Getting into hunting

Williamjg

Hi all. I’m turning 16 and want to start shooting/ hunting
I have gone hunting once or twice with my dad and have tried hunting with a slingshot and traps for a while but now that I’m almost 16 I can legally get a gun. I want a 12 gauge under and over game / field gun for hunting crows magpies pigeons pheasants and foxes.
My budget is €500 or less for the gun and would like second hand or new. Any recommendations on suitable first guns to fill these criteria.
I’m fairly sure on the proscess of getting a firearm certificate but if someone could could just run trough it with me that would be a big help
My extended family own 80 or so acres of land around my house so that is the first of three land permissions and I’m fairly confident I can get some local farmers just to give me permission to fill the blanks
There is a local gun club nearby so I plan to join that also
I plan on buying snap caps. Cleaning kit Travel case. Ear defenders and a safe. Is there any other things I would need
And last but not least my parents know I have an interest in hunting but would be reluctant to allow me get a gun so if someone would have any advice on how to persuade them it would be a big help
Thanks

Cass

Welcome to the forum Wiliamjg.

Williamjg wrote: »

Hi all. I’m turning 16 and want to start shooting/ hunting

Good for you lad.

I want a 12 gauge under and over game / field gun for hunting crows magpies pigeons pheasants and foxes.

Good choice. Shotgun is always a personal favorite.

My budget is €500 or less for the gun and would like second hand or new. Any recommendations on suitable first guns to fill these criteria.

A healthy enough budget.

There are a few that would close to your budget (around 500 to 600). They include Yildiz, Baikal, Kral, and another one i cannot remember the name of.

Second hand it depends on condition but you could look at Bettinsoli, Higher end Yildiz, Silma, and possibly some model of Browning. You might get something like a Beretta, but to be honest it might be in poor condition for your budget as theya are an expensive gun new.

I’m fairly sure on the proscess of getting a firearm certificate but if someone could could just run trough it with me that would be a big help

Here is how you apply : https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=106541327&postcount=3

My extended family own 80 or so acres of land around my house so that is the first of three land permissions and I’m fairly confident I can get some local farmers just to give me permission to fill the blanks

You only need two, but the more the merrier.

One piece of advice DON'T sign or tick section 5.2 on the FCA1 application form. This is a limited certificate and will only allow you to shoot on lands owned by you/your family. So DON'T fill in section 5.2

There is a local gun club nearby so I plan to join that also

If you have the gun club membership you won't need the land permissions, but it doesn't hurt to have both.

I plan on buying snap caps. Cleaning kit Travel case. Ear defenders and a safe. Is there any other things I would need

Competency course for your first application, and possibly a safe, but the firearms officer will let you know if its needed.

And last but not least my parents know I have an interest in hunting but would be reluctant to allow me get a gun so if someone would have any advice on how to persuade them it would be a big help
Thanks

As you will be living at home with your parents the FO may seek a letter from your parents saying they know you are applying, and have no problem with you storing the firearm in their home.. While they won't have access to it, the Firearms Officer (always called FO) may seek this. So just be prepared.

As for how to approach your parents the Gods honest truth only you will know how to talk to them. I'd advise you not to demand anything of them, don't throw a "hissy fit" if they have reservations, and try explain to them your interest in fieldsports.

Tell them how, thorugh the act of applying, you will be Garda vetted and be held to a higher standard of behaviour as any messing around will result in the loss of your firearm. This is the truth and you'll find most all firearm owners have never been in trouble with the law as we genuinely held to a higer standard and the law says if you are of intemperate character the application may be refused or if you have a gun the license revoked and the gun taken off you.

IOW tell your parents being a gun owner makes you a better person.

Then explain how you don't shoot simply as a hobby. Its a craft and how shooting sports in Ireland is the oldest sport in the country, older than the GAA. That you want to be a part of it and learn this craft.

Its also a huge social group with weekly events open to all where you'll meet other people of the same frame of mind. Friends you will make and keep over a lifetime.

I hope it works out for you and don't hesitate to come back and ask ANY question you might have. Remember there is no stupid question(s).

Williamjg

Thanks man That was a big help

Gorgeousgeorge

best of luck,

should have no problem getting a good 2nd hand o/u for that money. yildiz or baikal shouldn't run you much more than 250 euro.

