9yr old boy kills himself due to anti-gay bullying

NIMAN

What a terribly sad story, 9yr old boy commited suicide due to being bullied at school for being gay.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-45323933

My own little boy is about to turn this age, and shocked he might even be aware of sexuality at this age, let alone being bullied enough to take his own life.

The world can be a tough place sometimes.

May he RIP.

suicide_circus

poor little chap. kids can be cruel. if it wasn't the gay thing it could have been anything else.

Noo

While it's absolutely horrific that this poor little chap saw this as the only solution....what 9 year old knows successful suicide techniques!? The whole situation is wrong on so many levels.

pleas advice

suicide_circus wrote: »

if it wasn't the gay thing it could have been anything else.

... and if not that, it could have been nothing else. Not meaning to be a cúnt, but mental health is a bitch of a thing, and it can **** you up for any reason or no reason at all

mvl

poor kiddo, @9 is also early puberty, they say higher rates of behavioral and emotional problems in boys; "proud to be ..." thingy guess can be a reflection of the media exposure.

- sometimes its better with no TV at all

monty_python

Too many things wrong with this story.
Why is a 9 year old aware of sexuality??
Why is he capable of suicide??

NIMAN

monty_python wrote: »

Too many things wrong with this story.
Why is a 9 year old aware of sexuality??
Why is he capable of suicide??

Thats kinda my point.
Why was he declaring himself gay at 9?
I know some kids mature faster than others, but that shocked me.

suicide_circus

.

Ave Sodalis

It's entirely possible a nine year old is aware of his sexuality. I had crushes by the time I was nine. It was fourth class in primary school, and there were kids who were "boyfriend and girlfriend" by then. Is it so unbelievable that a boy happened to mention to someone that he liked another boy?

suicide_circus

Ave Sodalis wrote: »

It's entirely possible a nine year old is aware of his sexuality. I had crushes by the time I was nine. It was fourth class in primary school, and there were kids who were "boyfriend and girlfriend" by then. Is it so unbelievable that a boy happened to mention to someone that he liked another boy?

can prepubescent kids "fancy" others? or are they just emulating behaviours? When I was 9 I certainly preferred the company of other boys but it was not an emotional or sexual preference. I also played kiss chasing with girls but I don't think that was hormonal in nature either. i dont know, im not qualified on the subject.

Ave Sodalis

suicide_circus wrote:

can prepubescent kids "fancy" others? or are they just emulating behaviours? When I was 9 I certainly preferred the company of other boys but it was not an emotional or sexual preference. I also played kiss chasing with girls but I don't think that was hormonal in nature either. i dont know, im not qualified on the subject.

It certainly wasn't sexual, but it wasn't to fit in or emulate others when many don't tell who they like, or if they like someone. There's nothing to suggest that this boy liked the other boy in a sexual way either, or any other way than a typical childhood crush.

Malayalam

What I can't understand is how suicide is such an ''option'' for kids nowadays. I see fairly regular reports of young teenagers committing suicide and the reason given is beyond trivial. What has happened to children to make them feel that life is not something to be fought for in the face of all trauma because it is precious ? A very good friend of mine committed suicide recently but by God they fought hard for years.

I wonder if the constant talk about suicide - which is supposed to de-stigmatise it - actually places it in the forefront of children's minds as an option. Suicide had a huge stigma when I was a kid - yes there were still suicides, but the shock and awe we felt as teens when we heard of a suicide was shockingly profound. 3 children in one of my lads classes killed themselves over the course of a couple of years, and a few more in the area in those same years. It was insane, a psychic contagion. The kids seemed to view it as a valid choice in some way. After one funeral I heard the mourning kids describe the ''beautiful grave'' - I nearly lost the rag altogether, but kept enough control to tell them no grave is beautiful.

People hate to hear this but I wonder if the roots are somewhere in the wider societal loss of a deeper metaphysical sense and meaning of what it is to be human.

Tragic for this poor child. Beyond tragic.

erica74

Malayalam wrote: »

What I can't understand is how suicide is such an ''option'' for kids nowadays. I see fairly regular reports of young teenagers committing suicide and the reason given is beyond trivial. What has happened to children to make them feel that life is not something to be fought for in the face of all trauma because it is precious ? A very good friend of mine committed suicide recently but by God they fought hard for years.

