Bus Éireann city services

McGiver

As I repeatedly said in the past, there are two simple measures which can be put into effect immediately for a positive effect. Traffic cannot be simply fixed and rerouting is also quite problematic (Galway Council are working on it by the way). But these two measures are rather simple and fully in BE control.

1. Use multiple bus doors. To speed up loading and unloading. I was so happy when I saw the new buses with the second door, but then I looked at them at few stops and they are not used! I am speechless.

2. Streamline fare payment. Phase out cash, move to something faster than Leap. Driver's shouldn't be cashiers, but focus on driving & loading/unloading - this will speed up both. If you go to any larger city in Europe, you'll see that public transport drivers are drivers not fare collectors. Now, some (Mrs Bumble) have argued with me in other Galway transport thread that the delays caused by fare collection/validation isn't significant. I still don't agree and BusConnect also don't agree.

The second biggest source of bus delays, after traffic congestion, is the payment process at bus stops.Payment of fares by cash is still commonplace, slowing down the boarding time. Even when using the Leap Card, the complexity of payment stages means a high percentage of passengers have to interact with the driver, with resultant delays at bus stops. At busy bus stops these delays can be for several minutes. Multiply by the number of busy stops on a route, and those delays accumulate to add significantly to the overall journey time.
...
As part of this process, cashless operation will be introduced on all buses, to remove the delays caused by cash payments. Currently over 70% of fare payments are made by Leap card. As this increases over the next couple of years, the transition to a cashless regime will become easier. BusConnects will incorporate the latest developments in account-based ticketing technology, potentially allowing use of credit / debit cards or mobile devices as a convenient means of payment.

https://busconnects.ie/initiatives/just-the-ticket/

LoonyLovegood

If Galway had something like Dublin bus, where passengers paying leap fares are on the right, and passengers paying cash are on the left, it'd speed up immensely. Bus Eireann must be the only place where paying with a leap card is slower than paying in cash, because it checks for the prepaid ticket first.

Fitz*

Whole heartily agree on the above points.

I don't use the bus anymore, choosing to walk instead as my 2 feet are somewhat more reliable than a fleet of buses, but one thing I noticed right up until the end of my bus-taking-tenure is how bad the unloading process is.

And to be fair, it is not just the drivers who are at fault when it comes to the middle door. OK, they are responsible for not opening it at certain stops where it should be, but also so are the passengers. Many still chose to disembark at the front door only. They would either walk down the stairs and automatically turn right to disembark through the front door or else just walk past the open middle door and out the front door. There should be rules set that you can disembark only through the middle doors or something, but then that will need the driver to open the door at every stop.

When they got the new fleet of buses in, then was the time to introduce the tap-on/tap-off system that DB has. Why use the old, slow system? Sometimes I wonder if BE are self-sabotaging their own service on purpose.

zell12

FitzShane wrote: »

I don't use the bus anymore, choosing to walk instead as my 2 feet are somewhat more reliable than a fleet of buses

Well done.
Walking is excellent, keeps you fit, mentally and physically. Marvel at the wondrous rows of single occupancy sardine cans on the throughfares

McGiver

FitzShane wrote: »

Whole heartily agree on the above points.
And to be fair, it is not just the drivers who are at fault when it comes to the middle door. OK, they are responsible for not opening it at certain stops where it should be, but also so are the passengers. Many still chose to disembark at the front door only. They would either walk down the stairs and automatically turn right to disembark through the front door or else just walk past the open middle door and out the front door. There should be rules set that you can disembark only through the middle doors or something, but then that will need the driver to open the door at every stop.

Drivers will need to tell the people and educate them. At every single stop, again and again. Within few months issue fixed. There is no other way. Plus put up some signs explaining the same. But I don't see that happening here, the drivers are too lazy and people too disinterested in following any rules

When they got the new fleet of buses in, then was the time to introduce the tap-on/tap-off system that DB has. Why use the old, slow system? Sometimes I wonder if BE are self-sabotaging their own service on purpose.

The irony is, that BusConnect are saying that the DB system is too slow and must be sped up! So Galway system is even worse than that, and some people even think that the current system is acceptable in a European country in year 2018. That's where we are.

