The Curse of Defective Concrete (Mica, Pyrrhotite, etc.) in Donegal homes - Read Mod warning Post 1

Penfailed

malinheader wrote: »

The link seems to be deleted now. Must of been interesting.

Roughly, from memory -

Cassidy: "This is Cassidys. What would it take for all this to go away?"
Diver: "Close the gates."
Cassidy: "You want the whole place shut down, aye?"
Diver: *goes off on one about withheld numbers and calling him out for prank calls and telling him to man up and so on...*
Cassidy: "I hope your house falls down round you, ye ugly c*nt."

Commercial suicide.

malinheader

Penfailed wrote: »

Roughly, from memory -

Cassidy: "This is Cassidys. What would it take for all this to go away?"
Diver: "Close the gates."
Cassidy: "You want the whole place shut down, aye?"
Diver: *goes off on one about withheld numbers and calling him out for prank calls and telling him to man up and so on...*
Cassidy: "I hope your house falls down round you, ye ugly c*nt."

Commercial suicide.

Hopefully it is. And hopefully it's his business that falls down round him.
"What would it take for this to go away". I bet he's used this line alot in his years in business

Penfailed

malinheader wrote: »

"What would it take for this to go away". I bet he's used this line alot in his years in business

The thing is, it was one of the young Cassidys. From what I've heard, he's only 17.

NIMAN

Yeah think so.

We all did stupid things as kids, this is similar.

I'm sure he got ripped a new one by the family
He since apologised.

NIMAN

Good to see plenty of the signs up around the area.
Hopefully they can get plenty more made up and keep the heat on!

I heard PD last night on a video clip almost angling more towards the 100% redress and away from the 'Close Cassidys'.
I know of a couple of folk who have said is it fair to put workers out of their jobs for the sins of their bosses?
Perhaps people have said this to Mr Diver too?

I would agree a bit....100% redress is the No1 priority now for this campaign.

Are we going to the protest tomorrow? I am, and I hope it all passes off with no bad publicity. I hope to see everyone in masks and socially distanced. You know if not, it'll be reported negatively.

Swindled

NIMAN wrote: »

Good to see plenty of the signs up around the area.
Hopefully they can get plenty more made up and keep the heat on!

I heard PD last night on a video clip almost angling more towards the 100% redress and away from the 'Close Cassidys'.
I know of a couple of folk who have said is it fair to put workers out of their jobs for the sins of their bosses?
Perhaps people have said this to Mr Diver too?

I would agree a bit....100% redress is the No1 priority now for this campaign.

Are we going to the protest tomorrow? I am, and I hope it all passes off with no bad publicity. I hope to see everyone in masks and socially distanced. You know if not, it'll be reported negatively.

The Leinster Government / Civil service will only be too delighted if people focus their main efforts on Cassidys. The main priority should be revamp of the whole scheme, and the many aspects of the scheme that are not fit for purpose, not just the 90 / 100 % clause. If the people settle for a partial fix of the scheme, that's exactly what they will give them. And laugh how handy that was all the way back to Leinster. Whatever changes are agreed this time, are likely to be the last shot at this.

Penfailed

I'll be there with my family. I'm hoping for a massive turnout. The focus should, quite rightly, be for 100% redress as there's only a small window of opportunity to get it over the line. The Cassidys issue can be the long game.

DrPhilG

I think Diver made a wise choice to calm things down with regards to the Cassidys. Following that Facebook group, there are some absolute idiots on there and it was only a matter of time before something turned violent.

md23040

I have a holiday home in an small apartment complex and spent €20k fixing Mica in 2019 but it has since developed in another section. Exactly the same job but the price quoted in November last year has now been requoted at €32k. I know the price of materials has recently increased but the builders are gouging due to expected demand.

I cannot understand why the government has decided to cover residential holders only. Why differentiate and discriminate in a negligence case?

NIMAN

md23040 wrote: »

I cannot understand why the government has decided to cover residential holders only. Why differentiate and discriminate in a negligence case?

I think it was simply another condition they added in to help limit their outlay.

But you are correct. Simply because it's a holiday home and not your primary residence, why should it be excluded from redress?

Swindled

Bumping up the "grant" to 100% will be the simplistic and relatively cheap fix the Politicians / Leinster government / civil service will eventually propose after enough pressure. They will also expect us to be all pleased and grateful about it like good Donegal peasants. All that is going to achieve is to bump up the prices another 10%, while they get off scott free on all the other scheme flaws.

Penfailed

Swindled wrote: »

Bumping up the "grant" to 100% will be the simplistic and relatively cheap fix the Politicians / Leinster government / civil service will eventually propose after enough pressure. They will also expect us to be all pleased and grateful about it like good Donegal peasants. All that is going to achieve is to bump up the prices another 10%, while they get off scott free on all the other scheme flaws.

It should be parity with pyrite.

