Anyone willing to admit that they supported the IRA at any point?

FrancieBrady

FrancieBrady wrote: »

All groups killed...it happens in conflicts/wars.

Do you know how many children the British army killed for instance?

But but but whatabout......

FrancieBrady

Aegir wrote: »

But but but whatabout......

Why would you pick one group to criticise when all of them killed indiscriminately at various times?

I think I know the answer, never mind.

Zebra3

talking_walnut wrote: »

You do know he was in the Maze don't you? Admittedly it was initially due to internment without trial, but he has two convictions for attempted escapes, one of which involved kidnapping a lookalike in an attempt to forcibly make him swap places with "our boy gerry". But sure that's just what normal people do to get there mates out of prison right?

Internment was state sanctioned kidnapping. It’s called rendition nowadays.

Imagine someone trying to escape from being kidnapped. Incredible!!!

Taytoland

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Taytoland wrote: »

It's hardly radical to think the murder of a mother of 12 is wrong, it's hardly a big moral mountain, I'd say if you asked most people on this forum they would agree. 

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/iras-ghq-riddled-with-informers-26231534.html
https://www.independent.ie/opinion/comment/so-many-suspects-in-an-ira-riddled-with-spies-35076370.html
https://ansionnachfionn.com/2016/09/26/british-spies-agents-and-informers-in-the-ira/
https://www.irishecho.com/2011/02/how-informers-forced-the-provos-to-the-peace-table-2/
[font=Helmet, Freesans, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Talking to Terrorists book is excellent for more information on the agents within the IRA. [/font]

That was not the point.

The point was about what people selectively believe.

You keep busting your own arguments by harvesting info you think is relevant.

Did you even read this one? :D:D
https://ansionnachfionn.com/2016/09/26/british-spies-agents-and-informers-in-the-ira/

It's not a question of belief, it's what happened. She was murdered, shot in the head.

Giblet

Scratched IRA with a compass into a desk and failed history in me leaving does that count

end of the road

Aegir wrote: »

Which would make sense in the main and if the IRA fought to remove the British army from the island of Ireland, but that doesn’t explain the young people from Glenageary and Killininey who decided to shoot dead innocent Australians in Amsterdam or plant bombs in a busy pub in Birmingham on a Friday evening.

the first act was to show how distructive the IRA could and would be if they needed to be. the second was to show the british that they would target them on their own soil again and again whenever, wherever, until they came to the table.

FrancieBrady

Taytoland wrote: »

It's not a question of belief, it's what happened. She was murdered, shot in the head.

3000 other people died...needlessly. If the people with the power had done what they eventually did - provide an equal and fair society.
They tried to maintain a bigoted unionist statelet that they created and the lid came off.
Criminal negligence it used to be thought but as time moves on we are seeing that the government was actually a player in the conflict/war.

end of the road

end of the road wrote: »

the first act was to show how distructive the IRA could and would be if they needed to be. the second was to show the british that they would target them on their own soil again and again whenever, wherever, until they came to the table.

Nah, they were just wonton acts of cold blooded murder.

Try and justify it if you like, but then all you end up doing is justifying every act of cold blooded murder during the troubles.

Odhinn

Aegir wrote: »

Nah, they were just wonton acts of cold blooded murder.

…………...

What was?

end of the road

Aegir wrote: »

Nah, they were just wonton acts of cold blooded murder.

Try and justify it if you like, but then all you end up doing is justifying every act of cold blooded murder during the troubles.

i'm not justifying anything. i have been clear that the IRA should have insured no civilians were targeted by elements of their force.

Donald Trump

Aegir wrote: »

Nah, they were just wonton acts of cold blooded murder.

Try and justify it if you like, but then all you end up doing is justifying every act of cold blooded murder during the troubles.

mmmmmmmmmmmmmm. wontons

Taytoland

The biggest regret surely for the British and Loyalist volunteers is they didn't get enough IRA.

Donald Trump

Donald Trump wrote: »

mmmmmmmmmmmmmm. wontons

Damned autocorrect

end of the road

end of the road wrote: »

i'm not justifying anything. i have been clear that the IRA should have insured no civilians were targeted by elements of their force.

So what is the justification for detonating bombs in busy city center pubs on a Friday evening?