Mrs OBumble

McGiver wrote: »

2. Streamline fare payment. Phase out cash, move to something faster than Leap. Driver's shouldn't be cashiers, but focus on driving & loading/unloading - this will speed up both. If you go to any larger city in Europe, you'll see that public transport drivers are drivers not fare collectors. Now, some (Mrs Bumble) have argued with me in other Galway transport thread that the delays caused by fare collection/validation isn't significant.

Whoa there.

I never said that the delays aren't significant. All I've said is that Ireland's current cash replacement (Leap) is a lot slower than cash. Right now, moving prople to Leap is slowing things even further.

Historically buses had conductors who did fare collection. They were removed as unnecessary duplication of labour.

Mrs OBumble

FitzShane wrote: »

When they got the new fleet of buses in, then was the time to introduce the tap-on/tap-off system that DB has. Why use the old, slow system? Sometimes I wonder if BE are self-sabotaging their own service on purpose.

Nope ...

DB does not have tag on/off - that only works on trains and trams.

On DB you either use the right side validator and pay the maximum fare for the route (up to the daily cap), or you tell the driver where you are are going and s/he takes the cash off you or your leap card using the driver side validator.


And if BE follow the NTA's fare directive, we'll be telling the driver our destination on most Galway routes fron December onwards, so they know which fare to charge. ..... more here: https://news.galwaytransport.info/2018/11/2019-galway-bus-train-fare-increases.html

Storm 10

Passes Parkmore around 10am today and there were six double decker buses parked at the stop 409 and 401 buses, can you imagine just how far out of their schedule they must be, would not like to be waiting in this weather for a 409 or 401 bus.

McGiver

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Whoa there.

I never said that the delays aren't significant. All I've said is that Ireland's current cash replacement (Leap) is a lot slower than cash. Right now, moving prople to Leap is slowing things even further.

Historically buses had conductors who did fare collection. They were removed as unnecessary duplication of labour.

From which I imply that you are fine with cash i.e. status quo. Very backward solution. Cash is not an option, it's as simple as that. And "printing out" tickets is insane! It's 2018.

McGiver

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Nope ...

DB does not have tag on/off - that only works on trains and trams.

On DB you either use the right side validator and pay the maximum fare for the route (up to the daily cap), or you tell the driver where you are are going and s/he takes the cash off you or your leap card using the driver side validator.


And if BE follow the NTA's fare directive, we'll be telling the driver our destination on most Galway routes fron December onwards, so they know which fare to charge. ..... more here: https://news.galwaytransport.info/2018/11/2019-galway-bus-train-fare-increases.html

Why is this needed? Driver should drive and ensure safety of passengers. End of.

Mrs OBumble

McGiver wrote: »

Why is this needed? Driver should drive and ensure safety of passengers. End of.

Who should be resoonsible for revenue protection then?




Oh - and i never said I'm ok with cash, just that its the fastest option right now. I prefer to leave utopian dreaming to others, and focus on the here-and-now. In a spciety where one person in every six cannot read, cash has some handy understandability qualities

McGiver

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Who should be resoonsible for revenue protection then?

The Machines, as in any other bigger city on the continent. :P
That's the fundamental point you cannot grasp.

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Oh - and i never said I'm ok with cash, just that its the fastest option right now. I prefer to leave utopian dreaming to others, and focus on the here-and-now. In a spciety where one person in every six cannot read, cash has some handy understandability qualities

I mean really, have you been to Europe? Utopian? I can tell you that the city I'm from has had automated ticket machines since early 1980s (basically as long as I can remember), so that's 30 years ago and that wasn't even a market economy back then. The situation in e.g. West Germany would have been even more ahead, maybe 10 more years.

All cities on the continent are at or are moving to fully electronic solutions at the moment - RFID tag in/out, text tickets, apps etc. but you say that cash is an option. I just can't comprehend this. We have a fundamental philosophical difference and difference in outlook it seems, so I'll remind you again that it's year 2018 and that perhaps you could make a trip to the continent to see that it's all doable, it's not utopia. They will also tell you there that they've had that utopia for 20 years :cool:

bobbyss

McGiver wrote:

From which I imply that you are fine with cash i.e. status quo. Very backward solution. Cash is not an option, it's as simple as that. And "printing out" tickets is insane! It's 2018.

