Relationship issues

Sad and confused

I have set up a new login for this post, it’s so mortifying and sad I cannot chat to anyone IRL about it so please go easy with the feedback.

Ok here goes, I have been married for 7 years and with my husband for over 16 years. We have had our ups and downs over the years and are both a bit stressed with work etc at the moment. He cheated on me shortly after we got married but we worked through it and stayed together. He is a drinker, me too but I don’t tend to go out on the lash ( just for context). We went out at the weekend, just the 2 of us had dinner and some drinks and then got home early and had a couple more drinks. All was fine, we were listening to music and then went to bed, I wasn’t feeling too well and was sick and then to my recollection fell asleep and woke up a few hours later. When I awoke I felt very sore, my pj bottoms were off and I can’t remember anything happening. I woke my husband up and he said we attempted anal sex (never did it before) and when I said no he stopped and we fell asleep. The issue is, I dont remember a single thing about this, I would not ever want to have anal sex which I would assume he knows and the pain I have had since indicates he really tried to penetrate me. I have had to go to my dr and have been sent to hospital as I have a thrombosed haemorroid which has been drained but now requires surgery so it’s quite severe. I am in shock to be honest, my husband keeps apologizing and is in a seperate bedroom since. He has asked me if I want to call the guards (I don’t). We are not speaking bar dealing with the kids stuff, I dont know what to do next. I am in pain physically and I feel so confused as I cannot believe this has happened. I cannot bring myself to tell any of my friends but I do need another perspective so hence my post here.

What do I do next? Can anyone please give me any guidance on what to do and how to deal with this?

Pelvis

I'm sorry, but it's not clear what you are saying. Do you believe it happened as your husband says it did?

Dixie Chick

You poor thing, sounds extremely sore and uncomfortable.

As this happened with both parties full of drink, and ye willing to work on this?
Do you think that drink caused him to do this? Is there any history of this?
Has he ever hurt you before and once the rawness of this has ended, is this something that you fear would happen again?

qwerty13

Two questions:

Did he know that you’d never want anal sex? (You used the word assume)

Why are you not speaking? Do you believe he raped you?

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Sad and confused

....... wrote: »

Are you suggesting that your husband tried to anally rape you?

I guess why I am trying to say is that I do not know what happened as I have no recollection. All I know is that I have had to go to hospital twice and have been booked in for surgery on Friday to repair the thrombosed haemorroid. I find it hard to believe that he would intentionally try to rape me, he says he stopped but he obviously went further than he thinks he did.
I am just desperately confused and I don’t know what to do next and how to manage this situation.
I know ultimately this is up to me to decide what I can tolerate, I do realise that this situation happened as a result of us being drunk so am going to knock alcohol on the head for a while. I just want/need an outlet to think this through so I can decide what to do next.

Dixie Chick

Is your husband willing to knock alcohol on the head too ? This would be paramount to getting past this.

Sad and confused

I don't know, but I do agree it is essential to us being able to get past this. He has in the past tried things on when he has been drunk that he would not have done if he were sober, when he cheated on me he was drunk and he was meant to change then but I did not make a big deal when he went back to his old ways (drink wise). He says that he is very sorry about what happened and keeps apologising.
I don't ever want to put myself in a position like that again where I am so drunk that I am vulnerable to blacking out and not being able to consent/understand what is happening, so I am done with the drink for the foreseeable future- there is no point in me making excuses here I do need to deal with this head on.

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Neyite

I am so sorry this happened to you.

I think you need to talk to the Rape Crisis Centre because when something sexual happens that we don't recall, or you wake up bleeding and injured like that, it throws up very distressing feelings and emotions that needs to be untangled by a professional. You may never get to the bottom of whether or not you consented given the drinking, but the fallout from the incident can be very similar to the aftermath of being raped.

Simply put, it appears like you were not in any frame of mind to consent. Whether or not he realised this is something only you can guess at. Add into that, it was a sex act that you had no interest in. Did he know this? Has he suggested it before to you? Did he know that it's something that never appealed to you and something you'd never want to try?

Right now, you are sore - but since anal is not something you've ever done before you have no way of knowing what's 'normal' the day after with anal. Done consensually, with preparation (lube) with the recipient being relaxed and the other going gently, you should not have had any pain, let alone an injury requiring surgery.

Only you know if he's pushed your boundaries in other smaller ways. The vast majority of men would have tucked their drunk, sick wife into bed and not attempt anything sexual knowing she's too drunk to fully engage.

