero,
• 50 yd BR,
• 50 yd ISSF,
• 50 mtr Sporting,
• 100 - 300 yd Sheltered,
• 100 - 600 Windmill,
• 800 - 1,200 Creedmoor,
• Clays - DTL, Sporting, Skeet, ABT
• Archery

Not to mention the facilities:

• Registered Firearm Dealer,
• Shop,
• Clubhouse,
• Cafe,
• Armory,
• Reloading Facilities,
• Tuition,
• Competency Courses,
• Gunsmith(s),
• Wheelchair access throughout

GolfVI

Cass wrote: »

The Midlands won't give you a permissory note because there is nothing stopping you getting the license on the strength of such a letter, then not actually joining. I don't believe any range would do it.

The way the law is you have to have everything you intend to do in place before applying. Like security, yu must have the safes, alarms, etc. before you can apply for the 4th, 7th or restricted firearm. Not after you are granted it.

The only thing about applying for it on permission/hunting only is ammo limit/legal shooting. You can shoot on a range under section 2(4)(d), but if you get an ammo allowance of say 100 and want more becaue you're shooting targets on a range then they [AGS] could ask you why you didn't apply for the firearm for targets, class it as a fraudulent application and revoke or refuse it.

Now the chances of that are slim to none, but it's just a heads up.

As for the ammo limit thing though, it'll be hard to make a case for a higher ammo limit if you don't put range membership down.


My thoughts would be this. If you want to shoot targets then join the range. The membership of the range will almost guarantee you get the license. In fact it'll make it easier for you to get it than using hunting as a reason or the only reason.

The first year fee is a lot of money, but considering what you get, and that each consecutive year is only €300 it's quite a price. I know clubs in Dublin with only rimfire ranges that charge as much as €1,000 per year, each year. For your fee you get:

• 10 - 25 yd pistol,
• 25 yd zero,
• 50 yd BR,
• 50 yd ISSF,
• 50 mtr Sporting,
• 100 - 300 yd Sheltered,
• 100 - 600 Windmill,
• 800 - 1,200 Creedmoor,
• Clays - DTL, Sporting, Skeet, ABT
• Archery

Not to mention the facilities:

• Registered Firearm Dealer,
• Shop,
• Clubhouse,
• Cafe,
• Armory,
• Reloading Facilities,
• Tuition,
• Competency Courses,
• Gunsmith(s),
• Wheelchair access throughout

Thanks Cass, was exactly what i was thinking but just said id ask in case anyone has done it differently, youre right in saying that €300 after the first year is a good deal exactly why i want to use the range, however spending 600€ on membership for the first year then €1000+ On a rifle is gunna break the bank a little so said id chance and see, the ammo limit is one of the reasons i wanted to avoid just using the vermin/fox reason

Gravelly

GolfVI wrote: »

Thanks Cass, was exactly what i was thinking but just said id ask in case anyone has done it differently, youre right in saying that €300 after the first year is a good deal exactly why i want to use the range, however spending 600€ on membership for the first year then €1000+ On a rifle is gunna break the bank a little so said id chance and see, the ammo limit is one of the reasons i wanted to avoid just using the vermin/fox reason

I've an ammo limit of 2,000 on mine, which is considerably more than I need!

GolfVI

If i can ask another thing , if i get the .223 it will be the 4th gun in the house , after 3 i know i need alarms fitted with the safe but what kind of alarms are they looking for? I already have motion sensor alarms fitted inside the house in various rooms that are activated once we leave the house, would these be enough? Safe is already bolted to the wall and has been checked by a crime prevention officer already

Gravelly

GolfVI wrote: »

If i can ask another thing , if i get the .223 it will be the 4th gun in the house , after 3 i know i need alarms fitted with the safe but what kind of alarms are they looking for? I already have motion sensor alarms fitted inside the house in various rooms that are activated once we leave the house, would these be enough? Safe is already bolted to the wall and has been checked by a crime prevention officer already

For 4 firearms, they don't specify the alarm, only that one is fitted, and that the external doors have BS3621 locks.

"Each firearm shall be stored in a gun safe which complies with BS 7558 and which shall be securely fixed to a solid structure.The place in which the firearms are stored shall have an alarm fitted and the external doors to the place shall be fitted with locks which comply with BS 3621"

I was neither asked about my security (other than the paragraph on the form), nor was it ever checked, though I do comply with it.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2009/si/307/made/en/print

GolfVI

Gravelly wrote: »

I've an ammo limit of 2,000 on mine, which is considerably more than I need!

2000?! Must be alot of “foxes” youre shooting!

Cass

Gravelly wrote: »

I've an ammo limit of 2,000 on mine, which is considerably more than I need!

The thing is that is not a set amount and varies wildly form district to district.

The smallest amount i have on any of my licenses is 1,000. I gave forth a set of reasons why and was granted the licenses with the amounts i requested, but as a range membership i could justify it.

The chances of getting this for hunting only is slim, but not impossible and i notice more and more lads saying that after renewing (via the FCR) the new licenses are coming with a seriously reduced amount on the ammo limit.

GolfVI wrote: »

If i can ask another thing , if i get the .223 it will be the 4th gun in the house , after 3 i know i need alarms fitted with the safe but what kind of alarms are they looking for?