What is the policy exactly regarding this middle door business do you know? When using the Leap on DB if you have to go through the driver you can hear a constant flow of beeps on the machine on the right as you enter. You can only imagine the time lost if this option was not working. But no such thing in Galway. I would say 90% of passengers have a card with DB. Very unusual to see anyone use cash.
People fumbling for cash drive me up the wall. (There should be a law about it).
I have never taken a city direct bus but isn't it strange, as far as I am aware, that some of their busses (to knocknacarra?) start their journey west from Eyre Square outside the Bank by heading up bohermore going to Foster street and around the square again. What kind of asreways planning is that?

McGiver

bobbyss wrote: »

What is the policy exactly regarding this middle door business do you know?

I don't think there is any policy. Looks like the hind door is fro wheelchair users. But BE are too arsed to think how they could use it to speed up loading/unloading. It's a typical state-owned enterprise mentality - "who cares we get paid anyway, and if not we'll go for a strike". Customer service not a strong trait of most state-owned businesses

Mrs OBumble

McGiver wrote: »

...the city I'm from has had automated ticket machines since early 1980s (basically as long as I can remember), so that's 30 years ago and that wasn't even a market economy back then. The situation in e.g. West Germany would have been even more ahead, maybe 10 more years.

.... but you say that cash is an option.

There is a fundamental point you are missing. German cities are mainly populated by ... Germans. The people who come into Irish pubs and say "Hello, the sign says that the music will start at 9:30. It is now 9:35 and there is no music. What is happening please". That is - they follow the rules, and expect other people to do the same. Irish cities, on the other hand, are mainly populated by people whose survival for decades depended on sticking it to the man. Following the rules, complying with how machines tell you to behave, is just not a strong suite.

Whether or not any of us believe cash should be an option is irrelevant, and not something I've commented on. Right now, it is an option, whether we like it or not. And it's faster than the machine-based alternative. Until the latter changes, I don't support removing it.

bobbyss wrote: »

I have never taken a city direct bus but isn't it strange, as far as I am aware, that some of their busses (to knocknacarra?) start their journey west from Eyre Square outside the Bank by heading up bohermore going to Foster street and around the square again. What kind of asreways planning is that?

It's a hang-over from the days when the 411 went down Dock Rd, thru Spanish Pde and up Henry St. Then, it made sense. Now it's just silly. The people to complain to are the NTA, who approve route licenses.

McGiver wrote: »

Looks like the hind door is fro wheelchair users. But BE are too arsed to think how they could use it to speed up loading/unloading. It's a typical state-owned enterprise mentality - "who cares we get paid anyway, and if not we'll go for a strike". Customer service not a strong trait of most state-owned businesses

I have no idea how you got the idea that the middle door is for wheelchair users. On all three new DD buses that I've been on recently, the extendable ramp for wheelchair users is mounted on the front door beside the driver (who has to leave his/her seat to operate it).

I agree that there does not seem to be effective operational policy about using the middle door. For years, there were rumours that Dublin Bus drivers were personally liable if they opened the middle door and a passenger injured themselves getting on/off through it - and that the situation was different for the front door. I have no idea if this is true, or applies here: I expect it's not - but stranger things have happened in this litigation-crazy state.

Personally, I've observed the middle doors opened at terminal stops about 50% of the time. When used well, they have made a big difference to loading times.

McGiver

Mrs OBumble wrote:

There is a fundamental point you are missing. German cities are mainly populated by ... Germans. The people who come into Irish pubs and say "Hello, the sign says that the music will start at 9:30. It is now 9:35 and there is no music. What is happening please". That is - they follow the rules, and expect other people to do the same. Irish cities, on the other hand, are mainly populated by people whose survival for decades depended on sticking it to the man. Following the rules, complying with how machines tell you to behave, is just not a strong suite.

I'm not from Germany btw, I just threw in the West Germany to see the response as I expected some silly excuses, and I'm proven correct.

Literally the whole continental Europe works like this. This had nothing to do with the Germans. Automated ticketing machines and later on electronic validation system are totally ubiquitous.

If you think that Irish people are so stupid that you think they can't grasp the concept, albeit being about 35 years behind in this matter, then I don't know what to tell you. This is the most silliest argument I've heard.