It's very odd that with his version you mutually agreed to try it and he stopped right away when you said no, that he's asking if you wanted to call the Gardai. Why would he think like this unless he didn't have your consent /or he didn't stop when you asked him?

Dial Hard

I think you both need to speak to a counsellor who specialises in such issues.

And your husband definitely needs to quit drinking while you sort this out, possibly for good.

My heart goes out to you, OP, it's a very difficult situation to call. Some people will consider this rape but to me, it's a very grey area (I'll probably be lambasted for saying that). My partner and I both woke up to him inside me after a heavy session before. Luckily we both thought it was extremely sexy but it could have been a very different scenario for him had I felt differently and a guy was convicted of rape recently under similar circumstances.

Best of luck with it all. Mind yourself and I hope your surgery goes well.

judeboy101

You don't remember but he obviously does. In my book that's rape

Sad and confused

I don't know if I trust him right now, we have had these issues in the past (never as much) when there has been drink involved after a night out, i think he struggles with boundaries when he has drink in him and that is what I don't trust.
I would be very reluctant to call it rape, that is such a shocking term to me and does not fit with this I don't think. I do though feel so desperately sad and alone, I feel like if I told a friend or family member then that would be it, I would have to make a decision about my marriage that I am just not ready to make yet. Right now I am focusing on getting through to Friday getting the procedure done and putting the physical part of this behind me. I just feel unsure of what to do next. Counselling is a good call, I have been going to one anyhow so I will see if he can fit me in for a session so I can speak to someone and try and make sense of this.

Thank you for your replies so far, I do appreciate any input that will help me make sense of this.

Pelvis

judeboy101 wrote: »

You don't remember but he obviously does. In my book that's rape

Maybe you should close your book and put it away?

Dial Hard

Sad and confused wrote:

I don't know if I trust him right now, we have had these issues in the past (never as much) when there has been drink involved after a night out, i think he struggles with boundaries when he has drink in him and that is what I don't trust.

Ok, to be honest this changes things for me somewhat.

He absolutely needs to knock his drinking on the head, NOW. Then get himself into some one-on-one counselling as well as specialised couple's counselling with you. But I do think potentially a line has been crossed in your marriage and it will take a lot of work before you can decide whether or not you can get past that. Best of luck, whatever happens, OP. It really is a horrible situation.

Neyite

Sad and confused wrote: »

I don't know if I trust him right now, we have had these issues in the past (never as much) when there has been drink involved after a night out, i think he struggles with boundaries when he has drink in him and that is what I don't trust.

At the very least, he needs to immediately stop drinking. For good. I don't think you'll ever trust him with drink on board and if he's shocked and remorseful and wants to save your marriage it's the least he can do. Even with that, your marriage may take some time to recover as you need to process this first and build up intimate trust again, so a LOT of patience from him would also be required.

wrote:

I would be very reluctant to call it rape, that is such a shocking term to me and does not fit with this I don't think. I do though feel so desperately sad and alone, I feel like if I told a friend or family member then that would be it, I would have to make a decision about my marriage that I am just not ready to make yet.

Those feelings are perfectly normal. Putting a label on it can be difficult in even clear cut cases but in cases where there's a poor recall or grey areas it can be harder to call it rape because that changes it and changes both of you into roles of perpetrator and victim of sexual assault -and that's terrifying - some are never ready to label something like this because if it. Right now the label is unimportant. What is important is processing your feelings and your thoughts, and that's very much a day by day process.

wrote:

Right now I am focusing on getting through to Friday getting the procedure done and putting the physical part of this behind me. I just feel unsure of what to do next. Counselling is a good call, I have been going to one anyhow so I will see if he can fit me in for a session so I can speak to someone and try and make sense of this.

That sounds like a good plan.

Neyite

Pelvis wrote: »

Maybe you should close your book and put it away?

Mod:


Not the thread for sniping or for debating.

Sad and confused

Neyite wrote: »

At the very least, he needs to immediately stop drinking. For good. I don't think you'll ever trust him with drink on board and if he's shocked and remorseful and wants to save your marriage it's the least he can do. Even with that, your marriage may take some time to recover as you need to process this first and build up intimate trust again, so a LOT of patience from him would also be required.