Uinseann_16

Williamjg wrote: »

My extended family own 80 or so acres of land around my house so that is the first of three land permissions and I’m fairly confident I can get some local farmers just to give me permission to fill the blanks

And last but not least my parents know I have an interest in hunting but would be reluctant to allow me get a gun so if someone would have any advice on how to persuade them it would be a big help
Thanks

You could use this tho help convince your parents as you'd be helping your extended family out with pest control on their land.
Again as Cass pointed out its not something to be taken too lightly its a big responsibility
I was lucky that my father shoots so i was brought up around it and it was easy for me to get into shooting, Best of luck lad

Williamjg

My dad use to do a lot of shooting when he was my age but stopped years ago so that may help my case. We also have a lot of apple trees and crows keep eating them all so it would be good for a few to be shot
How long does the whole firearm certificate proscess take

Uinseann_16

Williamjg wrote: »

My dad use to do a lot of shooting when he was my age but stopped years ago so that may help my case. We also have a lot of apple trees and crows keep eating them all so it would be good for a few to be shot
How long does the whole firearm certificate proscess take

From 1 week to 3 months.. maybe more but a decision should be made within 3 months,depends entirely on your district tbh its a guessing game
my first licence for a .22 took about 6 weeks my second for a .308 took a week theres no rhyme or reason with AGS on the time they take to complete applications:(

ronn

What part of the country are you in,?

Williamjg

Galway

Jackdaw89

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Great advice their.
Cass your a credit to the sport, your always one of the first and best to answer. Fair play to ya for getting so many lads up and running. It’s the likes of you keeping the sport alive.
Theirs allot of lads giving it up because of the politics and hassle in it nowadays, I even find myself drifting away from it.

Williamjg

Would a higher end lanber be a good choice
I think they look nicer then a baikal and seem to be very reliable
They are also cheap enough so I could look for a 2013 game deluxe or something like that. Is this a good idea and if so do ye know any where or one who is selling them
Thanks

solarwinds

My first priority would be that it fits you right second then would be looks. It can look top class but if it doesnt fit it will break your heart, and you will get fed up pretty quick. Try a few and take it from there.

meathstevie

Williamjg wrote: »

Would a higher end lanber be a good choice
I think they look nicer then a baikal and seem to be very reliable
They are also cheap enough so I could look for a 2013 game deluxe or something like that. Is this a good idea and if so do ye know any where or one who is selling them
Thanks

Both are extremely good guns for the price you pay for them but as someone else already said, fit is everything.

The Baikal may just be that little bit sturdier, having said that I know a few lads who've shot proverbial lorry loads of cartridges through basic Lanbers and didn't have any problems beyond a broken firing pin or one wee spring or other needing replaced.

You can buy a shotgun for €50000 rather than €500 and given sufficient use they all will need maintenance and minor repairs at some stage.

Cass

Don't forget to check out the for sale section, here. There are adverts daily and someone might be selling a second hand gun for the right money, like this Miroku (example only, and i'm not related to seller).

Williamjg

I have looked on the for sale section and will keep an eye on it for the next 2 weeks or so
Is the Miroku not a little bit old or does age not matter that much

Cass

I just want to be very clear.

I'm not saying buy it, go for it, or even consider it. I'm only highlighting that the for sale section can be a good source of second hand guns from "known" people.

As for the gun, some people get hung up on age and others don't care. For me age is meaningless. If the gun is well maintained, and not abused then age is irrelevant especially for a higher end gun.

Some brands like Beretta are almost 500 years old. That is a long time to be around. So while you are paying a higher price for the name that name comes with centuries of experience and tried & tested methods.

Miroku have been around for 125 years so they're not a new or unknown quantity. They make guns for Browning and Winchester. If the seller has minded the gun, cleaned it regularly, not abused it (both in handling and firing) then its one to think about. If its not your cup of tea then look elsewhere.

Lastly my CZ rifle is 28 years old and its not the oldest gun i've owned. One was from the 70s and because the quality is so good is out performed brand new rifles.

Excuse me for repeating myself but i want to be 100% clear on this. I'm not selling the gun, don't know the seller and am not making anything out of the sale of the gun. It was simply the first advert i found as an example for something to look at.