To you.
Also, bear in mind that the "reason" reported in the media or even in the locality where the person lived may be entirely incorrect.

mvl

Malayalam wrote: »

What I can't understand is how suicide is such an ''option'' for kids nowadays. I see fairly regular reports of young teenagers committing suicide and the reason given is beyond trivial. What has happened to children to make them feel that life is not something to be fought for in the face of all trauma because it is precious ? A very good friend of mine committed suicide recently but by God they fought hard for years.

I wonder if the constant talk about suicide - which is supposed to de-stigmatise it - actually places it in the forefront of children's minds as an option. Suicide had a huge stigma when I was a kid - yes there were still suicides, but the shock and awe we felt as teens when we heard of a suicide was shockingly profound. 3 children in one of my lads classes killed themselves over the course of a couple of years, and a few more in the area in those same years. It was insane, a psychic contagion. The kids seemed to view it as a valid choice in some way. After one funeral I heard the mourning kids describe the ''beautiful grave'' - I nearly lost the rag altogether, but kept enough control to tell them no grave is beautiful.

People hate to hear this but I wonder if the roots are somewhere in the wider societal loss of a deeper metaphysical sense and meaning of what it is to be human.

Tragic for this poor child. Beyond tragic.

8-10 years ago there was this "emo" craze among teenagers - more suicides were linked to that. dunno if that still exists - in what shape or form.

NIMAN

NIMAN wrote: »

Thats kinda my point.
Why was he declaring himself gay at 9?
I know some kids mature faster than others, but that shocked me.

I know I was gay since I was 8 years old we discover at a young age that we are different

Malayalam

mvl wrote: »

8-10 years ago there was this "emo" craze among teenagers - more suicides were linked to that. dunno if that still exists - in what shape or form.

Yes I suppose it was about 7 or 8 years ago. Horrific. For a while it felt like one funeral after another for children. Their poor parents looked like living ghosts. Unbearable for them.

suicide_circus

Malayalam wrote: »

What I can't understand is how suicide is such an ''option'' for kids nowadays. I see fairly regular reports of young teenagers committing suicide and the reason given is beyond trivial. What has happened to children to make them feel that life is not something to be fought for in the face of all trauma because it is precious ?

the article says he was bullied for just four days. that is an astonishingly quick turn around. one can only suspect other factors at play.

Gannicus

Malayalam wrote: »

What I can't understand is how suicide is such an ''option'' for kids nowadays. I see fairly regular reports of young teenagers committing suicide and the reason given is beyond trivial. What has happened to children to make them feel that life is not something to be fought for in the face of all trauma because it is precious ? A very good friend of mine committed suicide recently but by God they fought hard for years.

I wonder if the constant talk about suicide - which is supposed to de-stigmatise it - actually places it in the forefront of children's minds as an option. Suicide had a huge stigma when I was a kid - yes there were still suicides, but the shock and awe we felt as teens when we heard of a suicide was shockingly profound. 3 children in one of my lads classes killed themselves over the course of a couple of years, and a few more in the area in those same years. It was insane, a psychic contagion. The kids seemed to view it as a valid choice in some way. After one funeral I heard the mourning kids describe the ''beautiful grave'' - I nearly lost the rag altogether, but kept enough control to tell them no grave is beautiful.

People hate to hear this but I wonder if the roots are somewhere in the wider societal loss of a deeper metaphysical sense and meaning of what it is to be human.

Tragic for this poor child. Beyond tragic.

Quite possibly the most intelligent post I've read on Boards to date. I went to 3 lads I went to primary school with AND 3 more I went to secondary school with all committed suicide, The first 3 were in their pre-teen and early teenage years, the others were in their late teens (maybe 20 at the eldest).

in 2017 Ireland’s suicide rate is 10.3 (per 100,000) amongst adolescents aged between 15 and 19. We have the 4th highest rate of suicide (for teens) in the EU


Here are some scary stats regarding suicude rates for teens in ireland
LINK: https://www.nsrf.ie/statistics/suicide/

Annasopra

I'm shocked at the naivete that thinks kids know nothing about sexuality and suicide. Because of access to internet and tv kids know a huge amount nowadays.