Those feelings are perfectly normal. Putting a label on it can be difficult in even clear cut cases but in cases where there's a poor recall or grey areas it can be harder to call it rape because that changes it and changes both of you into roles of perpetrator and victim of sexual assault -and that's terrifying - some are never ready to label something like this because if it. Right now the label is unimportant. What is important is processing your feelings and your thoughts, and that's very much a day by day process.


That sounds like a good plan.

Thank you, your kindness is so appreciated and Dial hard too, you are both correct he needs to stop drinking now and his reaction to that will be illuminating. I have gotten an appointment with my counsellor and will speak to my husband later on.

judeboy101

OP, he has a history of infidelity and has done this to you while you were unconscious. While you might feel some loyalty and forgiveness or give him the benefit if the doubt, his history must give way to the possibility that he may try this on another woman or girl whom he finds in a drunken unconscious state. While you might see your way to forgiving him for what has happened to you, could you forgive yourself if he does the same to another girl or woman knowing you might have prevented it by telling the guards about it now.

Pelvis

judeboy101 wrote: »

... and has done this to you while you were unconscious.

Where did the OP say this?

judeboy101

Pelvis wrote: »

Where did the OP say this?

OP fell asleep, woke up in pain. Sleep is an unconscious state. Her husband claims she woke up and consented to anal sex, she has no recollection of waking or consenting. So going by OP pov, she was unconscious.

Neyite

judeboy101 wrote: »

OP, he has a history of infidelity and has done this to you while you were unconscious. While you might feel some loyalty and forgiveness or give him the benefit if the doubt, his history must give way to the possibility that he may try this on another woman or girl whom he finds in a drunken unconscious state. While you might see your way to forgiving him for what has happened to you, could you forgive yourself if he does the same to another girl or woman knowing you might have prevented it by telling the guards about it now.

I get the sentiment but at this point I'm not sure that telling the OP this is useful at all.

Firstly, she does not have any obligation to any woman other than herself. This is making it sounds like the onus (and blame) would be on her if ever her husband ever hurt another woman in the future. His actions belong to him alone and she's not responsible for them nor should she feel guilty if it transpires he ever went on to hurt someone.

In any case, what can she report? It's a classic case of his word against hers and without recall of events from the OP or a confession from him there is nothing that an investigation team can work with.

judeboy101

Neyite wrote: »

I get the sentiment but at this point I'm not sure that telling the OP this is useful at all.

Firstly, she does not have any obligation to any woman other than herself. This is making it sounds like the onus (and blame) would be on her if ever her husband ever hurt another woman in the future. His actions belong to him alone and she's not responsible for them nor should she feel guilty if it transpires he ever went on to hurt someone.

In any case, what can she report? It's a classic case of his word against hers and without recall of events from the OP or a confession from him there is nothing that an investigation team can work with.

I'm sorry but I disagree. If OP at some future time has a daughter or niece and the husband finds them in the house some night in the future it could be a very sad outcome. It is true some people are afraid to admit that they have been abused as to accept the abuse will tear down what ever barriers they have built up to protect themselves from the event.

OP, you have been violated to such an extent that you require surgery. Talk to the rape crisis centre. If you are 100% confident that you could leave your husband alone drunk in a room with an unconscious sister, niece, daughter, friend or stranger then fine. BUT if there is the smallest bit of doubt, say something to the guards, Imho.

vandriver

It sounds like both of you need to give up alcohol.

downwesht

First of all I am sorry for your situation OP.
In my opinion you can look at the situation from a number of ways,deep down you have your answers.....but only you know...those of us on here can only speculate.

You can do the blame thing,blame yourself for getting blotto,blame your blotto husband for taking advantage.
You can believe that you gave consent and ended up the way you are through "misadventure"
You can believe that you did not give consent and Hubby carried on regardless.

Whatever happened you have to deal with the unfortunate consequences.
You know your husbands history, it is obviously giving you a "gut" feeling.......sometimes you have to trust your gut.

The best piece of advice I could give is that you look after only one person in the short-term ....YOU.
Get the op out of the way,get back on your feet and concentrate on getting better.
Leave your husband stew.It might focus his thoughts and realise the hurt he has caused.
Then make life changes,regarding alcohol,relationship and lifestyle.
Hope all goes well.

uck51js9zml2yt

judeboy101 wrote: »

OP fell asleep, woke up in pain. Sleep is an unconscious state. Her husband claims she woke up and consented to anal sex, she has no recollection of waking or consenting. So going by OP pov, she was unconscious.