If you want to check RFD (Registered Firearm Dealers) then look under this post, in my sign line, and you'll see a load of links for online shops, dealers, etc. Some have decent websites, others have poorly run websites and some don't have a website at all. However try some and you'll get an idea of what is out there and the prices being sought.

Williamjg

I’ve had a chat with my dad and I don’t think a shotgun is in the books. But I have been allowed to get an air rifle so I think I’ll try to get an air rifle instead. Thanks for all the help

Cass

Any particular reason he wasn't keen on you having the shotgun?

As for a rifle, if you're going that route go for a .22lr instead of the air rifle. Same price, if not cheaper to buy, and more range than an air rifle.

cookimonster

Following your thread.
Don't rush into anything at the moment, there's a few things you could do before parting with hard earned money.

I would surmise that in your parents eyes the air rifle would be the lesser of the two evils when it comes to firearms, if so then you may be able to convince them as to the merits of a .22LR. This rifle will stand the test of time if you peruse the sport and is always a good addition to a gun cabinet. A .22 air rifle would be good for what you want but I would suspect you'll pick up a neat little .22LR package cheaper then you would a reliable air rifle. Once you go down the rifle road you'll need a gun safe which will eat into your budget.

Alternatively you could try and persuade your father to become a co-licence holder on a shotgun. This may make him more comfortable with the idea and maybe (nothing is certain in the firearms application process) help improve your chance of getting your licence. You may even rekindle his interest in shooting and hunting which would be a bonus for you for traveling etc etc.

Lastly, hold out for a while with your application, contact someone in the gun club and see if you can get involved, walk out with a few lads, work with the birds or what ever the club is about. In others words as well as proving your dedication, maturity and interest to your parents your also getting an insight to the sport, so that your sure about what you want.

Any way best of luck in your endevours.

Uinseann_16

I went the .22 route and i dont regret it theres a reason its been around since 1887, its cheap and it works.
I paid 100 euro for my .22 you can probably pick up a second hand brno for 150-250 euro
I dont think ill ever sell my 22 ill keep it its a great shooting little gun:D

solarwinds

My first gun was a .22 BSA air rifle, a year later I got a semi auto shotgun. The following year I subbed the air rifle for a Swift.
My point being is, however you get into the sport is unimportant. Its more important you get into it and if that means getting an air rifle for a year or two and showing your parents you are responsible then so be it. The door has been opened to you so i suggest you take it. In the mean time you could go to a clay range a few times with your father or mother and get experience in as many disciplines of shooting as you can.
I wouldn't knock an air rifle they are good fun and perfect in around farm yards and orchards you could become very popular very quick and be providing a necessary service. All this could lead to a relaxing of your parents attitude towards firearms.

Williamjg

The area around the farmland I would be shooting is build up so noise is a problem which an air rifle is good for
Another problem with getting a 22 rifle is I’ll mainly be hunting birds and birds live in trees so I would much prefer to point an air rifle then a standard rifle into the sky as pellets tend to lose their power and speed a lot faster then a regular rifle and I also don’t want to be worrying about a back drop that much and if the bullet will end up in my neighbors living room if it misses the rabbit
They are the same reasons more or less that I wanted a shotgun because I want to hunt birds and rabbits but don’t want to be worrying about where my bullet will end up
I know air rifle are expensive looking at any bsa or air arms pcp gun will set you back over a €1000 new and a pump for the air is about 50 but I want to be out hunting most days and if not hunting firing a blast of rounds at a target and that’s the good thing about air rifles Ammo is cheap 100 pellets for €5 were as 100 .22 rimfire rounds would set me back about €45
So I think for the time being until I get a shotgun an air rifle is the way to go

Uinseann_16

Williamjg wrote: »

The area around the farmland I would be shooting is build up so noise is a problem which an air rifle is good for
Another problem with getting a 22 rifle is I’ll mainly be hunting birds and birds live in trees so I would much prefer to point an air rifle then a standard rifle into the sky as pellets tend to lose their power and speed a lot faster then a regular rifle and I also don’t want to be worrying about a back drop that much and if the bullet will end up in my neighbors living room if it misses the rabbit
They are the same reasons more or less that I wanted a shotgun because I want to hunt birds and rabbits but don’t want to be worrying about where my bullet will end up
I know air rifle are expensive looking at any bsa or air arms pcp gun will set you back over a €1000 new and a pump for the air is about 50 but I want to be out hunting most days and if not hunting firing a blast of rounds at a target and that’s the good thing about air rifles Ammo is cheap 100 pellets for €5 were as 100 .22 rimfire rounds would set me back about €45
So I think for the time being until I get a shotgun an air rifle is the way to go