Donald Trump

Aegir wrote: »

Damned autocorrect

In fairness to the Chinese, I have it on good authority that as a bunch of lads, they are great

steddyeddy

Taytoland wrote: »

The biggest regret surely for the British and Loyalist volunteers is they didn't get enough IRA.

I'm sure it is. Not the actual terrorist attacks and civilians they killed but the small amount of IRA members they killed.

end of the road

Aegir wrote: »

So what is the justification for detonating bombs in busy city center pubs on a Friday evening?

i already told you why it was done. it doesn't mean i agree with it or believe it was the correct tactic, i don't and it wasn't.

FrancieBrady

Aegir wrote: »

So what is the justification for detonating bombs in busy city center pubs on a Friday evening?

Much the same as carpet bombing or bombing hospitals - the spread of terror.

zapitastas

Aegir wrote: »

So what is the justification for detonating bombs in busy city center pubs on a Friday evening?

The pubs were frequented by off duty soldiers so was apparently an attempt to stike fear into soldiers that they could be hit while on r&r even when back home.

hatrickpatrick

RobertKK wrote: »

No, two wrongs doesn't make something right.

Obviously not, that's why I for one condemn IRA actions against civilians. But I find it hard to describe attacking the RUC or British Army, who were essentially state-sponsored terrorist groups being used to prevent a demographic from engaging in peaceful protest - as "wrong".

The entire Troubles essentially began with the civil rights march in Derry in 1968 being attacked totally unprovoked by RUC, paramilitary style. The video clip which sparked the ensuing violence showed an unarmed woman lying on the ground while having the sh!t kicked out of her by "policemen".

If you regard retaliating and attempting to disrupt and dismantle the organisations responsible as a "wrong" then that's your business, but a lot of people do not. It's only when civilians were targeted (or indeed recklessly endangered) that some of us have a problem with nationalist violence - the RUC and British Army got involved military-style in the business of oppressing peaceful dissent, and that makes both organisations absolutely fair game in the context of who counts as a civilian and who doesn't.

archer22

Some years ago Northern Ireland came up in a discussion I was having with a Russian ex soldier..his view was that the British restraint in Northern Ireland was ridiculous and only prolonged the conflict.
He maintained that the way to end the conflict quickly was to publicly execute 20 members of Sinn Fein and the IRA in public in the square of every town where a soldier had been killed.

As I said in an earlier post...the IRA were fortunate in who they were having a war with!!.

FrancieBrady

archer22 wrote: »

Some years ago Northern Ireland came up in a discussion I was having with a Russian ex soldier..his view was that the British restraint in Northern Ireland was ridiculous and only prolonged the conflict.
He maintained that the way to end the conflict quickly was to publicly execute 20 members of Sinn Fein and the IRA in public in the square of every town where a soldier had been killed.

As I said in an earlier post...the IRA were fortunate in who they were having a war with!!.

Well they are not completely stupid. They learned their lessons down south with that kind of random executions.

Harold Wilson was well aware at the start of the modern conflict that the wrong thing to do was to radicalise the south.
They lost their embassy and recruited plenty for the IRA after Bloody Sunday.

It was the collusion and underhand techniques they decided to use, as we are finding out.

steddyeddy

archer22 wrote: »

Some years ago Northern Ireland came up in a discussion I was having with a Russian ex soldier..his view was that the British restraint in Northern Ireland was ridiculous and only prolonged the conflict.
He maintained that the way to end the conflict quickly was to publicly execute 20 members of Sinn Fein and the IRA in public in the square of every town where a soldier had been killed.

As I said in an earlier post...the IRA were fortunate in who they were having a war with!!.

Executing the leaders of a rising? Where have I heard that before.....

Taytoland

archer22 wrote: »

Some years ago Northern Ireland came up in a discussion I was having with a Russian ex soldier..his view was that the British restraint in Northern Ireland was ridiculous and only prolonged the conflict.
He maintained that the way to end the conflict quickly was to publicly execute 20 members of Sinn Fein and the IRA in public in the square of every town where a soldier had been killed.

As I said in an earlier post...the IRA were fortunate in who they were having a war with!!.

I'd have pulled the trap door myself.

archer22

steddyeddy wrote: »

Executing the leaders of a rising? Where have I heard that before.....

