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Improving Football

  • 13-09-2018 3:02pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 3,990 ✭✭✭ Xenophile


    I saw a suggestion from a former player advocating that the number of players be reduced to 13. I am in agreement with this suggestion.


«13

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,990 ✭✭✭ Xenophile


    I suggest that all hand passes must go forward. Unless the ball is clearly seen to go forward a free kick is to be awarded to the opposing team.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,356 ✭✭✭ stooge


    make the pitch narrower. keep the length

    or ban handpassing altogether


  • Registered Users Posts: 22,991 ✭✭✭✭ blanch152


    stooge wrote: »
    make the pitch narrower. keep the length

    or ban handpassing altogether


    If you make the pitch narrower, you help the defensive teams.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,382 ✭✭✭ tritium


    Minimum of four players in the opposition half at all times


  • Registered Users Posts: 402 ✭✭ MattressRick


    I've seen the 13 a side thing recommended by some ex county players but Dublin will still handpass the ball to death if they need to get through 11 men back inside a 45 yard line.

    Would eliminating the bounce and making players only solo help? Players always use the bounce after they break through tackles. Only allowing solos would make it a bit easier to dispossess. Would free up the game a bit. Hurling has a good few turnovers, players have to solo on the stick and the balls there to be flicked away, this allows more end to end stuff.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭ LeinsterDub


    You need to to either encourage the attack or depower the defense.

    One option would be to make the goals wider so attacking teams can shoot from tighter angles
    This would in turn force defenses to attempt to win the ball rather than just sitting back.

    The option of having to have 4 players in the opposite half would only work if it's only applied to the defending side otherwise you'll just have 10 v 10 and the same problem as now.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,665 ✭✭✭ Fann Linn


    You need to to either encourage the attack or depower the defense.

    One option would be to make the goals wider so attacking teams can shoot from tighter angles
    This would in turn force defenses to attempt to win the ball rather than just sitting back.

    The option of having to have 4 players in the opposite half would only work if it's only applied to the defending side otherwise you'll just have 10 v 10 and the same problem as now.

    This Dublin team have no problem scoring as the current stats attest. The average score by Dublin in 2018 was 27.5 points per game as opposed to 25.7 ppg in 2017 as opposed to 20.9 ppg in 2016.
    Widening the goals might just give Dublin a slight advantage over everyone else😊😊😊


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,279 ✭✭✭ StupidLikeAFox


    The demise of football is greatly exagerrated


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭ LeinsterDub


    Fann Linn wrote: »
    This Dublin team have no problem scoring as the current stats attest. The average score by Dublin in 2018 was 27.5 points per game as opposed to 25.7 ppg in 2017 as opposed to 20.9 ppg in 2016.
    Widening the goals might just give Dublin a slight advantage over everyone else😊😊😊

    What does that stat look like if you exclude Leinster?


  • Registered Users Posts: 850 ✭✭✭ Agus


    You need to to either encourage the attack or depower the defense.

    One option would be to make the goals wider so attacking teams can shoot from tighter angles
    This would in turn force defenses to attempt to win the ball rather than just sitting back.

    The option of having to have 4 players in the opposite half would only work if it's only applied to the defending side otherwise you'll just have 10 v 10 and the same problem as now.


    Your description of "10 v 10" would still make it a lot easier for the attacking team because it leaves much more space than if 14 or 15 of the defending team are in their own half covvering the space. Field lacrosse has an "offside" rule llimiting the number of players that can be in each half and it seems to work. If a similar proposal is ever tried in football to see if it's actually workable and possible to officiate, you'd probably need to have both the attacking and the defending teams having designated backs and forwards (clearly marked with different jerseys like the goalkeeper) who must stay within their area of the field.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,956 ✭✭✭ Paulzx


    Reducing to 13 a side is not the answer. A full GAA pitch is easily big enough to accommadate 30 players.

    The problem arises when a team wishes to place all of their players in a third of the pitch and their only priority is to stop the other team playing while having minimal ambition to actually play themsleves.

    This needs to be the starting point for any rule tweaks.

    What can be done to make crowding all your players in your own half of no tactical benefit?

    I don't have a defintive answer to this but if a solution is found it will open the game up again irrespective of whether you hand pass or not


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭ The Lost Sheep


    Xenophile wrote: »
    I saw a suggestion from a former player advocating that the number of players be reduced to 13. I am in agreement with this suggestion.
    I think you need to do more than just reduce playing numbers. Their may be more space but teams will play same way. To improve things you need to tweak the rules of the game
    stooge wrote: »
    make the pitch narrower. keep the length

    or ban handpassing altogether
    As already said making the pitch narrower makes defences stronger and the defensive focused teams far stronger.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,399 ✭✭✭✭ ThunbergsAreGo


    The demise of football is greatly exagerrated

    Exactly, teams becoming smarter and more tactically aware should not necessitate a rule change especially those which only seem to aid a defensive mindset


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,749 ✭✭✭ Coillte_Bhoy


    I think it would be next to impossible to officiate the 4 players in the half suggestion


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,399 ✭✭✭✭ ThunbergsAreGo


    I think it would be next to impossible to officiate the 4 players in the half suggestion

    Is there any other sport that does it?