I think many of you are forgetting what it's like as a young child when being "gay" is more of an unfocused insult. It applies to everything. It's not simply a sexual remark but an insult that comes across for every aspect of living. It's one of those things that boys experience that women are not going to understand. And it's likely something every boy experiences at one stage or another with different results.

The problem here is three fold.

First, is the access to the internet. That medium is uncensored and feeds off the weak, or the ignorant(in terms of knowledge). For every nice or supporting website, there are dozens which are mean spirited or designed to promote rather dubious allegations. Kids nowadays have full access to the internet. Parents provide phones, and wifi is common. There is little to no observation about what the kids are looking at. I've seen the same with my nieces when they were of a similar age. Instagram, facebook, and a host of other apps with little regard for the ages/maturity of those viewing them. There is also the aspect of being able to search for suicide techniques, or even to be convinced that suicide is even an option.

Then, there's Social Media. I think we can all agree just how "toxic" SM is. But kids don't have the filter yet, that tells them that this is BS and that is "reasonable". The level of citicism that is involved in SM, along with identity politics is just disgusting.

Lastly, the changes in our society about sexuality, gender, etc. As some have said earlier, the gender debate might be a factor, although I personally doubt it. However, this rush to make everything sexual acceptable is extremely short-sighted with often conflicting opinions about what should happen. Again, as adults, we have the filter to weed out the retarded opinions, and our life experience prepares us to resist many of the oddball comments, but children don't have that defense.

We, as a society, really need to be putting more importance on the time children spend as... children. To not provide them with a medium like the internet which is aimed at adults, but giving children free access. It's like handing a kid fire, telling them (not explaining) to not burn anything, and then leaving them alone to have tea with your friends for a few hours.

As for sexuality or being aware of being gay at 9 years old, I'm calling BS. You might be aware that you "like" boys but there's nothing sexual for the vast majority. Your balls haven't dropped, you likely haven't any real experience and the only real influence is external. That you're being made to believe your attraction by others, and by the media (internet included) who seem to believe everyone should choose as early as possible.

Now, no doubt, many posters here will get emotional and accuse me (and others) of being insensitive about the situation. However, I would suggest we would be better off discussing how we can protect children in the future, rather than thumping out chests in objections.

When something like this happens, we should be stepping forward to acknowledge that our society is not perfect, that all these social changes have been rather short-sighted, and that we should be considering how to minimize the risks to those vulnerable.

Malayalam

Gannicus wrote: »

3 lads I went to primary school with AND 3 more I went to secondary school with all committed suicide, The first 3 were in their pre-teen and early teenage years, the others were in their late teens (maybe 20 at the eldest).

in 2017 Ireland’s suicide rate is 10.3 (per 100,000) amongst adolescents aged between 15 and 19. We have the 4th highest rate of suicide (for teens) in the EU


Here are some scary stats regarding suicude rates for teens in ireland
LINK: https://www.nsrf.ie/statistics/suicide/

You have seen it so, when they die one after another. Terrible. Maybe that obscures ones assessment of the situation because while those stats are bad (that Ireland is 4th in EU) unexpectedly I see there that the rates overall are dropping. Am surprised and relieved.

I love the "You're using this kid's death to push an agenda" stuff when the entire purpose of it is to push an agenda. I pointed the hypocrisy out at the time when August Ames died, the whole "Oh we don't know if that's what it really was" whereas now the same people will accept a stated cause right from the get-go.

Malayalam

Deleted User wrote: »

It's one of those things that boys experience that women are not going to understand. And it's likely something every boy experiences at one stage or another with different results.

.......................

Kids nowadays have full access to the internet. Parents provide phones, and wifi is common. There is little to no observation about what the kids are looking at.

I agree with some and disagree with some of your post. But just on these 2 points. My oldest was horrifically bullied with homophobic taunts as a very young child (6 or 7 years) - both verbally and with physical actions mimicking sex, and having failed to solve it despite enormous efforts on my part, I home schooled him thereafter. It is a terrible and insidious part of childhood bullying which is swept completely under the carpet. I don't know what has happened to the bullies that they become such evil little fcuks at some incredibly young ages. On the point about the internet I have recently heard - though I wont be researching it - that Tumblr contains within it a cesspit of violent porn aimed at teens and pre teens, and some have said the depictions available to children there are almost unimaginably perverse. I use Tumblr for the lovely pictures available there as I work at digital art, and have never seen such - but others have attested to it.