I don't think Irish people are any less intelligent or have lesser ability to learn new things and tech than any continentals. If Irish people learned how to drive cars, use mobile phones, computers, smartphones, and boards.ie, then they will learn how to use cash free public transport using self validation in the no time.

bobbyss

Yet again the 405 kept jumping on and off the screen so I rang Ceannt Station but no reply except to be told to try later. No voicemail service in fact. Why is that? If you ring most companies and can't get through usually they facilitate by allowing you to leave a messsge. Not everybody can call back as people are on the move.

Once I did get through a number of months ago. The lady I spoke to said the tracking device they use happened to be broken that particular day. ( I am not quite sure who can check this device, the person who answers the phone or only inspector?)

On another occasion I was given the number of the relevant inspector/supervisor and the first question I've asked was how did I get his number.

What is the experience of people who call the station to get info on busses? Shouldn't inspectors' phones be readily available and displayed on website along with name etc. I can't see why they apparently aren't. They know exactly where the busses are and probably know the reason they are late and eta etc.

Mrs OBumble

McGiver wrote: »

If you think that Irish people are so stupid that you think they can't grasp the concept, albeit being about 35 years behind in this matter, then I don't know what to tell you. This is the most silliest argument I've heard.

I don't think Irish people are any less intelligent or have lesser ability to learn new things and tech than any continentals. If Irish people learned how to drive cars, use mobile phones, computers, smartphones, and boards.ie, then they will learn how to use cash free public transport using self validation in the no time.

You're the only one who said anything about "stupid".

Not following the rules was an essential survival skill in this country for a very long time. It will take generations for that to change.

wotausername

Fare changes from 1st December

http://www.buseireann.ie/news_timetable.php?id=3203&month=Nov

Mrs OBumble

wotausername wrote: »

Fare changes from 1st December

http://www.buseireann.ie/news_timetable.php?id=3203&month=Nov

Indeed.

And the so called "cross city outer zone single fare for journeys longer than 7.5km" is quite a change indeed.

My summary with specific numbers is here: https://news.galwaytransport.info/2018/11/2019-galway-bus-train-fare-increases.html

It remains to be seen if they only apply it for cross city travel, or if it's for all trips longer than 7.5km.

Either way, if you are paying cash and will make two "outer zone" journeys in a day, then getting a day-saver ticket is better value.

xckjoo

bobbyss wrote: »

Yet again the 405 kept jumping on and off the screen so I rang Ceannt Station but no reply except to be told to try later. No voicemail service in fact. Why is that? If you ring most companies and can't get through usually they facilitate by allowing you to leave a messsge. Not everybody can call back as people are on the move.

Once I did get through a number of months ago. The lady I spoke to said the tracking device they use happened to be broken that particular day. ( I am not quite sure who can check this device, the person who answers the phone or only inspector?)

On another occasion I was given the number of the relevant inspector/supervisor and the first question I've asked was how did I get his number.

What is the experience of people who call the station to get info on busses? Shouldn't inspectors' phones be readily available and displayed on website along with name etc. I can't see why they apparently aren't. They know exactly where the busses are and probably know the reason they are late and eta etc.

It would be nice but nowhere answers phones anymore. You're better off using Twitter. Might be a bit of a cookie-cutter response, but it will get a response since it's public. I think they're required to respond to emails (unless I'm mixing them up with someone else) so it's a good choice for establishing a pattern of fault (e.g. 405 not showing up).

McGiver

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

You're the only one who said anything about "stupid".
Not following the rules was an essential survival skill in this country for a very long time. It will take generations for that to change.

A bit defeatist imho. With this attitude any progress isn't possible.

Stevolende

Had what I take to be a 409 change its display as it came down Doughiska road, cycled through display off, Centre of town, wound up on Tullamore then refuse to stop at one of the main stops on Doughiska rd last night.
Was the driver stoned or something.
Single decker bus, around 10 past 7.
Seemed to stop at every other stop as well.

flazio

What's the fare to Tullamore?

Storm 10

Wonder if it was the poster that had the problem and not the driver ,took a City bus service and ended up in Tullamore

Mrs OBumble

Stevolende wrote: »

Had what I take to be a 409 change its display as it came down Doughiska road, cycled through display off, Centre of town, wound up on Tullamore then refuse to stop at one of the main stops on Doughiska rd last night.
Was the driver stoned or something.
Single decker bus, around 10 past 7.
Seemed to stop at every other stop as well.

Yeah, I think I was on that bus. Driver is very new I think.

thesandeman

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Yeah, I think I was on that bus. Driver is very new I think.