  • Registered Users Posts: 37 fieldofsheep


    My own suggestion would be to really tighten up the rules around the mechanics of the handpass - I'd ban open hand passes (fist pass only), and police the motion of the hand holding the ball to prevent the 'throw' style pass.
    Going further, I'd even stipulate that the ball has to be in the air to hand pass, similar to hurling - you can't hand pass the ball with it resting in the palm of your non-striking hand!


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,074 ✭✭✭ LoughNeagh2017


    Minors used to play 13 a side in some club leagues


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,377 ✭✭✭ Felexicon


    My own suggestion would be to really tighten up the rules around the mechanics of the handpass - I'd ban open hand passes (fist pass only), and police the motion of the hand holding the ball to prevent the 'throw' style pass.
    Going further, I'd even stipulate that the ball has to be in the air to hand pass, similar to hurling - you can't hand pass the ball with it resting in the palm of your non-striking hand!

    I curious as to how this would improve the game?


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,665 ✭✭✭ Fann Linn


    Felexicon wrote: »
    I curious as to how this would improve the game?


    It wouldn't. People are just pulling crazy ideas outta the air now. And trying to turn football into hurling at the same time.
    Mad Ted.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,665 ✭✭✭ Fann Linn


    I think you need to do more than just reduce playing numbers. Their may be more space but teams will play same way. To improve things you need to tweak the rules of the game

    As already said making the pitch narrower makes defences stronger and the defensive focused teams far stronger.

    When Tyrone narrowed the pitch in Omagh, Jim Gavin stated that it just brought his forwards nearer to the goal.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,328 ✭✭✭ FastFullBack


    Been watching AFL the last few weeks and really like the mark. It really promotes 2 of the best facets of the game;kicking and high fielding.

    It could be something the GAA look at for football. After the mark you have 5 seconds to kick so it really shouldn’t slow the game down. It would really promote kicking which would reduce hand passing. It would also bring lots more high fielding into the game. Could it work?


  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 10,934 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Stoner


    It could be something the GAA look at for football. After the mark you have 5 seconds to kick so it really shouldn’t slow the game down. It would really promote kicking which would reduce hand passing. It would also bring lots more high fielding into the game. Could it work?

    There is already a mark from kickouts. It's been good, brought fielding back.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,328 ✭✭✭ FastFullBack


    Stoner wrote: »
    There is already a mark from kickouts. It's been good, brought fielding back.

    Was that there in championship this year?


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭ The Lost Sheep


    Was that there in championship this year?
    Yes and has been for few years


  • Registered Users Posts: 402 ✭✭ MattressRick


    Stoner wrote: »
    There is already a mark from kickouts. It's been good, brought fielding back.

    What about all over the field?


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭ The Lost Sheep


    Stoner wrote: »
    There is already a mark from kickouts. It's been good, brought fielding back.
    Its been good but should be able to call a mark all over the pitch not just from kick offs.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,328 ✭✭✭ FastFullBack


    Its been good but should be able to call a mark all over the pitch not just from kick offs.

    Ya I think all over the field should be looked at. It would be a radical change so will take time. But you can really see in AFL it promotes good accurate 20-30 foot passes. And obviously lots of great high fielding. Who wouldn't want this in football.

    I've heard there is talk of potentially trialling a mark inside the 21 if it's kicked from outside the 45, this is a start but really only promotes the Kieran donaghy style of football


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,749 ✭✭✭ Coillte_Bhoy


    naughtb4 wrote: »
    Is there any other sport that does it?

    Don't know tbh, but gaelic football is so difficult to referee anyway that adding this to the refs responsibilities would be crazy imo


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,280 ✭✭✭✭ bucketybuck


    To the best of my knowledge the tackle in GAA football is defined by the fact that you are supposed to tackle the ball, not the man. Block the ball, knock the ball out of the attackers hands, intercept the ball etc etc. Instead, we get multiple men surrounding a player and effectively punching his arms and body until he gets done for overcarrying, or boxing the player in on all sides without once even trying to touch the ball.

    You would immediately improve the game a thousand fold simply by enforcing that law. The whistle should go every single time a defender grabs an arm, grabs a shirt, kneels down on or wraps his arms around a player who is prone.

    As it stands it is far too easy for a defender to drag the attackers down to their level, and as such it makes no sense for weaker teams with weaker players to try and play through it. If the tackle was properly enforced it would immediately encourage faster and more mobile attackers, and weaker counties would try to develop those types of players instead of turning to the grinding defensive tactics that are the only leveller they have.

    The GAA don't need to invent any new rules or change numbers or anything like that, they just need to enforce the rule they have.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,920 ✭✭✭ freedominacup


    Change the football. Make it lighter. Make it easier for a defender to relieve pressure on his defence with a long clearance. Also increases the distance from which forwards can potentially score. Harder to mass defences over a bigger area.

    Rugby and soccer balls have changed utterly in the past 30 years but we sre still playing with the same ball that was used in the eighties.


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