Malayalam

Malayalam wrote: »

I agree with some and disagree with some of your post. But just on these 2 points. My oldest was horrifically bullied with homophobic taunts as a very young child (6 or 7 years) - both verbally and with physical actions mimicing sex, and having failed to solve it despite enormous efforts on my part, I home schooled him thereafter. It is a terrible and insidious part of childhood bullying which is swept completely under the carpet.

It's not swept under the carpet... not really, since many schools have tried to bring in measures to reduce bullying in schools, but what can you really do?

I, too, was bullied as a child with comments about being gay. Children don't really have such a wide range of insults to use, and being Gay factors quite highly. Children are often vindictive little ****s, but glorious angels at the same time. It's the way of childhood.

I don't know what has happened to the bullies that they become such evil little fcuks at some incredibly young ages. On the point about the internet I have recently heard - though I wont be researching it - that Tumblr contains within it a cesspit of violent porn aimed at teens and pre teens, and some have said the depictions available to children there are almost unimaginably perverse. I use Tumblr for the lovely pictures available there as I work at digital art, and have never seen such - but others have attested to it.

Dunno. I limit my SM exposure, because I really found it all to be so negative. Even the articles/comments which are, on the surface, supporting/positive, all tend to have an agenda behind them with rather suggestive language. Then the comments after are usually complete muck.

My niece had access to twitter at 7 years old through her fathers phone when he was cooking the dinner. Yay. That makes sense.

mvl

Deleted User wrote: »

I think many of you are forgetting what it's like as a young child when being "gay" is more of an unfocused insult. It applies to everything. It's not simply a sexual remark but an insult that comes across for every aspect of living. It's one of those things that boys experience that women are not going to understand. And it's likely something every boy experiences at one stage or another with different results.

actually my one came from school one day saying that a boy started calling her and her friend lesbians. she was 9 at the time, not sure what class was the boy in, but older; and this is a good school in town, but the education some kids are getting from ... older siblings, internet, TV, is just outrageous.
So, I think another major problem is that parents are so little present in their children's lives - as ppl are too busy paying their mortgage, or staying on social media... this is one important thing that needs changing imo.

Deleted User wrote: »

As for sexuality or being aware of being gay at 9 years old, I'm calling BS. You might be aware that you "like" boys but there's nothing sexual for the vast majority. Your balls haven't dropped, you likely haven't any real experience and the only real influence is external. That you're being made to believe your attraction by others, and by the media (internet included) who seem to believe everyone should choose as early as possible.

tbh would not agree with this - have a read at this
https://www.kidshealth.org.nz/sexual-behaviour-children-and-young-people

Deleted User wrote: »

However, I would suggest we would be better off discussing how we can protect children in the future, rather than thumping out chests in objections.

When something like this happens, we should be stepping forward to acknowledge that our society is not perfect, that all these social changes have been rather short-sighted, and that we should be considering how to minimize the risks to those vulnerable.

+1

- personally I am looking forward to hear smartphones are banned from schools. we don't intend to get one for our young one, but so many kids in class already have them.

meeeeh

I'll let the usual crowd to fight the whole gender fluidity, gay, SJW thing. However I have a nine year old at home and while he is probably a bit more naive and immature than many boys his age I still can't lose the feeling that the nine year old was somehow let down by adults in his life. Blaming kids for suicide because of 4 days of bullying at school is irresponsible. The question would have to be why the kid didn't feel comfortable to go to his parents or teachers about bullying, how did he commit suicide and how did he know how to commit suicide. This story makes a great title but frankly I think the gay angle is covering for other failures.

Malayalam

mvl wrote: »

actually my one came from school one day saying that a boy started calling her and her friend lesbians. she was 9 at the time, not sure what class was the boy in, but older; and this is a good school in town, but the education some kids are getting from ... older siblings, internet, TV, is just outrageous.
So, I think another major problem is that parents are so little present in their children's lives - as ppl are too busy paying their mortgage, or staying on social media... this is one important thing that needs changing imo.

This is it. The idea that children are inherently evil/angelic by turn doesn't cut it with me. There is environmental influence. Children who will psychopathically bully another child did not lick it up off the ground.