He must be if he was driving a bike.

Stevolende

Wondered when I saw the bus display say a destination outside of normal routes does the display have a database of every potential destination across the country or something. Certainly didn't seem to know what he was doing. Ha d he been trying to find the correct destination thing since he turned around at Parkmore.

Ashleigh1986

The park and ride project is another galway city joke .
Poor numbers using it .
Buses and drivers taken off normal routes at a busy time to facilitate a broken project .
Through out the city especially in eyre square people waiting at bus stops for buses / drivers that have been withdrawn to run park and ride .

westgolf

Ashleigh1986 wrote: »

The park and ride project is another galway city joke .
Poor numbers using it .
Buses and drivers taken off normal routes at a busy time to facilitate a broken project .
Through out the city especially in eyre square people waiting at bus stops for buses / drivers that have been withdrawn to run park and ride .

Bus Eireann has nothing to do with P+R. Its Callinan's / City link who are doing it this time.

ben.schlomo

westgolf wrote: »

Ashleigh1986 wrote: »

The park and ride project is another galway city joke .
Poor numbers using it .
Buses and drivers taken off normal routes at a busy time to facilitate a broken project .
Through out the city especially in eyre square people waiting at bus stops for buses / drivers that have been withdrawn to run park and ride .

Bus Eireann has nothing to do with P+R. Its Callinan's / City link who are doing it this time.

No point letting that get in the way of a good rant though. I say we disregard your post and embrace the rage.

bobbyss

You would despair. Seeing College Road outbound packed from begining to end with a number of busses stuck in the middle of all of that. Just crazy. Is there ANY street in the city that you could have exclusively for busses to fly in and out? A pity they didn't put two extra lanes on the Q Bridge when building it. Would it have cost that much extra at that point?

Mrs OBumble

Bus lanes on the Q-Bridge ... for all the mythical people in Knockers who work in Parkmore ... wouldn't make a bit of difference for people shopping in town.

The ones on the Dublin Rd do make a big difference. More would be better for sure. But they ain't useless.

bobbyss

Mrs OBumble wrote:

Bus lanes on the Q-Bridge ... for all the mythical people in Knockers who work in Parkmore ... wouldn't make a bit of difference for people shopping in town.

Mrs OBumble wrote:

The ones on the Dublin Rd do make a big difference. More would be better for sure. But they ain't useless.

Whizzing down the Dublin road from gmit to the bons and passing all that traffic is great until the bits after that when you're stuck. So yes it does help.

Extra bus lanes on the bridge would absolutely make a difference if I was going headford direction. Not everyone is going into town. On a bus out of dublin you are in a lane all the way out past Palmerston I think if not further. Passing all that traffic is fantastic. That's what we should be aiming for in Galway. Bus lanes all the way in and out. No messing with bits and pieces.

what_traffic

bobbyss wrote: »

You would despair. Seeing College Road outbound packed from begining to end with a number of busses stuck in the middle of all of that. Just crazy. Is there ANY street in the city that you could have exclusively for busses to fly in and out?

It is a good idea. One solution is Bus Gates.
City Council should just install a BUS Gates on College Road on the East side of the City and a BUS Gate on Salmon Weir Bridge on the West side of the City.
Would start with then been operational for certain periods of the day like 07h00 -> 10h00 and 15h00-> 19h00

zell12

bobbyss wrote: »

Is there ANY street in the city that you could have exclusively for busses to fly in and out?

Very simple.
College Road and Lough Atalia Road
Convert into one way system, one lane to a bus lane and possible tram lane in future. Readjust bus route so bus travels inbound and outbound quickly

Fitz*

zell12 wrote: »

Very simple.
College Road and Lough Atalia Road
Convert into one way system, one lane to a bus lane and possible tram lane in future. Readjust bus route so bus travels inbound and outbound quickly

B&B owners on College Road would definitely not allow this to happen. Also what about home owners in The Green etc.

xckjoo

FitzShane wrote: »

B&B owners on College Road would definitely not allow this to happen. Also what about home owners in The Green etc.

I think last time they did the trial run, part of the issue was that the elderly on College Road were stuck because they no longer had a bus passing that went into town (or out of, can't remember which direction of the flow was).