Swindled

Penfailed wrote: »

It should be parity with pyrite.

Then every single term, condition, clause, comma and full stop in the Pyrite scheme's terms and conditions needs to be examined extremely carefully and thought through at every level before settling for that, and we need to ensure it will resolve all of the difficulties people are experiencing, not just some of them.
If the Leinster government / civil service spot any nice little future get out clauses / loopholes for themselves to Donegal's disadvantage in Pyrite scheme, Donegal will have shot itself in the foot again. No one should underestimate how shrewd(not in a good way) and manipulative these people are, and their disdain for Donegal.

Penfailed

Swindled wrote: »

Then every single term, condition, clause, comma and full stop in the Pyrite scheme's terms and conditions needs to be examined extremely carefully and thought through at every level before settling for that, and we need to ensure it will resolve all of the difficulties people are experiencing, not just some of them.
If the Leinster government / civil service spot any nice little future get out clauses / loopholes for themselves to Donegal's disadvantage in Pyrite scheme, Donegal will have shot itself in the foot again. No one should underestimate how shrewd(not in a good way) and manipulative these people are, and their disdain for Donegal.

You are making very valid points. What are you doing about it?

Swindled

Penfailed wrote: »

You are making very valid points. What are you doing about it?

It's not about me, but if you must know, I'm doing a few things, which I'm not going into here. I'm posting here to raise awareness of some of the points being missed. The more people aware of these, and insisting the politicians of Donegal come together and actually do something about these and any other points and stop missing them/skipping over them, the better for us all. Failing that, if they don't produce the goods soon, I think the next option is to move onto single issue election candidates, which has worked over the years for other issues. The Politicians and Parties, especially in Inishowen and Letterkenny will soon have to get the finger out then. ( And no I have no interest in the horseshyte of politics before anyone tries to claim otherwise, and I couldn't care less who gets/takes credit for sorting it as long as it's sorted ).

The peaceful parts of the Cassidy protests have been good for raising awareness and helping in stopping any more houses being affected. Full energy can be put into the Cassidy situation when we have the scheme that will fix or replace our Donegal houses properly and compensate Donegal people properly. If the Cassidy protests turn ugly however (and watch out that some might even do that just to blacken the protests), it will only hamper our chances.

I would urge everyone and their families to email / write to / speak to their Councillors and TD's and make it the No.1 issue in the county, while the momentum and will is now here.

RobMc59

Some extensive coverage of the protests today in Donegal on many newsfeeds which include ITV here in the UK

NIMAN

Very successful protest today.

I have yet to check to see if it's been on any Irish news. I think I heard RTE had played down the numbers.

But need to keep the pressure on. Great to see so many masks and t-shirts getting the message out front and centre. I'll be buying one of each as soon as I see them for sale.


Edit:
I'd say there was definitely more than 2000 at it.

https://www.rte.ie/news/regional/2021/0522/1223230-mayo-pyrite-protest/

malinheader

NIMAN wrote: »

Very successful protest today.

I have yet to check to see if it's been on any Irish news. I think I heard RTE had played down the numbers.

But need to keep the pressure on. Great to see so many masks and t-shirts getting the message out front and centre. I'll be buying one of each as soon as I see them for sale.

I was thinking this myself, I wouldn't be expecting much coverage from rte unless to bad mouth Donegal for covid numbers . Hopefully I'm wrong. Unbelievable numbers today hopefully gets results.

DrPhilG

Think there were about 500 in Letterkenny. Saw some video from Buncrana and it looked huge.

Penfailed

I spoke to a guard at the bottom of the Main Street in Buncrana as he had watched most of the march pass by. I was quite far back so most of it had passed his location by the time I got there. He estimated 5-6,000 people. RTE - 2,000

NIMAN

Fair play to TG4, it was their lead story last night.

Penfailed

NIMAN wrote: »

Fair play to TG4, it was their lead story last night.

...and RTE didn't mention it in their news.

NIMAN

Penfailed wrote: »

...and RTE didn't mention it in their news.

And even itv.com have it listed

https://www.itv.com/news/utv/2021-05-19/donegal-homeowners-protest-over-defective-building-blocks

Shame on RTE.

muffler

NIMAN wrote: »

And even itv.com have it listed

https://www.itv.com/news/utv/2021-05-19/donegal-homeowners-protest-over-defective-building-blocks

Shame on RTE.

In fairness it is up on their website but they could have done more though.

Penfailed

muffler wrote: »

In fairness it is up on their website but they could have done more though.

One of the largest gatherings of people in Ireland in over a year and it didn't make the 6pm or 9pm news. Absolute disgrace.

DrPhilG

muffler wrote: »

In fairness it is up on their website but they could have done more though.

On their website but downplayed the numbers I believe.

Scoundrels.

muffler

Did RTE even have cameras and crews at the demonstrations?