Mr. CooL ICE

Mod: Reopened and thread cleaned up

jacksie66

This post has been deleted.

mvl

mvl wrote: »

actually my one came from school one day saying that a boy started calling her and her friend lesbians. she was 9 at the time, not sure what class was the boy in, but older; and this is a good school in town, but the education some kids are getting from ... older siblings, internet, TV, is just outrageous.
So, I think another major problem is that parents are so little present in their children's lives - as ppl are too busy paying their mortgage, or staying on social media... this is one important thing that needs changing imo.

Completely agree.

tbh would not agree with this - have a read at this
https://www.kidshealth.org.nz/sexual-behaviour-children-and-young-people

Well, your link relates to a business who makes money from their research (although there's no actual access to the research findings or the details on how the research was done).

My problem with modern psychology is that it makes itself relevant. It's a business. A very profitable business which they have an interest in promoting to make it more important, and necessary. It's really scary how quickly Psychology has moved from a dodgy, almost pop science, to being widely accepted in just a few decades... while still having questionable research techniques or assumptions along with the usual biases.

- personally I am looking forward to hear smartphones are banned from schools. we don't intend to get one for our young one, but so many kids in class already have them.

Agreed. My Dad has an 'old' nokia. No smartphone for him. Perfect for messages, and making phone calls. Why aren't children receiving the same? Although to be fair, we also need the same attitude to tablets like Ipads.

challengemaster

Noo wrote: »

what 9 year old knows successful suicide techniques!?

It doesn't take a genius to figure out a few methods. Having internet proficiency isn't the cause, it just takes less time to figure it out now.

Kids between 8 - 12 are eligible for CTYI. In case you're not aware what that is, it's summer camp for really smart kids (advanced abstract, numerical and verbal reasoning skills) where they get taught material probably suitable for JC level or slightly above. 9 year olds aren't as dumb as you'd like to assume they are.

Malayalam wrote: »

What has happened to children to make them feel that life is not something to be fought for in the face of all trauma because it is precious ?

In short - Bullying. This child may have only been 9, but none of us know if for the last 5 years (assuming they start school around 4-5 in US too) if he's had a single day where he wasn't bullied. Maybe that wasn't the case here, but it is the case for some kids. For some every single day of their childhood is torture because they have to deal with physical or emotional bullying every single day.

Now you tell me, if by the time you're 9 and you've experienced that sort of shít every day for most of your life already - what do you think there is to live for? Telling adults "things will get better" doesn't work, so why do we think it would for kids?

What I don't understand why the schools don't take a simple three-step approach to bullying.

(1) Don't do it and if they do there will be consequences.

(2) A proper education about bullying as in an examination of human behaviour such as the routs of the sadistic impulse to bully and why some put other down to make themselves feel better and so on. That might be painful and difficult.

(3) motive means and opportunity. As motive seem to be part of human nature there is not a lot that can be done about it, however, there is a lot that can be done with means and opportunity.

meeeeh

challengemaster wrote: »

Now you tell me, if by the time you're 9 and you've experienced that sort of shít every day for most of your life already - what do you think there is to live for? Telling adults "things will get better" doesn't work, so why do we think it would for kids?

If a kid at nine experienced that sort of stuff for five years then adults in his life weren't doing their job. Yes he could have been super intelligent but how many nine year old kids commit suicide? He could have been more aware of his sexuality than an average 9 year old and another link also claims he wanted to dress in more girly clothes. His mother also states he told her he wants to come out to his class mates because he is proud of being gay.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/9-year-old-denver-boy-dies-by-suicide-after-being-bullied-at-school-mother-says/

I don't know it just seems to myself a 9 year old was left to deal with issues above his ability to process on his own. I'm not denying there was bullying but I suspect there is some level of bullying in every school and it's a bit early to make a judgement it was all because of other kids. I' not going to blame his mother (parents) but the whole coming out to other kids thing just doesn't sit right with me. As parent I would want to supervise that myself somehow at that age and I would want to talk to school first.

Neyite

Bullying terrifies me. I was chronically bullied for a large part of childhood. Theoretically I was bullied for my glasses, hair colour, physical appearance, but as an adult I can see that if I had perfect vision, different hair or whatever, the bullies would have found something - anything- as a 'reason' to bully. If they could find nothing, I'm sure they would have settled on me being gay even if I wasn't.