It [the SI] says the place where the guns are stored shall be alarmed. This can mean the safe, or the room the safe is in. The house alarm usually refers to anything for 6 unrestricted or two or more restricted firearms, but you have to remember that these are MINIMUM standards so they can impose any amount of security they deem fit. You must have the minimum amount in though before applying.

With what you said you have you are either there or close. I'd buy an alarm safe (i think they used to be available in Argos) and cover yourself that little bit more.

GolfVI

Cass wrote: »

The thing is that is not a set amount and varies wildly form district to district.

The smallest amount i have on any of my licenses is 1,000. I gave forth a set of reasons why and was granted the licenses with the amounts i requested, but as a range membership i could justify it.

The chances of getting this for hunting only is slim, but not impossible and i notice more and more lads saying that after renewing (via the FCR) the new licenses are coming with a seriously reduced amount on the ammo limit.

It [the SI] says the place where the guns are stored shall be alarmed. This can mean the safe, or the room the safe is in. The house alarm usually refers to anything for 6 unrestricted or two or more restricted firearms, but you have to remember that these are MINIMUM standards so they can impose any amount of security they deem fit. You must have the minimum amount in though before applying.

With what you said you have you are either there or close. I'd buy an alarm safe (i think they used to be available in Argos) and cover yourself that little bit more.

Thanks again Cass, i guess ill just have to “ bite the bullet” and get the membership so im covered, do you know if the midlands do thier membership by calender year , eg; jan - dec 2018 or by month of applying eg ; sept 2018 - sept 2019

Gravelly

Cass wrote: »

The thing is that is not a set amount and varies wildly form district to district.

The smallest amount i have on any of my licenses is 1,000. I gave forth a set of reasons why and was granted the licenses with the amounts i requested, but as a range membership i could justify it.

The chances of getting this for hunting only is slim, but not impossible and i notice more and more lads saying that after renewing (via the FCR) the new licenses are coming with a seriously reduced amount on the ammo limit.

It [the SI] says the place where the guns are stored shall be alarmed. This can mean the safe, or the room the safe is in. The house alarm usually refers to anything for 6 unrestricted or two or more restricted firearms, but you have to remember that these are MINIMUM standards so they can impose any amount of security they deem fit. You must have the minimum amount in though before applying.

With what you said you have you are either there or close. I'd buy an alarm safe (i think they used to be available in Argos) and cover yourself that little bit more.

I agree completely - the amount of ammo on my licences varies considerably, and bears no resemblance to what I put on the form - for my .223 I actually forgot to put any amount in, and I got a call from the FO to say "you never put an ammo amount in, would 2,000 be alright" I said yeah fine, and that's what I got!
In fairness, the FO knows I target shoot.

Cass

July to June (start of July to end of June).

They sometimes, and i mean sometimes, run promotions whereby they'll offer lower first year terms if the join date is closer to renewal. IOW if you join in December/January they might offer a reduced price so you don't have to pay the full years membership for only 6 or 7 months of membership.

They also ran, past tense, a promotion whereby if you joined in Feb/March your membership ran through till June of the following year. IOW you got 15 months for the price of 12.

There is no set time frame for these and they are not guaranteed each year. Best bet is to take a trip down, and talk to JP. If nothing is being run then i'd suggest biting the bullet as you said, and joining because the benefits will outweigh the cost if you make use of the range. Too many people say they don't get the use out of a range, but they generally don't make use of all the facilities and i'm talking about all ranges not just the MNSCI.

GolfVI

Cass wrote: »

July to June (start of July to end of June).

They sometimes, and i mean sometimes, run promotions whereby they'll offer lower first year terms if the join date is closer to renewal. IOW if you join in December/January they might offer a reduced price so you don't have to pay the full years membership for only 6 or 7 months of membership.

They also ran, past tense, a promotion whereby if you joined in Feb/March your membership ran through till June of the following year. IOW you got 15 months for the price of 12.

There is no set time frame for these and they are not guaranteed each year. Best bet is to take a trip down, and talk to JP. If nothing is being run then i'd suggest biting the bullet as you said, and joining because the benefits will outweigh the cost if you make use of the range. Too many people say they don't get the use out of a range, but they generally don't make use of all the facilities and i'm talking about all ranges not just the MNSCI.

I may take a trip down so, im only 20-30 mins away from the range so if i do get membership ill be guarenteed to be down most weekends( if the Missus lets me of course )

Cass

Get her shooting too.

GolfVI

Cass wrote: »

Get her shooting too.

She’ll be getting the .22 if i get the .223 already tried the 12g but that nearly knocked her over

alanmc

I'm only shooting a few years in Midlands myself, but they've been great. All the lads there are more than willing to help you out if you're willing to take it on board.

A bit of shooting, a bit of talking about shooting, some coffee and then some more shooting. Well worth the entrance fee if you ask me.

Cass

GolfVI wrote: »

She’ll be getting the .22 if i get the .223 already tried the 12g but that nearly knocked her over

Always be careful letting someone try a 12g as their first gun. It can be a shock to the system if you're not used to it.

The 22 would be a great starter, but stats/facts show women are a better than men so it'll be more a case of you with the 22 and herself with the 223.