It worked for the Free State government in bringing the civil war to a fast conclusion...I guess the trick is to keep it up, not to just use it as a once off.

archer22

archer22 wrote: »

Some years ago Northern Ireland came up in a discussion I was having with a Russian ex soldier..his view was that the British restraint in Northern Ireland was ridiculous and only prolonged the conflict.
He maintained that the way to end the conflict quickly was to publicly execute 20 members of Sinn Fein and the IRA in public in the square of every town where a soldier had been killed.

As I said in an earlier post...the IRA were fortunate in who they were having a war with!!.

Ah yeah, keyboard warriors. You weren't so hard when a single IRA phonecall was paralysing the transport of millions of people on the Tube on a weekday morning. £££££. Do you think those workers care about your Britannia Rules the Waves "Take one for God & Ulster" fetish? £££££. And just how many bombs in London would also bring you to your senses? You what, you'd round up all the Irish in London and kill them? Because as you clearly don't like making martyrs by persecuting some of them, the only alternative is genocide.

Give it a rest. You had 40 years to beat them and to delegitimise them and you failed spectacularly on both counts - often humiliating yourselves in front of world opinion very publicly.

Aegir

Aegir wrote: »

So what is the justification for detonating bombs in busy city center pubs on a Friday evening?

Always lovely to see such sudden concern for human life from the same people who every October and November are the poppy-wearing "remembrance" cheerleaders for... the thugs and murderers of the British Empire who bombed and terrorised across the planet for centuries. You couldn't invent the hypocrisy here.

It's always different when your wars in other people's countries are finally brought back to the streets of Britain. Perhaps the thinking is that you'd be less inclined to invade and terrorise other peoples if you knew they could return the same to your own society?

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Ah yeah, keyboard warriors. You weren't so hard when a single IRA phonecall was paralysing the transport of millions of people on the Tube on a weekday morning. £££££. Do you think those workers care about your Britannia Rules the Waves "Take one for God & Ulster" fetish? £££££. And just how many bombs in London would also bring you to your senses? You what, you'd round up all the Irish in London and kill them? Because as you clearly don't like making martyrs by persecuting some of them, the only alternative is genocide.

Give it a rest. You had 40 years to beat them and to delegitimise them and you failed spectacularly on both counts - often humiliating yourselves in front of world opinion very publicly.

The IRA’s sole objective was to bring about a socialist 32 county republic.

Sounds to me like they were resoundly beaten.

end of the road

archer22 wrote: »

Some years ago Northern Ireland came up in a discussion I was having with a Russian ex soldier..his view was that the British restraint in Northern Ireland was ridiculous and only prolonged the conflict.
He maintained that the way to end the conflict quickly was to publicly execute 20 members of Sinn Fein and the IRA in public in the square of every town where a soldier had been killed.

As I said in an earlier post...the IRA were fortunate in who they were having a war with!!.

not luck, but simple reality. the reality that the northern ireland conflict was never going to be ended via a military defeat of the IRA. public mass slaughter by the security forces was already taking place throughout the conflict to no effect in terms of dampening down the conflict.

archer22

Deleted User wrote: »

Ah yeah, keyboard warriors. You weren't so hard when a single IRA phonecall was paralysing the transport of millions of people on the Tube on a weekday morning. £££££. Do you think those workers care about your Britannia Rules the Waves "Take one for God & Ulster" fetish? £££££. And just how many bombs in London would also bring you to your senses? You what, you'd round up all the Irish in London and kill them? Because as you clearly don't like making martyrs by persecuting some of them, the only alternative is genocide.

Give it a rest. You had 40 years to beat them and to delegitimise them and you failed spectacularly on both counts - often humiliating yourselves in front of world opinion very publicly.

First of all the conflict had Phuck all to do with me, but this is an internet discussion forum in case you hadn't noticed...so yes keyboards are used.But the only keyboard "warrior" I see on here is you!
As for "40 years to beat them" as far as I am aware the ones who decommissioned (destroyed) their weapons were the IRA not the British side...so I guess that kind of tells who was beaten...I have never heard of a victorious army destroying their weaponry ...that is a humiliation that only the vanquished have to endure.