Bullies bully because they themselves are unhappy, and because of dysfunction in their own lives. They bully because the adults in their lives aren't vigilant enough, or play down the bad behaviour, or because the school has a lax punishment policy for low level harassment. They bully because they can. A bullied child having to go into the arena of their torture daily and their self esteem and mental health as the bullies continue picking on your kid for months or years without punishment from anyone would drive a child to despair.

The trouble is that mental health resources for our children are pretty much non-existent. So while teachers or parents might see the child being troubled by something, accessing the professional help in a timely manner is very difficult. It's also difficult to achieve quick results in curtailing the bullying but it's about time that schools have a zero tolerance for any bullying starting from low level stuff all the way up. You might get the asshole parents stepping up to address it if they know that their kid is risking expulsion.

Lux23

I knew I was straight at 9, why wouldn't someone know they were gay? The attitudes displayed here are precisely why this little boy was bullied so intensely.

claregal1

monty_python wrote: »

Too many things wrong with this story.
Why is a 9 year old aware of sexuality??
Why is he capable of suicide??

I agree ...I have a friend who said to me recently that her 10 yo child told her that she was bi-sexual ... I was shocked to be honest that her child even knew by bi was , cos I know my own kids didn't even know what bi was until they were in their teens ....

meeeeh

Lux23 wrote: »

I knew I was straight at 9, why wouldn't someone know they were gay? The attitudes displayed here are precisely why this little boy was bullied so intensely.

Do you know he was bullied so intensely? His mother claims he told to his sister kids told him to kill himself. His mother who did not know about it at the time told a radio programme, school is doing counselling but investigation is still ongoing and at the moment foul play is ruled out. It's way too little information to make any kind of conclusion. A 9 year old committing a suicide is tragedy but do you really want to hold other nine year olds responsible without some investigation? And if it was parents of supposed bullies who were negligent then it's entirely possible that parents of the victim were also negligent.

aroundthehouse

I dont know which I find more shocking, the fact that he felt he was gay at 9 or that he knew how to commit suicide or that he even knew what suicide was? is this the way it is for kids now? where is their childhood gone? bullying is awful just awful but its been an issue since God was a gossin, there is no way sexuality should even come into the sphere in a 9 year olds life and there is no way a 9 year old should even know what suicide is, presumably this is a result of the tech age we live in now where all these things are available to kids at the touch of a button, back in my day a 9 year olds life expanded no further than the playground, i think its time we seriously looked at doing what we do with alcohol and put an age cap on kids access to the internet until they are at least 12

A parent was telling me about how they had decided to be open about a lot of things with their 7-year-old child, the child was a put out because of an expensive experience another child had got, now the parent of the child could not afford the same experience for their child.

Instead of the parent feeling guilty they could not afford the experience, instead of telling the child to be grateful for all they have etc.

They sat down and named the emotion for the child and told the child they were experience jealousy and they discussed jealousy and it worked instead of letting the child internalising the feeling of jealousy.

That is the level it has to start at.

farmerwifelet

It is a tragedy but the thing that struck me was he went to the first day of school wearing fake nails after deciding to come out as gay. Should his parents not have told him to be gay if he wants but to not make himself a target by wearing nails? My daughter wanted to wear something to school a while back can't remember what it was but I said no because it could single her out for ridicule. Kids can be little horrors so I tell her to wear what she likes at home but in school to be a little more careful. It's unfair but prudent to prepare her for the fact that bullies are out there.

meeeeh

aroundthehouse wrote: »

I dont know which I find more shocking, the fact that he felt he was gay at 9 or that he knew how to commit suicide or that he even knew what suicide was? is this the way it is for kids now? where is their childhood gone? bullying is awful just awful but its been an issue since God was a gossin, there is no way sexuality should even come into the sphere in a 9 year olds life and there is no way a 9 year old should even know what suicide is, presumably this is a result of the tech age we live in now where all these things are available to kids at the touch of a button, back in my day a 9 year olds life expanded no further than the playground, i think its time we seriously looked at doing what we do with alcohol and put an age cap on kids access to the internet until they are at least 12

I was 9 year old more than 30 years ago and I remember gay jokes flying around, we already came across pornography and I had crushes on other boys. So did my school mates. That was long before internet. In a way I think my kids are more sheltered than I was at their age but I'm pretty sure every child can come across feelings about their sexuality or similar at that age.

aroundthehouse

farmerwifelet wrote: »

It is a tragedy but the thing that struck me was he went to the first day of school wearing fake nails after deciding to come out as gay. Should his parents not have told him to be gay if he wants but to not make himself a target by wearing nails? My daughter wanted to wear something to school a while back can't remember what it was but I said no because it could single her out for ridicule. Kids can be little horrors so I tell her to wear what she likes at home but in school to be a little more careful. It's unfair but prudent to prepare her for the fact that bullies are out there.