She was so drunk , she doesn't know what went on so saying she was asleep without waking up is unproven.
As for your subsequent allegations that he'll abuse his daughter/niece... we'll that's just sensationalist.

OP, the more serious issue is yours and your husband's drinking as this was the starting point to what happened.
Unless you both knock that on the head, the two of you are without hope.
Counselling has been recommended. I'd also suggest AA. You may not be alcoholics but you both have a drink problem which needs addressing

Sad and confused

Thank you all for your posts, some of it is hard to read. I have already stated that we both need to stop drinking, I can only speak for myself in saying that I will, I am not a big drinker so last weekend was v unusual for me. However it’s a wake up call and I won’t be getting myself into a situation like that again.
I am going to focus on myself for now and get better physically at least. I will speak with my husband and in time will decide what happens next, I don’t believe he is a threat to other women though and I don’t have anymore to say on that.

Thanks all for the helpful replies, it is shocking to be in a situation like this and I am sad and mortified but hope to find a way through.

Merkin

This is equally horrifying and terribly sad and you must feel terribly alone. I know if I'm distressed my husband is the person I turn to so for your own partner to have caused you this emotional and physical pain must be completely mind bending.

This is ultimately a consent issue as you were clearly not in a position to give it. This should have been evident given that you were ill before you went to bed and admit you'd had a lot to drink. Especially with something that isn't the norm or usual to you and ultimately ended up in injury.

I think I'd advise you to a. Both quit alcohol completely for the foreseeable (and if is unwilling to do this then you have a really serious problem on your hands. B. Invoke the help of either the Rape Crisis Centre or a psychosexual therapists so you can get your thought processes and feelings in order and c. If you want to continue with your marriage you'll need to go for couples counselling to address everything that has happened (including prior to this incident).

I really wish you well and hope that you make a full emotional and physical recovery soon xx

I'm sorry this happened to you, OP. I can't imagine how horrific it must be to have been so damaged from a sexual encounter you have no recollection of that you were left injured, in pain, and needing surgery.

Good luck with your procedure and with untangling this situation, both emotionally and intellectually.

wiggle16

judeboy101 wrote: »

You don't remember but he obviously does. In my book that's rape

No it isn't. The OP cannot determine if what happened was something she agreed to or was fit to agree to, because she cannot remember it. What you are saying is not logically consistent because you are taking the fact that she can't remember it as proof that it wasn't consensual, which is a false premise:

A: sex without consent is rape;
B: if you cannot remember, then you cannot have consented;
Therefore, sex without recollection is rape.

This is not a sound argument because B is not true. A person can consent and later not recall the encounter, by any number of contingencies. Two people can wake up beside each other the next morning and have no recollection of the night before. That does not mean one or both committed rape. It's not helpful to be so absolutist about it.

OP, that said, I don't like the sound of what you're describing and I would encourage you to see a counsellor either way. His drinking has to stop for sure. If you do not remember what happened, but you know he's engaged in things previously where he wouldn't have while sober, I would be inclined to take this incident as an example of that which went too far in this instance. The truth is that you don't know what happened or how, you can only decide if you believe him or not. You have already said you don't trust him - personally I take that as the bigger issue and would doubt I could continue in that relationship if it were me, because I don't think I could or would want to repair trust after this.

Sad and confused wrote: »

I find it hard to believe that he would intentionally try to rape me, he says he stopped but he obviously went further than he thinks he did.

If it were me, I would put the question of rape out of my mind because unless he tells you it was rape, or you decide that in fact it must have been rape, you are never going to know for sure, and as you say, you find it hard to believe he would do that. That's your gut feeling, and I would go with that. I would concentrate on dealing with how you feel about it as things stand: certainly see a counsellor and I would second the recommendation to contact the Rape Crisis Centre - not to determine the nature of what happened, but because they have experience dealing with this kind of issue and will be able to refer you to other resources as needs be.

I hope you feel better soon either way. Mind yourself OP x

LegacyUser

Did you know you had hemorrhroids in the first place? They wouldn’t come about from anal sex. You’re assuming this is an injury caused by your husband. Thrombosis could occur for many reasons especially in a heavy drinker eg: passing hard stool after many drinks that you don’t remember. It can happen to anyone for multiple reasons and require surgery. Did your doctor imply this was from anal or attempted anal sex? Your husband could very well be telling the truth. A thrombosed hemorrhroid will burst completely on its own and cause blood. And yes hemorrhroids are excruciatingly painful but not an injury cause by trauma!?