Not sure why the B&Bs would complain as long as there's a car flow in one direction past them. College Road is a sh1t show of a road at the moment. Wouldn't endear me to stay there if I was an out-of-towner. They'll probably still complain though. Cause people are moany gits :pac:

Mrs OBumble

zell12 wrote: »

Very simple.
College Road and Lough Atalia Road
Convert into one way system, one lane to a bus lane and possible tram lane in future. Readjust bus route so bus travels inbound and outbound quickly

But no one is going to destinations in LA road. Pointless taking a bus down there. Enough are going to or from places in College Rd (council office, sports hround, sheltered accommodation) that two way buses are better.

xckjoo

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

But no one is going to destinations in LA road. Pointless taking a bus down there. Enough are going to or from places in College Rd (council office, sports hround, sheltered accommodation) that two way buses are better.

Close off College Road to all except buses and local cars and use Lough Atalia for car traffic?

GerardKeating

xckjoo wrote: »

Close off College Road to all except buses and local cars and use Lough Atalia for car traffic?

Perhaps difficult to police.

Maybe both College Road and Lough Atalia one way with a Bus Lane, Traffice goes one and in the other.

zell12

GerardKeating wrote: »

Perhaps difficult to police.
Maybe both College Road and Lough Atalia one way with a Bus Lane, Traffice goes one and in the other.

That's what I said but I was dismissed :mad:

bobbyss

Issue easily identifiable stickers for cars. Gardai to monitor for a while. Issue huge fines for breakers.

Ashleigh1986

Lads .... Take a look around galway city this week .
Cars parked up all along foster street .
All along eglinton street .
Gardai walking by doing nothing about it .
Where else would you get it .
Free parking at the busiest time of the year .
If galway traffic wants to be sorted , zero tolerance for these motorists who don't want yo pay for parking.

testtech05

Ashleigh1986 wrote: »

Lads .... Take a look around galway city this week .
Cars parked up all along foster street .
All along eglinton street .
Gardai walking by doing nothing about it .
Where else would you get it .
Free parking at the busiest time of the year .
If galway traffic wants to be sorted , zero tolerance for these motorists who don't want yo pay for parking.

It's a free for all at times alright. Was pleasantly surprised today to see police issuing a good few tickets to cars parked illegally down around woodquay earlier though.

Ashleigh1986

Gardai are a joke in this city .
Giving tickets to vehicles that aren't causing traffic chaos and ignoring places like foster street / eglinton street / back the west that are causing traffic problems daily .
Not one bit of commonsense among any of the galway gardai .
Salthill all this week , cars with the parking hazards on , with the " I'm only popping into the shop for a minute brigade " .
Bus drivers all this week must be going off the head trying to get around galway .

GerardKeating

bobbyss wrote: »

Issue easily identifiable stickers for cars. Gardai to monitor for a while. Issue huge fines for breakers.

So people living on the two streets in question cannot have visitors or deliveries is what you are saying then, same for the various business on the roads, which include quite a few B&B's

Ashleigh1986

Let's take foster street for a minute .
From 12am to 7pm it should be no parking zone .
Take out bus lane .
Right lane only for turning right up by o Connells bar .
Left lane only to be used to go down by the docks .
Put proper signage up warning motorists of parking on this road during these times.
All deliveries for shops / pubs to be done by 12am.
Zero tolerance and on the spot fines of €100 .

Mrs OBumble

Ashleigh1986 wrote: »

Let's take foster street for a minute .
From 12am to 7pm it should be no parking zone .
Take out bus lane .
Right lane only for turning right up by o Connells bar .
Left lane only to be used to go down by the docks .
Put proper signage up warning motorists of parking on this road during these times.
All deliveries for shops / pubs to be done by 12am.
Zero tolerance and on the spot fines of €100 .

Pubs taking deliveries at night ehen they're full of customers. Yeah, i can see that working well.

And removing one of the few bus lanes? No. Just no.

bobbyss

GerardKeating wrote:

So people living on the two streets in question cannot have visitors or deliveries is what you are saying then, same for the various business on the roads, which include quite a few B&B's

But this experience is not unique to Galway. There are bus lanes going past many houses in Dublin and I'm sure in other cities where the owners themselves can't even park outside never mind visitors. It's no big deal. We can't stop development because people say " I can't park outside my own house so there can't be a bus lane there'.