I agree and also they should have tried to put the whole gay thing out of his head until he was actually old enough to know if he really was gay or not, he could well have turned out to not be gay, how the heck would he know at 9

razorblunt

aroundthehouse wrote: »

I agree and also they should have tried to put the whole gay thing out of his head until he was actually old enough to know if he really was gay or not, he could well have turned out to not be gay, how the heck would he know at 9

There's already one poster on this thread who stated they knew they were gay at 8 years old so its not entirely impossible.

aroundthehouse

razorblunt wrote: »

There's already one poster on this thread who stated they knew they were gay at 8 years old so its not entirely impossible.

but they havent even hit puberty at that age, crazy

aroundthehouse

aroundthehouse wrote: »

but they havent even hit puberty at that age, crazy

Your equating being gay or straight with the physical act of sex and forgetting about the emotional internal world of the child, being gay or straight is not just about sex.

aroundthehouse

when we were kids, there was always a bit of the old blue talk, if a kid was a bit different or gay there wouldnt have been a problem just it would have been harder for them to join in on the banter, its shocking to think at 9 years old it ends in suicide

challengemaster

farmerwifelet wrote: »

Should his parents not have told him to be gay if he wants but to not make himself a target by wearing nails? My daughter wanted to wear something to school a while back can't remember what it was but I said no because it could single her out for ridicule. Kids can be little horrors

Perhaps instead of telling kids not to "make themselves a target", we should stop the bullying instead?

Same sort of victim blaming nonsense with rape and people "making themselves a target".

Wibbs

Lux23 wrote: »

I knew I was straight at 9, why wouldn't someone know they were gay?

+1. Even as a kid in the distant 1970's where this kinda thing was rarely if ever discussed and I certainly wouldn't have known or understood the labels kids likely would today, I instinctively knew I was "normal" for the real want of a better word.

A lad I know from the same time who is gay told me while he didn't have the labels either, he instinctively knew he was "different". If anything he reckons he knew before straight guys. He's not the only gay guy who has told me that actually. That they knew from early on, long before puberty kicked in that they didn't quite fit in. That when puberty came along it brought confusion, but also some explanation.

Other young kids can often spot the kids that don't quite fit in too. Again in my childhood where we didn't know the labels I remember two lads who were thought of and often singled out for being "sissies" or "puffters" because they were more effeminate than background.

That said and though the anti bullying thing was little thought of unless it ended up in a physical fight that was caught by teachers or parents - and even then the usual thing was "shake hands and move on" - those two kids I mentioned weren't bullied to nearly the same degree I hear about today. Though we didn't have as many avenues like social media etc to do it anonymously and/or to build groups of bullies.

On the suicide thing. I wouldn't have even had a clue what that was at 9. My first encounter with the subject would have been towards the end of my teens, when I knew of two people who attempted it(thankfully didn't succeed).

Hector Bellend

So many questions.

Mr. CooL ICE

I fancied the pants off Belinda Carlisle when I was 5

challengemaster

meeeeh wrote: »

If a kid at nine experienced that sort of stuff for five years then adults in his life weren't doing their job.

Some adults, sure. Teachers are well known to turn a blind eye. Be it favouritism, relatives, not caring or knowing that the parents of the bully don't actually care enough to do anything so they don't intervene. Schools (at least in Ireland) won't expel for almost any reason. The education dept. can be one massive facilitator of bullying as it stands.

Parents usually don't know because the kid hides it from them, or if they do know there's not a lot they can do. Again, the only action open to parents usually is to confront the other childs parents. If the bullies parents don't care, there's not a lot else that can happen. Gardaí don't care because of age, there is no other place to turn to or nothing else you can do about it.

You can say the adults in these kids lives aren't doing their job, in most cases they've already exhausted every option but the way things stand there's virtually no punishment or repercussions for a bully through any avenue.