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Is this a common attitude towards fatherhood in Ireland?

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Comments

  • #2


    Wanderer78 wrote: »
    Should women be the default minder, and since its a full time job, should they be paid accordingly?

    Paid by who?


  • #2


    splinter65 wrote: »
    Is there something wrong with being at home minding kids and doing housework?

    It's a far tougher job than going to work tbh.

    *dad with 3 kids


  • #2


    Igotadose wrote: »
    Seems like Ireland needs some laws guaranteeing income for the abandoned partner, alimony, child support, whatever. Coming from the US, the number of women whose partner has disappeared and doesn't provide a cent of care is astounding. And even if there are such laws, they need enforcement - garnishing wages, fines, imprisonment.

    .


    Abandoned? Its a way of life and strategic game plan for many. Supported by a lazy government who facilitarates and rewards them and refuses to provide the resources to police their fraudelent claims or make their partners pay for their offspring by stopping paymwets at source from their salaries or dole - or investigating their incomes. iIn many casrs there is an institutional intergenerational refusal to work or pay your way in society. Abandoned my Áras. Ask the CEO of the so called Dublin' homeless ' authority -the formula is well known and utterly abused.

    And for the no doubt long gone OP - you married into an old (aged) traditional Catholic family - 8 kids 70 year old in-laws - did you expect them to change ?! Habbits of a lifetime are rarely changed by in-laws and that model of a father providing and a hardworking stay at home mother is hardly unusual -nor the concept that one goes out to work and brings home the £, and the others work is the home and the children with everything financially provided for. Not an unusual model.


  • #2


    Abandoned? Its a way of life and strategic game plan for many. Supported by a lazy government who facilitarates and rewards them and refuses to provide the resources to police their fraudelent claims or make their partners pay for their offspring by stopping paymwets at source from their salaries or dole - or investigating their incomes. iIn many casrs there is an institutional intergenerational refusal to work or pay your way in society. Abandoned my Áras. Ask the CEO of the so called Dublin' homeless ' authority -the formula is well know and utterly abused.

    Unfortunately without data I can't confirm what you're saying, but every governmental system has corruption. Sadly, the government here have abdicated the responsibility to the courts, which isn't working and is very costly. Having a well managed government agency (preceding might be an oxymoron!) could help. But, what's happening here isn't working, and individuals going through the courts doesn't scale.


  • #2


    Facilitating lifelong dole dossers and encouraging children to fecklessly have children with the guarantee of a 3 bedroom house for e20 a week for life with all services provided free of charge by the hardworking poor & that beside their mother is unacceptable & the driving force behind the so called homeless figures.

    As for the courts - if the fathers were required to be named on the birth certs they could be simply through revenue or their dole payments be required to pay for their children by the payments being stopped at source. You can be sure there would be far less 4x4's or 3x3's if the fathers had to uphold the cost for 18 years of their penis rather than making other fathers married and/or comitted to their children and other hardworking families pay for their unwanted children and casually discarded responsibilities. Its not a complex matter to organise. They did it overnight with water charges and house tax.


  • #2


    Wanderer78 wrote: »
    Should women be the default minder, and since its a full time job, should they be paid accordingly?

    Who said that women are the default minder? Not me. If you decide as a couple to have children then you are accepting that they will have to be cared for. By one of their parents or by another appropriate adult. If you want to have a habitable home and home cooked meals then you accept that one of you or both of you will have to share those chores, or pay someone else to do it.
    It’s entirely your choice. It’s all your desicion.
    Who on earth do you think should be paying an adult to mind their own children and clean their own house?!?


  • #2


    It's a far tougher job than going to work tbh.

    *dad with 3 kids

    It sure is.


  • #2



    As for the courts - if the fathers were required to be named on the birth certs they could be simply through revenue or their dole payments be required to pay for their children by the payments being stopped at source. You can be sure there would be far less 4x4's or 3x3's if the fathers had to uphold the cost for 18 years of their penis rather than making other fathers married and/or comitted to their children and other hardworking families pay for their unwanted children and casually discarded responsibilities. Its not a complex matter to organise. They did it overnight with water charges and house tax.

    Amazing that they're not named on birth certs here. Is it optional or not required? Seems like it certainly *can* be entered, bogus if it isn't required: https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/birth_family_relationships/after_your_baby_is_born/registering_birth_your_baby.html


  • #2


    The law was changed a number of years ago to not require a fathers name on the birth cert. Strike one for fathers rights, childrens rights and open house on a lifelong gateway to social welfare fraud.