Witchie

For me, one of the biggest issues here is that her husband is the person she should be able to trust most when she is feeling unwell/drunk to look after her. 

This, coupled with his past cheating would have me very wary of trusting him ever again. 

Counselling is essential here and am glad to hear you are going. You really need to think about the impact on your marriage of being married to a man who can breach your trust just coz he is drunk.

nikkibikki

However drunk someone is, they should be able to sleep beside their spouse without fear or worry.

OP, your husband injured you to the point that you need surgery. He should be utterly devastated. It should be a kick in the behind for him to stop drinking. If it's not, he needs to ask himself some questions.

To add my own experience. Both my husband and I have been blotto drunk at times. We look after each other. Most recently it was me. We were on hols. I was drinking rum and coke. They weren't measuring the rum so I got drunk very quickly. Very very drunk. We were back in our hotel room early ish. I was in the bathroom ages so hubby came looking for me. I was passed out on the floor. He got me into bed, which wasn't easy as I weigh more than him, and gave me the bin to puke into. He got into bed beside me and what did he do? He went asleep. I still can't remember bits of that night months later but I was so grateful I was with him and perfectly safe. I have seriously curtailed my drinking since then. But my point is, you should feel safe with your spouse/partner in every situation.

LegacyUser

I’m assuming you asked what happened moreso because of the extreme pain than the missing pjs. Speaking from personal experience of same medical condition, which is what it is a medical condition not a traumatic injury I can see how waking up after a drunken night, not remembering anything and waking with pain there might lead you to conclusions. Had too much to drink by my standards one night last year, by no means to point of passing out or not remembering, was drinking spirits, came home with dodgy tummy but nothing unusual other than the runs, woke up next morning to same medical problem, extreme pain and swelling and discomfort to point it need to be iced. Oh and scary bleeding. And this came out of nowhere and was due from pressure outwards not inwards as no-one was near me. I wouldn’t assume because both things happened in same drunken experience that your husband is lying to you. Plenty men chance asking for something different when drunk that’s not unusual and ye were both drunk by sounds of things it sounds like he’s not too sure himself of events, he said he stopped when you said no. Your pain and surgery is for your medical condition but it’s nearly coming across as it’s a result of something he did to you. You’re making huge and possibly very wrong assumptions but then you allude to other incidents but don’t specify. If your doctor in anyway made out that what you’re having surgery for is a traumatic injury you need to go back and have a chat.

Sardonicat

Hangonasec wrote: »

Did you know you had hemorrhroids in the first place? They wouldn’t come about from anal sex. You’re assuming this is an injury caused by your husband. Thrombosis could occur for many reasons especially in a heavy drinker eg: passing hard stool after many drinks that you don’t remember. It can happen to anyone for multiple reasons and require surgery. Did your doctor imply this was from anal or attempted anal sex? Your husband could very well be telling the truth. A thrombosed hemorrhroid will burst completely on its own and cause blood. And yes hemorrhroids are excruciatingly painful but not an injury cause by trauma!?

Her husband told her that he ( he framed it as they) attempted anal sex.

LegacyUser

Sardonicat wrote: »

Her husband told her that he ( he framed it as they) attempted anal sex.

He also told her she said no to it and he stopped.
She is assuming because of pain, swelling and possibly bleeding that he hurt her and lied to her. Her condition is a medical one not an injury

Neyite

Mod:


Ok no medical diagnoses here please - the OP has her GP and surgeon for that. Someone on the internet can't diagnose and it's against the charter.

nikkibikki

Hangonasec wrote:

He also told her she said no to it and he stopped. She is assuming because of pain, swelling and possibly bleeding that he hurt her and lied to her. Her condition is a medical one not an injury

I'm not 100% on what this condition is but it sounds like one that would be made worse by anal sex.

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Sad and confused

Thanks for the replies, as for those who are saying that what has happened me is medical and not as a result of attempted anal sex all I will say is that I know that it’s a result of what was attempted. I am not going to get into medical history or the detail of my current situation as it’s not the right place.
I do appreciate all of the support and advice on here, it’s been good to get other perspectives. I have spoken briefly to my husband and he has agreed to stop drinking, we are going to discuss next steps in the coming days.

Thanks again to you all and mods if you could close comments now that would be great.