Should we convert to protestant?

n1st

Lapsed Catholics in Republic of Ireland, what's preventing us from changing to another Christian religion ?
And what are our options, for services and learning, other than Roman Catholic Church?

pauldla

n1st wrote: »

Lapsed Catholics, what's preventing us from converting to protestant?

If lapsed means 'no longer believing', surely the answer is in the question?

Peregrinus

Nothing prevents Catholics, lapsed or not, from converting to Protestantism.

Except, perhaps, a lack of any desire to be Protestants?

kelly1

n1st wrote: »

Lapsed Catholics, what's preventing us from converting to protestant?

Why would you propose that? What is to be gained?

jay0109

kelly1 wrote: »

Why would you propose that? What is to be gained?

Free soup

Day Lewin

If you are disaffected with the Roman Church but still want connection with the theme and direction of the Christ-like life, the Orthodox churches may repay study.

The Protestant route is a rather different angle...(in my not-very-educated opinion.)

Best of all, start with the Gospels, dwell on them, and go from there...

Apiarist

n1st wrote: »

Lapsed Catholics, what's preventing us from converting to protestant?

Because Protestantism is boring and associated with the British monarchy?

Why not convert to one of the more entertaining religions? Take Vodou, you can so much fun with singing and dancing and playing with dolls of your enemies. Or Buddhism if you want to sit and meditate instead.

incentsitive

Day Lewin wrote: »

, the Orthodox churches may repay study.

2-3 hours every Sunday are you mad?

Nothing stops you changing to protestant AFAIK.

Day Lewin

incentsitive wrote: »

2-3 hours every Sunday are you mad?

Nothing stops you changing to protestant AFAIK.

LOL - not all orthodox members do the full bell, book'n'candle thing every week!
There is a different culture, a tradition of contemplation, a sense of mystery.

I only said it would be worth a study: and to be honest, plunging into the practice without a study might be just as tedious as you describe - although it is a beautiful liturgy, for those who pay attention.

But so are all liturgies, given the chance.

n1st

n1st wrote: »

Lapsed Catholics, what's preventing us from converting to protestant?

By us I mean Christians and Christians living in Republic of Ireland.

homer911

Catholics need to appreciate that there are a wide variety of protestant denominations in Ireland, and even within those denominations, there can be great variety (e.g. CoI). Some of which can be close in appearance to Roman Catholicism. Just don't try one and think they are all the same in style, they are not, but their fundamental beliefs generally are.


In answer to the OP question, nothing except a laziness to get out of bed. Everyone is welcome at any Christian church/mass/service.

kneemos

Is there a signing up process to say I am now a Protestant?
Like babtism or whatever.

homer911

You can attend any church without "signing up". There is no process to say you are "protestant" but as the only two sacraments in the protestant churches are baptism and marriage, and that the protestant churches recognize by and large recognize infant baptism in the Roman Catholic church, then membership is down to whatever that church defines (eg public acceptance of the church's statement of faith). Usually full voting membership requires some sort of documented financial commitment, with no minimum specified

n1st

What are the Christian options in the Republic of Ireland?
Idea would be to continue with all the good Jesus stuff and have somewhere to attend and learn more every so often but not the Roman Catholic Church.

Mrs OBumble

n1st wrote: »

What are the Christian options in the Republic of Ireland?
Idea would be to continue with all the good Jesus stuff and have somewhere to attend and learn more every so often but not the Roman Catholic Church.

It depends where you live.

Most places have a Church of Ireland handy enough.

Other cities likely have Methodist / Presbyterian / Orthodox churches.

Lots of larger towns an African church of some evangelical type - not sure how well non-Africans are welcomed at the latter.

Dublin also has some non-denominational evangelical churches. (ie they have no affiliation except to themselves), and various others eg Unitarians, Salvation Army, etc.

_Brian

My family are fairly even split between Protestant and Catholic, we were raised RC but my beliefs would align more with Protestant.