Swindled

The Irish media are largely controlled by a relatively few owners, therefore they do not have to fully report all the facts / story, as there is very little competition.

RTÉ in theory are the public service broadcaster, and in theory should be more independent/reliable, as the don’t rely on owners and advertising for finance.

RTÉ in practice are controlled by the Leinster Regime, for the benefit of the Leinster Regime. So, in practice, don’t expect much from them unless it is to the benefit the Leinster regime.

[Leinster in one way or another, has always controlled the power in Ireland, and always despised the Irish Gael, as any sign of a united Irish native is a threat to Leinster’s power, but that’s for another day]

The large turnout and support, will however get noticed by Donegal's politicians, and that is what we want/need to notice above all else.

Swindled

It's all about understanding the FLOW OF POWER in Ireland, how it works, and who controls that Power.

I apologise for the long post/read, but it’s important to understand how power flows down in Ireland if we want the Mica issue resolved . . .

[Now before anyone tries it, I’m not a supporter of any particular political party or politician or politics. I could not care less who is in power / gets in power / gets any credit, if the Mica issue is sorted]

The original MICA redress scheme was signed into effect and announced by the Minister of Finance Pascal Donohue on Friday 31st January 2020, not to aid effected homeowners, but in order to aid the general election outcome on Saturday 8 February 2020. Nothing Else.

The principal holders of actual political power in Ireland in practice, is the Taoiseach, and the Minister of Finance (he who pays the pipers calls the tunes). Due to the party whip system, the rest of the TD's and Ministers in practice do not have any. They are told what to do, when to do it, and how to vote on every dail motion, and must do so or will be ejected from the party.

After the Leinster Government, the remaining practical power in Ireland is divided between the Leinster civil service (the permanent government), Leinster media, and Leinster academia, and the largest corporations.
The Leinster civil service control the funding and resources given to County Councils and therefore everything they can do and can't do, and the policy they must comply with.
The Leinster Government, has control over senior civil service appointments and promotions, and therefore has control and influence over the Leinster Civil service.

(The EU [or rather who controls the EU] are actually in charge above all of this, but that's for another day. The EU don't care what the Leinster government do or don't do, about "local" matters in Ireland such as Mica. Though they do care about EU elections)

Only one thing will force their hand: The next general election, or more importantly, the feared outcome of the next general election.
As we all know, the number of TD's determines which parties share power and to what extent for the next 5 years. Every seat counts at that moment in time. The important point here is: That's the ONLY TIME the result of the 5 TD's elected in Donegal, or what they want, matter one iota to those scrambling to be Taoiseach. Therefore, the reality is, the ONLY TIME any of us, and our issues matter, is the day we vote, and for whom.

Depending on turnout etc., approx. 6,000 first preference votes will elect a TD for Donegal.

So, more importantly, how can we use this knowledge to help us get the Mica issue properly addressed in Donegal?

Well, it should form basis of the only effective tactics that will lead to a successful reform of the Mica scheme, what is that?

1) Regular awareness, peaceful demonstrations / protests, and regular peaceful representations to Donegal politicians about Mica, why? because it proves and continually reminds the politicians in Donegal that there ARE VOTES in MICA (you must remember votes, and what gets them, or loses them, is the only thing a politician, and their party bosses, really need to worry about)

2) Do those in power have to do a single thing about Mica before the next election? or spend money on Mica that they could spend more effectively elsewhere to consolidate and retain their power? The answer is No. So how do we perhaps force their hand before the next election? The only way, is to demand real united action immediately from Donegal’s TD’s, or face the prospect of two SINGLE ACTION, MICA REDRESS ONLY candidates getting off the ground and building support for the next election.
Two candidates, one on each side of Lough Swilly have a chance of taking away 6,000 votes each, especially the candidate on the Inishowen side, and perhaps the candidate on the western side of the Swilly, if he/she is well enough known beforehand.

I’m not suggesting people effected by Mica do put forward single issue candidates yet, but the fear of them getting off the ground, might be enough to stoke some action from above now before the next election.


3) If none of this works, and even for one reason or another the general election pressure / outcome does not work, what then? Is there anything left to do?

The only thing remaining at that point, with no guarantee of success is well organised Mass Civil disobedience in Donegal (similar to the water charges fiasco). I don’t endorse this btw, before anyone tries to accuse me of anything.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_disobedience#:~:text=Civil%20disobedience%20is%20the%20active,peaceful%20protests%20or%20nonviolent%20resistance.

NIMAN

Some interesting thoughts.

A little thing that is gnawing at me now is SFs supposed concern for Mica homeowners.

We had Mary Lou raising it in the Dail, and their Donegal personnel are getting great praise by the leaders of this campaign, but (and correct me if I'm wrong here) have they only become interested in the last few weeks? I don't think I seen SF talk much in Dublin about Mica until this new campaign started?

Are they just jumping on the bandwagon in the hope of attracting all the votes from those affected?