  • #2


    Igotadose wrote: »
    Amazing that they're not named on birth certs here. Is it optional or not required? Seems like it certainly *can* be entered, bogus if it isn't required: https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/birth_family_relationships/after_your_baby_is_born/registering_birth_your_baby.html

    It’s not required. If a woman isn’t legally married she can’t enter a mans name on a birth cert unless he gives his permission.


  • #2


    The law was changed a number of years ago to not require a fathers name on the birth cert. Strike one for fathers rights, childrens rights and open house on a lifelong gateway to social welfare fraud.

    You never needed a fathers name on a birth cert.


  • #2


    karen42 wrote: »
    . I find it quite contradictory that they are also in a cohabitation situation with the children's fathers and there are multiple fathers.

    I have no idea what this means? Sounds like some hippy commune!


  • #2


    L1011 wrote: »
    30 years ago, yes. Now its not that common at all. In rural areas there'd still be slightly more people with that idea than in urban areas.

    Where are you getting this big rural/urban divide ? If you are going on stereotypes then that's like me saying that women are more likely to suffer domestic violence in an urban area.


  • #2


    Squatter wrote: »
    Of course bringing a man to court for maintenance and actually receiving the maintenance awarded are two very different things.

    Maintenance can be attached to earnings so that it is automatically taken from income at source, especially if there is a history of missing payments.

    Alternatively maintenance can be directed to be paid through the district court office. If payments are not made the court service will issue a summons on the defaulter.


  • #2


    Maintenance can be attached to earnings so that it is automatically taken from income at source, especially if there is a history of missing payments.

    Alternatively maintenance can be directed to be paid through the district court office. If payments are not made the court service will issue a summons on the defaulter.

    Neither of these things ever happen.


  • #2


    splinter65 wrote: »
    You never needed a fathers name on a birth cert.

    And unfortunately sometimes the mother doesn't know who the father of the child is :(

    My own dad was very hands-off, as were his parents. But my brother is very hands-on with his 3 kids. Things have changed drastically over the past 20 years, and that's a really good thing.


  • #2



    Maintenance can be attached to earnings so that it is automatically taken from income at source, especially if there is a history of missing payments.

    Alternatively maintenance can be directed to be paid through the district court office. If payments are not made the court service will issue a summons on the defaulter.


    Phew - that's grand so, evidently there's absolutely no problem in Ireland with single mothers not receiving maintenance payments from their sperm donors!

    Many thanks for putting us right on that one!


  • #2


    splinter65 wrote: »
    Neither of these things ever happen.

    False, they do and I've seen them happen.

    You should correct your statement to "Neither of these have happened in a case I have heard of"


  • #2


    sexmag wrote: »
    Well being a person who's been through the courts I've seen many people jailed for not paying maintenance and for denying access so it happens but again that doesn't suit your agenda there now does it

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.breakingnews.ie/ireland/10-days-jail-for-dad-accused-of-not-paying-enough-maintenance-826118.html



    Really?? Many people jailed?? There was only 1 person jailed in 2017 for not paying maintenance, yet over 400 for not paying a TV licence.

    Attachment of earnings means multiple trips to court and also knowing the Father's employer. If he changes employer, the order is null and void. On the other hand, revenue can stop property tax directly from employers without a court order and doesn't need to attach it solely to one employer.

    Oh and under the Civil Registration Act 2014, unmarried Mother's must name Father's. Even prior to this though, 80% of Father's names were on birth certs of children born to unmarried parents.

    Makes you wonder, how we can have a more efficient collection system for TV licences and property tax. Anyone would think we don't care about children as much as property tax.


  • #2


    Squatter wrote: »
    In fairness, the father was there when it really mattered to him, i.e. when he was achieving orgasm. The subsequent offspring was merely an incidental by-product of the act and thus of no real concern to him.

    fairness to whom?


  • #2


    Just seen this thread here and reminded me of a conversation I had with a friend recently. I live in Dublin and here it's pretty standard that you'd see dads cycling with their kids on their bikes or in an attached carriage. You'd often see dads going around with baby strapped to his front or dads pushing prams around.

    I lived in the midlands for 2 years, and not once in that time did I ever see a male person even push a pram. I suspect the answer is economic. In areas where it is financially feasible for a family to operate on a single income, you'll get a clear and total separation of domestic roles. In Dublin, the middle classes must have 2 working parents, thus all work is shared.


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