There’s no way I even remotely think the priest is converting the bread and wine into anything other than bread and wine, it’s a symbolic process, to me it represents sharing of a meal among friends and community as a form of kinship and community solidarity.

mikemac2

You get a double barrelled name

branie2

I'll never convert

Peregrinus

_Brian wrote: »

My family are fairly even split between Protestant and Catholic, we were raised RC but my beliefs would align more with Protestant.

There’s no way I even remotely think the priest is converting the bread and wine into anything other than bread and wine, it’s a symbolic process, to me it represents sharing of a meal among friends and community as a form of kinship and community solidarity.

Actually, to pick nits, these are not views which "align more with Protestant"; most of the Protestant denominations present in Ireland would strongly reject the view that the eucharist is merely symbolic. The main Protestant denominations all affirm the reality of the Real Presence, even if they reject transubstantantion.

Which highlights the point that, Catholic or Protestant, it's easy (and fairly common) to be a member of a particular Christian church without necessarily accepting all its formal teachings and doctrines. (Indeed, in many cases, without necessarily even knowing what some of them are.) People look for different things in selecting the church community they will participate in, but 100% doctrinal alignment with their own views is often not one of the things they look for.

Hotblack Desiato

homer911 wrote: »

In answer to the OP question, nothing except a laziness to get out of bed.

Totally ignoring the long and painful history of religious division on this island, and the cultural identity which non-attendees (and in some cases even non-believers) still hold on to. This is how we still have 78% ticking the RC box on the census. There is a cultural (and often familial) resistance to switching from Denomination A to Denomination B even if one's beliefs align with B but no longer align with A. We even have derogatory names for the process, like "taking the soup".

smacl

kelly1 wrote: »

Why would you propose that? What is to be gained?

The OP might find that some other Christian churches have an ethos that is somewhat closer to that held by many Irish people today. For example, a CoI Bishop has been consistently pro-choice and pro gay marriage, as evidenced in this IT article. It is clear that very many Irish Catholics currently oppose Vatican dogma, and may well prefer a more liberal and egalitarian interpretation of Christianity.

Peregrinus

smacl wrote: »

The OP might find that some other Christian churches have an ethos that is somewhat closer to that held by many Irish people today. For example, a CoI Bishop has been consistently pro-choice and pro gay marriage, as evidenced in this IT article. It is clear that very many Irish Catholics currently oppose Vatican dogma, and may well prefer a more liberal and egalitarian interpretation of Christianity.

What's less clear, though, is that many of them see that preference as a reason for changing denominations.

smacl

Peregrinus wrote: »

What's less clear, though, is that many of them see that preference as a reason for changing denominations.

I'd guess most Irish Catholics wouldn't change as Catholicism is more about cultural identity and belonging to a certain community than being religiously devout or having preference for the Catholic religious message over a Protestant one. Even on this thread we see a vague antipathy towards Protestantism in terms of nationality and class, though thankfully we're largely past actual sectarianism in the south at least. Another thing to consider is that for lapsed Catholics that don't go to church with any regularity, not going to a Protestant church is pretty much the same as not going to a Catholic one, so why change?

n1st

Circumstances change, with children I toe now for example I would be nice to return to some organised religion but this time one we agree with and trust.

smacl

n1st wrote: »

Circumstances change, with children I toe now for example I would be nice to return to some organised religion but this time one we agree with and trust.

First of, not religious myself, so take this with a large grain of salt. That said, maybe ask yourself why you're looking for organised religion? If it is for a sense of community, pick a church where you like the other people first and foremost that maybe have kids of a similar age. Cynically, you also have to ask yourself how your choice is likely to affect your kids, in terms school entry, local friends and the like. Mine both went to educate together so their friends come from a pretty broad mix of religious backgrounds which I personally think is fantastic but may not be what everyone's after. On the other hand, some schools still discriminate in favour of their own religions when enrolling, so if your heart is set on a given local school, you may want to check if that is the case and weigh up how that affects your choice of religion. Best of luck with it either way.