No way 100 rounds of .22LR will cost about 8-10 euro.:D if someones is trying to sell you 100 rounds of 22 for 45euro run a mile:eek:

Uinseann_16

Williamjg wrote: »

The area around the farmland I would be shooting is build up so noise is a problem which an air rifle is good for
Another problem with getting a 22 rifle is I’ll mainly be hunting birds and birds live in trees so I would much prefer to point an air rifle then a standard rifle into the sky as pellets tend to lose their power and speed a lot faster then a regular rifle and I also don’t want to be worrying about a back drop that much and if the bullet will end up in my neighbors living room if it misses the rabbit
They are the same reasons more or less that I wanted a shotgun because I want to hunt birds and rabbits but don’t want to be worrying about where my bullet will end up
I know air rifle are expensive looking at any bsa or air arms pcp gun will set you back over a €1000 new and a pump for the air is about 50 but I want to be out hunting most days and if not hunting firing a blast of rounds at a target and that’s the good thing about air rifles Ammo is cheap 100 pellets for €5 were as 100 .22 rimfire rounds would set me back about €45
So I think for the time being until I get a shotgun an air rifle is the way to go

Under no circumstances should any Rifle be used for shooting into the sky. Only shotguns and small bore air rifles(.177s,.22s,.25s) even then you have to be sure of your backstop
Do not put down target shooting on your application this cannot be done legally outside of an un authorized range with a rifle or air rifle yes shooting tin cans is illegal dont ask me why:(
You can however shoot clays in a field with a shotgun this can be done with a cheap hand thrower or a manually operated thrower for little money, as this is not considered target shooting

Cass

The lads have covered most things but a few more and some repetition as its worth saying twice.

Williamjg wrote: »

Another problem with getting a 22 rifle is I’ll mainly be hunting birds

You cannot shoot any bird with a rifle, unless its for derogation, and this means in a field to protect crops or livestock. It doesn't cover shooting them in trees.

and birds live in trees so I would much prefer to point an air rifle then a standard rifle into the sky

I'd suggest doing a competency course as this is covered as the lads have above.

You shouldn't be firing any rifle at birds for a start, but definitely not into trees/the sky. While an air rifle does have a limited range if nothing else it forms the bad habit and when you move to another rifle you'll be tempted or used to doing it so won't think twice with a more powerful rifle.

and if the bullet will end up in my neighbors living room if it misses the rabbit

If you miss you should already know your backstop and whether the shot was shot to take in the first place. Shotgun, air rifle, rifle, etc. They all should be treated the same.

They are the same reasons more or less that I wanted a shotgun because I want to hunt birds and rabbits but don’t want to be worrying about where my bullet will end up

There are some species of animals that can ONLY be shot with a shotgun (like Hares) and all birds MUST be shot with a shotgun as explained above.

and if not hunting firing a blast of rounds at a target and that’s the good thing about air rifles

As was said above target shooting outside an authorised range is illegal so don't do that, don't put it on your application, and (without being a dick) another reason you need to do a competency course.

Ammo is cheap 100 pellets for €5 were as 100 .22 rimfire rounds would set me back about €45

Most pellets come in tins of 500, granted they come in 100s too, but 22lr come mostly in packs of 50 which start at €4.50 up to €13 for the top of the line/Olympic style rounds. They also come in sleeves of 100 which cost around €11 to €15. A pack of 525 rounds of 22lr will cost you about €30. So for the €45 you quoted you'd get between 450 to 750 rounds. Its the second cheapest form of shooting after air firearm shooting.

So I think for the time being until I get a shotgun an air rifle is the way to go

No one is trying to talk you out of an air rifle and if the shotgun is out of the question then go for what you want. However make sure you understand the law, the requirements , and then make a decision based on that. no point in going for an air rifle to find out you cannot do the type of shooting you want.

None of the above is meant to embarrass you to put you down. It's a good chance to inform yourself, ask questions, and get the straight answers that will give you the best information so you are fully prepared.