Nekarsulm

homer911 wrote: »

You can attend any church without "signing up". There is no process to say you are "protestant" but as the only two sacraments in the protestant churches are baptism and marriage, and that the protestant churches recognize by and large recognize infant baptism in the Roman Catholic church, then membership is down to whatever that church defines (eg public acceptance of the church's statement of faith). Usually full voting membership requires some sort of documented financial commitment, with no minimum specified

As well as baptism and marraige, Holy Communion is a third sacrament.
As far as I know, protestant churches have an "open table" attitude, if you feel like recieving it, you are welcome to participate.

Actually, now that I think about it, Marraige isnt a sacrament in most protestant churches.
Just baptism and holy communion.

Graces7

smacl wrote: »

First of, not religious myself, so take this with a large grain of salt. That said, maybe ask yourself why you're looking for organised religion? If it is for a sense of community, pick a church where you like the other people first and foremost that maybe have kids of a similar age. Cynically, you also have to ask yourself how your choice is likely to affect your kids, in terms school entry, local friends and the like. Mine both went to educate together so their friends come from a pretty broad mix of religious backgrounds which I personally think is fantastic but may not be what everyone's after. On the other hand, some schools still discriminate in favour of their own religions when enrolling, so if your heart is set on a given local school, you may want to check if that is the case and weigh up how that affects your choice of religion. Best of luck with it either way.

It is called "fellowship" which is a basic tenet of faith

See

https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/Fellowship,-Among-Believers

Graces7

Interesting thread; thank you.

Depends on where your faith lies; in Jesus or in the church. Whatever church

I was raised Church of England, going back over three score years and ten... My lifelong illness finally came between me and the active church life I loved and was a part of, and I became and am a Solitary. Now, as my immune system makes eg church a dangerous place and my mobility is .... well, bad... when I came to Ireland i came to the Catholic church.

My faith and my life are in the Lord Jesus Christ. if you keep that at the focus, then ?

My prayer and worship life are here, alone in a remote place, with connections with my neighbours etc are rare but very good. They respect my dedicated life to prayer.

On my rare outings I care for our small church here, pray in the ancient ruins that predate the divisions.

People matter and a local church matters. As long as you stay connected to the Heart. Jesus

Thinkingaboutit

No again.

Protestantism is based ultimately on Martin Luther's mendacious editing and translation of Scripture and the Biblical Canon (removing Maccabees, moving the Epistle of James to the end of NT, changes portions of Romans to support sola fide etc.). The traditional Roman Rite (not the somewhat related committee effort of the late 60s) predates a time when the NT Canon was even settled.

Now, a not entirely unfounded perception that there exists a culture of homosexual and pederastic predation and sexual harassment among Catholic bishops and priests has nauseated many. Pope Francis made great efforts as Archbishop of Buenos Aires to protect Fr Grassi, an Argentine celebrity hypocrite activist priest and pederast, or trying to reverse Benedict's dismissal of convicted paedophile Fr Inzoli, only stopping when Inzoli was gaoled. There are too many examples of a lax attitude towards sexual harassment by seminarians. This was seen in Maynooth too. This impurity can be connected with the smashing of proven methods of priestly formation in the aftermath of V2. When normal, devout men shied away, or were expelled, moral inadequates took their place. There was an effort beginning with JP2, now substantially halted under Francis, if not to restore Tridentine methods of formation, at least to enforce morally healthy standards of formation.

This time of darkness for the Church will pass. Jumping ship would be a foolish thing, because there is no possibility of Salvation outside the Church. St Peter set a standard by denying Christ as He prophesised, and a good many Popes have tried to outdo that.

MonkieSocks

Never!


Never!


Never!

kneemos

Thinkingaboutit wrote: »

This time of darkness for the Church will pass. Jumping ship would be a foolish thing, because there is no possibility of Salvation outside the Church. St Peter set a standard by denying Christ as He prophesised, and a good many Popes have tried to outdo that.

Will clean living upright citizens of other religions be refused salvation when a hard living murdering Catholic be granted salvation at will?